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8151

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I think that they should make certain Fleck's buy-out is as high as possible. I was a big Kill supporter and I think that Claeys was a very good Defensive coordinator. My thinking on Fleck:

1) I believe the team is more disciplined under Fleck (this is not a criticism of Kill or Claeys);
2) I believe that the coordinators, overall, are superior;
3) I believe that the sideline, game management, etc. is superior;
4) I believe that Fleck is and will be more persuasive with recruits than either Kill or Claeys;
5) I believe that Fleck will recruit better players and is more in-tune with modern recruits than his predecessors;
6) I believe that Fleck is not going to lose confidence in himself or in his system because of this year and I think that is the correct approach; and
7) I believe that the comparisons between Fleck and Brewster are overblown and incorrect. One, Fleck, is a legitimate Big-10 head coach--whether you like him or not. (Last year at Western Michigan and this year shows that). The other was not prepared to be a head coach and the fact that he has not been a head coach since his firing speaks volumes. Both Fleck and Brewster have a passion for recruiting that Mason/Kill/Claeys did not have.

Feel free to comment!
 

short ornery norwegian

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I think that they should make certain Fleck's buy-out is as high as possible. I was a big Kill supporter and I think that Claeys was a very good Defensive coordinator. My thinking on Fleck:

1) I believe the team is more disciplined under Fleck (this is not a criticism of Kill or Claeys);
2) I believe that the coordinators, overall, are superior;
3) I believe that the sideline, game management, etc. is superior;
4) I believe that Fleck is and will be more persuasive with recruits than either Kill or Claeys;
5) I believe that Fleck will recruit better players and is more in-tune with modern recruits than his predecessors;
6) I believe that Fleck is not going to lose confidence in himself or in his system because of this year and I think that is the correct approach; and
7) I believe that the comparisons between Fleck and Brewster are overblown and incorrect. One, Fleck, is a legitimate Big-10 head coach--whether you like him or not. (Last year at Western Michigan and this year shows that). The other was not prepared to be a head coach and the fact that he has not been a head coach since his firing speaks volumes. Both Fleck and Brewster have a passion for recruiting that Mason/Kill/Claeys did not have.

Feel free to comment!

Objection - facts not in evidence. Fleck may prove himself to be a legitimate B1G head coach, but it will take more than 2 B1G games and 3 non-conf games to do that. I don't want Fleck Fired, and I don't want to give him a contract extension. I want to watch the rest of the season and form my own conclusions.

As far as the coordinators being superior - I would take Sawvell back in a heartbeat to be the D-coordinator. On offense, it's a wash.
 

TruDomGopher

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Some fair points, but I believe anyone that thinks Smith is superior to Sawvel shouldn't handle any object sharper than a banana.
 

PMWinSTP

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Some fair points, but I believe anyone that thinks Smith is superior to Sawvel shouldn't handle any object sharper than a banana.

Immediately thought of this when I read that line...

<iframe width="854" height="480" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/9eJ0iGZ7Ms8" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 

NotAFanOfBecky

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I think that they should make certain Fleck's buy-out is as high as possible. I was a big Kill supporter and I think that Claeys was a very good Defensive coordinator. My thinking on Fleck:

1) I believe the team is more disciplined under Fleck (this is not a criticism of Kill or Claeys);
2) I believe that the coordinators, overall, are superior;
3) I believe that the sideline, game management, etc. is superior;
4) I believe that Fleck is and will be more persuasive with recruits than either Kill or Claeys;
5) I believe that Fleck will recruit better players and is more in-tune with modern recruits than his predecessors;
6) I believe that Fleck is not going to lose confidence in himself or in his system because of this year and I think that is the correct approach; and
7) I believe that the comparisons between Fleck and Brewster are overblown and incorrect. One, Fleck, is a legitimate Big-10 head coach--whether you like him or not. (Last year at Western Michigan and this year shows that). The other was not prepared to be a head coach and the fact that he has not been a head coach since his firing speaks volumes. Both Fleck and Brewster have a passion for recruiting that Mason/Kill/Claeys did not have.

