The new Corona virus, should we worry?

oak_street1981

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 20, 2008
Messages
3,541
Reaction score
361
Points
83
Which state has implemented a plan to protect patients in LTCF's that has worked?

It's not a thing. It can't be done, unless you're OK with locking the staff inside the building with a supply of food, against their will. Last I checked, that was not legal.

Exactly, MPLS, you just nailed it!


Nothing can be done, and this is where the bulk of the deaths occur..

So if we all accept this premise, why are we destroying the rest of our lives, where the impact of lock downs is nothing!
 

oak_street1981

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 20, 2008
Messages
3,541
Reaction score
361
Points
83
I completely agree. I wear a mask and only leave my house for supplies and work. Life is not fun right now but I can live with it. Why wait to close restaurants until Friday at 10:00pm, why not tonight at 10:00pm if it’s a matter of life or death. If Walz knew he was going to stop youth sports tonight why didn’t he stop them last night when teams were playing. The arbitrary numbers and times is what I don’t like. Make the changes immediately if it’s a matter of life or death.
Walz is the dumb high school phs. ed. teacher teacher we all remember. He he just had an army of DFL message/ PR people to smart him up a bit. This guys knows squat.
 

RahSkiUMah

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 26, 2018
Messages
345
Reaction score
343
Points
63
Exactly, MPLS, you just nailed it!

Nothing can be done, and this is where the bulk of the deaths occur..

So if we all accept this premise, why are we destroying the rest of our lives, where the impact of lock downs is nothing!
Because hospitals are filling up, we run the risk of people receiving substandard care, 30 years old and got in a car accident and need an icu bed? Okay I guess we’ll have to choose which older patient we’re moving out of the ICU...

Staff is overworked and burning out, do you want an overworked, disaffected health care provider taking care of your family?

We’re stopping surgery that requires inpatient admission all over the place. You can’t have a surgery if you don’t have a bed available for the patient to stay after the surgery. There isn’t a hospital in Wisconsin that I know of that doesn’t have some limitations in place right now. Elective surgeries account for about half of hospital revenues and are somewhere around 5-10% of GDP.

Flatten the curve and slow the spread was and is about hospital capacity.
 

GophersInIowa

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 21, 2008
Messages
26,486
Reaction score
1,861
Points
113
Doing the best you can would involve an extensive, frequent testing routine at these places. Daily even.

Stats show 85-90% compliance on mask mandate. "Half the people" is just not accurate. Also, more people wear them now than before the mandate. People should wear them, but people not wearing them is not the reason for the recent surge. The fact that it is a virus that spreads easily is. Have you not been paying attention to surges all across the country and the world?
I think you’re right that it’s not the reason for the surge but probably is a factor in how bad the surge is. Many of the states that have done the worst since masks were recommended have been those without mandates.
 

oak_street1981

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 20, 2008
Messages
3,541
Reaction score
361
Points
83
The death rates are all hightest in NYC, New Jersey still to this day. ND, SD, Nebraska, ect have nowhere near the death rates that the eastern states have due to Covid as of 11/18/2020.
 

Gopher_In_NYC

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 19, 2010
Messages
1,125
Reaction score
792
Points
113
Now that we have crossed 250K dead in the US - was said today that it would take 10 days to read all those who have died - Good Lord.:cry::cry::cry:

Meanwhile Trump has nothing on his public calendar yet again:rolleyes: :unsure::mad: That make 12 out of the last 15 days (see below) - hella of a self-proclaimed Covid wartime president, lol. He's actually the tee time President.

1605789393568.png
 
Last edited:

Wally

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 15, 2016
Messages
3,017
Reaction score
1,212
Points
113
I assume that is sarcasm.
Actually the ltc position is about what I think should be done. No need to let it rip thru them, but I do believe they should treat in place. Simplest way to preserve hospital beds.

People in ltc shouldn't get ICU level care or go on ventilators except in special circumstances. Being sedated fucks people up and it really fucks up old and frail people bad.

Sure its not pretty, but its alot more sane than the Republicans just letting hospitals go to shit. If you want things open you have to make hard decisions.

I saw a story recently, 47 year old woman died of a heart attack in Utah most likely because their were no beds in her local hospital and they turned away the ambulance.
 

Wally

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 15, 2016
Messages
3,017
Reaction score
1,212
Points
113
The death rates are all hightest in NYC, New Jersey still to this day. ND, SD, Nebraska, ect have nowhere near the death rates that the eastern states have due to Covid as of 11/18/2020.
They are getting there. And they don't even have any black and brown people who are hospitalized and die at way higher rates than whites.
 

