Judd Zulgad: There is only one person to blame for Gophers QB mess: Jerry Kill

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BleedGopher

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per Judd:

Kill waited until he felt he had no choice but to insert Croft, thus doing the kid a complete disservice by putting him in a Big Ten game and not what should have amounted to an exhibition.

Someone tweeted me a question Saturday asking if I thought Leidner had taken his last snap as a Gopher. I have no idea on that, but I do know this. During the first quarter Saturday, I went from feeling frustration with Leidner to feeling incredibly sorry for him.

It was a nice story that Leidner led a couple of late drives in victories over Colorado State and Ohio, but there were so many times it was clear the kid shouldn't be subjected to trying to direct a Big Ten team with actual aspirations of being competent in the passing game.

Kill has no choice but to stick with Croft next Saturday in Purdue, and the hope has to be that Kill and offensive coordinator Matt Limegrover can finally start to make some proper adjustments.

Croft likely will struggle again, in part because he was kept on the sideline too long. There is only one person to blame for this and there is only one person to blame for the mismanagement of this entire situation.

That is Jerry Kill.

http://www.1500espn.com/sportswire/...one_person_to_blame_for_Gophers_QB_mess100315

Go Gophers!!
 

The Childress/Tavaris comparison is apt. He was clearly a bust from the get go. Terrible instincts, the jump passes, the INTs. Some coaches have their pet projects and are incredibly blind to obvious deficiencies. He wasted some of APs best years on a draft reach.
 

reading the story, I was wondering if Kill has an OC
 

I agree with this column and have been waiting a while for someone to say it. The way our QB situation has been handed has been nothing but BRUTAL the last two years. Here is what I think happened. It's probably not all correct, but everyone has an opinion.

1. 2013, Phillip Nelson gets hurt, and Leidner comes in against San Jose State and runs for tons of yards. The coaches fall in love with him, thinking the they have an unstoppable running QB with a strong arm. In hindsight, they overestimated his running ability against better defenses, and they WAY over estimated his potential as a passer.

2. Later in 2013 with Nelson back, he leads the Gophers to 4 Big Ten wins in a row, getting 7 TDs and 0 INTs in those games. Then in the final 2 Big Ten games, he struggles against Wisconsin and Michigan State, two teams who went a combined 14-2 in the Big Ten. Apparently the damage has been done though, because just a couple series into the bowl game he is pulled in favor of Leidner and chased out of town. This was the HUGE and fatal mistake IMO. Even though Nelson had struggles, I never saw anything, ever, that suggested Leidner was going to be a better Big Ten QB than Nelson (and yes I know Nelson has his flaws).

3. They signed Streveler... why again?

4. So due to signing Streveler and Nelson getting chased out, they are left with Leidner, Perra and Croft as our QBs. Despite this, they do not sign a JUCO coming into this year. Who should they have signed you ask? I don't know, but it doesn't take a lot to improve what we currently have. I would be willing to bet that every other scholarship, non-redshirting QB in the conference is better than any of our three. (excluding Croft)

5. So now this year. It's pretty clear after about 3 series against TCU that Leidner has not fixed his issues. Maybe is a smarter QB, but he is still a terrible passer. Time to think about someone else.

6. Then as Judd mentioned, Kent State happened. If you are going to make a chance to Croft, it HAD to be after this game, to at least give him Ohio to play against instead of throwing him to the wolves, on the road in the Big Ten. So now here we are the Big Ten, we have burned the redshirt off our freshman, and are now asking him to take over already into the Big Ten season. Again, this was mis-handled.

It really saddens me as a fan that we have upgraded so many parts of our team/program, yet the QB position could not have been handled worse. So, from here it's pretty much rebuilding time. let's start to get he freshmen involved, and hope our defense does not have too much of a dropoff next year.
 

gopher7 said:
2. Later in 2013 with Nelson back, he leads the Gophers to 4 Big Ten wins in a row, getting 7 TDs and 0 INTs in those games. Then in the final 2 Big Ten games, he struggles against Wisconsin and Michigan State, two teams who went a combined 14-2 in the Big Ten. Apparently the damage has been done though, because just a couple series into the bowl game he is pulled in favor of Leidner and <b>chased out of town.</b> This was the HUGE and fatal mistake IMO. Even though Nelson had struggles, I never saw anything, ever, that suggested Leidner was going to be a better Big Ten QB than Nelson (and yes I know Nelson has his flaws).
Click to expand...

