Sports, the last meritocracy

Spaulding!No!

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Look at the bright side- your facts apply to the U.S only. It’s not the entire globe.
 

stocker08

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Warning: this is the second questionable link posted by GR today. Make sure that if you DO click it....that you have some malware/virus protection running. These right wing pop-up websites tend to be sketchy.
 

justthefacts

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In every area of life standards are being lowered so the best have to step aside for the average

Accelerated Math Dropped to Promote "Equity"


The actual story is a lot more nuanced of course. I'll never understand the absolute insistence of a large portion of Conservative Americans on getting their news from these weird places. Fox News is head and shoulders about those fringe sites.


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forever a gopher

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The actual story is a lot more nuanced of course. I'll never understand the absolute insistence of a large portion of Conservative Americans on getting their news from these weird places. Fox News is head and shoulders about those fringe sites.


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Based on the language of the link you provided, it appears to be the case (more nuanced than just "dropping" accelerated courses). But the root of it does support the OP. So basically, they are dropping separate courses where advanced students can learn in an accelerated way, and instead lumping all kids together and attempting to make the teachers teach different levels all at once. Of course, if you've ever been in a school, you know where the teacher's attention is usually directed- to the struggling students, as they need more one-on-one assistance. Hasn't this been proven over and over again that this format hurts pretty much all students, no matter the ability level? Or is that the point? Why allow for accelerated students to advance with other at their ability level, and why allow for struggling students to get more help when we can just lump all together so we can be equitably screwed?

The only thing that will come of this is that the students that can use accelerated courses, and come from an affluent home will just leave public school and go private. Or, they'll stay in public school, but get private tutoring to make up the difference. Meanwhile, the less affluent, but advanced students will no longer be able to receive accelerated courses, and instead be stuck being bored in "regular" classes. Just another way to further divide the haves and the have-nots, but hey, we look like we're being equitable!!
 

Goldboy

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Man I thought this was satire or a lie until I googled it.

I don't really see the nuanced angle yeah they are putting up arguments for why they are doing it besides equity but they all seem bullshit for a variety of reasons. Its obvious what the real driver is behind it.

The most obvious is that even if they are changing the way the are teaching that in no way is a justification for getting rid of advanced courses. Just because you are changing the way you are teaching the courses in no way means you can't have advanced ones. Most people in gifted courses understand the material better than those that aren't because they are gifted. Saying that you are doing it for deeper understanding is absolute bullshit

The Next is that its going to be an absolute nightmare for teachers. They are going to be expecting teachers to teach different levels in the same classroom. That is a huge burden and I am not sure how its even possible. Instead of Heterogenous environment its probably going to be the lowest common denominator.

The last is Private schools. This is going to do the opposite of the intended. Rich people are going to see this and send their kids to private schools so that they can take advance courses. While the gifted poor students are going to be stuck taking the normal classes.
 

WilliamsArenaGuy

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Man I thought this was satire or a lie until I googled it.

I don't really see the nuanced angle yeah they are putting up arguments for why they are doing it besides equity but they all seem bullshit for a variety of reasons. Its obvious what the real driver is behind it.

The most obvious is that even if they are changing the way the are teaching that in no way is a justification for getting rid of advanced courses. Just because you are changing the way you are teaching the courses in no way means you can't have advanced ones. Most people in gifted courses understand the material better than those that aren't because they are gifted. Saying that you are doing it for deeper understanding is absolute bullshit

The Next is that its going to be an absolute nightmare for teachers. They are going to be expecting teachers to teach different levels in the same classroom. That is a huge burden and I am not sure how its even possible. Instead of Heterogenous environment its probably going to be the lowest common denominator.

The last is Private schools. This is going to do the opposite of the intended. Rich people are going to see this and send their kids to private schools so that they can take advance courses. While the gifted poor students are going to be stuck taking the normal classes.
If you knew anything at all about teaching, you'd know that is already the case. And it has been for years. That is just simply the job.
 

golf

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As a math teacher myself, this had better not be about putting students of all different abilities in a room and expecting a teacher to differentiate. No one wins in that scenario. Would be a nightmare for teachers.

Unless there is something i am missing, this has to be about the dumbest thing i have ever heard.

Why do we force all students to be the same? Equality/equity is going to be the death of us. Other countries start tracking students at a young age according to their interests and skills. Not us, we do the opposite. No wonder so many kids hate school and our dropout rates are so high.

