Doogie on U/Pitino: I don’t see them paying him 1.75 to leave then committing 6 for 18 or more to a replacement. This isn’t the SEC.

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Doogie is always wrong.....Coyle is well aware that Pitino is toast....Navigating a coaching search and coming up with funds during covid is why he gets paid the big bucks.
 
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Doogie also said the Twins wouldn't fire Molitor
 
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Let's say we bring Pitino back next year and average 5k attendance/game vs. 9K/game with Craig Smith. 4k x18 games=72k lost ticket sales x $50/ticket = $3.6 million. Even cut in half this is enough to justify the buyout, without even considering donors etc.
 

It's truly amazing how bad Doogie is at his job. Wake Forest fired Danny Manning late last Spring (pandemic in full effect) and owed him a $15 million buyout. Jeff Goodman has since tweeted that Wake Forest believes Manning didn't meet certain requirements and that they owe him less than half that. Lets be incredibly charitable to Wake Forest and say they end up owing Manning $6 million. That's more than 3 times Pitino's buyout. Howeda7 said it perfectly, just disband the program if you can't pay a $1.75 million buyout. It's almost impossible for a high major basketball coach to ever have a lower buyout than this.

On to the second part. Dutcher signed a contract extentsion at San Diego State for about $1.3 million a season. Niko Medved makes $750,000 at Colorado State and Craig Smith makes $700,000 at Utah State. If you are hiring one of the Mountain West guys with local ties, there is literally no reason why the contract would be anywhere near 6 years and $18 million. As of last year at this time, $3 million a season was top 25 money: https://www.thestreet.com/lifestyle/sports/highest-paid-college-basketball-coaches-14774331 I'd love the Gophers to pay that and I think they can, but it's also not necessary (Greg Gard doesn't appear on this list for example).

If Pitino isn't fired it's due to worrying about optics during a pandemic. It shouldn't matter, but I don't put it past the "U" to shoot itself in the foot again.
 


Marky Dit said:
He was right.
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He was wrong......
On October 2, 2018, the Twins fired Molitor as manager, but expressed that they had interest in having him continue to maintain a role with the team in some capacity. He finished with a record of 305 wins and 343 losses in 648 games.
 



It’s comical that Doogie has a platform to give sports opinions. He is clueless. Support for this program is at an all time low. If Coyle doesn’t make a change after this season, it will drive away the few fans remaining. This is a sad time for Gopher hoops.
 

Right or wrong, he does make a valid point. If the pandemic forced Coyle to cancel plans to replace Pitino earlier, as the rumor goes...the pandemic and its financial challenges are still with us.
 

Bad Gopher said:
Right or wrong, he does make a valid point. If the pandemic forced Coyle to cancel plans to replace Pitino earlier, as the rumor goes...the pandemic and its financial challenges are still with us.
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To some extent they will be for years. Keeping him around makes things worse financially, not better. If I'm Coyle and I'm told I can't fire him due to optics, I resign on the spot.
 

howeda7 said:
To some extent they will be for years. Keeping him around makes things worse financially, not better. If I'm Coyle and I'm told I can't fire him due to optics, I resign on the spot.
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The fallout from not firing Pitino at this point will be much worse in a few years than not firing him.

It also makes Coyle's summer statement regarding keeping Richard and being committed to building a "championship program" all the more laughable. It was ridiculous when he said it and it's even more ridiculous now to the point of being plainly comical.

Coyle and Pitino definitely have egg on their faces. Only one of the two has the ability to remedy it.

It's been eight years of mostly incompetence and it isn't going to get fixed with Pitino at the helm.

Therefore, the ball should be in Coyle's court here. But as you said, if some higher-up tells Coyle to keep Pitino for "optics" sake, we might as well fold it up right now.
 



MRJ said:
The fallout from not firing Pitino at this point will be much worse in a few years than not firing him.

It also makes Coyle's summer statement regarding keeping Richard and being committed to building a "championship program" all the more laughable. It was ridiculous when he said it and it's even more ridiculous now to the point of being plainly comical.

Coyle and Pitino definitely have egg on their faces. Only one of the two has the ability to remedy it.

It's been eight years of mostly incompetence and it isn't going to get fixed with Pitino at the helm.