You are welcome to your opinion, but the bolded is false. It is well documented and undisputed that PN9 chose to leave when Kill wouldn't hand him the reigns. He gave Kill a choice "guarantee I start or I'm leaving". Kill did the right thing and let him go. Absolutely no room for someone like that on your team. He likely heard how great he was from Dad a bit too much.
 


gopher7 said:
I agree with this column and have been waiting a while for someone to say it. The way our QB situation has been handed has been nothing but BRUTAL the last two years. Here is what I think happened. It's probably not all correct, but everyone has an opinion.

1. 2013, Phillip Nelson gets hurt, and Leidner comes in against San Jose State and runs for tons of yards. The coaches fall in love with him, thinking the they have an unstoppable running QB with a strong arm. In hindsight, they overestimated his running ability against better defenses, and they WAY over estimated his potential as a passer.

2. Later in 2013 with Nelson back, he leads the Gophers to 4 Big Ten wins in a row, getting 7 TDs and 0 INTs in those games. Then in the final 2 Big Ten games, he struggles against Wisconsin and Michigan State, two teams who went a combined 14-2 in the Big Ten. Apparently the damage has been done though, because just a couple series into the bowl game he is pulled in favor of Leidner and chased out of town. This was the HUGE and fatal mistake IMO. Even though Nelson had struggles, I never saw anything, ever, that suggested Leidner was going to be a better Big Ten QB than Nelson (and yes I know Nelson has his flaws).

3. They signed Streveler... why again?

4. So due to signing Streveler and Nelson getting chased out, they are left with Leidner, Perra and Croft as our QBs. Despite this, they do not sign a JUCO coming into this year. Who should they have signed you ask? I don't know, but it doesn't take a lot to improve what we currently have. I would be willing to bet that every other scholarship, non-redshirting QB in the conference is better than any of our three. (excluding Croft)

5. So now this year. It's pretty clear after about 3 series against TCU that Leidner has not fixed his issues. Maybe is a smarter QB, but he is still a terrible passer. Time to think about someone else.

6. Then as Judd mentioned, Kent State happened. If you are going to make a chance to Croft, it HAD to be after this game, to at least give him Ohio to play against instead of throwing him to the wolves, on the road in the Big Ten. So now here we are the Big Ten, we have burned the redshirt off our freshman, and are now asking him to take over already into the Big Ten season. Again, this was mis-handled.

It really saddens me as a fan that we have upgraded so many parts of our team/program, yet the QB position could not have been handled worse. So, from here it's pretty much rebuilding time. let's start to get he freshmen involved, and hope our defense does not have too much of a dropoff next year.
Click to expand...
i said it every week for 2 years.
 

It's becoming clear that we have no identity on offense. 3-4 years ago there was a STrib article about how all the coaches chip in plays that might work the next Saturday. The gist of the article was the Gophers were/are unpredictable because the offense was/is a mixture of several offensive schemes, but now the lack of a true identity may have become a serious flaw. Apparently the collective wisdom has not been learning any new things, and anyway I don't think there are many well paid offensive coordinators still working that would be proud to take suggestions from Sam, Dick, or Harry. We have made each team we played this year look like defensive masterminds instead of the other way around. And then we blame the quarterback and the offensive line because the same plays used to work. But the nature of the game is adapt or lose. We need to adapt faster. Plain old conservative smash mouth is fine if you can do it, but it's looking more and more obvious that you have to be smart about whichever offensive identity you choose. We are obviously easy to plan for.
 

There was an old SNL skit about porn stars that couldn't make it in the real world because every situation became a sexual innuendo. I feel the same about this team. I don't know if they can change from their multiple tight end/deep play action/narrow splits/power run philosophy. In Jerry speak, we need to run with the horses we got. I feel like we could be more successful with more consistent execution, but we shoot ourselves in the foot way too often. What made Patterson shift course?

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/eZDBMfe3iPE" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 

I think you're right PE, I don't think there is any other offense for us to run. The problem is we're not executing this one very well either. I don't think there is an answer where we become average. We need older skill position kids and a flat out better offensive line. In 2 years, the receivers, Croft and the running backs will have a lot more experience.
 



gopher7 said:
2. Later in 2013 with Nelson back, he leads the Gophers to 4 Big Ten wins in a row, getting 7 TDs and 0 INTs in those games. Then in the final 2 Big Ten games, he struggles against Wisconsin and Michigan State, two teams who went a combined 14-2 in the Big Ten. Apparently the damage has been done though, because just a couple series into the bowl game he is pulled in favor of Leidner and chased out of town. This was the HUGE and fatal mistake IMO. Even though Nelson had struggles, I never saw anything, ever, that suggested Leidner was going to be a better Big Ten QB than Nelson (and yes I know Nelson has his flaws).
Click to expand...

I don't disagree with a lot of what you are saying, but I don't agree with some of this paragraph. Nelson went a combined 15 of 48 (31%) with 2 INT in the last three games in 2013. I would say that is worse than just struggling.