Go4Broke

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 5, 2010
Messages
3,447
Reaction score
346
Points
83
Population of:

North Dakota - 762,000

South Dakota - 885,000

South Korea - 51,640,000


1605792356673.png
 
Last edited:

Gopher_In_NYC

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 19, 2010
Messages
1,125
Reaction score
792
Points
113
Population of:

North Dakota - 762,000

South Dakota - 885,000

South Korea - 51,640,000

View attachment 10537
South Korea had their first case on the same date as the US.

The difference??

Nationwide approach for a national emergency and a population that understands the "greatest good for the greatest number."
 
Last edited:

Go4Broke

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 5, 2010
Messages
3,447
Reaction score
346
Points
83
States That Imposed Few Restrictions Now Have the Worst Outbreaks

Coronavirus cases are rising in almost every U.S. state. But the surge is worst now in places where leaders neglected to keep up forceful virus containment efforts or failed to implement basic measures like mask mandates in the first place, according to a New York Times analysis of data from the University of Oxford.

Outbreaks are comparatively smaller in states where efforts to contain the virus were stronger over the summer and fall — potential good news for leaders taking action now. States and cities are reinstating restrictions and implementing new ones: In recent days, the governors of Iowa, North Dakota and Utah imposed mask mandates for the first time since the outbreak began.

The index comes from Oxford’s Blavatnik School of Government, where researchers track the policies — or lack thereof — governments use to contain the virus and protect residents, such as contact tracing, mask mandates and restrictions on businesses and gatherings. Researchers aggregate those indicators and assign a number from 0 to 100 to each government’s total response.

At its highest level of containment efforts, New York state scored an 80 on the index. At the beginning of November, most states were scoring in the 40s and 50s. Though many have taken fresh steps to contain the virus since then, the Times analysis compares cases and hospitalizations for a given date to a state’s index score from two weeks before, since researchers say it is reasonable to expect a lag between a policy's implementation and its outcome.

Most states imposed tight restrictions in the spring even if they did not have bad outbreaks then. After reopening early, some Sun Belt states, including Arizona and Texas, imposed restrictions again after case counts climbed. Now, Midwestern states have among the worst outbreaks. Many have also done the least to contain the virus.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/11/18/us/covid-state-restrictions.html?action=click&module=Top Stories&pgtype=Homepage


1605795460012.png
 

Go4Broke

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 5, 2010
Messages
3,447
Reaction score
346
Points
83
Countries that implemented fast, early restrictions and robust test-and-trace programs have seen the most success

New Zealand recently lifted all restrictions following 10 days with no new cases.
New Zealand’s prime minister, Jacinda Ardern, called it a validation of the country’s “go hard, go early” strategy, in which the country reacts rapidly to signs of community spread.

Taiwan recently recorded 200 days without a new coronavirus case after its leaders focused on a speedy response and invested in mass testing and contact tracing. Despite an early outbreak, South Korea flattened the curve with aggressive testing and contact tracing, as well as widespread mask wearing.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/11/18/us/covid-state-restrictions.html?action=click&module=Top Stories&pgtype=Homepage
 

Pompous Elitist

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 18, 2013
Messages
15,943
Reaction score
1,660
Points
113
President of Minnesota Nurse's Association on her conversation with President-elect Biden yesterday ...

Why aren’t MN nurses walking off in numbers if they aren’t provided proper PPE? They are not soldiers on accepted suicide missions. They are not obligated under any scenario to go into a ward or room without proper protection. Walz?
 

Pompous Elitist

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 18, 2013
Messages
15,943
Reaction score
1,660
Points
113
States That Imposed Few Restrictions Now Have the Worst Outbreaks

Coronavirus cases are rising in almost every U.S. state. But the surge is worst now in places where leaders neglected to keep up forceful virus containment efforts or failed to implement basic measures like mask mandates in the first place, according to a New York Times analysis of data from the University of Oxford.

Outbreaks are comparatively smaller in states where efforts to contain the virus were stronger over the summer and fall — potential good news for leaders taking action now. States and cities are reinstating restrictions and implementing new ones: In recent days, the governors of Iowa, North Dakota and Utah imposed mask mandates for the first time since the outbreak began.

The index comes from Oxford’s Blavatnik School of Government, where researchers track the policies — or lack thereof — governments use to contain the virus and protect residents, such as contact tracing, mask mandates and restrictions on businesses and gatherings. Researchers aggregate those indicators and assign a number from 0 to 100 to each government’s total response.

