FSU Want to leave ACC and come to B1G

If FSU wants out, they should have to pay, just like Texas and OU agreed to pay.

FSU shouldn’t just get to throw itself on the grocery store floor kicking and screaming (= file a lawsuit) to get what they want. As a parent, you have to teach your children that they don’t get whatever they want, just because they want it. That’s not how the world works.
 

And what would be their prize? Getting bashed in the skull on a yearly basis by the SEC programs? How often do you think FSU would ever win the SEC? :sneaky:
I don't think Oklahoma will ever win it either to be honest.
 

If FSU wants out, they should have to pay, just like Texas and OU agreed to pay.

FSU shouldn’t just get to throw itself on the grocery store floor kicking and screaming (= file a lawsuit) to get what they want. As a parent, you have to teach your children that they don’t get whatever they want, just because they want it. That’s not how the world works.
Filing a lawsuit is often a way to start a negotiation.
Seriously what world do you live in? Seems wild in your brain
 

Did the WCHA somehow hinder the academic endeavors of the U? No. Grant administrators don't care about athletics. It's an artificial distinction and if the University or any Big 10 member university doesn't want to associate with an institution for research purposes, it need not let athletics dictate that affiliation.

Easy fix - FSU, your football players are not as smart as our rocket surgeon football players and thus, you are not part of the consortium.

MIT, your football players are not as fast and strong as our superhuman football players. You may join our research consortium but you will not join our athletic league.

It's a ridiculous suggestion that there should be some kind of academic purity among institutions when we're all here because of a few revenue sports, very few of the participants of which would attain admission to the institutions of our favorite leagues based on their own academic merits. Even before NIL and the portal era, the idea that our football, basketball and hockey players were " scholar athletes" was an antiquated and naive belief.
No, but that's not relevant as there wasn't a B1G conference in Men's hockey until Penn State added a D1 Men's team.

There's also not a B1G conference in women's hockey, and so they keep playing in the WCHA. But should enough B1G teams add women's hockey, they would all suddenly be playing in the B1G conference.

The fact of the matter is, whether or not they should be linked, the conference is used both in the athletics sphere and the academics sphere and there's no major reason to stop using it for both.

Also you say it's easy to say "FSU, your academics aren't good enough so you don't get to be in the research consortium" but it's not. FSU is literally suing the ACC to get out of the conference, you don't think they'd sue to try to force the B1G to let them into the research consortium?
 

Yeah that makes sense. Pay lawyers a bunch a money to start a conversation that could just start for free!

Are you really serious that you think that’s how that works?

You go the free route first. Obviously.


You avoid lawsuits at all costs. They’re expensive and risky as hell.
 


The fact that the AAU passed FSU over for membership, tells you all you need to know.

The school isn’t good enough.

Hopefully the Big Ten stays true to its identity and soul.
 

I don't understand why they're so pressed on this over missing this year's Final Four when the issue goes away next year anyway. Move on. Going to the SEC to go 5-7 or B1G to go 7-5 won't make things bet

No, but that's not relevant as there wasn't a B1G conference in Men's hockey until Penn State added a D1 Men's team.

There's also not a B1G conference in women's hockey, and so they keep playing in the WCHA. But should enough B1G teams add women's hockey, they would all suddenly be playing in the B1G conference.

The fact of the matter is, whether or not they should be linked, the conference is used both in the athletics sphere and the academics sphere and there's no major reason to stop using it for both.

Also you say it's easy to say "FSU, your academics aren't good enough so you don't get to be in the research consortium" but it's not. FSU is literally suing the ACC to get out of the conference, you don't think they'd sue to try to force the B1G to let them into the research consortium?
The point isn't that there was no B1G hockey conference, it's that linking athletics to research is artificial.

Re: Potential FSU litigation. Freedom of association. What's to prevent FSU or any school from suing the B1G for excluding them from any endeavor, athletic or academic? Nothing. Frivolous lawsuits happen. It's a hollow argument.
 

Yeah that makes sense. Pay lawyers a bunch a money to start a conversation that could just start for free!

Are you really serious that you think that’s how that works?

You go the free route first. Obviously.


You avoid lawsuits at all costs. They’re expensive and risky as hell.
That really is how it works. You think lawyers aren't intimately involved in negotiations pre-litigation? They are.

And in FSU's case, it's well known that they've engaged outside counsel long ago and have pressed the ACC for more favorable division of revenue. This isn't something that's sprung up overnight. The CFP snub was simply the final straw.
 

