PJ Fleck compares Gophers' 'line of success' to the stock market

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Per Joe:

Being consistently good to great is not the expectation Gophers football fans should have, according to head coach P.J. Fleck, who on Monday – following a 37-3 drubbing at the hands of Ohio State on Saturday – compared the line of success for most college teams to the stock market.

"The line of success...it is a jagged line. It looks like the stock market. And some programs, their jagged line is all the way at the top and it's just a little squiggly, but there aren't deep valleys and there are always high peaks, but there are dips," Fleck said.

"Winning's hard. It's really hard. We've had some really close wins, we've had some really close losses. We've had some unbelievable wins and some heartbreaking losses," Fleck continued. "All of that is teaching these guys lessons, teaching our coaches lessons. Finding ways to be able to do it better and grow and learn from the lessons of why."


Go Gophers!!
 

Squawk talk, right out of the Beginners' coaching hand book.
 


I expect a bounce back next year. Whatever changes need to be made to make that happen need to happen. I have faith in the system that's in place, I think we have some wonky pieces in the offensive gameplan at both the coaching and player level which need some overhaul.
 

mngg11 said:
I expect a bounce back next year. Whatever changes need to be made to make that happen need to happen. I have faith in the system that's in place, I think we have some wonky pieces in the offensive gameplan at both the coaching and player level which need some overhaul.
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We have a rough schedule yet again next year so not sure how high to set expectations. I wouldn’t expect to look as ugly in the easier games though.
 


CentralGopher said:
We have a rough schedule yet again next year so not sure how high to set expectations. I wouldn’t expect to look as ugly in the easier games though.
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You've got to earn the bad ones back. After some real bad outings against middle to bad opponents, we need to string together some real good outings against the middle to good opponents next year. The way you punch above your weight class is beat everyone you should and steal a few you shouldn't. If you reverse that, drop all the ones you should and choke away some of the ones you shouldn't, it gets ugly fast.
 


Fans don't want to hear it but with very few exceptions nearly every team has ups and downs. Coaches that have more ups than downs and are able to avoid prolonged down periods keep their jobs and get to keep going. Those that don't get fired.

At this point Fleck has had more good years than bad ones. Seasons like the one we are having are going to happen from time to time (heck, seasons like the one we are having right now were the norm not that long ago). It will be on Fleck to make sure that 2023 is just a brief dip and we get back to trending upwards again going forward.
 

Some guy said:
The nice thing about being a fan is you can criticize the coach for saying nothing and also for saying anything
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Coaches get the accolades, and the arrows. Not everyone is built to deal with it. Clemson HC, for example.
 



Did anyone assume the Gophers would win 8+ games every single season?

Be competitive — long term — with the likes of Iowa and Wisconsin. Anything more than that is exceeding any reasonable expectations.

The NIL stuff will make this even more difficult going forward.
 


RememberMurray said:
Did anyone assume the Gophers would win 8+ games every single season?

Be competitive — long term — with the likes of Iowa and Wisconsin. Anything more than that is exceeding any reasonable expectations.

The NIL stuff will make this even more difficult going forward.
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No. But this year the team should currently be 7-4
They gave away 2 games. So that’s frustrating
 

RememberMurray said:
Did anyone assume the Gophers would win 8+ games every single season?

Be competitive — long term — with the likes of Iowa and Wisconsin. Anything more than that is exceeding any reasonable expectations.

The NIL stuff will make this even more difficult going forward.
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I'll sheepishly raise my hand. I'm a realist, but based on the past few seasons I've come to believe that 8 win seasons should be our new normal. Fleck was hired to raise the standard in the win/loss column, which he has minus the occasional blip year like this one. Next year might be tough but if we can retain our talent and keep the injury bug away, we can be competitive with the likes of USC and UCLA. Washington and Oregon are definitely peaking at the moment so we'll need our very best to stay with them. I don't know. It's hard for me to get too down on this team. I've seen too much good the past few years to think that we're on some predestined long term downswing. NIL be damned.
 




proudgopher said:
I like PJ but he set the standard, not us, to be "elite" and to always "improve your best." That's a high bar, but he set it and now has to achieve those lofty goals.
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You absolutely should have high expectations! But we need to remember that the line on the chart is jagged, not straight up. No team gets better every season. At Minnesota, there will be ups and downs. It's inevitable. We're a developmental program. With realignment it will get even more difficult.
 

MNVCGUY said:
Fans don't want to hear it but with very few exceptions nearly every team has ups and downs. Coaches that have more ups than downs and are able to avoid prolonged down periods keep their jobs and get to keep going. Those that don't get fired.

At this point Fleck has had more good years than bad ones. Seasons like the one we are having are going to happen from time to time (heck, seasons like the one we are having right now were the norm not that long ago). It will be on Fleck to make sure that 2023 is just a brief dip and we get back to trending upwards again going forward.
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You are saying nobody should expect any more for $6 or 7 million dollars a year? It's a difficult job.
 