Secondly, why do you say he was "chased out of town"? There has been no evidence of that. Most reports seem to hint Nelson wasn't happy and wanted to transfer.
 

gopher7 said:
I agree with this column and have been waiting a while for someone to say it. The way our QB situation has been handed has been nothing but BRUTAL the last two years. Here is what I think happened. It's probably not all correct, but everyone has an opinion.

1. 2013, Phillip Nelson gets hurt, and Leidner comes in against San Jose State and runs for tons of yards. The coaches fall in love with him, thinking the they have an unstoppable running QB with a strong arm. In hindsight, they overestimated his running ability against better defenses, and they WAY over estimated his potential as a passer.

2. Later in 2013 with Nelson back, he leads the Gophers to 4 Big Ten wins in a row, getting 7 TDs and 0 INTs in those games. Then in the final 2 Big Ten games, he struggles against Wisconsin and Michigan State, two teams who went a combined 14-2 in the Big Ten. Apparently the damage has been done though, because just a couple series into the bowl game he is pulled in favor of Leidner and chased out of town. This was the HUGE and fatal mistake IMO. Even though Nelson had struggles, I never saw anything, ever, that suggested Leidner was going to be a better Big Ten QB than Nelson (and yes I know Nelson has his flaws).

3. They signed Streveler... why again?

4. So due to signing Streveler and Nelson getting chased out, they are left with Leidner, Perra and Croft as our QBs. Despite this, they do not sign a JUCO coming into this year. Who should they have signed you ask? I don't know, but it doesn't take a lot to improve what we currently have. I would be willing to bet that every other scholarship, non-redshirting QB in the conference is better than any of our three. (excluding Croft)

5. So now this year. It's pretty clear after about 3 series against TCU that Leidner has not fixed his issues. Maybe is a smarter QB, but he is still a terrible passer. Time to think about someone else.

6. Then as Judd mentioned, Kent State happened. If you are going to make a chance to Croft, it HAD to be after this game, to at least give him Ohio to play against instead of throwing him to the wolves, on the road in the Big Ten. So now here we are the Big Ten, we have burned the redshirt off our freshman, and are now asking him to take over already into the Big Ten season. Again, this was mis-handled.

It really saddens me as a fan that we have upgraded so many parts of our team/program, yet the QB position could not have been handled worse. So, from here it's pretty much rebuilding time. let's start to get he freshmen involved, and hope our defense does not have too much of a dropoff next year.
Click to expand...

]

I agree with much of what you said, but Philip Nelson was also atrocious in the bowl game against Syracuse (Leidner was much better and almost led the team to a win) and, due to the serious criminal charges Nelson faced last year, he probably wouldn't have been playing for the Gophers anyway.

I agree that he should have tried inserting Croft earlier but the Gophers had no breather games in non-conference. Furthermore, Leidner did have a pretty good game against Ohio so he was the reasonable starter for today's game. He should have been benched after the 3rd quarter, though. Not recruiting someone else after Nelson left was really a major error of wishful thinking. Perhaps Kill thinks he can coach up any prospect regardless of talent, but I hope he's learning the limits of his coaching powers.
 

Sparlimb said:
I think you're right PE, I don't think there is any other offense for us to run. The problem is we're not executing this one very well either. I don't think there is an answer where we become average. We need older skill position kids and a flat out better offensive line. In 2 years, the receivers, Croft and the running backs will have a lot more experience.
Click to expand...

I'd like to see more 27 and 24 running out of 3 and 4 wr sets. I think he can break some tackles. Try something different.

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/_PQdKJhZFwI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 

Nelson was recruited here to run more of a spread offense which better suited his abilities. He was a pretty decent runner. Then the offense was switched to what we see now. He wasn't all-world or anything, but I don't blame him for not wanting to play in this offense.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 



Nort73 said:
Nelson was recruited here to run more of a spread offense which better suited his abilities. He was a pretty decent runner. Then the offense was switched to what we see now. He wasn't all-world or anything, but I don't blame him for not wanting to play in this offense.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

That's the first I have heard of that. When has Kill ever ran a spread offense?
 

Spread is a spectrum of philosophies. Even our offense has elements of spread in it.
 

GophersInIowa said:
That's the first I have heard of that. When has Kill ever ran a spread offense?
Click to expand...

