B1G Monday morning: Will PJ Fleck and James Franklin always be also-rans?

BleedGopher

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per Alex:

When the Big Ten schedule came out, Minnesota at Penn State felt for all the world like it was going to be the premier game of Week 8.

Shoot. That much seemed true as recently as Oct. 1.

Both teams were likely to be ranked. With any luck, they’d both be undefeated, too.

It would require a Penn State upset at Michigan, but the Nittany Lions appeared capable of such a task. They’d proven themselves road warriors with wins at Purdue and Auburn. Last year, a much worse Penn State team gave a much better Michigan team all it could handle in Happy Valley.

ABC likely felt it had a potential dream Saturday night matchup lined up.

Instead, it’s got something between a dream and a nightmare: the bleakness of reality. Both teams are backsliding into this prime-time meeting.

The Golden Gophers are rusting before our very eyes.

Minnesota started out of the gates looking like a different animal from its Big Ten West counterparts — one capable of hanging with the elite in the East after a blowout win over Michigan State put the Gophers at 4-0.

Consecutive losses to Purdue and Illinois have squelched that notion. The Gophers scored a combined 24 points in those defeats.

Minnesota is a game behind the Illini and Boilers in the standings, and doesn’t have a tiebreaker over either. If Minnesota runs the table, it needs both Illinois and Purdue to finish 3-2. With another loss, the Gophers would need both of them to close out 2-3.

Thus seemingly ends the second straight year in which things lined up for it to be the year for PJ Fleck’s Gophers.

Last season, Minnesota had veteran quarterback Tanner Morgan and running back Mohamed Ibrahim coming back behind the nation’s most experienced offensive line.

Unfortunately, Ibrahim was lost for the season in Game 1. You couldn’t ask for a tougher break. But Minnesota headed into November with a 4-1 Big Ten record, and the lone defeat was to Ohio State. The Gophers overcame adversity and looked perfectly capable of reaching Indianapolis.

Then they choked.

Perhaps peeking ahead a week, Minnesota inexplicably lost 14-6 to an Illinois team still finding its way under first-year coach Bret Bielema. The Gophers followed it with a 27-22 loss at Iowa, dropping to 0-5 against the Hawkeyes under Fleck.

This year, the Gophers simply got a month head start on the back-to-back losses that effectively cook their division title hopes.

There was some bad luck involved with the Purdue loss. Ibrahim was scratched with an ankle injury. But scoring 7 points on 3 trips in the red zone was just as much a factor.

Luck and mistakes weren’t a factor in Minnesota’s loss at Illinois. The Illini are simply better.

And that fact must really get the goat of Gophers fans.

Bielema, a long-time Minnesota nemesis, needed just one offseason to get the Illinois program in a better position than Minnesota in Year 6 under Fleck. And the program Fleck inherited from Tracy Claeys was in phenomenal condition compared to the husk Bielema picked up from Lovie Smith.

So it merits asking if 2019 will remain the peak of what Minnesota can achieve under Fleck. Those Gophers dropped 2 of their last 3 to miss the Big Ten championship game, but beat Auburn in the Outback Bowl to finish 10th in the country.

With the core of sixth-year veterans leaving the program this offseason, a drop-off is inevitable. After that, Minnesota could potentially be stuck in a division or a scheduling pod with USC.

Fleck’s best shots to take Minnesota to the Big Ten title game may already be behind him. And the same could be true of his Penn State counterpart.

Little Game James​

“Big Game James” was the nickname earned by former Los Angeles Lakers star James Worthy, who proved it with a triple-double in Game 7 of the 1988 NBA Finals.

The sobriquet does not apply to Penn State coach James Franklin.

Following Saturday’s 41-17 beatdown at Michigan, Franklin is 2-14 against Top 10 teams in his coaching career. Against Top 25 teams, his record is 11-18.

Franklin can win the little games. But the Nittany Lions tend to shrink under the spotlight.

Franklin’s signature win remains an upset of No. 2 Ohio State in 2016 that gave Penn State the Big Ten East title. Since then, Penn State’s most impressive victory relative to where teams finished the season is over No. 15 Iowa in 2019.

Penn State’s 2016 is feeling a lot like Minnesota’s 2019 — the high-water mark under its high-energy head coach who talks a better game than he calls.

The difference for Franklin is in what he has arriving compared to Fleck.

