Reading between lines, expect fans to be present?

Ski U Master

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If we all drove 2 MPH whenever we were in a car, that would also dramatically decrease traffic fatalities. Why isn't that the right thing to do?
What you're talking about is more analogous to having everyone in line at the TSA strip searched and having all articles of clothing and luggage searched individually. Finding a proper balance between invasive restrictions and proper security/safety is the key. In the TSA world, having people go through a metal detector or body scanner and a brief x-ray of their luggage is enough. In the world of driving, speed limits are set at a reasonable amount (although there is a probably case to be made that the speed limits are too high, particularly on city streets).
 

GoldenRodents

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Holy Cr@p, did they ever cancel a baseball game because the team had a flu outbreak? These decision makers are like the accusers at the Salem Witch Trials...
 

PJparty

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Heard on the radio that trained dogs can smell the virus at 94% accuracy.
 

MplsGopher

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I dunno man.... like expressing hop for a game isn't wishing for death on someone...

Is baseball trying to kill someone? I doubt it.
Just fine to hope the game can be played, and I share in that hope.

I don't agree that "If some teams and games don't work out bummer...." is a reasonable wording of such an expression. It seems much more likely to be expressing "play the game, if people get sick, oh well". That's how I took it.


Obviously neither you or MLB are wanting people to get sick, hospitalized, or die.
 

A_Slab_of_Bacon

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Just fine to hope the game can be played, and I share in that hope.

I don't agree that "If some teams and games don't work out bummer...." is a reasonable wording of such an expression. It seems much more likely to be expressing "play the game, if people get sick, oh well". That's how I took it.


Obviously neither you or MLB are wanting people to get sick, hospitalized, or die.
You took it wrong.
 

MplsGopher

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Hospitalized with the cold? Maybe, but death is extremely unlikely with this group. You know that.

I’m old enough to remember when you repeatedly guaranteed there would be a season.
Death of 60+ year old managers, coaches, staff is extremely unlikely? False. Oh I see, if it's not a player who dies, then who cares? I guess that's similar to like, if someone in a nursing home dies, oh well, they were probably going to die next week anyway, so I'm not going to stop living my life.

Please find any quote from me that "guaranteed" there would be an MLB season.
 

MplsGopher

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If we all drove 2 MPH whenever we were in a car, that would also dramatically decrease traffic fatalities. Why isn't that the right thing to do?
It still boggles my mind that deniers/hoaxers continue to resort to auto accident fatalities as the analogy.

Like, one of the least reasonable or sensible attempts at an analogy that one could make, with a contagious disease.
 

A_Slab_of_Bacon

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I say you worded it poorly.

No need to waste time. I did take it wrong, and I'm glad you have clarified what you meant.
I would suggest you not assume that any mention of the situation means someone needs a finger waving about the epidemic.

The epidemic of armchair epidemiologists who who are out patrolling for anyone who expresses the desire to do things so they can finger wave about the epidemic is getting as bad as the straight up denial folks...
 

PitinoFan

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Death of 60+ year old managers, coaches, staff is extremely unlikely? False. Oh I see, if it's not a player who dies, then who cares? I guess that's similar to like, if someone in a nursing home dies, oh well, they were probably going to die next week anyway, so I'm not going to stop living my life.

Please find any quote from me that "guaranteed" there would be an MLB season.
I was talking about college football. You repeatedly said they would definitely play. Now, it sounds like you’re pretty negative on the prospects, understandably so.

Anyway, everyone who is leaving their homes to do their jobs right now is putting themselves at risk to some degree, and if they get tested positive, they get sent home. It’s the way we have to live until there’s a vaccine, which isn’t guaranteed. Nobody is stopping you from isolating yourself in your house if that’s your choice.
 

MplsGopher

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I would suggest you not assume that any mention of the situation means someone needs a finger waving about the epidemic.

The epidemic of armchair epidemiologists who who are out patrolling for anyone who expresses the desire to do things so they can finger wave about the epidemic is getting as bad as the straight up denial folks...
Good. Happy to get in your's or anyone else's face about it. Needs to happen.

