The Next Step: Gophers' Carlie Wagner eyeing WNBA career

Shades

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http://www.mankatofreepress.com/spo...cle_d2abf802-35ad-11e8-a460-b3efb8395e7b.html

She is hoping to get drafted during the three-round selection process or, at least, get invited to a team’s preseason camp.

“I’d like to keep playing if I could,” Wagner said. “I still love the game.”
I love hearing this. When I talked to her about pro ball before she came to the U, she was doubtful about the WNBA and really doubtful about overseas ball. Confidence in herself seems to be building. Just grab the bull by the horns, Carlie. :clap:


Wagner has been a constant fixture in the weight room and on the court since joining the Gophers.

“I’ve tried to work on things that are outside my comfort zone,” she said. “I’ve tried to improve my defense and just become a more well-rounded player. And I know I’ve grown a lot as a leader, too.”
As for the WNBA, Stollings said it will be a significant challenge to make it but that Wagner has the mindset to pull it off.

“In the WNBA, it’s hard to get drafted, let alone picked for a roster,” Stollings said. “When she came to us a wide-eyed freshman she did absolutely everything we asked her to do.

“That’s what she’ll have to if she gets to a WNBA camp. She’ll have to listen to what they’re asking her to do, and I know she’s more than capable of doing that.”
 

Shades

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LaChina Robinson was part of a pre-draft conference call and said something about Carlie Wagner.

http://www.asapsports.com/show_interview.php?id=139140

Q. Wonder if you had a chance to see the University of Minnesota play at all this year and if you thought that Carlie Wagner has enough of what it would take to find a spot in this league as a player off the bench?
LACHINA ROBINSON: I did. I had an opportunity to watch Minnesota. I had them in the NCAA Tournament. And I was very impressed with Wagner. I think the biggest thing is how she's able to find shots.

She's a great three-point shooter, but it takes so much more than that. I would compare her to Rebecca Greenwell, three-point shooter that worked extremely hard to get open. Her work ethic is incredible. I think one thing that doesn't always translate on watching her on television or watching her on film is how physically fit she is.

She can play an entire game and never take a possession off. One of the challenges for her is definitely on the defensive end. But her ability to come in the game and knock down shots, not concerned about that at all.

So can you do that at an 11th or 12th spot on someone's roster? Depends on that team and their need. But that's always a premium when a player can hit from long range the way Carlie can.
 

Ignatius L Hoops

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Ignatius L Hoops

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Shades

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The only way the Lynx can keep Carlie is if they did something like this (max 12 roster)

Whalen/Robinson/Jones
Augustus/Wright/Wagner
Moore/Zandalasini
Brunson/Kizer
Fowles/Fagbenle

They’d be overloaded at guard and thin at post. They’d have to lean on Maya Moore to backup the PF position. Could be done but not sure they’d want it that way.

If Whalen would quit the Lynx altogether, it’d actually make things easier for the Lynx and Carlie.
 

dpodoll68

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The only way the Lynx can keep Carlie is if they did something like this (max 12 roster)

Whalen/Robinson/Jones
Augustus/Wright/Wagner
Moore/Zandalasini
Brunson/Kizer
Fowles/Fagbenle

They’d be overloaded at guard and thin at post. They’d have to lean on Maya Moore to backup the PF position. Could be done but not sure they’d want it that way.

If Whalen would quit the Lynx altogether, it’d actually make things easier for the Lynx and Carlie.
So you want the Lynx to be worse this year?
 

Shades

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So you want the Lynx to be worse this year?
They’re probably going to be worse no matter what.

Plenette Pierson: retired
Kia Perkins: retired
Renee Montgomery: moved on to ATL (painful)
Natasha Howard: moved on to SEA (painful)

They brought in some pieces to replace them, but they have no idea how they’ll mesh.

I’m not sure Whalen can focus 100% on the Lynx when she has other things on her mind.
An experienced coach like Stephanie White tried to coach the Fever during the summer right before coaching Vanderbilt in the fall. The Fever season was a disaster, and I don’t think she got off on the right foot with Vanderbilt either. She’s still stumbling with them.
 

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They’re probably going to be worse no matter what.

Plenette Pierson: retired
Kia Perkins: retired
Renee Montgomery: moved on to ATL (painful)
Natasha Howard: moved on to SEA (painful)

They brought in some pieces to replace them, but they have no idea how they’ll mesh.

