What grade do you give Ben Johnson for his first year?

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

I agree this season doesn’t deserve a B or C. I get the F grade just felt they were slightly better than expected at least in the number of games won.

How the roster was constructed this year could mean next year as they get younger the team could be worse. I won’t have a problem with that. I rather see the program built mainly with high school recruits and only add supporting pieces through the transfer portal. Let the young guys take their lumps for a couple of seasons and hopefully there is a payoff in year 4 of the Ben Johnson era.

Dead last in a 14 team conference.... It's really REALLY hard to assess a grade any better than a "D". The team didn't get better as the season wore on, they got worse, and a lot worse. That's coaching, regardless of the roster.

If they had started HORRENDOUSLY and finished with some promise and finished strong, and the same record, I could/would be inclined to give a fairly higher grade. But they didn't. Dead last in a 14 team conference with some real stinker teams, it's essentially inconceivable how one could hang a grade any higher than a D. Not just losing, but some real big, ugly losses down the stretch.

 

[Blackhammer]

I would have been satisfied with a less successful preseason if BJ would have attempted to develop a bench. He was to worried about early Ws and let the bench suffer.

If your bench basically has no one who can play a lick, what is it you’re suppose to develop? You see guys everyday in practice as a coach. Ben along with his assistants I believe Are every bit as focused on next season as the fan base.

 

[Spaulding!No!]

How about we stop the Thorson is Bentino’s mentor. If there is any truth to this Thorson has to leave now to save his career.

 

[PhiloVance]

If your bench basically has no one who can play a lick, what is it you’re suppose to develop? You see guys everyday in practice as a coach. Ben along with his assistants I believe Are every bit as focused on next season as the fan base.

The season was never going to end in a NCAA run. You also know the 6 players can't physically compete if they have to play 36 to 40 minutes a game. Then throw your bench under the bus shows a lack of experience if not maturity.

 

[Gophers_4life]

I guess Tanner Morgan, Chris Autman-Bell, John Michael Schmitz, Mo Ibrahim, Boye Mafe, and Esezi Otomewo should have just stayed in the MAC since they haven't contributed to the success of the program....Plus he had to recruit Winfield Jr to stay and keep Blaise Andries committed. All of those players were recruited his first 3 weeks on the job to a program coming off of a very public scandal.

Convincing kids who had signed up to play for the top MAC program at the time, that just had went to the Cotton(?) bowl to play Wisconsin in the NY6, to forgo that and come to even colder Minnesota with a not great record of winning and the scandal to boot, I do agree would not necessarily be as trivial as was made out to be. If it was to Ohio State, sure of course.

And then there is the other aspect of recruiting than just the salesmanship/closing, which is the evaluating. Fleck had to know which guys he wanted to ask to come with him. Your list there is some pretty damn good evaluating that they'd all do well at the Big Ten level.

 

[PhiloVance]

If your bench basically has no one who can play a lick, what is it you’re suppose to develop? You see guys everyday in practice as a coach. Ben along with his assistants I believe Are every bit as focused on next season as the fan base.

I might add if he's coaching for next year why was he only playing 1 player major minutes who is coming back next year.

 

[Dakota2]

I went with a C.

we are, in fact, talking about a rookie head coach. Starting as a 1st-time head coach for a P5 program is a challenge. some people argued against hiring Johnson for that same reason. he had a lot to learn on the job, and had to do it with with an........unusual.....roster situation.

Next year is going to be very important. Johnson has a chance to show what he has learned in multiple areas - recruiting, roster management, in-game adjustments, and yes, use of the bench.

If we are back here next year having the exact same conversation, then that is a big problem.

Just the fact he was a rookie head coach moves the grade from C to B considering what he did in that situation. A lot of coaches with 20 years at the helm could not have done it.

 

[Dakota2]

Nope.
First priority is culture development and nurturing. Been told that right here on gh hundreds of times.
Culture.

Good grief, Jen. Do you ever think for yourself? Seems like you start every dump here with "been told right here". Surely you know a lot of posters here are just as dumb as you.

 

[Dakota2]

And after Fox got hurt. Ihnen also isn't a PF like everyone is trying to make him out to be.

