STrib: Pardon us, P.J. Fleck. It's going to take a while to get used to 'elite'

[Bob_Loblaw]

The media in this town is not only incredibly negative, they are also completely ignorant about college athletics.

Fat Pat included the Gopher football team into his "Turkey of the Year" nonsense this year when they were probably the best team of major sports (Twolves, Twins, Vikings, Gopher BB, Gopher FB, Wild Hockey).

PJF is going to have a tough time with the group here. We don't have a history of sustained success and the bar is set absurdly high.

That said, the amount PJ says talks in Fleckisms is annoying. I like PJ, but it's my least favorite thing about him.

 

[e.bigelow]

Did anyone catch PJ Fleck with Dan B. on KFAN last night?
http://kfan.iheart.com/onair/dan-barreiro-11904/listen-gopher-football-hc-pj-fleck-15527624/

Dan asked Fleck for his last question if anything surprised him after coming to MN. Fleck was quick to put the local media on notice.

PJF:"I'll be honest with you, the media surprised me a little bit. I can't wait to continue to build a relationship with them. But, we haven't won a championship since 1967. And I think I speak for everybody in this room and even our media that, somewhere down deep, all of us believe we can do that, and not just a B1G championship but a National Championship. But you don't want to bring it out because you're a little AFRAID of it. We're going to need everybody. The media is going to have to be positive to bring recruits into the Twin Cities, to the U of M. Our alums are going to have to be positive. Winners surround themselves with positivity, and positivity finds winners. I look forward to the challenge every sing day, it's why I took the job. I also knew what was sleeping here, and when it gets woken up, what it can become. That's why I took the job."
DB: "If you win, then the media will be positive (laughs)"
PJF: "Correct. But I will say this: It's about buying into the process early enough. It's like the stock market, everybody wants to make a lot money, but you want to buy in when it's making money. That's easy. How about buying when it's really low and you could lose a lot, however, man, that thing down deep inside me says 'that is worth it, that's my gut, this is it, I'm buying it' and BOOM! That's exactly what we did in Western Michigan"

One thing Fleck gets is culture. If you undercut and undersell the program for years, whether you are an alum, a reporter, a sports personality, people start believing it (fans, media, and even inside the locker room). Culture is contagious, whether it is negative or positive. Fleck wants to reenergize all the stakeholders, from the University BOR, to the U Athletic Dept, to the students, to the alums, to the sports fans, to the high school players and potential recruits, to the sports writers and media personalities, to the community, to the public in general. If all of those stake holders are buzzing with positivity, it won't guarantee victories on the field, but boy could it help. Culture surrounded in positivity and energy makes the path to success easier. It will be very interesting to see how the old stalwart local media treats this new era of Gopher FB.

SKI U MAH and ROW THE BOAT!

The bold is so spot on whether in football, business or life. People with sh!t attitudes justify their sh!ttiness by bringing others down. Being in my early 30's and working for two large corporations, I can totally attest to this. Sh!t attitudes and not buying in get you sh!t results.

 

[KillmeNow]

Maybe a timeline through the entire 20th century and through 16 years of the 21st century is going overboard and will be too long winded???


Suffice it to say, in the 30s the Football team was ELITE as was the Men's Hockey team and the Baseball team even won 2 Conf titles and the Wrestling team had 2 Top 4 finishes and the Men's Gymnastics team had a 4th and 5th place finish.



in the 40s, the football team was ELITE to the point that it took intervention of the US military and unfavorable circumstances related to that, to stop the Bernie Bierman led Golden Gopher DYNASTY. And it was Bernie Bierman himself who broke the winning streak he started.

And the hockey team again, was also Elite in the 40s, even having an undefeated Natl Title winning season.


A few other Elite accomplishments in the 40s, from memory, were a Track and Field team Natl Title, and Top 4 finishes other seasons by the Track team, the Men's Gymnastics team, including 2 Natl RunnerUp finishes and the Wrestling team, and an Individual Natl Title in Golf.


The 1950s was when the Baseball team won the first of its northern US leading 3 National Titles in the span of 9 seasons and Paul Giel finished in the Top 4 of the Heisman voting in back to back seasons, coming in 2nd in the closest vote in Heisman history that stood as that for a long time. Not sure if it still does? And the Hockey team had 2 Runner Up finishes.


And the 60s was a pretty Elite decade for the Football team, and the Baseball team win its 2nd and 3rd titles in 60 and 64.

The Golf team had a couple Top Ten finishes, which is Elite for a northern program.



And the US Olympic Hockey team won a Gold Medal, that was not as glorified as the 1980 win, possibly because of Gopher filled lineups in 52 (4 Gophs) and 56 (6 Gophs) and a Gopher coached team in 1956, both that won Silver Medals, the 1960 team may not have been seen as such an underdog? And like the 1980 team, it was led by a good number of Gophers, including most importantly some thought, the goalie Jack McCarten who was credited by some as being the main reason they won that Gold Medal.


