Pat Fitzgerald suspended for 2weeks.

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Pompous Elitist said:
Current and former players could mean two (2). It is curious why they can’t be more expansive, right?

Are there more than two players? That doesn’t mean they’re lying, but it does raise more questions.
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Could. But when they say they interviewed 50’people and found that things are largely supported that something doesn’t quite make sense. Would genie most likely thing is people said hazing is happening but clammed up on the details as no one wants to be implicated in any of this.

Also is interesting the team saying this is overblown given very very few of them would’ve been on the team at the time of Kenosha anyway
 

Pompous Elitist said:
I don’t know, what are NU’s “talent levels” compared to results. AFAIK pretty impressive but I don’t have the data in my think box right now. I do believe I collated it years ago and he’s done pretty well with what he has. The last couple years, yep, terrible.
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NU’s “talent level” was good enough for Randy Walker and Gary Barnett to win big ten titles in shorter time period.
NU is 3-24 in its last 27 non Covid year big ten games.

He is a good coach. Anyone who thinks he is a top 20 coach in the country is drinking the Kool aid
 


Pompous Elitist said:
Schrodinger’s observer. Everyone participated, yet nobody participated. Maggie Hickey has some quantum physics to explain.


While the investigation did not uncover evidence pointing to specific misconduct by any individual football player or coach, participation in or knowledge of the hazing activities was widespread across football players.
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It's possible that no one wanted to single any people out. That is completely understandable to me, they just want to expose and stop this widespread behavior.

If they single out perpetrators and it becomes criminal their lives could be upended as much as the perpetrators.
 



Wally said:
It's possible that no one wanted to single any people out. That is completely understandable to me, they just want to expose and stop this widespread behavior.

If they single out perpetrators and it becomes criminal their lives could be upended as much as the perpetrators.
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An explainer: I admit my life experiences and personal knowledge of people (of all stripes) lying (or wildly exaggerating) for various motives and on several occasions at the expense of hapless victims without care to collateral damage makes me more cynical than the average person. Particularly when all signals point to a lawsuit and settlement coming soon from a deep-pocketed, insured entity deeply mired in a PR nightmare.

Sorry, I can understand some of your guys’ rush to judgment but won’t participate. Let the process play out. I don’t know any of these people personally. Many unknowns here on the what, when, who, how, why.
 
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Fitz currently getting savaged in Chicago media, which is turning up the heat on the NU administration. Stay tuned, this is far from over.

 

Some guy said:
NU’s “talent level” was good enough for Randy Walker and Gary Barnett to win big ten titles in shorter time period.
NU is 3-24 in its last 27 non Covid year big ten games.

He is a good coach. Anyone who thinks he is a top 20 coach in the country is drinking the Kool aid
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Playing against the awful BT west has built many ‘legendary’ coaches.
 




more from ESPN on the allegations:

From Schill: "In determining an appropriate penalty for the head coach, I focused too much on what the report concluded he didn't know and not enough on what he should have known," Schill wrote. "As the head coach of one of our athletics programs, coach Fitzgerald is not only responsible for what happens within the program but also must take great care to uphold our institutional commitment to the student experience. ... Clearly, he failed to uphold that commitment, and I failed to sufficiently consider that failure in levying a sanction."

It will be interesting to see what the final report comes out as in full, but making it seem more and more likely it's going to be a lengthy suspension versus firing for Fitz.
 

If anything in the Daily Wildcat article is true, Fitz and his staff are going to be fired for cause before training camp, and the NU administration will not be paying any buyout to do it.

The two week suspension is there so that the general counsel's office can get the paperwork drawn up. Fitz is toast.
 

Great.. They fire Fitz and we have to listen to how PJ is at the top of their list.
 

upnorthkid said:
more from ESPN on the allegations:

From Schill: "In determining an appropriate penalty for the head coach, I focused too much on what the report concluded he didn't know and not enough on what he should have known," Schill wrote. "As the head coach of one of our athletics programs, coach Fitzgerald is not only responsible for what happens within the program but also must take great care to uphold our institutional commitment to the student experience. ... Clearly, he failed to uphold that commitment, and I failed to sufficiently consider that failure in levying a sanction."

It will be interesting to see what the final report comes out as in full, but making it seem more and more likely it's going to be a lengthy suspension versus firing for Fitz.
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That may be right, but the house is on fire right now. These administrators have to make a decision now, even though they have what is likely imperfect and incomplete information. That's why administrators make the big bucks, they have to make really tough calls. https://chicago.suntimes.com/2023/7...ed-to-pat-fitzgerald-suspension-ncaa-football
 




DCinOK said:
Hazing in any way, shape, or form is the stupidest thing ever. Horrendously, it's been seen in sports programs, military institutions, frats, sororities, etc. Hideous and stupid. Treat the members of your team/group/organization like humans.
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I agree. I don't think it's ever going to be eliminated, but it seems there's a "how bad can we make it" mentality that somehow always incorporates gay sex into the process. I'm old and I went to a small college where there were no fraternities, but the football players had a little club that requires an initiation, but it was mostly harmless stuff like soaking a jockstrap in syrup and dumping birdseed on it and making the guy where it all day. Stupid, but not that demeaning.
 


Word said:
My take is this. It's very likely Fitz knew this stuff is going on (and if he didn't, he needs better oversight of his team). In this day and age when there's a scandal of this nature and your teams also suck, you're probably fired. But if Fitz knew and didn't do anything, I don't see how the school keeps him.
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You think the school lied?
 