Every so often the stock market does more than ups and downs: it crashes. Hope this season was just a "down" to be followed by an "up." If instead it is a pre-crash tremor, the next couple of years could be tough! Might need the Federal Reserve to pump some cash into our fledgling NIL collective.
 

Well, I don’t think it’s necessarily the record that has people the most upset and questioning the staff, It’s the type of losses, blow the huge lead against NW, failing to get a first down with 2 great chances against Illinois to close it out and instead giving up huge plays to a cold backup and lose, and getting waxed by probably one of the 2 weakest teams in the league (Purdue).
When coach took the job he said, if I recall, that those days of blowing leads etc. were over, they apparently are not and here we are again, the feeling is real.
 


60's Guy said:
You are saying nobody should expect any more for $6 or 7 million dollars a year? It's a difficult job.
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The coaches pay has nothing to do with it. We are not the kind of program that is going to be able to win at a high level every single year without the occasional dip in performance. You may not like hearing that but it is the truth and it is not just the truth for us.....it applies to Wisconsin, Iowa, Purdue, Northwestern, Illinois, Michigan State, Nebraska, Rutgers, Maryland, Indiana and really all but the very few teams that are at the top year in and year out. And heck, even those programs have down years sometimes.

Fans are always going to have lofty goals and expectations but there should also be understanding that down years are going to happen.

Right now 2023 is a step back from the past couple of seasons. But it is just one year and does not warrant the freak out level that it has drawn from some fans.
 


MNVCGUY said:
The coaches pay has nothing to do with it. We are not the kind of program that is going to be able to win at a high level every single year without the occasional dip in performance. You may not like hearing that but it is the truth and it is not just the truth for us.....it applies to Wisconsin, Iowa, Purdue, Northwestern, Illinois, Michigan State, Nebraska, Rutgers, Maryland, Indiana and really all but the very few teams that are at the top year in and year out. And heck, even those programs have down years sometimes.

Fans are always going to have lofty goals and expectations but there should also be understanding that down years are going to happen.

Right now 2023 is a step back from the past couple of seasons. But it is just one year and does not warrant the freak out level that it has drawn from some fans.
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Read proudgopher in post #15...I'm not the one setting the bar. And post #18 is a lot of it.
 
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Tech Machine said:
Well, I don’t think it’s necessarily the record that has people the most upset and questioning the staff, It’s the type of losses, blow the huge lead against NW, failing to get a first down with 2 great chances against Illinois to close it out and instead giving up huge plays to a cold backup and lose, and getting waxed by probably one of the 2 weakest teams in the league (Purdue).
When coach took the job he said, if I recall, that those days of blowing leads etc. were over, they apparently are not and here we are again, the feeling is real.
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Your first part is definitely a big reason for the frustration. We lost some very winnable games and that sucks.

In regards to your last line you are not recalling things correctly....no coach in their right mind would promise something like that.
 

60's Guy said:
Read proudgopher in post #15...I'm not the one setting the bar.
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Yeah well proudgopher doesn't understand the bar Fleck set because right from the very beginning he showed that graph with the jagged success line. He didn't just make that up this year.

The goal is always to be trending up and in the right direction as a program but it isn't going to come without some dips along the way.
 


MNVCGUY said:
Yeah well proudgopher doesn't understand the bar Fleck set because right from the very beginning he showed that graph with the jagged success line. He didn't just make that up this year.

The goal is always to be trending up and in the right direction as a program but it isn't going to come without some dips along the way.
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fair enough...I'd agree with that
 

60's Guy said:
You are saying nobody should expect any more for $6 or 7 million dollars a year? It's a difficult job.
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Your expectations are your expectations; you have every right to set them as you choose... just like the rest of us.

Speaking of: What are your own expectations? Please be specific. Wins per year, every year... maybe set a floor and a ceiling for win totals, based on your expectations.

And... regarding the "$6 or $7 million dollars" part: does anyone know how Fleck's salary compares to other B1G coaches?
 

kisarazu said:
6mil is the 28th or so highest paid HC in CFB so we should at least expect bowl games.
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Fleck has accomplished that, almost every single season. If we get to a bowl this season it will be 5 out of 7 since Fleck took over, with the first season and the COVID year being the only outliers.

So far, Fleck is 4-0 in bowls as Gopher coach, with wins over Georgia Tech, Auburn, West Virginia and Syracuse.
 


RememberMurray said:
Your expectations are your expectations; you have every right to set them as you choose... just like the rest of us.

Speaking of: What are your own expectations? Please be specific. Wins per year, every year... maybe set a floor and a ceiling for win totals, based on your expectations.

And... regarding the "$6 or $7 million dollars" part: does anyone know how Fleck's salary compares to other B1G coaches?
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The expectation is for coaches not to blow games players have won.
 

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