That really is how it works. You think lawyers aren't intimately involved in negotiations pre-litigation? They are.
That doesn’t mean a lawsuit is filed. Lawyers being invoked is not in any way shape or form equal to a lawsuit being filed.

“Hey company X, this is company Y. We really like the tech you’ve developed and are interested in starting talks about how we can license this from you. So we’re going to file a lawsuit against you.”

Come on …


And in FSU's case, it's well known that they've engaged outside counsel long ago and have pressed the ACC for more favorable division of revenue. This isn't something that's sprung up overnight. The CFP snub was simply the final straw.
None of the things you said was “engage in negotiations to see if a reasonable amount for the GoR buyout can be agreed to by all parties”.

That’s the actual reasonable thing.
 



Also love “more favorable division of revenue.” :ROFLMAO:

As if it is in any way legitimate that all fully vested members of a conference receive un-equal shares of conference revenue.

That’s a farce. That’s not a conference.
 

it's that linking athletics to research is artificial.
Humans divides themselves into identities.

It’s quite natural to be tribal and want to identify with a tribe.

So, reject your premise.
 


"Florida State's decision to file action against the Conference is in direct conflict with their longstanding obligations and is a clear violation of their legal commitments to the other members of the Conference," the statement said. "All ACC members, including Florida State, willingly and knowingly re-signed the current Grant of Rights in 2016, which is wholly enforceable and binding through 2036. Each university has benefited from this agreement, receiving millions of dollars in revenue and neither Florida State nor any other institution, has ever challenged its legitimacy."


Yes, don’t forget that the ESPN only gave the ACC the deal they got because the conf members were willing to sign such a right GoR!

They (FSU) got those tens of millions per year because they signed the GoR.


They need to get bitchslapped so hard in court.
 



I almost hate to post this, because I know MPLS will start screaming "clickbait" at me.

But, FWIW - was listening to Greg Flugaur. He said that there have already been 3rd-party communications between FSU and B1G representatives. according to Flugaur, he has been told that IF FSU becomes available, the B1G would be very interested. but the B1G does not want to have an odd number of teams, so another team would have to be willing to come along.

the B1G's dream would be Notre Dame. If they are unwilling or unable, then the most likely targets would be Clemson or Miami (Fla). North Carolina is less likely.

again, all of this depends on FSU finding a legal way to get out from under the ACC GOR. other ACC schools that may be interested in leaving are willing to sit back and see whether FSU finds a legal way to get out of the GOR.

believe it or not. just sharing what I heard.
 

I almost hate to post this, because I know MPLS will start screaming "clickbait" at me.

But, FWIW - was listening to Greg Flugaur. He said that there have already been 3rd-party communications between FSU and B1G representatives. according to Flugaur, he has been told that IF FSU becomes available, the B1G would be very interested. but the B1G does not want to have an odd number of teams, so another team would have to be willing to come along.

the B1G's dream would be Notre Dame. If they are unwilling or unable, then the most likely targets would be Clemson or Miami (Fla). North Carolina is less likely.

again, all of this depends on FSU finding a legal way to get out from under the ACC GOR. other ACC schools that may be interested in leaving are willing to sit back and see whether FSU finds a legal way to get out of the GOR.

believe it or not. just sharing what I heard.
The big ten seems pretty committed to 9 conference games not 10

Unless they change from 9 conference games to a different number, they literally can’t have 19 in the conference and make the schedule work.

Don’t understand why North Carolina and Virginia wouldn’t be the two most coveted, even maybe including Florida State
1) notre dame
2) North Carolina
3) Virginia
4) Georgia Tech
5) Clemson/Florida state - but they jump up for football reasons I guess. The 4 above them on this list expand the footprint and fit the profile much better IMO
 

The big ten seems pretty committed to 9 conference games not 10

Unless they change from 9 conference games to a different number, they literally can’t have 19 in the conference and make the schedule work.

Don’t understand why North Carolina and Virginia wouldn’t be the two most coveted, even maybe including Florida State
1) notre dame
2) North Carolina
3) Virginia
4) Georgia Tech
5) Clemson/Florida state - but they jump up for football reasons I guess. The 4 above them on this list expand the footprint and fit the profile much better IMO
Yeah, Irish and Stanford would be my next two.
 