PMWinSTP said:
Your post that I responded to...first line..."very likely Fitz knew"...
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When did the university say he for sure didn't know?

Also, if he didn't know, that is also on him because he should know what's going on in his program. This doesn't sound like a one-off incident done by one or two players.

I'm not saying Fitz should go to jail. I just think that a coach a) either knowing about this and not doing anything, or b) not knowing about something that shows he's lost oversight of his program and c) doesn't have very good football teams is a coach that won't be employed much longer.

My opinion doesn't matter. It's just my speculation about what will happen. Just like predicting the score of a game.
 


PMWinSTP said:
Did you read the executive summary that was released?
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I mean it just says they did not find sufficient evidence to believe the coaching staff knew. And further from Schill in his update:
"The confidential report concluded that while there was corroborating evidence that hazing had occurred, there was no direct evidence that Coach Fitzgerald was aware of the hazing."

Hard to say. Do you read between the lines and say there were some saying he might have known or do you say there's nothing direct from Fitz and take him at his word? Don't know if it'll matter when it's all said and done but we shall see
 

PMWinSTP said:
Did you read the executive summary that was released?
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Do you mean quotes like below? They are basically agreeing that Fitz should have known. I would also say the first part just says the evidence can't prove he knew. I'm just skeptical that he and/or his staff wouldn't know. The university president has even backtracked and said he focused too much on what Fitz didn't know and not on what he should have known.

"The investigation team did not discover sufficient evidence to believe that coaching staff knew about the ongoing hazing conduct. They determined, however, that there had been significant opportunities to discover and report the hazing conduct."

I'm not a lawyer and don't know how firing for just cause would work, but I think at a minimum he's embarrassed NW and as bad as his teams have been, this doesn't bode well for him.
 
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Pretty damning stuff.

dailynorthwestern.com

Former NU football player details hazing allegations

Content warning: This article contains mention of hazing, sexual assault and suicidal ideation. A former Northwestern University football player told The Daily some of the hazing conduct investigated by the university involved coerced sexual acts. A second player confirmed these details. The...
dailynorthwestern.com dailynorthwestern.com
 

upnorthkid said:
and with that he has made it look infinitely worse from an embarrassing to the University standpoint
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Caving to public outrage is part and parcel of university PR. This has the potential to get messier and expensive.

Did President Schill read the report before yesterday? Does the report support the allegations? Yes, no? If it did why the weak penalty? If it didn’t why is he changing his tune now?
 

Word said:
Do you mean quotes like below? They are basically agreeing that Fitz should have known. I would also say the first part just says the evidence can't prove he knew. I'm just skeptical that he and/or his staff wouldn't know. The university president has even backtracked and said he focused too much on what Fitz didn't know and not on what he should have known.

"The investigation team did not discover sufficient evidence to believe that coaching staff knew about the ongoing hazing conduct. They determined, however, that there had been significant opportunities to discover and report the hazing conduct."
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^Assuming the allegations are not exaggerated or even fabricated. If I had to guess something happened but hard to know what or to what degree. The player alleged Fitz would clap over his head to order a run. Are we taking that at face value? Other team members stating this guy is basically full of it.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Caving to public outrage is part and parcel of university PR. This has the potential to get messier and expensive.

Did President Schill read the report before yesterday? Does the report support the allegations? Yes, no? If it did why the weak penalty? If it didn’t why is he changing his tune now?
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It could be a) he realized he made a mistake, b) was hoping to sweep it under the rug and didn't realize it would go so public, c) is caving to public pressure, or d) some combination of a, b, and c.
 

Spaulding!No! said:
Playing against the awful BT west has built many ‘legendary’ coaches.
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Not really.
Only Wisconsin coach to get fired since 1993 was fired for not being good enough in the west.
Illinois has fired multiple coaches
Ferentz had more big ten titles before the west than after
Nebraska has fired multiple coaches…appeared in a conference title game during legends/leaders but not east/west

Minnesota fired one coach but I would argue he was interim

Northwestern firing Pat Fitzgerald is as much for on field performance as it would be for the hazing (if it happened)

Purdue fired multiple coaches



Excluding Covid year:
Fitzgerald 43% conference winning percentage pre-East/West
39% conf winning percentage during east/west
 
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Pompous Elitist said:
^Assuming the allegations are not exaggerated or even fabricated. If I had to guess something happened but hard to know what or to what degree. The player alleged Fitz would clap over his head to order a run. Are we taking that at face value? Other team members stating this guy is basically full of it.
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True but even the university seems to be admitting those things happened. Question just seems to be who knew and/or should have known.
 

if the behavior described by the complaint is accurate, it's hard to believe that someone didn't know. there are a lot of people connected to a D1 P5 football program - student assistants, equipment managers and assistants, trainers and assistants, strength & training staff, academic support, video people and so forth. not to mention players' girlfriends and family members.

BUT - allegations are just that - allegations. I believe something happened - but I also think that it is very possible that the alleged misconduct may be have exaggerated or overblown by a disgruntled former player or players.

look - I could be dead wrong - but Fitz just doesn't seem like the kind of person who would cover up activity like this. if things were that bad, and he knew about it, I think Fitz would have done something.

remember the U of MN faculty person - Jason Stahl - who was going after the Gopher FB program for alleged player mistreatment? people have agendas.
 

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