Still have faith in Pitino?

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MadtownGopher said:
Next year we'll have 6'5 Carlos Morris, 6'4+ Dupree McBrayer, and 6'8 Charles Buggs available to log minutes at the 3.
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Morris and Buggs are helping us become the worst team in the BIG, but you're excited about having their contributions back next year? And McBrayer is extremely skinny and undersized for the BIG, he is a couple years out from contributing in conference. You're really excited about this?
 

Gotta love the "if this woulda happened, then this woulda happened, and if we coulda got a break here, then one more break here, and then......" fan in justifying the gong show of a basketball team we have. That stuff is comical. What's the old saying, "you are what your record says you are"?
 

sonnygarcia said:
Morris and Buggs are helping us become the worst team in the BIG, but you're excited about having their contributions back next year? And McBrayer is extremely skinny and undersized for the BIG, he is a couple years out from contributing in conference. You're really excited about this?
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Which games have you seen McBrayer in? I'm curious how he looked specifically in the games you saw him play.

Thanks in advance.

Go Gophers!!
 

dpodoll68 said:
I don't even know what that means.
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I'm going to punt. Going back and forth with you and dissecting each other posts is not my definition of exciting, because we both agree that's what I'm all about right? You twist my words, I twist yours, you act pompous and elite and I act snarky and sarcastic. We've all seen it before and it adds nothing.

We both agree that Pitino wasn't coming to this job with a lot of experience, we disagree on whether that was by design and or a good idea or whether or not we had other options. /discussion
 

BleedGopher said:
Which games have you seen McBrayer in? I'm curious how he looked specifically in the games you saw him play.

Thanks in advance.

Go Gophers!!
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Going off of actual video footage from this summer, which shows he is about 170, maybe 175:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3X0ITz355Y

Also, his coach this summer was quoted as saying a redshirt year would be good for him at Minnesota because he is undersized.

Is that enough for you?
 


Plus, at 6'4" 170 lbs he is essentially a guard, and we will be wanting him to play the 3. So more undersized players on the wing...... I feel like we've tried this before.......
 

sonnygarcia said:
Going off of actual video footage from this summer, which shows he is about 170, maybe 175:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3X0ITz355Y

Also, his coach this summer was quoted as saying a redshirt year would be good for him at Minnesota because he is undersized.

Is that enough for you?
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This dude is primed for an epic meltdown. You need to slow your roll. Bleed was asking you a legitimate question.
 

sonnygarcia said:
Going off of actual video footage from this summer, which shows he is about 170, maybe 175:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3X0ITz355Y

Also, his coach this summer was quoted as saying a redshirt year would be good for him at Minnesota because he is undersized.

Is that enough for you?
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Ahh, a video and a quote is enough to declare someone unable to contribute to the team in conference play for a "couple of years." You may very well be right, but personally, I don't have enough confidence in my ability to judge talent from a video and quote to make such declarations. I honestly thought you had seen him play in person. My bad.

Go Gophers!!
 

dpodoll68 said:
Key word in this rambling diatribe. The rest was word salad. That horrible roster managed to win an NCAA Tournament game, btw, and was the only Minnesota roster in over a generation to do so.
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A new coach wasn't inheriting a roster that won an NCAA Tournament game. A new coach was inheriting a roster minus three starters and two reserves that averaged over 10 minutes a game.

A new coach was inheriting Andre H. (14.6 ppg), Austin (10.7), Mav (3.3), Eliason (2.2), Walker (2.2), Oto (2.2) and Wally (2.0).

Also, Tubby inherited McKenzie (14.9), Coleman (14.2), Tollackson (12.0), Abu-Shamala (6.5), Westbrook (3.5), Payton (2.2), Damian (1.6) plus two Monsen recruits (Blake and Al).
 



Maximus said:
A new coach wasn't inheriting a roster that won an NCAA Tournament game. A new coach was inheriting a roster minus three starters and two reserves that averaged over 10 minutes a game.

A new coach was inheriting Andre H. (14.6 ppg), Austin (10.7), Mav (3.3), Eliason (2.2), Walker (2.2), Oto (2.2) and Wally (2.0).
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Dont DO IT Maximus....
 