And where did I say Fox wouldn't help? The Gophers were getting regularly blown out, Fox isn't making a 20 point difference.

Hawkins is a different player than Fox. He's a great 3 point shooter, and Fox has very little outside game.

Where again am I being a hypocrite?

Fox and Ihnen would have made a 20-point difference on defense and rebounding, even without scoring. We were glaringly weak on interior defense.

 

[Dakota2]

I think most people will give him a relative pass for not having a complete roster in year one. But filling a roster and/or retaining players is probably more important than any task a head coach needs to perform. Having five scholarships either go unused and/or are not occupied by players capable (or willing to go in?) in the last game of the year or of the college career in a couple cases is not a good look. We don't know much about Fox's effectiveness at a higher level and Ihnen has been somewhat of an enigma his entire career so I'm not sure that is the only reason for overall lack of success this year. Maybe you are right.

There has been many posts about "expectations" here. Expectations are largely set by circumstance. Pitino won a coach of the year award in conference in large part because they had set the bar so low the previous year. Ben Johnson won four conference games out of 21 in year one in large part because he set the bar so low with the retention of last year's roster and perhaps more scary with the lack of development of 4 scholarship players. Sadly, almost all the production leaves via graduation and doesn't provide a huge deal of hope (at least initially) for next year. Our "expectations" will be low again.

That's a D in my book with an understanding he has plenty of time to turn it around.

What is really scary is that you think we had four scholarship players who could have been developed but were not. Of those four, only Thompson can be developed. The other three do not have the natural ability to develop into Big Ten players.

 

[BarnBurner]

Fox and Ihnen would have made a 20-point difference on defense and rebounding, even without scoring. We were glaringly weak on interior defense.

Mark this gem down. For next year’s post of the year!!!

 

[golfing18now]

What is really scary is that you think we had four scholarship players who could have been developed but were not. Of those four, only Thompson can be developed. The other three do not have the natural ability to develop into Big Ten players.

That's an even worse indictment on the coach. You are saying three of his players and the open scholarship were completely wasted under that scenario. I guess the injury excuse becomes convenient if the baseline we start from is now 9 players.

 

[Dakota2]

Good job, Jen. Mark it down. And drop down to the gym someday and watch Fox pickin' quarters off the top of the backboard.

 

[Dakota2]

That's an even worse indictment on the coach. You are saying three of his players and the open scholarship were completely wasted under that scenario. I guess the injury excuse becomes convenient if the baseline we start from is now 9 players.

Check the timeline. He brought in the fiddler, Ogele, and Thiam to fill the roster and allow practice competition. There wasn't much available by then. He could have brought in three different guys with different names and the same result.

 

[benlaur]

Just the fact he was a rookie head coach moves the grade from C to B considering what he did in that situation. A lot of coaches with 20 years at the helm could not have done it

When you remove all the noise, there is only one way to rate the success this year, how did you finish against your peers in the conference and by that metric, it was not a good year since we finished last.

Every coach deals with injuries, graduating players, transferring players, personal health issues, beginning of career struggles, mid career blues, end of career indifference, admin support, etc....your record is a reflection of how you dealt with all the obstacles to winning. Excuses are a barrier to winning because it turns the focus away from solutions and improvement.

Let's just call it what what it was this year and focus on next year.

Let's hope Ben Johnson and staff figure it out for the future years and get their team playing some top-tier hoops. I wish them nothing but the best. The good news is odds are with us that the team finishes higher in the Big Ten standings next year and we have a guarantee that standing-wise, it will not be worse.

 

[BarnBurner]

Good job, Jen. Mark it down. And drop down to the gym someday and watch Fox pickin' quarters off the top of the backboard.

20 points on d with ihnen and fox.

 

[golfing18now]

Check the timeline. He brought in the fiddler, Ogele, and Thiam to fill the roster and allow practice competition. There wasn't much available by then. He could have brought in three different guys with different names and the same result.

This is probably true but supports what I'm saying. His inability to retain anybody off last year's roster other than Ihnen and eventually Curry and his very slow building of a staff led to the issues surrounding fielding a competitive roster. This year's result became an inevitability with the talent differential between his team and his peers. He didn't look ready for this job in the first month (in particular). I'm not saying that can't or won't change. The topic of the OP is a grade for Ben's first year. The answer based on the bottom line results in the conference and post-season is a D.