Feel free to comment!

1. Yes
2. No...at least not defensively.
3. Yes
4. Absolutely
5. Not so sure
6. Agree
7.Yes and no. Comparisons as a coach are no comparison. Comparisons at gimmicks and goofy sayings are absolutely comparable.
 


#2Gopher

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So lets support our coach and go with it. More trolls on this site than I thought though.
 

GoldenGophers7

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I think that they should make certain Fleck's buy-out is as high as possible. I was a big Kill supporter and I think that Claeys was a very good Defensive coordinator. My thinking on Fleck:

1) I believe the team is more disciplined under Fleck (this is not a criticism of Kill or Claeys);
2) I believe that the coordinators, overall, are superior;
3) I believe that the sideline, game management, etc. is superior;
4) I believe that Fleck is and will be more persuasive with recruits than either Kill or Claeys;
5) I believe that Fleck will recruit better players and is more in-tune with modern recruits than his predecessors;
6) I believe that Fleck is not going to lose confidence in himself or in his system because of this year and I think that is the correct approach; and
7) I believe that the comparisons between Fleck and Brewster are overblown and incorrect. One, Fleck, is a legitimate Big-10 head coach--whether you like him or not. (Last year at Western Michigan and this year shows that). The other was not prepared to be a head coach and the fact that he has not been a head coach since his firing speaks volumes. Both Fleck and Brewster have a passion for recruiting that Mason/Kill/Claeys did not have.

Feel free to comment!

I agree with everything you said.


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Bob_Loblaw

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I am fine with the buy-out being as high as possible. IMO, unless a coach is an absolute dumpster fire (Brew), I think stability is the only way for us to go from decent (2016) to a good Big 10 team.

I haven't seen anything this year that has made me change my opinion that Fleck is a good coach. So yeah, I'm fine with a high buy out.
 

GopherSteak

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All the whiners have me dumbfounded. I'm overall happy with Fleck as he was left with lots of issues. We are playing ok with a d2 qb on offense. I hunk he's churning as much butter as he can.
 



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Sawvel is far superior to Smith.....Recruiting is always a wait and see approach....The team is more disciplined...Fleck made zero in-game adjustments at halftime to help them beat Maryland or Purdue....I wonder how ticket sales will be next year if they finish with four wins..Coyle cannot be happy.
 

GopherWeatherGuy

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Some fair points, but I believe anyone that thinks Smith is superior to Sawvel shouldn't handle any object sharper than a banana.

Sawvel is only in his second year as a defensive coordinator and first without Claeys. So far he's done a good job, but he also inherited a very good defense. But he still has plenty to prove yet.

Last year Sawvel's defense gave up 22.9 points per game with far superior DBs. Smith's defense has given up 17.2 so far this year. Smith had a top 10 defense at Arkansas in 2014. Arkansas defense has not gotten better this year with his departure.
 

Bob_Loblaw

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Sawvel is only in his second year as a defensive coordinator and first without Claeys. So far he's done a good job, but he also inherited a very good defense. But he still has plenty to prove yet.

Last year Sawvel's defense gave up 22.9 points per game with far superior DBs. Smith's defense has given up 17.2 so far this year. Smith had a top 10 defense at Arkansas in 2014. Arkansas defense has not gotten better this year with his departure.

You want to revisit these numbers on Thanksgiving?
 

Oregon Gopher

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So lets support our coach and go with it. More trolls on this site than I thought though.

You really think there's a lot of trolls on this site? I think the great great majority of posters wish for nothing but success for our Gophers. Now, there's tons of differing opinions on the coaches methods, philosophies and personality- but that hardly makes trolls out of those who disagree with some of your opinions.


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GopherWeatherGuy

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You want to revisit these numbers on Thanksgiving?