Therefore, the ball should be in Coyle's court here. But as you said, if some higher-up tells Coyle to keep Pitino for "optics" sake, we might as well fold it up right now.
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Be aware that Coyle said what he said to publicly establish an expectation. That's the baseline for evaluating success or failure forward from that point. To wit, if they don't even sniff a top-four finish with this team's talent, that justifies a move.
 


Bad Gopher said:
Be aware that Coyle said what he said to publicly establish an expectation. That's the baseline for evaluating success or failure forward from that point. To wit, if they don't even sniff a top-four finish with this team's talent, that justifies a move.
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Good perspective. Could very well be, but I have my doubts based what Pitino's track record was up to that point.

With that said, Coyle could very well come back to his previous statement and simply say "clearly, we need to go in another direction to achieve our goal of building a championship level program."
 

MRJ said:
Good perspective. Could very well be, but I have my doubts based what Pitino's track record was up to that point.

With that said, Coyle could very well come back to his previous statement and simply say "clearly, we need to go in another direction to achieve our goal of building a championship level program."
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It was a public, oral version of a "letter of expectation": something you give to someone who's under-performing and something that's usually a precursor to an adminstrative action up to and including dismissal. Up to that point, it had not been made clear by the U what the expectation was. It's always been, well, we'll do the best we can. Now, with a first-class training facility, there's no crutch to lean on anymore. The sky should be the limit for a program like this. For every natural disadvantage we have, there's a natural advantage.

Pitino himself has never backed down from his longtime assertion that you can win at Minnesota. He himself has never lowered the expectation he himself set. Coyle's public statement only reinforced what Richard has said all along and essentially called on him to put his money where his mouth has been. I love Richard because he does embrace the challenge and did not flinch when Coyle said what he said. If he ultimately does not get the job done here, it won't be for lack of effort or good attitude. It'll be because he just wasn't the elite coaching talent we'd all hoped he'd amount to when he was hired.
 

EG#9 said:
Lets be incredibly charitable to Wake Forest and say they end up owing Manning $6 million. That's more than 3 times Pitino's buyout. Howeda7 said it perfectly, just disband the program if you can't pay a $1.75 million buyout. It's almost impossible for a high major basketball coach to ever have a lower buyout than this.
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To put this buyout in perspective, Iowa paid Todd Lickliter $2.4 million over three years when they fired him 11 years ago. I believe at the time he was making a little less than $1.5 million per year as the Iowa coach.
 

Bad Gopher said:
It was a public, oral version of a "letter of expectation": something you give to someone who's under-performing and something that's usually a precursor to an adminstrative action up to and including dismissal. Up to that point, it had not been made clear by the U what the expectation was. It's always been, well, we'll do the best we can. Now, with a first-class training facility, there's no crutch to lean on anymore. The sky should be the limit for a program like this. For every natural disadvantage we have, there's a natural advantage.

Pitino himself has never backed down from his longtime assertion that you can win at Minnesota. He himself has never lowered the expectation he himself set. Coyle's public statement only reinforced what Richard has said all along and essentially called on him to put his money where his mouth has been. I love Richard because he does embrace the challenge and did not flinch when Coyle said what he said. If he ultimately does not get the job done here, it won't be for lack of effort or good attitude. It'll be because he just wasn't the elite coaching talent we'd all hoped he'd amount to when he was hired.
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"If?"

"IF he doesn't get the job done here?"

Jeebus, man. Take off the maroon glasses.
 

Coyle could raise that buyout money in 30 minutes if he wanted too, this is silly. It might be a poor look to outsiders after cutting sports but that buyout isnt stopping anything.
 

whalenfan said:
Coyle could raise that buyout money in 30 minutes if he wanted too, this is silly. It might be a poor look to outsiders after cutting sports but that buyout isnt stopping anything.
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This is such a great job. Very little pressure. At many other schools big donors would tell the AD that the large gifts are gone unless the coach is gone. He might have to call 10-12 people to get that done. No one person is biting that themselves. Those guys have walked away already.
 

Perspective...we have been in the Top 25 in the country for about month. We play wildly inconsistent and look horrible. Our record is respectable at present...if we would make a modest run we are in the NCAA 3 of 4 years and maybe back in the Top 25.
Win one game in the tournament...I’d be surprised if he was fired.
Hard to coach in a pandemic.
Probably has proven it is very unlikely he will ever win a Big Ten title but guessing he’s here next season unless we disintegrate.
 