The 70s saw either the Gopher Hockey team, led by former Gopher Herb Brooks or Wisconsin, led by former Gopher Bob Johnson dominating the NCAA tournaments of that decade. Leading of course to that Miracle on Ice in 1980.
In 1973 or 74 a Molitor led Gopher Baseball team finished 3rd at the NCAA tourney.

And we saw a Big Ten title in 72 for the Men's BB team and a 77 team that went 24-3 and had the potential to win the Natl Title, having beaten the eventual Champs Marquette, in Marquette. And in retrospect, the team was full of winners, so many ended up going on to NBA success, either as a player or as a coach.


To be continued, maybe? If needed.

 

[GophersInIowa]

Fleck has been everywhere because he just got hired and we had signing day. Everyone is interviewing him, everything will calm down.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

The bold is so spot on whether in football, business or life. People with sh!t attitudes justify their sh!ttiness by bringing others down. Being in my early 30's and working for two large corporations, I can totally attest to this. Sh!t attitudes and not buying in get you sh!t results.

This is true, however, too much of that stuff rubs people the wrong way. Using your business example, I look at the Target employees downtown. They were like the PJ Fleck's of DT Mpls. They had their own language. They repeated over and over again. They just created a cult-like employee base where they were too blinded by their love of Target to realize they needed to adapt. It's a big reason why they are continuing to have massive layoffs every few months (they weren't able to adapt).

So yeah, being positive is good. Drinking the Kool-Aid, meh. I've seen several companies that it's been a large part of their downfall.

 

[KillmeNow]

In a few other unordinary ways, the University of Minnesota has proven itself to be elite.


Most here at Gopherhole are at least a little bit aware of our Dance Teams, that seem to win multiple Natl Titles every year and have been doing so for most of the 21st Century and there isn't another program out there that even comes close to matching them. If that isn't Elite, then nothing or nobody is.

But going way back to the 50s I think, the University of Minnesota has also been one of the truly "elite" college Debate/Quiz Bowl programs. When the Quiz Bowl first became popular on TV, the UMn team was on more episodes than any other program, and later, when Quiz Bowl competitions became more organized with National Championship like tournaments, Minnesota has won more than a few of them, with only 1 or 2 other programs winning close to the same amount or more?

And then there is the Solar Raycing program, which has competed nationally and internationally for decades now, and that has won several National Titles and finished very well in almost every race they've competed in. The University of Michigan is probably the only program in the country that has more to brag about than UMn in the realm of Solar Raycing.


Minnesotans are a competitive bunch. If not competing at a sport, then we compete at something academic or research orientated or at games that take intelligence, like chess or poker.


A lot of people around the country view UMn as nothing more than a hockey school, but let me ask you how many northern schools out there can boast TRACK, GOLF & BASEBALL Natl Titles??? Ohio St and Michigan maybe?

 

[MennoSota]

Fleck should never take a job in the Northeast or Chicago if he doesn't want a skeptical media.
The Twin Cities media is not all that negative. Panama Jack Fleck is gonna need to go with the flow.

 

[FanSinceTheFifties]

Were not use to that word...were use to average.

Huh?

 

[FanSinceTheFifties]

Fleck should never take a job in the Northeast or Chicago if he doesn't want a skeptical media.
The Twin Cities media is not all that negative. Panama Jack Fleck is gonna need to go with the flow.

Yes, it's not the negativity of the media here -- it's the indifference toward the U by them as they are occupied with the so-many pro sports and other attractions here. Something not facing the strong programs in neighboring ND, WI, and IA.

 

[KillmeNow]

The problem with the Minnesota press isn't that they write negative articles, it's that they seem to go way out of their way to write negative articles or to say negative things, whether there is a legitimate reason to do so or not.

My guess is that they don't truly want Gopher teams to lose, they just believe that they will and that things will never really change, and they also do not believe that in a million years would their becoming paid cheerleaders help the teams do better, and if they did, they would feel like sellouts and they might even get fired?

It's like actors and musicians who know how to sell lots of albums or who know how to make blockbuster movies, but they reach a point in their careers where they decide to do their own thing, where they seek critical approval, not fan approval, where they want to prove that they can act or the breadth of their acting ability or their range of musical talent, etc..

But in a columnist/reporters situation, the equivalent to being a sell out is being a cheerleader for the home team. They feel that they are being biased. As a columnist/reporter they feel bashing the home team whenever possible, is the only way to prove that they are truly an unbiased reporter. The only time they make an exception to this rule of always bashing the home team, is when they feel they have some sort of unordinary excuse to do so, an example would be, teams that are undervalued, like a women's hockey team or a women's VB team or a Rowing team, etc., that they think doesn't get enough attention for the amount of their accomplishments, and one other example would be a Championship caliber team that doesn't lose.

