Fleck is staying!!!

PJ Fleck is not the program.
He is the current coach of the program.

Look at it this way - Gopher Football is an apartment. PJ Fleck is the current renter. sooner or later, he will move out of the apartment and someone else will move into the apartment. If Fleck has not made a big mess of the apartment, he will get his damage deposit back.

coaches come and go. the program endures.

my loyalty is to the program. I reserve the right to be pleased or displeased at the performance of the current coach.

You may not have noticed, but in the list of recent 'tenants', Fleck has been the best. By far. Some of the other 'tenants' have left the landlords seriously considering the idea of dumping the property.
 

Commenters have said UCLA football has a poorly funded NIL & are highly in debt. Why is that? What's causing the deficit? The big question, whatever is causing UCLA & the state of California's downfall could it happen in Minnesota & the U? Save Gopher football.

part of the budget issues at UCLA have to do with athletic revenue. if you didn't notice, the Pac-12 conference no longer exists. 10 of the 12 teams left for other conferences because they were looking for better TV deals, more overall revenue and more stability. (wanting a commissioner who is not a total doofus was another incentive to leave) UCLA is also in a different situation because of the Board of Regents that govern the UC system. (which is a long story).

UCLA plays 2nd fiddle to USC in the L.A. market, and the UCLA program has not been very successful on the field for the last 25 years.

It's ironic, but MN is in a much better financial situation than UCLA - which is why UCLA is joining the B1G. they want a slice of that Fox/NBC/CBS money.
 

PJ is super replaceable but our AD is dumb so I guess I’m OK if he stays as I give Coyle a one in three chance in making a good next hire. ‘24 is super important for PJ. Last year sucked.
 

I was actually surprised to see that a lot of national sites had PJ right at the top of the list of possible coaches for UCLA. I thought this below description from The Sporting News put things into perspective quite well. I think PJ is considered a good candidate for good, but not great, P5 level jobs like UCLA. It's definitely possible to upgrade over Minnesota in the new Power 2 conferences. UCLA is probably a slight tier above Minnesota long term just because they do have a lot better local recruiting base, but as of right now, our program is in a much more stable position...some of that is due to PJ. Joining the B1G is actually going to solve some of UCLA's budget problems so they will likely be a bigger threat in a few years:

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nca...-fleck-eric-bieniemy/1e38f7aa6dd8e1a0a642cb5f

P.J. Fleck, Minnesota coach

Fleck is 50-34 at Minnesota the last seven seasons, and that includes five bowl victories. UCLA is 41-41 in the same seven-year stretch, and one could make the argument that Fleck is positioned to compete in the 18-team Big Ten with his current program. Still, Fleck could do more with the California recruiting backyard, and at 43 years old he could be a fit for a program that is switching conferences. The Gophers have won their last five bowl games and had a 11-win season in 2019. UCLA has never won 11 games in a single season.
 

I was actually surprised to see that a lot of national sites had PJ right at the top of the list of possible coaches for UCLA. I thought this below description from The Sporting News put things into perspective quite well. I think PJ is considered a good candidate for good, but not great, P5 level jobs like UCLA. It's definitely possible to upgrade over Minnesota in the new Power 2 conferences. UCLA is probably a slight tier above Minnesota long term just because they do have a lot better local recruiting base, but as of right now, our program is in a much more stable position...some of that is due to PJ. Joining the B1G is actually going to solve some of UCLA's budget problems so they will likely be a bigger threat in a few years:

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nca...-fleck-eric-bieniemy/1e38f7aa6dd8e1a0a642cb5f

P.J. Fleck, Minnesota coach

Fleck is 50-34 at Minnesota the last seven seasons, and that includes five bowl victories. UCLA is 41-41 in the same seven-year stretch, and one could make the argument that Fleck is positioned to compete in the 18-team Big Ten with his current program. Still, Fleck could do more with the California recruiting backyard, and at 43 years old he could be a fit for a program that is switching conferences. The Gophers have won their last five bowl games and had a 11-win season in 2019. UCLA has never won 11 games in a single season.
Considering who UCLA chose .... kinda a punt decision.

Now I think PJ on those lists makes a lot more sense. I ❤️ PJ, but he's generally not listed as the top tier of coaches. UCLA you might think would be aiming sorta high...

But it seems pretty clear UCLA was more concerned with saving $ than competing. In that case hoping to bring PJ seems way more plausible. Just less so that PJ would be interested.
 


