Sid: U averaged 10,675 fans per game last season in 16 games at Williams Arena. This season, it is averaging 9,888.

[short ornery norwegian]

Since the thread is about attendance, any discussion of the on-court product should focus on how it does - or does not - impact attendance.

It's kind of odd the way perception works. The Gophers have a competitive team. They have played even with or defeated some good clubs. but, I think the perception among casual fans is that the Gophers are an average to mediocre team. Pitino tried to make the schedule tougher because of the NET system and Quad 1 wins, etc. I understand why he did it. but it also meant the Gophers lost more non-conf games than people are used to, adding to the perception that the team is not that good.

Even with a home-town kid like Oturu having a great season, fans still aren't showing up.

I suspect price has a lot to do with it - but the only way to be sure is to drop the prices and see if more people show up. As I said before, I suspect the powers that be would rather have a 2/3 full building at the current prices instead of a full building at lower prices. I don't get it.

 

[GopherBlood777]

Maybe they just need to get a little more creative for single game ticket deals. A lot of people on the board took advantage of the $15 ticket + beer deal for the student section. I know I only went to that game due to the cheaper than normal ticket and the atmosphere was good. I think if they offered single game deals on the upper level bench seats (like $10 gets ticket + hot dog, or maybe just $10 ticket) would probably get a lot more people in the door. Just don't want to alienate season ticket holders I guess with price cuts that no longer make season ticks a price advantage. Lot's of variables go into it, but something is better than nothing!

 

[bga1]

I think we had 4 scoring options last year that kept defenses playing honest. When Gabe struggles this year, which is often, we have had 2 and teams that effectively take away one of those 2 beat us. I think Oturu (this year) is out playing Murphy (last year) but I wouldn't say we are a better team this year.



Projecting Mashburn or a Mashburn/Williams/Mystery as an effective replacement for losing what Oturu does now is an over reach. Gabe is either plateau'd or regressing. Willis rarely can make up for Gabe struggling this year. Projecting guys to get stronger and bigger also rarely works out in college basketball.

I beg to differ. That's what most kids do. Look at Oturu- nobody, or at least very few, thought he would turn into the player he is this soon. Pitino has been solid on developing players who have the ability. He has not gotten enough players. But that is improving.


Agreed if we make the tourney and win a game it's a tough decision. If they miss the tourney and the AD agrees with me that next year looks worse than this year, you have a two year trend in the wrong direction deep into a coaches time here and if you wait until the end of 2021 you might have waited too long.

No, it's not a tough decision. If they make the tournament, that's three of the last 4 years. No way are they firing him.



I do think it will come down to making the tournament, and how good a candidate for a replacement Coyle has lined up prior to that time.

The last part I agree with- both parts are key.

Make the tournament he stays -99.9% certain.
Fail to make the tournament but close- then it depends on how likely Coyle thinks he can upgrade to the coach he wants.
Even then, Coyle is also going to weigh the ability of the incoming recruits, chance of losing them (100% with Mashburn) and what the spring recruiting chances look like with Pitino.

 

[USAF]

Since the thread is about attendance, any discussion of the on-court product should focus on how it does - or does not - impact attendance.

It's kind of odd the way perception works. The Gophers have a competitive team. They have played even with or defeated some good clubs. but, I think the perception among casual fans is that the Gophers are an average to mediocre team. Pitino tried to make the schedule tougher because of the NET system and Quad 1 wins, etc. I understand why he did it. but it also meant the Gophers lost more non-conf games than people are used to, adding to the perception that the team is not that good.

Even with a home-town kid like Oturu having a great season, fans still aren't showing up.

I suspect price has a lot to do with it - but the only way to be sure is to drop the prices and see if more people show up. As I said before, I suspect the powers that be would rather have a 2/3 full building at the current prices instead of a full building at lower prices. I don't get it.

I'm pretty sure they have people who spend a great deal of time trying to maximize income. 10000 x $40 is more than 14000 x $25. There's a sweet spot somewhere in there, and people with the education and experience to make pretty good estimates make those recommendations.

It's not quite that simple, but if you're after money, you're better off with fewer people at a higher cost. All sports teams (and theaters, etc ... anything attendance driven) do these kinds of analysis. "How do we maximize revenue?"

Simplest way, of course, is to increase demand, which will require winning more. Then you can both charge more and get more people.

 

[bga1]

I'm pretty sure they have people who spend a great deal of time trying to maximize income. 10000 x $40 is more than 14000 x $25. There's a sweet spot somewhere in there, and people with the education and experience to make pretty good estimates make those recommendations.

It's not quite that simple, but if you're after money, you're better off with fewer people at a higher cost. All sports teams (and theaters, etc ... anything attendance driven) do these kinds of analysis. "How do we maximize revenue?"

Simplest way, of course, is to increase demand, which will require winning more. Then you can both charge more and get more people.

If you are after short term money- fewer people at a higher cost is terrific.
If you are after building long term, loyal fans and followers, the short term strategy ain't so great.
What if more fans in the building creates a better atmosphere that leads to better recruits and more winning? The Barn looks like a dump when half full. It's amazing when full.

 

[Gopherfan84]

I think we had 4 scoring options last year that kept defenses playing honest. When Gabe struggles this year, which is often, we have had 2 and teams that effectively take away one of those 2 beat us. I think Oturu (this year) is out playing Murphy (last year) but I wouldn't say we are a better team this year.

KenPom and most other metrics disagree.

Projecting Mashburn or a Mashburn/Williams/Mystery as an effective replacement for losing what Oturu does now is an over reach. Gabe is either plateau'd or regressing. Willis rarely can make up for Gabe struggling this year. Projecting guys to get stronger and bigger also rarely works out in college basketball.