I’m not sure Whalen can focus 100% on the Lynx when she has other things on her mind.
An experienced coach like Stephanie White tried to coach the Fever during the summer right before coaching Vanderbilt in the fall. The Fever season was a disaster, and I don’t think she got off on the right foot with Vanderbilt either. She’s still stumbling with them.
Lynx will NOT be "worse no matter what". I recently had a conversation with the coach/GM and she feels very good. Obviously they begin by returning all five starters. They will miss Renee (left to play near home) and Howard (traded) but she feels VERY good about the potential of Robinson. She also worked hard to get Wright to return and feels like Zandalasini and Jones are just starting to emerge. Also thinks Miyem (coming from same Italy team as Zan and also has 9 years experience with France national including silver in 2012 Olympics) might have ability. I do agree with Shades that Carly will have a hard time making team (unless one of the five guards ahead of her gets an injury).
 

dpodoll68

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Lynx will NOT be "worse no matter what". I recently had a conversation with the coach/GM and she feels very good. Obviously they begin by returning all five starters. They will miss Renee (left to play near home) and Howard (traded) but she feels VERY good about the potential of Robinson. She also worked hard to get Wright to return and feels like Zandalasini and Jones are just starting to emerge. Also thinks Miyem (coming from same Italy team as Zan and also has 9 years experience with France national including silver in 2012 Olympics) might have ability. I do agree with Shades that Carly will have a hard time making team (unless one of the five guards ahead of her gets an injury).
I commented on Shades' post because I'm baffled as to why anyone would want one of the greatest female players in history to retire so that a fringe WNBA player can grab the 12th roster spot.
 

Shades

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With all the attention and promotion Carlie Wagner is getting, aren’t they setting up the fans for disappointment if they end up cutting her? From the post-draft interview, it sounded like the Lynx might have to start out the season with only eleven players unless one of the veteran players doesn’t make the cut. That’s really bad news.

Not signing Wright (who is capable of backing up the PG) BEFORE DRob kinda messed things up for the Lynx, in my opinion.
 

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I commented on Shades' post because I'm baffled as to why anyone would want one of the greatest female players in history to retire so that a fringe WNBA player can grab the 12th roster spot.
You realize she stepped down from USA Basketball. Do you know why? She knew it was time to give other players the opportunity. And she was kind of a late bloomer to USA Basketball herself.

The 35-year-old felt she wouldn’t be able to fully commit the time necessary to be part of the 2020 Olympic team and that it was time to give someone else a chance.

“If I had played in worlds (this year), and a year or two from now had said I’m ready to be done playing, that wouldn’t be fair to them,” Whalen said.
And this quote was way BEFORE she took on the role of head coach of the U.

Now substitute “2020 Olympic” with 2018 Lynx and “worlds” with WNBA, and you get something like this.

The 35-year-old felt she wouldn’t be able to fully commit the time necessary to be part of the 2018 Lynx team and that it was time to give someone else a chance.

“If I had played in WNBA (this year), and a year or two from now had said I’m ready to be done playing, that wouldn’t be fair to them,” Whalen said.



Exactly!
 

dpodoll68

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You realize she stepped down from USA Basketball. Do you know why? She knew it was time to give other players the opportunity. And she was kind of a late bloomer to USA Basketball herself.



And this quote was way BEFORE she took on the role of head coach of the U.

Now substitute “2020 Olympic” with 2018 Lynx and “worlds” with WNBA, and you get something like this.

The 35-year-old felt she wouldn’t be able to fully commit the time necessary to be part of the 2018 Lynx team and that it was time to give someone else a chance.

“If I had played in WNBA (this year), and a year or two from now had said I’m ready to be done playing, that wouldn’t be fair to them,” Whalen said.



Exactly!
The 2020 Olympic team and 2018 Lynx team aren't even on the same planet in terms of conversation. A lot of people like to play for pride and country, but most everyone (if not literally everyone) would prioritize their actual team ahead of their Olympic ambitions. Plus, if she steps down from the Olympic team, they'll have someone else just as good or better to take her place - the Lynx will not have that. And, additionally, what does her playing for the 2018 Lynx have to do with her playing for the 2019/2020 Lynx team? Who is it "unfair" to that she's playing this year?

What a weird post.
 

Ignatius L Hoops

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With all the attention and promotion Carlie Wagner is getting, aren’t they setting up the fans for disappointment if they end up cutting her? From the post-draft interview, it sounded like the Lynx might have to start out the season with only eleven players unless one of the veteran players players doesn’t make the cut. That’s really bad news.