Right when he came here. A lot more QB reads. Way less double tight end formations from what I remember. I'm not comparing that offense to Oregon, but it had more of a spread philosophy than what we are seeing now.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Nort73 said:
Right when he came here. A lot more QB reads. Way less double tight end formations from what I remember. I'm not comparing that offense to Oregon, but it had more of a spread philosophy than what we are seeing now.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Yeah I don't remember if the formations were a lot different. But Nelson did run a lot of QB reads when he was here. There were rumors part of the reason he left was because he wasn't happy getting hit as much as he was because he was being asked to run it so much.
 

cjbfbp said:
]

I agree with much of what you said, but Philip Nelson was also atrocious in the bowl game against Syracuse
Click to expand...
Don't disagree. But with the way the staff handled the QB situation that year I think they actually made Nelson worse. Can't back this up at all, but my recollections were that Nelson was usually clearly better than Leidner, and he seemed to do worse the more they platooned them. They created a controversy where there should have been none.
 


I must have missed the part where Croft led us to multiple 4th quarter TDs and we came back to win the game...
 

I always liked Nelson far better than Mitch and thought people were crazy for not giving him a longer leash. The ideal situation would have been that Nelson improved and was a senior this year and Mitch was a back-up who had played sparingly. It doesn't really matter though since Nelson wouldn't have been here due to his own actions.
 

John Galt said:
I always liked Nelson far better than Mitch and thought people were crazy for not giving him a longer leash. The ideal situation would have been that Nelson improved and was a senior this year and Mitch was a back-up who had played sparingly. It doesn't really matter though since Nelson wouldn't have been here due to his own actions.
Click to expand...

Well, maybe the trauma of losing his job caused him to go astray. :)
 

Mitch led us to a 5-3 record in the B1G last year. Are this year's problems only on Mitch? or Limegrover? or Kill? or all 3?
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Mitch led us to a 5-3 record in the B1G last year. Are this year's problems only on Mitch? or Limegrover? or Kill? or all 3?
Click to expand...

Well I'd argue David Cobb and Maxx Williams had a lot more to do with 5-3 than Mitch. So did our defense. But you can't argue, he was the starter and we went 5-3. Right back to Mase territory.
 


Sparlimb said:
Well I'd argue David Cobb and Maxx Williams had a lot more to do with 5-3 than Mitch. So did our defense. But you can't argue, he was the starter and we went 5-3. Right back to Mase territory.
Click to expand...

Of course they did. The point still stands, we were 5-3 in the B1G with a guy who "isn't a D-1 QB." So obviously, something else has gone seriously haywire this year.
 

Missing on Streveler and McKinzy and not going after a JUCO/5th year QB transfer are larger issues to me. Croft was/is likely to struggle this year regardless of whether or not he played against Kent State or Ohio. He wasn't a 5 star QB who has been to all the elite camps since he was 12 years old or whatever, he was a kid with one power 5 offer who probably isn't ready to play for a MAC school, much less in the B1G.

Coming in to try to fix a broken offense as a lightly recruited true freshman is an almost impossible task. There should have been a more experienced option behind a quarterback who has never shown any consistency.
 

EG#9 said:
Missing on Streveler and McKinzy and <b>not going after a JUCO/5th year QB transfer </b>are larger issues to me. Croft was/is likely to struggle this year regardless of whether or not he played against Kent State or Ohio. He wasn't a 5 star QB who has been to all the elite camps since he was 12 years old or whatever, he was a kid with one power 5 offer who probably isn't ready to play for a MAC school, much less in the B1G.

Coming in to try to fix a broken offense as a lightly recruited true freshman is an almost impossible task. There should have been a more experienced option behind a quarterback who has never shown any consistency.
Click to expand...

Let's all stop this crap. There aren't a many JuCo/Grad Transfers to be had. Every time someone spews this line they look silly. Getting a Russell Wilson that way is equivalent to getting a JT Barrett in recruiting. There are only a few elite ones and they ain't coming here.
 

Spoofin said:
Let's all stop this crap. There aren't a many JuCo/Grad Transfers to be had. Every time someone spews this line they look silly. Getting a Russell Wilson that way is equivalent to getting a JT Barrett in recruiting. There are only a few elite ones and they ain't coming here.
Click to expand...

There's a wide gulf between Russell Wilson and Mitch Leidner. Making statements like this make you silly. If "they aren't coming here" is your answer for every possible upgrade from Mitch Leidner or just someone to turn to other than a lightly recruited freshman QB, then maybe the coach responsible for "here" is the issue
 

Spoofin said:
You are welcome to your opinion, but the bolded is false. It is well documented and undisputed that PN9 chose to leave when Kill wouldn't hand him the reigns. He gave Kill a choice "guarantee I start or I'm leaving". Kill did the right thing and let him go. Absolutely no room for someone like that on your team. He likely heard how great he was from Dad a bit too much.
Click to expand...

The way he went out complaining that he wanted to go someplace that was more focused on the pass, that sounds about right. And let's keep in mind Nelson was all of a 50% completion guy too..... I'm sure we would have passed more had he been more like 75%.
 

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