 

[Dakota2]

When you remove all the noise, there is only one way to rate the success this year, how did you finish against your peers in the conference and by that metric, it was not a good year since we finished last.

Every coach deals with injuries, graduating players, transferring players, personal health issues, beginning of career struggles, mid career blues, end of career indifference, admin support, etc....your record is a reflection of how you dealt with all the obstacles to winning. Excuses are a barrier to winning because it turns the focus away from solutions and improvement.

Let's just call it what what it was this year and focus on next year.

Let's hope Ben Johnson and staff figure it out for the future years and get their team playing some top-tier hoops. I wish them nothing but the best. The good news is odds are with us that the team finishes higher in the Big Ten standings next year and we have a guarantee that standing-wise, it will not be worse.

Can you think of a coach who ever started his job with two players on the roster, the best of which would never suit up?

 

[golfing18now]

Can you think of a coach who ever started his job with two players on the roster, the best of which would never suit up?

Ben, is that you?

 

[Ogee Ogilthorpe]

Can you think of a coach who ever started his job with two players on the roster, the best of which would never suit up?

Again, did the players/team they HAD get better as the year played out? Coaching is improving the players you have. Just how much of this did we see? Set aside the W/L record, were they better yesterday than they were in Nov/Dec?

 

[Dakota2]

This is probably true but supports what I'm saying. His inability to retain anybody off last year's roster other than Ihnen and eventually Curry and his very slow building of a staff led to the issues surrounding fielding a competitive roster. This year's result became an inevitability with the talent differential between his team and his peers. He didn't look ready for this job in the first month (in particular). I'm not saying that can't or won't change. The topic of the OP is a grade for Ben's first year. The answer based on the bottom line results in the conference and post-season is a D.

Inability to retain anyone from last year? Yes, one. Gabe. He tried, Gabe was set on a new start. Carr, gone no matter who the coach might be. And Ben didn't want him for good reasons. Mashburn? Gone with Pitino. Period. Robbins ... gone with his uncle. Non-negotiable. Brandon Johnson ... Ben surely wanted him but he wanted Fox more. He got Fox. Williams? He got a better player in Stephens.

In hindsight, with the injuries, it certainly would have been better to have Freeman than Daniels, or Mitchel than Ogele. Don't know their reasons for leaving or if Ben tried to retain them. And yes, Gach would have been better than Thiam but not near as good as Sutherlin.

 

[Blackhammer]

Again, did the players/team they HAD get better as the year played out? Coaching is improving the players you have. Just how much of this did we see? Set aside the W/L record, were they better yesterday than they were in Nov/Dec?

Played poorer teams early and because of no depth players just flat out got wore down as season went on. .So your analogy doesn’t always hold true imo,

 

[Dakota2]

Ben, is that you?

Nope, not Ben. But can you answer the question or are you just throwing horseshit around?

 

[Ragnor]

People continue to act like not having Ihnen and Fox is like not having Murphy and Oturu, when it's more like not having Elliot Elliason and Charles Buggs. And I like Fox and think he can be good, but we don't know how good until we see it.

If we don't know, how can you say the prior?

All of the other transfers you mentioned contributed to a last place team.

Absolutely true, but with how much we were undermanned at the post they did a remarkable job keeping it close in many games and winning the games they did.

In my opinion the better argument would be did BJ make the right choices in not trying to go for more Off Reb. or trying TT more in some games for more rest of Curry.

At 2 million per year the Gophers could have hired a coach with significant head coaching experience.

Instead they hired a guy who had zero head coaching experience, who couldn't land a mid-major head coaching job, and they didn't give him a budget salary. No one was expecting Bill Self or Mark Few.

Last night was an embarrassment to end one of the worst seasons in Gopher basketball history.

 

[Dakota2]

Again, did the players/team they HAD get better as the year played out? Coaching is improving the players you have. Just how much of this did we see? Set aside the W/L record, were they better yesterday than they were in Nov/Dec?