Like Uncle Pat says "A high BMI & Low IQ is not a good way to go thru life". Gopher fan's prayers were answered PJ will not be turning UCLA into a National powerhouse. "The power of prayer is mightier than the sword." Mahatma Gandhi

Sounds like Uncle Pat stole that line from Dean Vernon Wormer:

"Kent Dorfmann, a .44 grade point average. Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life, son."
 


LOL. That title is misleading. He was never leaving.
 

He wasn't that serious of a contender. The LA Times listed their serious candidates and he was at the bottom in the others but it stated he had issues with ex-players.
 



LOL. That title is misleading. He was never leaving.
Don’t think I buy that for a second.

But, for whatever he real reasons are that he’ll never be forthcoming about, it didn’t work out.
 

You may not have noticed, but in the list of recent 'tenants', Fleck has been the best. By far. Some of the other 'tenants' have left the landlords seriously considering the idea of dumping the property.
Not really. He has been similar to, but not drastically better. And, I'm not advocating for him to leave. I just think we are largely in the same place we were with Mason and Kill/Claeys. He has more wins, with an easier schedule. Hope moving out of the West doesn't make last year the norm, and 2021 and 2022 are more similar with an occassional 2019.
 

Not really. He has been similar to, but not drastically better. And, I'm not advocating for him to leave. I just think we are largely in the same place we were with Mason and Kill/Claeys. He has more wins, with an easier schedule. Hope moving out of the West doesn't make last year the norm, and 2021 and 2022 are more similar with an occassional 2019.

I disagree on Fleck playing an easier schedule.

Mason played 4 non-conference games each season to Fleck's 3, and Mason's Gopher teams caught a lot of flack for making sure the non-conference slate was well-larded with cupcakes. As for Kill, he demanded the U pay up in order to dump North Carolina from the Gopher's non-conference schedule.

Mason's bowl record was 3-4. Kill was 0-3 in bowl games.

Mason was fired, in part, because his teams lost games after holding large leads.

Mason's B1G conference win % was .400. Kill's was also .400.

I was a fan of both Mason and Kill, but Fleck is better, and it ain't close.
 

I disagree on Fleck playing an easier schedule.

Mason played 4 non-conference games each season to Fleck's 3, and Mason's Gopher teams caught a lot of flack for making sure the non-conference slate was well-larded with cupcakes.

Mason's bowl record was 3-4.

Mason was fired, in part, because his teams lost games after holding large leads.

Mason's B1G conference win % was .400.

Fleck is better, and it ain't close.
AMEN

Also I love playing cupcakes .... but the Mason era cupcakes even bored me. Mason loved 40 something to 10 games that were just tiresome. Both teams looked bored at times.

Also I feel like coaching and player talent has REALLY spread out across the land of CFB, especially the lower level. Mason era games vs say Louisiana Lafayette teams ... those Louisiana teams were SO BAD, they'd run maybe a handful of plays all game, physical talent was abysmal. I swear at times they didn't even bring their entire team to the dome... Some of their linemen in those days were "I swear that guy isn't athletic, he's just fat...".

Now you see teams at that level playing a whole different games.

Don't get me wrong I'd love some 40 to 10 games to start the season again, but against some live (even if lesser) teams.
 
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Yeah, I'm in agreement with you two. For me, the biggest thing that stands out is talent across the board. Look at the Dlines that Fleck has given us. I was happy if a Mason or Kill team had TWO defensive lineman that were decent at the B1G level - with Fleck we've had Dlines that had 4 players that belonged at this level. Same with other groups like secondary, WRs, etc.
 

PJ is super replaceable but our AD is dumb so I guess I’m OK if he stays as I give Coyle a one in three chance in making a good next hire. ‘24 is super important for PJ. Last year sucked.
Yabbut- PJ is likely one good season from leaving.
 

Or maybe the fact that the Gophers play in a Power 2 conference and kids want to play in the best conferences has made MN relevant........just sayin.
Give Fleck his credit. Kid's come to Minnesota because they want to play for him. He's a good guy and he genuinely loves those kid's. He wants them to be successful on and off the field. That in itself goes a long way even for 18 and 19 year olds.
 

I disagree on Fleck playing an easier schedule.

Mason played 4 non-conference games each season to Fleck's 3, and Mason's Gopher teams caught a lot of flack for making sure the non-conference slate was well-larded with cupcakes. As for Kill, he demanded the U pay up in order to dump North Carolina from the Gopher's non-conference schedule.