The likes of Fat Pat, would prefer to root for a National Championship bound team, but since guys like Fat Pat don't believe a Gopher fb or bb team can win a Natl Title, they have simply resolved to bash those 2 teams especially, every chance they get.

And their bosses love it. They know that it fires up the yokels, the homers, the diehards, they generate passion.


Anyone know how many Rush Limbaugh listeners are liberals who hate him??? It's a fair percentage. Not only does Rush Limbaugh's outrageous comments fire up the Right wingers, but they fire up the liberals, too. It's all about #s. And outrageous sh1t generates #s, and its the same way with these columnist/reporters, their bosses care more about #s than anything else and the only time they can get away with being cheerleaders, is when the team always wins. Then they have an excuse and can get away with being a cheerleader.



And though it may seem like I'm making excuses for them, I'm not. Doing something just for #s is not what I'd consider honorable and I think it makes them hypocrites and losers, in that they think it makes them legit and proves they are unbiased, but they go too far, they are in fact biased against the home team, which is worse than being biased for the home team, because being a homer can be forgiven by most, because its the natural inclination for the average person out there.


Thing is, being a homer is more forgivable, but is not the best thing and probably doesn't generate the #s like being the villain and anti-homer does, but being the anti-homer is no more unbiased than being a homer is, its like those guys are selling their souls for better #s? I believe that there is a middle ground in there, where you can be a good unbiased reporter, and tone down the homerism while avoiding going out of your way to find any little thing to try to manipulate into something negative.

 

[e.bigelow]

This is true, however, too much of that stuff rubs people the wrong way. Using your business example, I look at the Target employees downtown. They were like the PJ Fleck's of DT Mpls. They had their own language. They repeated over and over again. They just created a cult-like employee base where they were too blinded by their love of Target to realize they needed to adapt. It's a big reason why they are continuing to have massive layoffs every few months (they weren't able to adapt).

So yeah, being positive is good. Drinking the Kool-Aid, meh. I've seen several companies that it's been a large part of their downfall.

I get what your saying. You have to know when the culture is good. Both places I have been (one I'm still at, been at both combined ten years in June) at had great culture that prompted positive engagement.

All I'm saying is I can completely relate to what he is trying to implement within the football program and can see where 18-24 year olds eat this stuff up. It certainly has affected me positively.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[maroonfive]

People need to get over the fear of actually having goals, achieving those goals, and being a success. Some of the naysayers should try it sometime. There is nothing to be afraid of. It is ok to not be mediocre. If you have to take baby steps at being above average and go from there.

Ski-U-Mah !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

People need to get over the fear of actually having goals, achieving those goals, and being a success. Some of the naysayers should try it sometime. There is nothing to be afraid of. It is ok to not be mediocre. If you have to take baby steps at being above average and go from there.

Ski-U-Mah !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks Tony Robbins!

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Fleck should never take a job in the Northeast or Chicago if he doesn't want a skeptical media.
The Twin Cities media is not all that negative. Panama Jack Fleck is gonna need to go with the flow.

The news outlets in New York are knowledgeable though. Like, they will be incredibly tough on the Giants and the Yankees, but they aren't completely ignorant as to how those sporting entities work.

Because the Vikes are #1, I think the media knows quite a bit more about the Vikes than the Gophers. Most of the ridicule towards the Vikes seems arguable. I don't always agree with it, but I get it. With the Gophers, our local media is absolutely clueless. They are clueless about college football and basketball in general. I don't think there is a person on KFAN (except JG and occasionally DB) who even watch Gopher football games. I don't think the same thing can be said about the New York media and the Yankees.

 

[citywok]

To distill it down a bit, positive Gopher news isn't really very big news to the media outlets in this town, because there are so many other horses out there. It doesn't benefit them that much. However, negative Gopher news is always big news to media outlets, negative is better for their bottom lines than positive.
I would argue that Timberwolves fans likely feel similar.
To take it a step further, it is also very clear to many media outlets that positive Vikings news is very good for their bottom lines, and because of this you see them covered in an almost propagandistic manner. Whether it's fair or not.

 

[joshvanklomp]

Maybe this won't help change any minds, but I think it's easier to understand the word usage if you have the story behind it. This video was shot in June 2013...three months before he ever coached a game.

 

[citywok]

My takeaway from that video is that sometimes crazy people can be wildly successful in what they do, and never cause any harm with their craziness. Sometimes.

I dislike PJ's methods in the same way that I dislike suburban megachurches.

 

[Dano564]

My takeaway from that video is that sometimes crazy people can be wildly successful in what they do, and never cause any harm with their craziness. Sometimes.

I dislike PJ's methods in the same way that I dislike suburban megachurches.

I hate suburban megachurches too, but I don't dislike PJ Fleck.