Not signing Wright (who is capable of backing up the PG) BEFORE DRob kinda messed things up for the Lynx, in my opinion.
Maybe some fans don't realize how hard it is to make a WNBA roster (especially as the last pick); but I assume most of us do. Carlie certainly knows. Her former teammate, Shae Kelley, a 35th pick, got a few seconds in the league. So it's worth a try.
 

Shades

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A lot of people like to play for pride and country, but most everyone (if not literally everyone) would prioritize their actual team ahead of their Olympic ambitions.
I’m pretty sure you have that backwards. For most players, the gold medal is the pinnacle. What’s more “actual” than Team USA?

Plus, if she steps down from the Olympic team, they'll have someone else just as good or better to take her place - the Lynx will not have that.
There’s no “if” about it. She already stepped down. Somebody seems to be in denial. I’m not sure who Team USA gets to replace Whalen will be just as good. I thought you said Reeve was high on DRob, so what’s the problem giving her the full reins?

Who is it "unfair" to that she's playing this year?
Duh!

What a weird post.
Hopefully in your future posts you won’t feel a need to get personal.
 

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A few seconds? She got to experience a WNBA championship season.View attachment 5460
True, but by playing only a few seconds.

Carlie will have a bigger challenge as the Lynx are deeper right now at her position than they were with Shae. Also, even if Lindsay had decided not to play this year, Carlie might have had a slightly better chance to make the last cut but still would not play very many minutes. Either way, she will be able to play professionally somewhere.
 

Shades

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Carlie will have a bigger challenge as the Lynx are deeper right now at her position than they were with Shae.
You’re preaching to the choir. I was the one pointing out how difficult it would be to add Wagner to the roster with Whalen on it. Difficult but not impossible. In Kelley’s season, a two for one trade for Fowles opened a spot for her to return. For Wagner, the Lynx would have to go with an unusual balance of 6 guards, an unexpected trade of a guard happens (like Alexis Jones asks out because she doesn’t want to be the 3rd PG), or Whalen retires. I know all this. If you can’t tell, the WNBA is very much my thing.

Also, even if Lindsay had decided not to play this year, Carlie might have had a slightly better chance to make the last cut but still would not play very many minutes.
She’d be comfortably in if Whalen retired. That’s part of the reason I brought it up. I know it’s not going to happen. The Gophers have already calculated the 65% first year term rate for not being a fulltime head coach and they seemed to have agreed on this. It’s just that if Whalen felt bad about taking away younger Team USA members’ opportunities, she should feel just as bad if not more for Wagner. It’s her dream to play for the Lynx, and not just for a training camp. The minutes don’t really matter. Reeve is notorious about not playing rookies. This is nothing new. It’s about the whole experience.

Either way, she will be able to play professionally somewhere.
Yeah, I’m just hoping her home state team does all it can to make it happen. You know, rewarding the loyalty that she showed Minnesota. She could have gone to Maryland. Rewarding her for loyalty is part of what they’re doing now with the training camp experience. Now let’s take it another step. It doesn’t all have to be about loyalty. She obviously has merit. I’m feeling like the only Gopher fan on this board that has any faith in her. If in camp she shows she totally doesn’t have anything that it takes to be a WNBA player, I would understand not extending the opportunity to her... but that would surprise me.

You can think about it this way too. Wagner giving it her usual all and some extra this year made it possible for the Gophers to go to the NCAA tournament and to actually win a game in the tournament, which in turn was a huge factor in Stollings getting a new job, which in turn helped Whalen get the Gopher head coaching job. It’s the circle of life. Let’s reward Wagner now.

Look, I just wanted to vent on this. I realize Wagner making the team is unlikely to happen no matter what I say. I really don’t need people coming back at me repeating things already said, preaching to choir, or insulting me because I feel giving 100% to her new job is most unselfish route for Whalen to go. If you have something new to say about this subject, I’m all ears.
 

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I agree with those who have pointed out that it's absurd to suggest that Whalen should step aside to make room for other players (i.e. Wagner) to make the roster. Whalen is the starting point guard on a world championship team and I'd never expect her to abandon her long-time teammates a few weeks before training camp.
 

dpodoll68

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It’s just that if Whalen felt bad about taking away younger Team USA members’ opportunities, she should feel just as bad if not more for Wagner.
Completely illogical. Whoever takes her spot on Team USA is an established star player. Moreover, the drop in quality of player doesn't exist on Team USA going from her to another player - if anything it might be an upgrade. It's not her job to step aside from the Lynx (and hurt her team) so that a fringe WNBA player can earn a roster spot. There is no argument against the fact that Whalen is a vastly superior player to Wagner right now.