Battle got better. But he was a soph so room to grow. Curry, Loewe, Stephens, Willis, Sutherlin, Daniels, and Ogele are all fifth or six year players. Days of improvement are gone.

 

[golfing18now]

Inability to retain anyone from last year? Yes, one. Gabe. He tried, Gabe was set on a new start. Carr, gone no matter who the coach might be. And Ben didn't want him for good reasons. Mashburn? Gone with Pitino. Period. Robbins ... gone with his uncle. Non-negotiable. Brandon Johnson ... Ben surely wanted him but he wanted Fox more. He got Fox. Williams? He got a better player in Stephens.

In hindsight, with the injuries, it certainly would have been better to have Freeman than Daniels, or Mitchel than Ogele. Don't know their reasons for leaving or if Ben tried to retain them. And yes, Gach would have been better than Thiam but not near as good as Sutherlin.

Yes, inability to retain anyone from last year. Even our last coach was able to sell the program and kept much of the prior regime's roster intact. It led to a markedly better first year than we just observed and a roster that had much more upside (as of now) for year two. I'm just comparing the first year, not making an overall endorsement of Pitino.

I'm not willing to give a complete pass to Johnson for having to fill 11scholarships. Is it unprecedented? No, but certainly unusual. But again, that's at least partially on him. The roster didn't have room for Fox AND Johnson? Williams AND Stephens? Gach AND Thiam? By your own admission, we had four scholarships either unfilled or filled by players with no chance to develop. I'm pretty sure Williams, Freeman, Gach, Johnson, others could have provided more than your assessment of some of these wasted scholarships. That's at least partially on Ben.

 

[Johnnyboy18]

Yes, inability to retain anyone from last year. Even our last coach was able to sell the program and kept much of the prior regime's roster intact. It led to a markedly better first year than we just observed and a roster that had much more upside (as of now) for year two. I'm just comparing the first year, not making an overall endorsement of Pitino.

I'm not willing to give a complete pass to Johnson for having to fill 11scholarships. Is it unprecedented? No, but certainly unusual. But again, that's at least partially on him. The roster didn't have room for Fox AND Johnson? Williams AND Stephens? Gach AND Thiam? By your own admission, we had four scholarships either unfilled or filled by players with no chance to develop. I'm pretty sure Williams, Freeman, Gach, Johnson, others could have provided more than your assessment of some of these wasted scholarships. That's at least partially on Ben.

The portal wasn't a thing when Pitino took over.

 

[golfing18now]

The portal wasn't a thing when Pitino took over.

That's a fair point. You could still move but waivers weren't handed out with a rubber stamp. Coleman left the team, if memory serves. The rest of the guys stayed, I believe. Last year was a different animal.

 

[fan of Ray Williams]

Ben actually getting a higher rating than Fleck's first year. Albeit less voters.

What grade would you give PJ Fleck in his Gopher debut season?

What grade would you give PJ Fleck in his Gopher debut season?

gopherhole.com

 

[noamfromm]

Just stop. You repeatedly use this excuse, and that is exactly what it is. Injuries happen to all teams. This season wasn't unique or any other term you love to use.

Ihnen would have benefitted the team, no doubt. I think he can rebound a bit, and his defense was a bit better near the end of last season. Would it have meant a win or two more? Could have.

From all accounts, Fox is not a shooter. Slasher is the term most use. Is he going to rebound well at 6-8 220? In the Big 10? Maybe. Again, how many more wins this season? Same as above.

I dont see either of them as a high impact player that would have made a huge difference in wins this season. Hope I am wrong as I really like II.

CBJ needs to sign kids that will be impact players, quickly. Next season is pivotal, imo. Another season of less than mediocre in therms of wins will put CBJ on tough ground, imo.

I have watched this program for darn near 50 years. Nothing I want more than going to The Barn to an atmosphere like the 90's. It was special. The Barn was a blast when the team returned home around midnight after punching the FF ticket. Something I will never forget.

6'8" is an extremely reasonable size for someone to rebound well in the Big Ten. 6 of the top 10 rebounders in the Big 10 this year were 6'9" or shorter, and Jordan Murphy deserves at shoutout