America is by far the sh__tiest developed country in the world when it comes to cv19, precisely because of the relatively laissez faire attitude towards the disease.
 

MplsGopher

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I was talking about college football. You repeatedly said they would definitely play. Now, it sounds like you’re pretty negative on the prospects, understandably so.

Anyway, everyone who is leaving their homes to do their jobs right now is putting themselves at risk to some degree, and if they get tested positive, they get sent home. It’s the way we have to live until there’s a vaccine, which isn’t guaranteed. Nobody is stopping you from isolating yourself in your house if that’s your choice.
My last comment in that regard is probably from well over a month ago. End of May into mid to late June, things legitimately looked like they were going well. Then it hit the fan again, as too many states and places got too lax and opened up too much, too fast.

Your last paragraph is fine, but has nothing to do with the discussion of if college sports should happen this fall. It is perfectly reasonable and justifiable to advocate that it won't work, without a vaccine.
 

Taji34

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Heard on the radio that trained dogs can smell the virus at 94% accuracy.
They can smell it in spit with 94% accuracy, and they have to do more testing to see if the dogs can differentiate between different respiratory sicknesses.
 

MplsGopher

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I mean, that's neat and all.

But there's no chance in hell that they can ramp up a national "dog spit smelling" program in any reasonable amount of time, to make a significant dent in anything.

"A dog on every corner and every storefront!" -- you'd be talking about hundreds of millions of dogs. Who trains them? Where do they come from? Who pays for the breeding and training? How long will it take for the dogs to grow from pups to fully ready to go? What's the rejection rate of the training? Etc etc etc

Everything is just so hopeless, when you look at it through that lens.
 

golfing18now

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It still boggles my mind that deniers/hoaxers continue to resort to auto accident fatalities as the analogy.

Like, one of the least reasonable or sensible attempts at an analogy that one could make, with a contagious disease.
I see you haven't lost your charm staying away from tOTB, MplsGopher! :)

Ski U Master made an interesting point about security lines at airports. Without question, those measures reduce risk in an airplane and are likely worth the inconvenience. There are many other examples where we try to reduce risk through our actions -- speed limits just happen to be one of the most obvious. We make trade-offs for risk vs. convenience all the time by hopping in a car. Attending a football game with eyes wide open shouldn't be any different, in my opinion. For the college and high school athletes participating, it is more risky to drive to the game than to participate in it (speaking about COVID here). Fans should make their own decisions on whether or not to attend and who they want to engage with after/before/during the game. I'm on board with social distancing, limiting the number of fans, mask wearing etc while at the game -- those measures would be more akin to the security line analogy Ski U Master made initially.
 

MplsGopher

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I see you haven't lost your charm staying away from tOTB, MplsGopher! :)

Ski U Master made an interesting point about security lines at airports. Without question, those measures reduce risk in an airplane and are likely worth the inconvenience. There are many other examples where we try to reduce risk through our actions -- speed limits just happen to be one of the most obvious. We make trade-offs for risk vs. convenience all the time by hopping in a car. Attending a football game with eyes wide open shouldn't be any different, in my opinion. For the college and high school athletes participating, it is more risky to drive to the game than to participate in it (speaking about COVID here). Fans should make their own decisions on whether or not to attend and who they want to engage with after/before/during the game. I'm on board with social distancing, limiting the number of fans, mask wearing etc while at the game -- those measures would be more akin to the security line analogy Ski U Master made initially.
You're just adding more words to the exact same fallacy.

The fallacy is talking about risk as if harm can only be done to the person who decides to take on the risk.
 