60's Guy said:
Perspective...we have been in the Top 25 in the country for about month. We play wildly inconsistent and look horrible. Our record is respectable at present...if we would make a modest run we are in the NCAA 3 of 4 years and maybe back in the Top 25.
Win one game in the tournament...I’d be surprised if he was fired.
Hard to coach in a pandemic.
Probably has proven it is very unlikely he will ever win a Big Ten title but guessing he’s here next season unless we disintegrate.
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On the other hand, we've won one game since January 3rd and are likely to lose the next one too.
 

howeda7 said:
On the other hand, we've won one game since January 3rd and are likely to lose the next one too.
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Without looking it up to be exact...we have only played a couple games this month...that ain't normal.
It is hard to be sharp playing once a week for the last three weeks. Our opponents have been pretty good...Maryland has won some tough games against other teams too.
We are capable...there is hope...just so wildly inconsistent. But, I think that is more the times we live in and our once a week schedule than it is inferior coaching.
I mean, we are wildly awesome when we're good. Can't just dismiss that.
 

60's Guy said:
Without looking it up to be exact...we have only played a couple games this month...that ain't normal.
It is hard to be sharp playing once a week for the last three weeks. Our opponents have been pretty good...Maryland has won some tough games against other teams too.
We are capable...there is hope...just so wildly inconsistent. But, I think that is more the times we live in and our once a week schedule than it is inferior coaching.
I mean, we are wildly awesome when we're good. Can't just dismiss that.
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We're 1-4 since January 3rd with one game cancelled.
 

60's Guy said:
Without looking it up to be exact...we have only played a couple games this month...that ain't normal.
It is hard to be sharp playing once a week for the last three weeks. Our opponents have been pretty good...Maryland has won some tough games against other teams too.
We are capable...there is hope...just so wildly inconsistent. But, I think that is more the times we live in and our once a week schedule than it is inferior coaching.
I mean, we are wildly awesome when we're good. Can't just dismiss that.
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Who cares about this year?...He has been here eight years now...He has a 52-88 B10 conference record...How is that good enough for any fan?....The program is destined for 7-12 B10 standing finish every year he is the coach...Maybe that is good enough for you, but a lot of fans have seen enough and want a change.
 
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USAF said:
"If?"

"IF he doesn't get the job done here?"

Jeebus, man. Take off the maroon glasses.
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Point taken, but...let me put it this way: if he's still here it's because *someone* thinks there's still a chance for Richard, and until he's dismissed or leaves, there still IS.
 

60's Guy said:
Without looking it up to be exact...we have only played a couple games this month...that ain't normal.
It is hard to be sharp playing once a week for the last three weeks. Our opponents have been pretty good...Maryland has won some tough games against other teams too.
We are capable...there is hope...just so wildly inconsistent. But, I think that is more the times we live in and our once a week schedule than it is inferior coaching.
I mean, we are wildly awesome when we're good. Can't just dismiss that.
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I liked your previous post better. (I agree he's done a nice job managing the team and rolling with the punches this year.) This post sounds too much to me like, it's too hard, and the other teams are too good.
 

It just gets discouraging, man, as it seems the same issues plague this team year after year after year, just like Groundhog Day. It's our inability to win on the road. It's our coaching staff's inability or unwillingness to make in-game adjustments in order to counter or exploit what the opposing coach is trying to do and the adjustments our opponents have made. It's our far, far, far, far, far too many collapses in the second halves of games (which ties in with the above inability to make effective in-game adjustments), and it's our nearly annual collapse down the stretch run of the conference season, turning what based upon our season's start, might have, could have and should have been sure-thing NCAA Tournament seasons into these gut-wrenching, nail-biting, white-knuckle finishes in which we back our way into March Madness at best. Is it beyond possibilty that we might ever, ever, have an actual strong finish to a season rather than these losing, sliding, limping affairs?

It just seems the same shit, over and over again. We are fully healthy this season, we've been extraordinarily fortunate RE: COVID-19, and that doesn't even matter, as we are doing the exact same things and following the exact same path as we seemingly always do beneath Pitino's tenure.

It's tiring, discouraging, and terribly frustrating.
 

Bad Gopher said:
Right or wrong, he does make a valid point. If the pandemic forced Coyle to cancel plans to replace Pitino earlier, as the rumor goes...the pandemic and its financial challenges are still with us.
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And the challenges will remain for a long time, most likely. So that means no coaching changes can happen until the financial challenges of the pandemic are in the rear view mirror? Please.
 

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