I really hope this is being mis-reported. Also am really glad i am not a virginia math teacher.
 

KillerGopherFan

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As a math teacher myself, this had better not be about putting students of all different abilities in a room and expecting a teacher to differentiate. No one wins in that scenario. Would be a nightmare for teachers.

Unless there is something i am missing, this has to be about the dumbest thing i have ever heard.

Why do we force all students to be the same? Equality/equity is going to be the death of us. Other countries start tracking students at a young age according to their interests and skills. Not us, we do the opposite. No wonder so many kids hate school and our dropout rates are so high.

I really hope this is being mis-reported. Also am really glad i am not a virginia math teacher.
According to WilliamsAreaGuy, you’d have to be a teacher to know it’s always been that way.

Oh wait, you are a teacher.
 

Plausible Deniability

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As a math teacher myself, this had better not be about putting students of all different abilities in a room and expecting a teacher to differentiate. No one wins in that scenario. Would be a nightmare for teachers.

Unless there is something i am missing, this has to be about the dumbest thing i have ever heard.

Why do we force all students to be the same? Equality/equity is going to be the death of us. Other countries start tracking students at a young age according to their interests and skills. Not us, we do the opposite. No wonder so many kids hate school and our dropout rates are so high.

I really hope this is being mis-reported. Also am really glad i am not a virginia math teacher.
Whether it's in school/education or in the world of business and employment, let's be honest at least; the lefties have never been about raising the lower end UP, they're all about bringing the higher achievers DOWN.

That has always been their definition of "equity" and "equality".
 

goldengophers

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Is there a story on this from other than a conservative source? I searched for one and couldn't find a one.
 

GoldenRodents

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My daughter was getting A's in accelerated Math in public school. She was two years ahead of the average child. But I would notice how little homework she had. I know from personal experience that to master Algebra and Trigonometry you either need to put in hours of disciplined work on a weekly basis, yet my daughter was breezing through her 4 problems a night. In 10th grade we switched her to a private school, They really stacked on the work in every area, and she could no longer keep up with Pre-Calculus. She had to drop it. She was mortified.

That tells me she wasn't really earning her A's in public school, they intentionally dropped their standards which made the children, the teacher and the school look better than they actually are. That is a fraud.
 

GoldenRodents

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Warning: this is the second questionable link posted by GR today. Make sure that if you DO click it....that you have some malware/virus protection running. These right wing pop-up websites tend to be sketchy.

Hey @stocker08, I'll take a computer virus over a mind virus any day. You need to search deeply into your enemies best arguments. It's a lot easier on your psyche to assume your intellectual opponents are stupid and lazy, but it is bad for your soul and body. Don't you be stupid and lazy. Dig deeper into these issues. Your children's happiness may depend on it.

"Better is an open rebuke than hidden love."
 

GoodasGold

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Hey @stocker08, I'll take a computer virus over a mind virus any day. You need to search deeply into your enemies best arguments. It's a lot easier on your psyche to assume your intellectual opponents are stupid and lazy, but it is bad for your soul and body. Don't you be stupid and lazy. Dig deeper into these issues. Your children's happiness may depend on it.

"Better is an open rebuke than hidden love."
Utter nonsense
 

justthefacts

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My daughter was getting A's in accelerated Math in public school. She was two years ahead of the average child. But I would notice how little homework she had. I know from personal experience that to master Algebra and Trigonometry you either need to put in hours of disciplined work on a weekly basis, yet my daughter was breezing through her 4 problems a night. In 10th grade we switched her to a private school, They really stacked on the work in every area, and she could no longer keep up with Pre-Calculus. She had to drop it. She was mortified.

That tells me she wasn't really earning her A's in public school, they intentionally dropped their standards which made the children, the teacher and the school look better than they actually are. That is a fraud.
Dear God, then, let no man attempt to change the system!
 

Wehatebadgers

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Dear God, then, let no man attempt to change the system!
It’s about accountability, we are teaching our kids to be average! Just give them an A, and if you go out for a sport and can’t compete make more classes! Pathetic
 

stocker08

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Hey @stocker08, I'll take a computer virus over a mind virus any day. You need to search deeply into your enemies best arguments. It's a lot easier on your psyche to assume your intellectual opponents are stupid and lazy, but it is bad for your soul and body. Don't you be stupid and lazy. Dig deeper into these issues. Your children's happiness may depend on it.

