Marcus Fuller blog: If Gophers started a true freshman QB it would be risky

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It's a long time before any decision will be made on the Gophers' starting quarterback job.

But coach Jerry Kill and offensive coordinator Matt Limegrover might be considering starting true freshman Max Shortell in the 2011 season, especially if the Kansas City native completely blows them away with his pocket presence and ability to read defenses in the fall.

But would that be the best thing for Minnesota and for Shortell's future? Maybe not.

It wouldn't be shocking to me if Kill ends up using two quarterbacks (junior MarQueis Gray and Shortell), especially if Gray is still not completely where he needs to be after two-a-days in August and Shortell progresses quickly starting this summer. Kill eluded to the possibility of playing two quarterbacks this season after the spring game, because he did it at Northern Illinois.

Here's some info I looked up on several quarterbacks who started as true freshman in recent Big Ten history. The numbers are mostly average at best with former Michigan and current Miami Dolphins quarterback Chad Henne as an exception.

In 2010, Rob Bolden won the starting job for Penn State as a true freshman after only joining the team in the summer. He had a decent debut going 20-for-29 for 238 yards with two touchdowns and one interception against Youngstown State. But he had his "welcome to college football" experience in his second game against Alabama.

Bolden ended up throwing for 1,360 yards with five touchdowns and seven interceptions last season. He went through a rough five-game stretch with only two touchdowns and six interceptions before suffering a head injury against Minnesota on Oct. 23. He never got back into the mix after that when former walk-on Matt McGloin shined.

Tate Forcier was only the second quarterback ever to start every game for Michigan as a true freshman in 2009. The other player was Henne. Forcier passed for 2,050 yards with 13 touchdowns and 10 interceptions. He led the Wolverines to a 4-0 start, but they finished the season 1-7. Forcier, who eventually lost his spot to Denard Robinson, was sacked 25 times his first year. Robinson was only sacked seven times as Michigan's starter last season.

In 2004, Henne had an amazing season for a true freshman while throwing for a school-record tying 25 touchdowns with only 12 interceptions. But he was the 13th best high school player in the nation, according to Rivals.com. Henne was also surrounded offensively by future NFL receivers Braylon Edwards, Jason Avant, Steve Breaston.

-- Missouri's Blaine Gabbert and former Kansas State and current Tampa Bay Bucs quarterback Josh Freeman both worked with the same trainer, Skip Stitzell, as Shortell in high school.

Both also played as true freshmen in college. But they weren't starters from Day One.

After the fifth game of the season in 2006, Freeman took over as the Kansas State starter and showed glimpses of his potential despite throwing for only six touchdowns and 15 interceptions. He started the next two seasons and threw a combined 38 touchdowns with 19 interceptions.

But the best scenario this season for Shortell in my opinion would be to start his career like Gabbert did.

Gabbert got a little taste early seeing action in five games straight out of high school in 2008. He then thrived as a first-time starter the following season as a sophomore and earned All-Big 12 honors throwing for 3,593 yards and 24 touchdowns.

It's also important to note that Heisman Trophy-winning quarterbacks Tim Tebow and Cam Newton (left Florida for junior college following season) weren't asked to start but saw some time in their first college seasons.

Big Ten true freshman starting quarterbacks since 2003

School Player Comp. Att. Yards TDs INTs Year
Penn St Rob Bolden 112 193 1360 5 7 2010
Michigan Tate Forcier 165 281 2050 13 10 2009
Ohio St Terrelle Pryor 100 165 1311 12 4 2008
Illinois Juice Williams 103 261 1489 9 9 2006
Michigan Chad Henne 240 399 2743 25 12 2004
Gophers Max Shortell ???
 

So he's suggesting we start Gray for five games and then bench him in favor of Shortell? Wat?
 

That's a doubtful premise backed by cursory research. Marcus should switch to being a political writer.

At best Shortell becomes the number 2 QB by the end of the season. But unless Gray has a season ending injury, Kill will not burn his redshirt to take a few snaps.
 

What am I missing, when did Max Shortell become the second coming? I would be perfectly happy if he never sees the field this fall.
 


mkAz said:
What am I missing, when did Max Shortell become the second coming? I would be perfectly happy if he never sees the field this fall.
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Completely agree. Seems like a decent prospect and possibly a good QB down the line, but Gray has much better athleticism, more knowledge of the offense, and more practice running it. Not sure why Marcus is trying to push a QB competition that really isn't there.
 

Just as silly to me as those that wanted to bench Weber to give Gray early reps.
 