It’s her dream to play for the Lynx, and not just for a training camp.
And why shouldn't she earn it? How would she feel about being gifted the opportunity (not earning it) by virtue of a better player stepping out of the way?

Yeah, I’m just hoping her home state team does all it can to make it happen. You know, rewarding the loyalty that she showed Minnesota. She could have gone to Maryland. Rewarding her for loyalty is part of what they’re doing now with the training camp experience. Now let’s take it another step. It doesn’t all have to be about loyalty. She obviously has merit. I’m feeling like the only Gopher fan on this board that has any faith in her. If in camp she shows she totally doesn’t have anything that it takes to be a WNBA player, I would understand not extending the opportunity to her... but that would surprise me.
The Lynx owe her something because she played for the Gophers? Huh? Again, completely illogical.

You're arguing with your heart and not your head. If you want to call that a "personal insult," have at it. Just realize that you're being irrational.
 

Shades

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I agree with those who have pointed out that it's absurd to suggest that Whalen should step aside to make room for other players (i.e. Wagner) to make the roster. Whalen is the starting point guard on a world championship team and I'd never expect her to abandon her long-time teammates a few weeks before training camp.
Then she shouldn’t haven taken the job? I’m sure her teammates would fully understand the situation and not blame her for retiring. It’s not just about the Lynx side. It’s also not fair as a new inexperienced head coach not to give the Gopher job 100% from the start. It’s like she’s just a figurehead and others will be doing the heavy lifting until she decides she’s ready. It’s just a strange situation all around. I wish the Gophers view would have been “Do you want the job or not?”
 

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Shades, a couple of weeks ago, you called my wish for Whalen to be the Gophers next head coach a "pipe dream" (after I called your constant musings about Bueckers being a Gopher a "pipe dream". Well, my pipe dream came true. Wouldn't it be ironic if my pipe dream enabled yours to come true? (Whalen has a much better chance of recruiting Bueckers than Stollings ever did.) I'm sure the Gophers would have preferred that Whalen was coaching full-time going into next season, but it also seems that Coyle felt strong enough about Whalen to allow her to continue her Lynx career as compared to choosing someone else for the job. And successful Gopher volleyball coach has a somewhat similar agreement when he was signed to coach at the U. (It seems that worked out very well for the U of M.) You can argue that in the perfect world, Whalen would be coaching full-time, but then again the world isn't perfect. And as for the musings that Whalen should step aside to make room for Wagner (who the Lynx owe loyalty?), I agree with dpodoll68...you're thinking with your heart, not your head.
 

Shades

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People that think Whalen was the best choice for immediate success of the Gopher program even though she has zero coaching experience and won’t immediately commit 100% to the job.... those people say I’m thinking with my heart? That’s interesting. This has got to be the most hiring from the heart candidates in history of D1 coaches.
 

Ignatius L Hoops

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https://theathletic.com/339663/2018...ers-new-richland-lindsay-whalen-cheryl-reeve/

Tyler Mason in the Athletic:

One game changed everything for Carlie Wagner.

The origins of the Minnesota Lynx rookie’s path to the WNBA can be traced back to her sophomore year of high school at New Richland-Hartland-Ellendale-Geneva High School, an hour and a half due south of Minneapolis. Though she’d played on the varsity team since eighth grade and started as a freshman, it was during the state tournament of Wagner’s sophomore season that she put her stamp on Minnesota prep basketball.

Wagner outdueled highly-touted prospect Rebekah Dahlman and Braham High School, a team trying to defend its state title. Instead, Wagner dropped 43 points on Braham as NRHEG rolled to a 30-point win.

Not long after, calls from college coaches started flooding head coach John Schultz’s voicemail...


...Wagner will have an uphill battle if she hopes to make the Lynx roster out of training camp.

Minnesota has plenty of veteran guards, including a few new additions in Tanisha Wright and Danielle Robinson that figure to add a big lift off the bench. Yet even though Wagner has been with the team since the day after she was drafted on April 12, she insists she’s not letting herself think about the pressures of trying to make a WNBA roster.

“One practice at a time. That’s all you can do at this point,” Wagner said. “That’s what Coach Reeve told me the first time after the draft I met her. She’s like, ‘Don’t come in with this attitude of, I’ve gotta make the team, because it’s not going to go well.’ … That’s the best advice I could’ve gotten.”..
 

Shades

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There’s going to be a Carlie Wagner piece coming up in the next half hour on Fox9.

The Lynx cut three players today, and Carlie wasn’t one of them.
 
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