Sure, but with the mounting injures at DB, it'll likely be worse.

Purdue's offense still scored more points and had nearly the same amount of yards against Sawvel's defense last year. Blough threw for 391 and 3 TDs against Sawvel's defense with a couple of NFL DBs.
 

Bob_Loblaw

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Sure, but with the mounting injures at DB, it'll likely be worse.

Purdue's offense still scored more points and had nearly the same amount of yards against Sawvel's defense last year. Blough threw for 391 and 3 TDs against Sawvel's defense with a couple of NFL DBs.

You think maybe a full Big 10 schedule might also have a little bit of an impact on those numbers? Nah - excuse computer time.
 

GopherWeatherGuy

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You think maybe a full Big 10 schedule might also have a little bit of an impact on those numbers? Nah - excuse computer time.

Sure it does. What did the excuse computer say when Sawvel's defense gave up 31 to Purdue and 32 to Rutgers last year?
 

MNSpaniel

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Sawvel was missing a number of those DB due to suspensions. Every team has injuries and I'm sure we had them last year as well. Just can't think of who right now. I've always said I don't like Fleck's persona but can live with it if we have a better team. Time will tell.
 

TruDomGopher

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Other people are entitled to their controversial opinions as well.

While I admittedly didn't follow Arkansas all that closely, Smith's defenses seemed to fall off as his own players were brought into the system.

On the other hand, I've never seen any coach anywhere that was better at developing and coaching up the defensive backfield better than Sawvel. And with Minnesota, those are exactly the kind of coaches that are worth their weight in gold.

I will grant you that Sawvel doesn't have a long resume as DC, but in the pluses/minuses game--especially watching what's going on at Wake--I'm firmly of the opinion that Sawvel would have been a better long term option for the Gophers. However, in the circumstances, that wasn't happening.

And that doesn't mean I don't support Coach Fleck and Smith. It just means I have an opinion, too, and after 60 years of supporting the Gophers through thick and thin--mostly thin--my rodent credentials speak for themselves.
 

Mulligan

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You really think there's a lot of trolls on this site? I think the great great majority of posters wish for nothing but success for our Gophers. Now, there's tons of differing opinions on the coaches methods, philosophies and personality- but that hardly makes trolls out of those who disagree with some of your opinions.


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I think you're basically right. However, some people come out of the woodwork only when we lose and they can't make their points once or twice and leave it at that. They literally beat the hell out of the poor dead horse and usually don't add much of anything.

God knows PJ left himself open with his schtick but how many repeated versions of, "We really look good handing the ball to the ref," or, "The sprint between quarters was elite," does it take before someone realizes it's not that clever? Gets old seeing the same bitching over and over in each new thread.

We've been exposed once we got into league play. The tests now are to see if he can adjust and still win several and if the players keep buying into the program.
 


Face The Facts

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1. Yes
2. No...at least not defensively.
3. Yes
4. Absolutely
5. Not so sure
6. Agree
7.Yes and no. Comparisons as a coach are no comparison. Comparisons at gimmicks and goofy sayings are absolutely comparable.


#5 - You don't think Fleck will recruit better players than Claeys would have?

I can't fathom that Claeys would do a better job year in and year out recruiting. I just can't see it.
 

Spoofin

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Last year Sawvel's defense gave up 22.9 points per game with far superior DBs. Smith's defense has given up 17.2 so far this year. Smith had a top 10 defense at Arkansas in 2014. Arkansas defense has not gotten better this year with his departure.

Wow. That is a great point. Let's take it further - Sawvel's defense gave up nearly 300 points last year and Smith's has given up less than 100 this year. That sounds even more dramatic. Equally out of context, but more dramatic.



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Nort73

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I want to see the defense with solid talent and depth at all three levels before I say Sawvel is for sure better. But I was a big fan of Sawvel. He just had more to work with than what we currently have in the roster.


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