Mason's bowl record was 3-4. Kill was 0-3 in bowl games.

Mason was fired, in part, because his teams lost games after holding large leads.

Mason's B1G conference win % was .400. Kill's was also .400.

I was a fan of both Mason and Kill, but Fleck is better, and it ain't close.
Disagree 100% - totally different contexts of Big Ten play and bowls. Big Ten West provided a much easier schedule for Fleck, and he inherited a much better situation than did Kill or Mason (even worse than Kill's). Bowls are a joke now (not Fleck's fault), so who cares what our record is in them. Not worth debating further. As I wrote earlier in this thread I didn't want Fleck to leave because I want to see if he can take another step.
 

Yeah, I'm in agreement with you two. For me, the biggest thing that stands out is talent across the board. Look at the Dlines that Fleck has given us. I was happy if a Mason or Kill team had TWO defensive lineman that were decent at the B1G level - with Fleck we've had Dlines that had 4 players that belonged at this level. Same with other groups like secondary, WRs, etc.
I remember sitting at a game in the Dome and a guy behind me stating that Eden Prairie's DL was bigger than the Gophers DL 😂😂
 

Disagree 100% - totally different contexts of Big Ten play and bowls. Big Ten West provided a much easier schedule for Fleck, and he inherited a much better situation than did Kill or Mason (even worse than Kill's). Bowls are a joke now (not Fleck's fault), so who cares what our record is in them. Not worth debating further. As I wrote earlier in this thread I didn't want Fleck to leave because I want to see if he can take another step.
I think the one extra tough game Mason would have to play in the Big Ten is evened out by the fact that he essentially had to face two less P5 opponents just about every season.
 

I think the one extra tough game Mason would have to play in the Big Ten is evened out by the fact that he essentially had to face two less P5 opponents just about every season.
Really? In 2019 we played three non-conference games against non-P5 and lost to two of the three teams we played with winning records. In 2021 and 2022 we played two awful Colorado teams, and lost to Bowling Green in non-conference. These are much like Mason years. Again, I don't think it is worth arguing with anyone about anymore, just think it's dumb that people are crowning Fleck like he's achieved great things when he really hasn't.

Unfortunately, with the West going away he missed what was the most attainable opportunity any of our football coaches since the 60's have ever had at some type of championship. He went 8-4 in 2021 and 2022 where he had three gimme's, much like Mason had many years non-conference, and he had a relatively easy West with Wisconsin coming back to the pack. 2023 didn't go well at all, but it was one year so that doesn't make a trend. He has provided consistent quality, but hasn't gotten over the hump to win anything.

I'm not caling for his head. As I wrote in an earlier post I want him to be our coach. I just don't think we should look at it like he's achieved great things yet. And notice, I said yet. I hope he does in the years ahead. I don't expect us to be Ohio State or Michigan, and I don't even know what "great things" will mean in this new landscape - maybe qualifying for the playoffs? Bowl games don't really mean anything anymore, especially as playoffs expand.
 

AMEN

Also I love playing cupcakes .... but the Mason era cupcakes even bored me. Mason loved 40 something to 10 games that were just tiresome. Both teams looked bored at times.

Also I feel like coaching and player talent has REALLY spread out across the land of CFB, especially the lower level. Mason era games vs say Louisiana Lafayette teams ... those Louisiana teams were SO BAD, they'd run maybe a handful of plays all game, physical talent was abysmal. I swear at times they didn't even bring their entire team to the dome... Some of their linemen in those days were "I swear that guy isn't athletic, he's just fat...".

Now you see teams at that level playing a whole different games.

Don't get me wrong I'd love some 40 to 10 games to start the season again, but against some live (even if lesser) teams.
I’ve broken down this issue before. There is no doubt in my mind the easiest era to be a coach at Minnesota in terms of scheduling was from the expansion to the 12 game schedule To the addition of Nebraska.

4 non conference games, only need 6-6 to make a bowl, miss 2 opponents per year at random. Possibility of a 3 or 4 way tie to win big ten title without needing to win a conference title game and you could go 0-1 against the other teams in the tie and still claim the title. For example the 2008 gophers team under Brewster went 7-6. Beat Northern Illinois, Bowling Green, Montana State, Florida Atlantic. Played just 1 of the top 3 teams in the big ten. Just 3 teams that finished .500 or better in the big ten. Even the 2022 team that missed both Michigan and Ohio state played 4 teams that finished .500 or better in the conference. And to win the big ten, the 2022 team would’ve had to have beaten Ohio state in an extra game. Big ten so much easier pre Nebraska expansion.