The only upside to 20 is we can go back to having divisions. It would make most sense to grab Stanford and either FSU or UVa.

West: Washington, Oregon, USC, UCLA, Stanford

North: Nebraska, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, Purdue

Lakes: Michigan, OSU, Michigan State, Illinois, Northwestern

East: Penn State, Maryland, Rutgers, FSU, Indiana
 

I thought before Notre Dame would like to join Big Ten but locked into an NBC media deal to work around.

Now I saw this article:



Sunday, November 19, 2023

1699280597-3b5ae466ca2217a.jpg



On Saturday, Notre Dame and Comcast NBCUniversal announced a new TV deal running through 2029.

Notre Dame is expected to receive around $50 million per year from NBC, in addition to the $17 million it receives from the ACC. Notre Dame’s total compensation is slightly less than what members of the Big Ten would receive. NBC has held the rights to Notre Dame football since 1991.
 

The only upside to 20 is we can go back to having divisions. It would make most sense to grab Stanford and either FSU or UVa.

West: Washington, Oregon, USC, UCLA, Stanford

North: Nebraska, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, Purdue

Lakes: Michigan, OSU, Michigan State, Illinois, Northwestern

East: Penn State, Maryland, Rutgers, FSU, Indiana

I would like Stanford. But Big Ten doesn't want that football program that would be a sponge.
 

The only upside to 20 is we can go back to having divisions. It would make most sense to grab Stanford and either FSU or UVa.

West: Washington, Oregon, USC, UCLA, Stanford

North: Nebraska, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Iowa, Purdue

Lakes: Michigan, OSU, Michigan State, Illinois, Northwestern

East: Penn State, Maryland, Rutgers, FSU, Indiana
Yeah. 20 really a lot better logistically than 18

Play 4 every year. Play everyone else home and home every 6 years.

Top 2 go to championship but schedule is built in a way that eliminates more than 2 being unbeaten
 

This is why I feel Minnesota should come out and say that Ganglehoff's writing services were technically available for any student, un-vacate 1997 and hang the banner back up. The moral high ground thing is noble, but clearly nobody else gives two shits. UNC is happy as can be with academic fraud 100x worse than some admin writing papers.
This...put the banners up, the Michigan Fab 5, put their banners...the UNCheat scandal proved the NC2A is irrelevant. They don't have the power anymore, unless you're Cleveland State, Southern..etc.
 

I thought before Notre Dame would like to join Big Ten but locked into an NBC media deal to work around.

Now I saw this article:



Sunday, November 19, 2023

1699280597-3b5ae466ca2217a.jpg



On Saturday, Notre Dame and Comcast NBCUniversal announced a new TV deal running through 2029.

Notre Dame is expected to receive around $50 million per year from NBC, in addition to the $17 million it receives from the ACC. Notre Dame’s total compensation is slightly less than what members of the Big Ten would receive. NBC has held the rights to Notre Dame football since 1991.
Since NBC is in with B1G, would be easy to rip up that contract.
 

As a fan of another ACC school, and as someone who’s lived in FSU country, we should not want FSU in the B1G. Super obnoxious, self-entitled, mostly redneck fanbase that does not at all fit the culture of the conference. They think they’re the only reason the ACC is a decent conference. And now that they actually have some academic standards with a big rise in US News (thanks to booming population growth), they’re pretentious about academics too.

It’s a bad concoction of sucky traits. Getting shafted by the CFP couldn’t have happened to a better fanbase. I hope they pay out the nose to leave the ACC and end up stuck in the Big 12.
 

The big ten seems pretty committed to 9 conference games not 10

Unless they change from 9 conference games to a different number, they literally can’t have 19 in the conference and make the schedule work.

Don’t understand why North Carolina and Virginia wouldn’t be the two most coveted, even maybe including Florida State
1) notre dame
2) North Carolina
3) Virginia
4) Georgia Tech
5) Clemson/Florida state - but they jump up for football reasons I guess. The 4 above them on this list expand the footprint and fit the profile much better IMO
That will change to 10 when the conference expands, maybe even 11.
 

This is the FSU legal move:

"After exploring all options, I feel we are left with only this option as a way to maximize our potential as an athletic department and it's best for Florida State University," school president Richard McCullough said.

Florida State athletic director Michael Alford noted, "This isn't a relationship decision or an issue at all. It's a simple math problem. A very clear math problem."

"It really points to the mismanagement of previous conference administration in stewarding future finances for our best interests," Alford added.