This is completely wrong. Teams that get old win. This means that guys stay and get better over their 4 years. Plateaus in one season do not mean they will not improve the next year.

Agreed if we make the tourney and win a game it's a tough decision. If they miss the tourney and the AD agrees with me that next year looks worse than this year, you have a two year trend in the wrong direction deep into a coaches time here and if you wait until the end of 2021 you might have waited too long.


I really think Oturu is gone and will announce he is gone as soon as the season is over. Nothing about his game or personality makes me think he would humble himself and say he isn't ready for the NBA. If your projecting as a first rounder, i think your crazy to not leave anyway.

I do think it will come down to making the tournament, and how good a candidate for a replacement Coyle has lined up prior to that time.

Why does Daniel need to humble himself? He's been playing wonderfully this year and is a good kid and student. If anything he could carry a little more swagger.

 

[Go Gophs]

Since the thread is about attendance, any discussion of the on-court product should focus on how it does - or does not - impact attendance.

It's kind of odd the way perception works. The Gophers have a competitive team. They have played even with or defeated some good clubs. but, I think the perception among casual fans is that the Gophers are an average to mediocre team. Pitino tried to make the schedule tougher because of the NET system and Quad 1 wins, etc. I understand why he did it. but it also meant the Gophers lost more non-conf games than people are used to, adding to the perception that the team is not that good.

Even with a home-town kid like Oturu having a great season, fans still aren't showing up.

I suspect price has a lot to do with it - but the only way to be sure is to drop the prices and see if more people show up. As I said before, I suspect the powers that be would rather have a 2/3 full building at the current prices instead of a full building at lower prices. I don't get it.

Try not letting Michigan State hammer you twice this season. How about let's not get thumped by Iowa.
Maybe going on a winning streak more than 2 games would help.

I agree it's price. I said it earlier in this thread. But when you say people think they are average or mediocre? THEY ARE. They are play hard and a decent team for sure. But they are inconsistent and aren't world beaters or a must see by any means.

 

[Hates Monikers]

A lot of people said TCF was empty because the tickets were overpriced. Then the football team started having success last season and the place filled up without a price reduction.

I would argue that football attendance still wasn't great last year. Sure, when you play the two most important home games in 50 years, that helps the numbers. Yes, that's attributable to winning. But I'll wait to see attendance for the Tennessee Tech and BYU games in September and Purdue and Northwestern in November before saying the football attendance problem is solved.

South Dakota State 49,112
Georgia Southern 41,021
Illinois 39,341
Nebraska 43,502
Maryland 44,715
Penn State 51,883
Wisconsin 53,756

 

[USAF]

If you are after short term money- fewer people at a higher cost is terrific.
If you are after building long term, loyal fans and followers, the short term strategy ain't so great.
What if more fans in the building creates a better atmosphere that leads to better recruits and more winning? The Barn looks like a dump when half full. It's amazing when full.

I guess that's possible, and it's not linear or easy either way, but I think it's more likely you mostly have it backwards. Winning leads to more fans and a better atmosphere.

And I didn't say maximizing revenue was my preferred method, but I'm pretty confident that's the U's preferred model. And I can't really blame them. They need money, too.

 

[LakerFan]

Why does Daniel need to humble himself? He's been playing wonderfully this year and is a good kid and student. If anything he could carry a little more swagger.

I think you misread me there, or I wasn't making it clear. I think for him to decide to stay he would have to think less of himself than he actually is. I don't think he should humble himself, he impresses me as someone who is very confident in himself and his game, I'm saying he won't doubt he's ready.

 

[bga1]

This is interesting. Perhaps the Gopher athletic department could actually learn something from the TWolves here. Hat tip to Iceland who posted this info from a Strib article in the TWolves thread on the off topic:
On Tuesday, the Wolves were finally ready to make their season ticket renewal pitch to their most loyal customers — longstanding and often long-suffering season ticket holders. In an aggressive plan released to the general public Wednesday, the Wolves offered three key pieces to fans who either renewed existing tickets or bought new ones for the 2020-21 season:

*50% off all food, beverage and retail purchases at Target Center, including alcohol, for the next two seasons.

*The flexibility to exchange tickets for games they can’t use for ones they can use later.

*And a pledge to not raise ticket prices next year and the year after.

The Wolves will offer about 1,000 lower-level season tickets at $23 per game (less than $1,000 per season) with upper level seats starting at $16. The 50% discount on food, drink and retail purchases (available while using the Timberwolves app, on which money can be loaded) is extremely rare in major pro sports.

 

[topos]

I went to the Michigan St. game. I bought the cheapest ticket for $49. It was an awful game, and at one point, I thought, "I paid a lot of money to watch this horse ****!?"

I don't like that my mind went there, but it did. How many "casual fans" left there thinking, "Welp, I went to my Gopher's MBB game for the year. Yuck!"

My brother also attended with this wife and young daughter. He's not rolling in the dough by any means. He dropped over $200 once you factor in concessions and parking on top of the tickets. That price point is not attainable for most families. Even if they had spanked Sparty, I doubt the budget would allow for an encore, regardless of the momentum of the team.

My biggest fear is that high prices combined with the apathetic atmosphere are stymying the next generation of gopher basketball fans. I understand that offering ticket discounts could be seen as unfair and a slap in the face to the season ticketholders. I also think a reasonable season ticket holder needs to realize there is not going to be anyone to backfill their seat if we continue on the same trajectory. We need to start playing the long-term game.