 

[DougMN]

The things we already don't like about PJ Fleck.

1. The use of the word elite
2. Row the boat
3. Thumps up sign
4. How he looked throwing plates to the Red Panda
5. How he looked throwing tee shirts to the crowd at the Wolves game
6. How he reacted to a Andrew Wiggin's dunk
7. He didn't wear a collared shirt to the Wolves game
8. sparkling cider
9. Gopher fans buying into PJ Fleck

Still to come as things we don't like about Fleck - how he runs spring practice and the spring game

Love all of them except #8. My wife drinks sparking cider. If you are going to dip your toes into the pool before noon, just have a beer. If you want Gopher fans to 'get on board'- they should have been Jameson shots.

 

[DougMN]

If he wins games- I don't care if he uses 'Moist', 'Phlegm' and 'Lugubrious' in every sentence. Our problem is that so far there is no body of work to back up the talk. There will be though...

 

[Word]

My takeaway from that video is that sometimes crazy people can be wildly successful in what they do, and never cause any harm with their craziness. Sometimes.

I dislike PJ's methods in the same way that I dislike suburban megachurches.

What about urban megachurches?

 

[PMWinSTP]

It's a nice video. Not sure the Navy SEAL origin fits his narrative. SEALs are elite, very few in the Navy are SEALs.

He said they don't want followers. Pretty broadly interpreted term, followers. Are players followers? How about fans of the team?

 

[gopherdudepart2]

Religious Amway those Mega churches are.

I hate suburban megachurches too, but I don't dislike PJ Fleck.

PK Fleck I don't dislike. Those suburban megachurches are nothing but shakedown artist at the pulpit trying to dig deeper and deeper into your wallet. No reason for youth pastors to be making six figure salaries and head pastors clearing $600,000 a year as a non-profit entity.

 

[joshvanklomp]

Our problem is that so far there is no body of work to back up the talk. There will be though...

So do you want him to not talk to the media until after the Buffalo game? Good luck with that.

 

[GophersInIowa]

So do you want him to not talk to the media until after the Buffalo game? Good luck with that.

Yeah I'm not sure what some people want him to do? So many people were complaining about Claey's lack of enthusiasm. Now Fleck shows too much?

 

[Spoofin]

If he wins games- I don't care if he uses 'Moist', 'Phlegm' and 'Lugubrious' in every sentence. Our problem is that so far there is no body of work to back up the talk. There will be though...

Eventually. First recruiting class and season don't count.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[bizzle22]

The news outlets in New York are knowledgeable though. Like, they will be incredibly tough on the Giants and the Yankees, but they aren't completely ignorant as to how those sporting entities work.

Because the Vikes are #1, I think the media knows quite a bit more about the Vikes than the Gophers. Most of the ridicule towards the Vikes seems arguable. I don't always agree with it, but I get it. With the Gophers, our local media is absolutely clueless. They are clueless about college football and basketball in general. I don't think there is a person on KFAN (except JG and occasionally DB) who even watch Gopher football games. I don't think the same thing can be said about the New York media and the Yankees.

I agree with most of that. To be fair, JG is the PA of Gopher sports. He watches the games no question, but he's a little over the top for me sometimes. I'm not a huge Barreiro fan (though I'll take him over anyone else at KFAN), but I do believe that he's good at really digging into an issue when he wants to. Definitely agree that we don't have a good college sports media person in the TC. Most are pretty clueless, and only latch onto stories that are already happening and then overreact.

 

[bizzle22]

I couldn't care less about his shtick. I don't really care as long as he wins. If his shtick works with the players then shtick away! If he's winning he could say elite 400 times in a press conference and it wouldn't matter to me. Just give the dude a couple years to get this thing going and let's see where we are then. And please beat the dang badgers.

 

[KillmeNow]

I liked the video and his explanation. I like that he mentions bringing in excellent recruits and giving them the training to become elite, and it seems whatever he did at WMU worked. I can't imagine how different things might have been had WMU beaten Wisconsin???


And I hope he sticks to the point he made about avoiding bringing in anyone that was bad, no matter how good of an athlete or coach they were, because the University of Minnesota, imho, can not handle anymore bad. For goodness sake, it has seemed like an endless string of bad things, starting out with "The Brawl" and Musselman scandal and ending finally with the stuff with the 10 players on our current fb team.


Now maybe some of those non-revenue sports can afford to suffer from some more bad, but the two sports where we need to avoid bad at all costs are the football program and the men's bb program.


So I hope Fleck is serious about that. Avoid bad people at all costs, strive to bring in only excellent people who buy into his ideas and who are willing to be trained to become elite.

 

[dpodoll68]

As for Ski-U-Mah, that was virtually never said until PJF arrived.

Do you mean by coaches/administrators? I say Ski-U-Mah virtually every day and have for closing in on 20 years.