In any agreement there must be an exchange of value or the contract is void, in concept anyway. And one side can argue not enough value, did not perform that end of the deal. Then it gets weak.

A few different strategies could be explored. We don't know what the goal or leverage posturing is.

For them it's the time to move, when the iron is hot, the bowl games controversy.

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And for me Notre Dame obviously would be the jewel to add. Then UNC. I like Stanford but what kind of football team is that. Oh, Pandora's box is now open. What about FSU, Pitt...


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EDIT: I changed the quote.
 
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ESPN's Pete Thamel addressed the SEC's interest in adding Florida State but noted that multiple SEC teams would be against adding the Seminoles into the conference.

"In the short term, where they go may depend if the SEC wants to play defense," Thamel said. "There's not an immediate, voracious appetite for Florida State in the SEC. It's a redundant market. Florida would obviously not be pleased if Florida State came in... I don't think Auburn or Georgia would be crying for it either. But what the SEC doesn't want is the Big Ten flag planted directly in their backyard."

Florida State's Board of Trustees granted the university permission to file a lawsuit against the ACC to challenge the current grant of rights. Currently, Florida State is to remain in the conference until 2036.

Multiple conferences have been named as potential landing spots, led by the Big Ten and SEC. Reports surfaced that the SEC has little interest in adding Florida State, but Thamel noted that the conference could add the Seminoles to block the Big Ten's expansion into the state of Florida.


----------------------------


The SEC's goal is to play a level of football that appeals to a national audience. It also already has schools in Florida (the University of Florida) and South Carolina (the University of South Carolina).

“My sense is there is more opposition than interest,” one SEC source said.

Any move on FSU and/or the others would be defensive, mainly to block the Big Ten from gaining a foothold in the region.

The Big Ten might be different. It is aggressively snapping up television draws and doesn’t care whether it makes any geographic, cultural or traditional sense. It begins next season as an 18-team entity with a four-school West Coast wing: USC, UCLA, Oregon and Washington.

The importance of the Big Ten Network getting basic cable subscriptions still matters, even as cord cutting has limited those numbers.

Adding exciting football matchups would no doubt appeal to Fox, its main television partner, let alone CBS and NBC. FSU, Clemson and Miami all bring that before UNC and UVA. Or maybe North Carolina jumps in with the first three schools.
 
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That doesn’t mean a lawsuit is filed. Lawyers being invoked is not in any way shape or form equal to a lawsuit being filed.

“Hey company X, this is company Y. We really like the tech you’ve developed and are interested in starting talks about how we can license this from you. So we’re going to file a lawsuit against you.”

Come on …



None of the things you said was “engage in negotiations to see if a reasonable amount for the GoR buyout can be agreed to by all parties”.

That’s the actual reasonable thing.
You've apparently missed the negotiations that have been going on in the ACC for the better part of a year instigated by FSU and directly related to distribution of revenue with the result being that the ACC adopted their performance incentives which FSU obviously was not satisfied with.

You know, when you slow down and digest what you are reading and then thoughtfully contribute to the forum, you actually can provide some value. When you spaz out, you look like a fool. Conference realignment is an obvious trigger and area where you have a track record of being very wrong. Take a breath.
 

This is the FSU legal move:

"After exploring all options, I feel we are left with only this option as a way to maximize our potential as an athletic department and it's best for Florida State University," school president Richard McCullough said.

Florida State athletic director Michael Alford noted, "This isn't a relationship decision or an issue at all. It's a simple math problem. A very clear math problem."

"It really points to the mismanagement of previous conference administration in stewarding future finances for our best interests," Alford added.



In any agreement there must be an exchange of value or the contract is void, in concept anyway. And one side can argue not enough value, did not perform that end of the deal. Then it gets weak.

A few different strategies could be explored. We don't know what the goal or leverage posturing is.

For them it's the time to move, when the iron is hot, the bowl games controversy.

-----

And for me Notre Dame obviously would be the jewel to add. Then UNC. I like Stanford but what kind of football team is that. Oh, Pandora's box is now open. What about FSU, Pitt...


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EDIT: I changed the quote.
For me, the next two at this point are the Irish and Stanford. Irish really should have come with Penn State.
 

Can you imagine the SEC in North Dakota and Illinois?

Now imagine Big Ten at Clemson and FSU. It could happen, probably not for a long time but not ruled out sooner.
 




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