Marcus is rapidly approaching Myron territory with his terrible Gray takes. Among numerous other errors in the article, comparing Shortell at this stage to any of Henne, Freeman, or Gabbert is ridiculous and laughable.

Henne - #13 overall prospect, #3 QB, U.S. Army All-American, multiple BCS offers; Michigan had just graduated John Navarre, and Henne's only reasonable competition at QB was Clayton Richard, who is now a professional baseball pitcher for the Padres

Freeman - #92 overall prospect, #4 QB, U.S. Army All-American, multiple BCS offers; his QB competition at Kansas St. was Dylan Meier, a lightly-recruited ATH who should've been playing practically anywhere but QB

Gabbert - #14 overall prospect, #1 QB, U.S. Army All-American, multiple BCS offers; Missouri had nothing to lose by letting him play his true freshman year, because it was a virtual guarantee that he would declare for the draft after 3 years regardless of circumstances

Shortell - NR overall prospect, #22 QB, only offer (BCS or otherwise) was Minnesota; Minnesota has an Army All-American QB (and #3 dual-threat QB) with 2 years of playing experience in front of him

No one should be expecting anything more out of Shortell than to get in fall camp, learn the playbook, and spend the next 2 years preparing himself to be the starting QB in 2013. You can put this in writing, or set it as a bookmark, or whatever you desire:

If MarQueis Gray is not under center in LA on Sept. 3, and does not play the overwhelming majority of snaps at QB each of the next two seasons (barring injury, of course), I will never post on this website again.
 

Stop the madness. This is really bordering on crazy talk. I want to see your birth certificate.

SHORTELL WILL NOT PLAY A DOWN IN 2011.

Kill will not waste a year of Shortell's eligibilty for an experimental down or two.

SHORTELL WILL NOT PLAY A DOWN IN 2011.

He has 4 upper classmen ahead of him.

SHORTELL WILL NOT PLAY A DOWN IN 2011.

Lueck will play before Shortell sees the field. He is very smart and knows the playbook. He's also the holder on kicks.

SHORTELL WILL NOT PLAY A DOWN IN 2011.

Rinse, repeat.
 




Since when was anyone even talking about Shortell as a possible starter?
 

What is this guy's problem? The staff has came out and said the job basically is Gray's to lose yet Fuller keeps writing this crap.
 

There are two chances Shortell will play this year. Slim and none.
 



hmmm risky to play a true freshman at the hardest position in football who won't have any grasp of the playbook on a team thin at the wideout position...
 

Shortell

I think DPODOLL has it exactly right. What's all the buzz about Shortell? Parish was ranked at least as high coming out of high school and is quite mobile.
 

If Shortell is a gifted passer and Gray has not honed his accuracy, then the coaches will have to at least look at situationally playing (maybe in obvious passing downs only).

You can't have a QB that can't make the throws. Can't do it. I don't care how athletic his is.
 

BisonGopher said:
If Shortell is a gifted passer and Gray has not honed his accuracy, then the coaches will have to at least look at situationally playing (maybe in obvious passing downs only).

You can't have a QB that can't make the throws. Can't do it. I don't care how athletic his is.
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You also have to remember that is has been almost 4 years since Gray has played real games at QB or taken the majority of the reps. There will be some rust. I don't care how athletic he is.
 

Silvio said:
You also have to remember that is has been almost 4 years since Gray has played real games at QB or taken the majority of the reps. There will be some rust. I don't care how athletic he is.
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Enough rust to even consider starting a true freshman at quarterback when a more experienced and more mobile backup qb in Tom Parish is available?
 

Kuato Lives! said:
Enough rust to even consider starting a true freshman at quarterback when a more experienced and more mobile backup qb in Tom Parish is available?
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No, but the initial premise of the article is consistent with everything that Kill has said so far. If Shortell comes in and wins the job I'm sure he'll play. I think it will be very doubtful that Shortell will win the job. He come in and prove to be the best pure passer right away, but I think those who have been in the new system longer (Gray, Parish, Etc.) will have a been grasp of the other aspects of the position.
 

Marcus is accomplishing the objectives that his employers have set for him. He is getting people to the site and reading his blog.
 

BisonGopher said:
If Shortell is a gifted passer and Gray has not honed his accuracy, then the coaches will have to at least look at situationally playing (maybe in obvious passing downs only).

You can't have a QB that can't make the throws. Can't do it. I don't care how athletic his is.
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I think you're on to something here.

I think some people are missing the point in this article (may I be struck down in my chair for arguing the merits of a column written by Marcus or Myron, as they are both horrendous).