Penn State’s stellar freshman class highlighted by quarterback Drew Allar and running backs Nicholas Singleton and Kaytron Allen will be good enough to compete against Michigan and Ohio State if comparable talent follows in their footsteps.

It will take until 2024 for this potential Penn State Death Star to fully form, but at least the pieces are accumulating.

Maybe it’ll even give Franklin enough time to prove he can win another big game.


Go Gophers!!
 

"Bielema, a long-time Minnesota nemesis, needed just one offseason to get the Illinois program in a better position than Minnesota in Year 6 under Fleck. And the program Fleck inherited from Tracy Claeys was in phenomenal condition compared to the husk Bielema picked up from Lovie Smith."

THIS is spot on why Gopher fans are frustrated by this team.
 

"Bielema, a long-time Minnesota nemesis, needed just one offseason to get the Illinois program in a better position than Minnesota in Year 6 under Fleck. And the program Fleck inherited from Tracy Claeys was in phenomenal condition compared to the husk Bielema picked up from Lovie Smith."

THIS is spot on why Gopher fans are frustrated by this team.
Dragons and raisins, dragons and raisins.
 

"Bielema, a long-time Minnesota nemesis, needed just one offseason to get the Illinois program in a better position than Minnesota in Year 6 under Fleck. And the program Fleck inherited from Tracy Claeys was in phenomenal condition compared to the husk Bielema picked up from Lovie Smith."

THIS is spot on why Gopher fans are frustrated by this team.
This quote stood out to me as well, but for a different reason: we have no idea whether it's true. It might be, but we need more data. I'm as frustrated by this loss as anyone, but to say Illinois has somehow "passed" Minnesota as a program is pretty shortsighted, IMO. It could happen, but we won't know for a few more years. Again, sucks they have a better team this year -- and probably better coached -- but I'm not ready to crown them perennial contenders.
 
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This quote stood out to me as well, but for a different reason: we have no idea whether it's true. It might be, but we need more nts in other threads, but is it really true? I'm as frustrated by this loss as anyone, but to say Illinois has somehow "passed" Minnesota as a program is pretty shortsighted, IMO. It could happen, but we won't know for a few more years. Again, sucks they have a better team this year -- and probably better coached -- but I'm not ready to crown them perennial contenders.

That's right. Illinois has put together a really good team this year but that's no guarantee that they'll have a good team two years from now.
 


2 things
  • Will Illinois' season this year be as good as Minnesota's 2019 in year 3 under Fleck?
  • The Gophers Fleck inherited were not in a "phenomenal position" compared to what Bielema inherited. Talent wise I'm guessing they were similar and Fleck didn't have the transfer portal then
Lazy writing by the author.
 


2 things
  • Will Illinois' season this year be as good as Minnesota's 2019 in year 3 under Fleck?
  • The Gophers Fleck inherited were not in a "phenomenal position" compared to what Bielema inherited. Talent wise I'm guessing they were similar and Fleck didn't have the transfer portal then
Lazy writing by the author.
Why is it lazy? Curious…
 

"Bielema, a long-time Minnesota nemesis, needed just one offseason to get the Illinois program in a better position than Minnesota in Year 6 under Fleck. And the program Fleck inherited from Tracy Claeys was in phenomenal condition compared to the husk Bielema picked up from Lovie Smith."

THIS is spot on why Gopher fans are frustrated by this team.
Tracy claeys was 5-7 and 8-4
Lovie was 4-8 6-6 his last two full years

13-11 vs 10-14

Congrats on the 3 more wins
 
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You are forgetting the State of Illinois produces more 5* in one year than Minnesota in 10 years.
 

I’m not convinced Franklin will.
 


You are forgetting the State of Illinois produces more 5* in one year than Minnesota in 10 years.
The vast, vast majority of Illinois 4/5* over the last 10 years have not gone to Illinois. A quick look at commit lists shows Illinois signed about 3 4* TOTAL in the last 4 years and none were from Illinois. So actually the Gophers have more 4* Illinois HS recruits in the last 4 years than the Illini.
 



per Alex:

When the Big Ten schedule came out, Minnesota at Penn State felt for all the world like it was going to be the premier game of Week 8.

Considering Penn State was not ranked until Week Three and the Gophers weren't ranked until Week Five, the entire premise is a tad off.

In fact, it is still the premier game of this week's Big Ten schedule, given there aren't any real marquee matchups.
 




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