When Nebraska was added it got much harder to win a conference title but stayed about the same to make a bowl. (Kill era)

The legends and leaders were a little harder than the east west but not a huge change as Michigan was down while they were in the gophers’ division.

In the east west, the gophers have only played Indiana twice as an east west crossover game. The gophers have only played Rutgers 3 times. Those are the worst two programs in the conference.
Minnesota played Michigan 5 times since the west was created. Ohio State 5 times.

fleck has played Ohio state 3 times in 7 years
Kill/claeys played Ohio state 2 times in 6 years.

Fleck has played Michigan 3 times in 7 years.
Kill/claeys played Michigan 5 times in 6 years.

It is a little easier in the west, but not as big of a gap as some like to think. The ease of it is in making the championship game, not the schedule itself.

Disagree 100% - totally different contexts of Big Ten play and bowls. Big Ten West provided a much easier schedule for Fleck, and he inherited a much better situation than did Kill or Mason (even worse than Kill's). Bowls are a joke now (not Fleck's fault), so who cares what our record is in them. Not worth debating further. As I wrote earlier in this thread I didn't want Fleck to leave because I want to see if he can take another step.
 
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Really? In 2019 we played three non-conference games against non-P5 and lost to two of the three teams we played with winning records. In 2021 and 2022 we played two awful Colorado teams, and lost to Bowling Green in non-conference. These are much like Mason years. Again, I don't think it is worth arguing with anyone about anymore, just think it's dumb that people are crowning Fleck like he's achieved great things when he really hasn't.

Unfortunately, with the West going away he missed what was the most attainable opportunity any of our football coaches since the 60's have ever had at some type of championship. He went 8-4 in 2021 and 2022 where he had three gimme's, much like Mason had many years non-conference, and he had a relatively easy West with Wisconsin coming back to the pack. 2023 didn't go well at all, but it was one year so that doesn't make a trend. He has provided consistent quality, but hasn't gotten over the hump to win anything.

I'm not caling for his head. As I wrote in an earlier post I want him to be our coach. I just don't think we should look at it like he's achieved great things yet. And notice, I said yet. I hope he does in the years ahead. I don't expect us to be Ohio State or Michigan, and I don't even know what "great things" will mean in this new landscape - maybe qualifying for the playoffs? Bowl games don't really mean anything anymore, especially as playoffs expand.
In Mason's last 5 seasons, he played 9 P5 teams just once. The Gophers do that every year at a minimum. Last year it was 10. Will be 10 again this year.

The Big Ten schedule was tougher most years under Mason as he had to play Ohio St, Michigan, and Penn St a little more often. But he also played more "cupcakes" in the non-conference too. I think the strength overall are not that different.

In Mason's 10 win season, the Gophers went 1-3 against teams above .500 and that one win was against a 7-5 WI team. Not trying to knock Mason's accomplishments either. Just think his achievements are a little exaggerated.
 

PJ's conservative ball control offense combined with his aggressive attacking defense is a winning combination. A win win for players, recruits & fans. With PJ the program progresses forward without him we are set back decades. Remember the Metrodome & Brewster years.
 

I disagree on Fleck playing an easier schedule.

Mason played 4 non-conference games each season to Fleck's 3, and Mason's Gopher teams caught a lot of flack for making sure the non-conference slate was well-larded with cupcakes. As for Kill, he demanded the U pay up in order to dump North Carolina from the Gopher's non-conference schedule.

Mason's bowl record was 3-4. Kill was 0-3 in bowl games.

Mason was fired, in part, because his teams lost games after holding large leads.

Mason's B1G conference win % was .400. Kill's was also .400.

I was a fan of both Mason and Kill, but Fleck is better, and it ain't close.
Nonsense.
 

PJ's conservative ball control offense combined with his aggressive attacking defense is a winning combination. A win win for players, recruits & fans. With PJ the program progresses forward without him we are set back decades. Remember the Metrodome & Brewster years.
Last year our games for the first time in a long time were nearly unwatchable. You guys are clueless.
 

Last year our games for the first time in a long time were nearly unwatchable. You guys are clueless.
Depends on your definition of a long time. First time since 2017 for sure. I don’t think that is a long time
 







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