The Brain Trust said:
Morris stats this year pretty much a dead heat vs Austin Hollins last season
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except for, you know, defense. but i wouldn't expect you to realize that basketball is more than offensive stats.
 




I have total faith. Coach Pitino has the guys in situations to have success. It is up to the guys on the floor to actually succeed through their performance. THEY are not doing their jobs on the floor.
 

I still have faith in Pitino. I like the style of play, I like the way he communicates honestly and is pretty open about what is happening and why. He doesn't hide in coach speak and cliches.
Every coach misses on a recruit now and then, every coach even has some up and down seasons and every coach is always trying to learn and get better because they know they are making mistakes too. We get to watch our coach grow and learn and because of the country we live in and because we have this forum we get to second-guess and criticize. Some of which is necessary, some of which is just to vent. But being positive fans that appreciate the effort put forth by college kids and the coaching staff will help make you a better fan, not a bitter fan.
 

Go4 said:
except for, you know, defense. but i wouldn't expect you to realize that basketball is more than offensive stats.
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well rookie, steals are part of defense and Morris has a slight edge. What stats do you have to prove that Morris is way behind Hollins on D.??? I do not recall Hollins being an all big ten defensive player....
 

sonnygarcia said:
Going off of actual video footage from this summer, which shows he is about 170, maybe 175:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3X0ITz355Y

Also, his coach this summer was quoted as saying a redshirt year would be good for him at Minnesota because he is undersized.

Is that enough for you?
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I remember that article Sonny. The coach was really confusing in it because at one point he was saying McBrayer was ready to help right away and at another point he said a redshirt year would help. After reading the article I recall thinking that the coach was thinking that the year of prep school would serve like a redshirt year for McBrayer to develop.
 


MadtownGopher said:
I still have a lot of faith in Pitino. I personally can't wait for next year. I think we'll be much better than this year's squad. We'll have a ton of guards to press and run. Our big guys will still be raw, but they'll also be able to run and block shots. We will no longer have players that don't fit Pitino's system (other than maybe King).
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Interesting take given that Pitino recruited King...
 

Tubby's getting his a$$ handed to him at Texas Tech, so I'm not sure why this is even still part of the discussion: http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/team/_/id/2641/texas-tech-red-raiders

As someone who criticized this board last spring for the mad love Pitino was given after an 8-10 B1G season, it's equally ridiculous to question whether he's the right coach this early. He probably overachieved a little last year, and is underachieving a little bit right now. Other than Maryland, 5 of our B1G losses have been by 5 points or less. If we were losing these games by 15-20 points it would be more of a cause for concern. Our next 4 games are all winnable (ILL, @PSU, Neb, Purdue), so let's see how the team responds.
We haven't been helped out by the departures of McNeil, Martin, and the other transfer that was kicked off the team. That's 0-3 and some of the blame falls on Pitino. If we had 1-2 more players to add depth, shooting, an defense we probably have 1-2 more wins this year.

We are also going to feel the repercussions of failing to land any of the Big 3 plus JP last year for a while. It will take some time to recover from that. Our recruiting in Minnesota has to improve for us to take the next step. Jarvis and Hurt will help, Coffey and Trent would be huge.
 

John Galt said:
Interesting take given that Pitino recruited King...
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I think it would be more appropriate to say that Pitino filled a gap with King. I don't think anyone would say that King is the type of recruit that Pitino would normally be looking for under more ideal conditions than when he took King on. The kid we were after was Buckles, a totally different type of player. When that fell through King became available and filled a need.