The point I'm taking, and the point I've basically been hearing since the start of spring practice, is that Gray just isn't blowing people away. This is a major concern that I think most of us just don't want to hear. Gray appears to be extremely gifted at the QB position at just about everything except hitting his targets with regularity.

Maybe I'm wrong, I don't go to practice. But it's troublesome when EVERYTHING I've read indicates that Gray just isn't a very accurate QB.

The silver lining that I'm clinging to is, the athletic ability that he has, when he breaks from the pocket, I'm thinking/hoping that while he's scrambling he'll find people frequently that are just plain WIDE open and he can actually find them.
 

I believe the overall sentiment of the article is right, the best player will play. However, there is about as much chance of Shortell starting at QB this season as there is of Quinn Bauducco starting at MLB or Cobb being our starting RB.
 

Unregistered User said:
It wouldn't be shocking to me if Kill ends up using two quarterbacks (junior MarQueis Gray and Shortell), especially if Gray is still not completely where he needs to be after two-a-days in August and Shortell progresses quickly starting this summer. Kill eluded to the possibility of playing two quarterbacks this season after the spring game, because he did it at Northern Illinois.
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Marcus, I think you mean 'alluded' not 'eluded'. However if coach Kill is in fact 'elusive' maybe he should start at QB?
 

Silvio said:
You also have to remember that is has been almost 4 years since Gray has played real games at QB or taken the majority of the reps. There will be some rust. I don't care how athletic he is.
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Gray has plenty of time to get his passing game right and from what I've read and seen it most definitely won't be from a lack of effort and will.
 

I think Gray might be one of the players who plays alot better in games then in practices, a la THE FOG
 

Ogee Oglethorpe said:
Gray just isn't blowing people away.
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I guess is depends on your definition of "blowing people away." Kill has said at least on 4 or 5 occasions in the last 10 days that Gray was the single biggest surprise to him this spring. Kill has said several times that he needs about 4 or 5 more Grays and "we'd be getting there." Limegrover was gushing over Gray after the spring scrimmage. Limegrover clearly proclaimed Gray the starter.

In regard to some stance that Kill is taking that the 'job is still open' - well, IMHO he is just "poor boying" it or trying to keep Gray motivated. Gray will be the starter at USC (barring injury) and have a nice season and I am certain Kill knows it.
 

My take: What I hear from Coach Kill

Coach Kill is trying to get guys to work in the off season....so, he says that any freshman can win the job if he is the best player. While that's true, he also is trying to light a fire under the incumbents to improve in the next three months. Plus, give the freshmen hope. Kill said Shortell will compete for the starting job. He can't say Shortell can't win the job but then that Olson can, for instance.

He also said it is scary how good Gray can be. He is obviously pissed and miffed that Gray did not get more of a chance to play quarterback in his first two years. If he had he'd be spectacular already. Coach Kill thinks Gray will be awesome! That is what I heard coach Kill say.
 

tjgopher said:
I guess is depends on your definition of "blowing people away." Kill has said at least on 4 or 5 occasions in the last 10 days that Gray was the single biggest surprise to him this spring. Kill has said several times that he needs about 4 or 5 more Grays and "we'd be getting there." Limegrover was gushing over Gray after the spring scrimmage. Limegrover clearly proclaimed Gray the starter.

In regard to some stance that Kill is taking that the 'job is still open' - well, IMHO he is just "poor boying" it or trying to keep Gray motivated. Gray will be the starter at USC (barring injury) and have a nice season and I am certain Kill knows it.
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I think in some terms, yes, Gray has pleasantly surprised a lot of people. It sounds like he has done some GREAT things; started working EARLY on trying to learn the offense, has really done an outstanding job of stepping up and being a leader, taken control of the huddle, etc. This stuff is music to my ears, I love hearing this as they are all major components to being a starting QB in the Big Ten. I'm sure the coaching staff feels the same way.

I'm just saying that I haven't heard anything from anybody (MV, the beat writers, fans at practice, etc.) that gives any indication that Gray is an accurate passer. He's got a great arm, the ball expodes out of his hand and he throws effortlessly, really fun to watch actually, but I've heard nothing in his 3 years here to lead me to believe he's very accurate.

I hope I'm horribly wrong and maybe with hard work over the summer, working with a handful of his perspective passing targets will make major strides in this area.
 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I feel like all of this "Shortell has a chance to start" talk began when he himself said he wanted to play this year and challenge Gray for the spot. It seems that the media interpreted this as "Shortell has chance to start this fall" and the snowball has gotten bigger from there.
 

I am not understanding why people think shortelle is going to be a great player as a freshman. Did I miss something. I am not understanding why people are saying gray can't be the guy. Did I miss something?
 

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