At its highest level of containment efforts, New York state scored an 80 on the index. At the beginning of November, most states were scoring in the 40s and 50s. Though many have taken fresh steps to contain the virus since then, the Times analysis compares cases and hospitalizations for a given date to a state’s index score from two weeks before, since researchers say it is reasonable to expect a lag between a policy's implementation and its outcome.

Most states imposed tight restrictions in the spring even if they did not have bad outbreaks then. After reopening early, some Sun Belt states, including Arizona and Texas, imposed restrictions again after case counts climbed. Now, Midwestern states have among the worst outbreaks. Many have also done the least to contain the virus.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/11/18/us/covid-state-restrictions.html?action=click&module=Top Stories&pgtype=Homepage


View attachment 10540
One of the more absurd things I’ve seen since the beginning of the pandemic.
 

MplsGopher

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 4, 2017
Messages
17,817
Reaction score
3,353
Points
113
Exactly, MPLS, you just nailed it!

Nothing can be done, and this is where the bulk of the deaths occur..

So if we all accept this premise, why are we destroying the rest of our lives, where the impact of lock downs is nothing!
Because the world isn't binary. Never has been.

Making such (silly) assumptions about the world, helps frame it in a very simplistic way, which is much easier to digest and process for simple minds. Problem is, it's just not true.

There are some deaths outside of LTCF. Some amount of people who aren't in LTCF, and even people who are healthy(!!), get severe symptoms and need to use up hospital resources, and even die!


We need to do something. Make some effort to save people's lives.


The only possible wrong course of action, is it do nothing and "let nature take its course".

That's what animals do. Laissez faire is a mental disease.
 

MplsGopher

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 4, 2017
Messages
17,817
Reaction score
3,353
Points
113
Because hospitals are filling up, we run the risk of people receiving substandard care, 30 years old and got in a car accident and need an icu bed? Okay I guess we’ll have to choose which older patient we’re moving out of the ICU...

Staff is overworked and burning out, do you want an overworked, disaffected health care provider taking care of your family?

We’re stopping surgery that requires inpatient admission all over the place. You can’t have a surgery if you don’t have a bed available for the patient to stay after the surgery. There isn’t a hospital in Wisconsin that I know of that doesn’t have some limitations in place right now. Elective surgeries account for about half of hospital revenues and are somewhere around 5-10% of GDP.

Flatten the curve and slow the spread was and is about hospital capacity.
Bang.

Nailed it!
 

MplsGopher

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 4, 2017
Messages
17,817
Reaction score
3,353
Points
113
Population of:

North Dakota - 762,000

South Dakota - 885,000

South Korea - 51,640,000


View attachment 10537
Also:
ND - 70.8k sqmi
SD - 77.2k sqmi
SK - 38.7k sqmi (!!!!)

Testing. Tested the living crap out of anything that moved.

That is the bottom line, of why the Asians kicked ass on this and Europeans and Americas were such little bitches on it.
 

MplsGopher

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 4, 2017
Messages
17,817
Reaction score
3,353
Points
113
Why aren’t MN nurses walking off in numbers if they aren’t provided proper PPE? They are not soldiers on accepted suicide missions. They are not obligated under any scenario to go into a ward or room without proper protection. Walz?
Yeah Walz!! Help PE make his sales target for the most expensive kinds of PPE this quarter!!
 

MplsGopher

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 4, 2017
Messages
17,817
Reaction score
3,353
Points
113
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/18/world/asia/covid-cleaning.html

The Coronavirus Is Airborne Indoors. Why Are We Still Scrubbing Surfaces?
All over the world, workers are soaping, wiping and fumigating surfaces with an urgent sense of purpose: to fight the coronavirus. But scientists increasingly say that there is little to no evidence that contaminated surfaces can spread the virus. In crowded indoor spaces like airports, they say, the virus that is exhaled by infected people and that lingers in the air is a much greater threat.

Hand washing with soap and water for 20 seconds — or sanitizer in the absence of soap — is still encouraged to stop the virus’s spread. But scrubbing surfaces does little to mitigate the virus threat indoors, experts say, and health officials are being urged to focus instead on improving ventilation and filtration of indoor air.

“In my opinion, a lot of time, energy and money is being wasted on surface disinfection and, more importantly, diverting attention and resources away from preventing airborne transmission,” said Dr. Kevin P. Fennelly, a respiratory infection specialist with the United States National Institutes of Health.
 

MplsGopher

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 4, 2017
Messages
17,817
Reaction score
3,353
Points
113
Vermont banned “multi-household gatherings,” and its governor, Phil Scott, argued that those gatherings had led to more infections than restaurants. “I know this is difficult & frustrating, especially with the holidays right around the corner, but it’s necessary,” Scott tweeted.
 
Top Bottom