Regarding Dupree McBrayer who has been discussed in this thread I found an interesting article on him. He is actually viewed as a combo guard pg or sg - not so much as a wing. This would be good news as we would be looking at longer guards which makes a team tough defensively if the length is accompanied by quickness. It also appears that he could have been in college this year but decided to go a year of prep to develop more- perhaps this is what his coach meant by the red shirt comment

http://www.rumbleinthegarden.com/st...4/7/30/5953189/st-johns-dupree-mcbrayer-offer
 

John Galt said:
Tubby's getting his a$$ handed to him at Texas Tech, so I'm not sure why this is even still part of the discussion: http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/team/_/id/2641/texas-tech-red-raiders

As someone who criticized this board last spring for the mad love Pitino was given after an 8-10 B1G season, it's equally ridiculous to question whether he's the right coach this early. He probably overachieved a little last year, and is underachieving a little bit right now. Other than Maryland, 5 of our B1G losses have been by 5 points or less. If we were losing these games by 15-20 points it would be more of a cause for concern. Our next 4 games are all winnable (ILL, @PSU, Neb, Purdue), so let's see how the team responds.
We haven't been helped out by the departures of McNeil, Martin, and the other transfer that was kicked off the team. That's 0-3 and some of the blame falls on Pitino. If we had 1-2 more players to add depth, shooting, an defense we probably have 1-2 more wins this year.

We are also going to feel the repercussions of failing to land any of the Big 3 plus JP last year for a while. It will take some time to recover from that. Our recruiting in Minnesota has to improve for us to take the next step. Jarvis and Hurt will help, Coffey and Trent would be huge.
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A very fair, level-headed post on the Gopher program's current situation. Thank you.
 

How's Billy Donovan doing this year at Florida? How many recruits did he inherit?

My point: Sometimes teams just don't succeed. Sometimes you just have to push through and move on.
 

I still have faith. My only concern is his recruiting of big men so far
 

I still have faith in pitino. I just worry about recruits deciding not to come here because it looks like this could be a lost season and next year looks like not a very good season. I hope I am wrong about next season, but with a lot of young and inexperience it looks that way.
 

tinyarch said:
How's Billy Donovan doing this year at Florida? How many recruits did he inherit?

My point: Sometimes teams just don't succeed. Sometimes you just have to push through and move on.
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Billy Donovan has a long and historic run of success to fall back on and give their fanbase the expectation that the team will bounce back. (I'd love to have their 3-2 conference record, btw.) Richard Pitino has an NIT championship and a 36% winning percentage in the Big Ten.
 

dpodoll68 said:
Billy Donovan has a long and historic run of success to fall back on and give their fanbase the expectation that the team will bounce back. (I'd love to have their 3-2 conference record, btw.) Richard Pitino has an NIT championship and a 36% winning percentage in the Big Ten.
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So. What do you propose we do knowing what we know today?
 

Winasota Gopher said:
So. What do you propose we do knowing what we know today?
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I wouldn't have fired Tubby Smith in the first place, particularly not after the school's best season in 23 years. But putting that aside, I wouldn't have hired a 30-year-old with 1 year of head coaching experience to be a head coach in the Big Ten. But putting that aside, now that he's here, if he doesn't make the Tournament by the end of 2015-16, he should be gone in my book. You don't fire a coach with 3 tournament appearances in 6 years (never before done at this school) and Tournament appearances in his 2nd and 3rd years to keep a coach who can't make one (let alone two) in 3 years. People hated Tubby so much and wanted him gone so badly that they couldn't see how firing him set his successor up for unrealistic expectations.
 

dpodoll68 said:
I wouldn't have fired Tubby Smith in the first place, particularly not after the school's best season in 23 years. But putting that aside, I wouldn't have hired a 30-year-old with 1 year of head coaching experience to be a head coach in the Big Ten. But putting that aside, now that he's here, if he doesn't make the Tournament by the end of 2015-16, he should be gone in my book. You don't fire a coach with 3 tournament appearances in 6 years (never before done at this school) and Tournament appearances in his 2nd and 3rd years to keep a coach who can't make one (let alone two) in 3 years. People hated Tubby so much and wanted him gone so badly that they couldn't see how firing him set his successor up for unrealistic expectations.
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Meanwhile in the real world
 

He's only a year-and-a-half into his tenure here, and I've seen some positive happenings in that window, so I'm not bailing on Pitino yet. I'm giving him 5 years to build his program; run through 5 recruiting cycles and show what he can do. If he's not in a significantly better place by that time then I'll reassess.
 

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