"Better is an open rebuke than hidden love."

Also.....avoid vaccinating your children.
 

Donovan

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Dear God, then, let no man attempt to change the system!
Good luck changing the system with the public teacher’s union in charge. You need to watch this documentary. It was produced by a liberal before you dismiss it.
 

Spoofin

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My daughter was getting A's in accelerated Math in public school. She was two years ahead of the average child. But I would notice how little homework she had. I know from personal experience that to master Algebra and Trigonometry you either need to put in hours of disciplined work on a weekly basis, yet my daughter was breezing through her 4 problems a night. In 10th grade we switched her to a private school, They really stacked on the work in every area, and she could no longer keep up with Pre-Calculus. She had to drop it. She was mortified.

That tells me she wasn't really earning her A's in public school, they intentionally dropped their standards which made the children, the teacher and the school look better than they actually are. That is a fraud.
Grade inflation is nothing new. IIRC, I read an article a year or so ago that in order to be in the top 10% of your class at Eden Prairie, you need above a 4.0 (i.e. all As & in honors classes).
 

golf

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My daughter was getting A's in accelerated Math in public school. She was two years ahead of the average child. But I would notice how little homework she had. I know from personal experience that to master Algebra and Trigonometry you either need to put in hours of disciplined work on a weekly basis, yet my daughter was breezing through her 4 problems a night. In 10th grade we switched her to a private school, They really stacked on the work in every area, and she could no longer keep up with Pre-Calculus. She had to drop it. She was mortified.

That tells me she wasn't really earning her A's in public school, they intentionally dropped their standards which made the children, the teacher and the school look better than they actually are. That is a fraud.

Oh yeah. See it as well when we get foreign exchange students. Even when we get foreign students who are of average ability in their own schools, they are way ahead of our students.

In rochester, a big number of the asian kids take an accelerated math program outside of public school that is taught by college professors. Excellent program. Very common to see asian 9th/10th graders taking calculus 2 or calc 3.
 

goldengophers

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Oh yeah. See it as well when we get foreign exchange students. Even when we get foreign students who are of average ability in their own schools, they are way ahead of our students.

In rochester, a big number of the asian kids take an accelerated math program outside of public school that is taught by college professors. Excellent program. Very common to see asian 9th/10th graders taking calculus 2 or calc 3.
This has been going on forever, 40 years actually

https://cse.umn.edu/mathcep/about-umtymp
 

goldengophers

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For sure. Excellent program.
For sure, had some friends who went through it their math skills were/are incredible. Not sure why people would want to slow advancement for those who have a high aptitude, kids who are under challenged in a math class benefits no one. The only positive I could see is possible peer assistance similar to a TA, but those already exist in HS.
 

GoldenRodents

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For sure, had some friends who went through it their math skills were/are incredible. Not sure why people would want to slow advancement for those who have a high aptitude, kids who are under challenged in a math class benefits no one. The only positive I could see is possible peer assistance similar to a TA, but those already exist in HS.
We could easily cut our college enrollment in half and improve the quality and performance of our professional class. If we moved the money to K12 vocational ed the results could be astounding.
 

Section2

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We could easily cut our college enrollment in half and improve the quality and performance of our professional class. If we moved the money to K12 vocational ed the results could be astounding.
Or just give parents choice and control. The problem with public school is that the kids who have no interest in being there can ruin it for everyone else. If those kids are a small percent of the population, it’s not a big deal. If they’re a high percent, it’s a disaster.
 

GoldenRodents

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Choice
Or just give parents choice and control. The problem with public school is that the kids who have no interest in being there can ruin it for everyone else. If those kids are a small percent of the population, it’s not a big deal. If they’re a high percent, it’s a disaster.
This would accelerate inequity, kids from more productive home cultures would further widen the gaps.
 

FormerFatOL

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Or just give parents choice and control. The problem with public school is that the kids who have no interest in being there can ruin it for everyone else. If those kids are a small percent of the population, it’s not a big deal. If they’re a high percent, it’s a disaster.
Exactly why daughter chose to take as many honors/advanced courses as possible, even in subjects she wasn't necessarily advanced. The eff-ups ruin it for everyone else.
 
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