PMWinSTP

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I see you haven't lost your charm staying away from tOTB, MplsGopher! :)

Ski U Master made an interesting point about security lines at airports. Without question, those measures reduce risk in an airplane and are likely worth the inconvenience. There are many other examples where we try to reduce risk through our actions -- speed limits just happen to be one of the most obvious. We make trade-offs for risk vs. convenience all the time by hopping in a car. Attending a football game with eyes wide open shouldn't be any different, in my opinion. For the college and high school athletes participating, it is more risky to drive to the game than to participate in it (speaking about COVID here). Fans should make their own decisions on whether or not to attend and who they want to engage with after/before/during the game. I'm on board with social distancing, limiting the number of fans, mask wearing etc while at the game -- those measures would be more akin to the security line analogy Ski U Master made initially.
Car accidents are not highly contagious.
 

short ornery norwegian

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With all due respect, the issue is not whether players will die. the odds of that are very, very low.

I still believe the real issue is whether you can have a legitimate season while controlling covid-related disruptions.

Look at what's happening in MLB. 15 of the 30 players on the Miami Marlins active roster have tested positive. Now what - play with minor leaguers?

Imagine something equivalent happening in football. Imagine learning on Friday that 4 or 5 or 6 starters have tested positive and can't play on Saturday.

do you shrug your shoulders and run the 2nd string out there for a key game?

Those are the type of issues that are much more realistic. and you have to have a plan to deal with them.

I suspect that the "let them play" crowd would be singing a very different tune if the Gophers had to play a key game without Morgan, or Bateman, or any other key starter due to covid.
 

GopherGuy8

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With all due respect, the issue is not whether players will die. the odds of that are very, very low.

I still believe the real issue is whether you can have a legitimate season while controlling covid-related disruptions.

Look at what's happening in MLB. 15 of the 30 players on the Miami Marlins active roster have tested positive. Now what - play with minor leaguers?

Imagine something equivalent happening in football. Imagine learning on Friday that 4 or 5 or 6 starters have tested positive and can't play on Saturday.

do you shrug your shoulders and run the 2nd string out there for a key game?

Those are the type of issues that are much more realistic. and you have to have a plan to deal with them.

I suspect that the "let them play" crowd would be singing a very different tune if the Gophers had to play a key game without Morgan, or Bateman, or any other key starter due to covid.
Yes and yes. Next man up, I feel like that's an obvious answer.
 

PJparty

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I mean, that's neat and all.

But there's no chance in hell that they can ramp up a national "dog spit smelling" program in any reasonable amount of time, to make a significant dent in anything.

"A dog on every corner and every storefront!" -- you'd be talking about hundreds of millions of dogs. Who trains them? Where do they come from? Who pays for the breeding and training? How long will it take for the dogs to grow from pups to fully ready to go? What's the rejection rate of the training? Etc etc etc

Everything is just so hopeless, when you look at it through that lens.
I'd let a dog smell my spit if the result is me walking in to TCF Bank stadium to watch the Gophers.

Probably only need like 100 of these Corona pups on game day if the stadium is limited to quarter capacity. These dogs are highly trained and effective in their craft.
 

howeda7

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With all due respect, the issue is not whether players will die. the odds of that are very, very low.

I still believe the real issue is whether you can have a legitimate season while controlling covid-related disruptions.

Look at what's happening in MLB. 15 of the 30 players on the Miami Marlins active roster have tested positive. Now what - play with minor leaguers?

Imagine something equivalent happening in football. Imagine learning on Friday that 4 or 5 or 6 starters have tested positive and can't play on Saturday.

do you shrug your shoulders and run the 2nd string out there for a key game?

Those are the type of issues that are much more realistic. and you have to have a plan to deal with them.

I suspect that the "let them play" crowd would be singing a very different tune if the Gophers had to play a key game without Morgan, or Bateman, or any other key starter due to covid.
The one advantage of conference games only is if they still start in September, they essentially have 5 weeks to make up games that get postponed.
 

golfing18now

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You're just adding more words to the exact same fallacy.

The fallacy is talking about risk as if harm can only be done to the person who decides to take on the risk.
Then what is the solution MplsGopher?

I've been pretty consistent from the start in thinking we never went far enough in the beginning. If you aren't willing to close your liquor stores, abortion clinics, gun shops, and weed dispenseries because these are "essential businesses" then you aren't taking things as seriously as other countries. Now four plus months in and policy seems to be dictated by where the least resistance will come from. A school classroom or football game is dangerous but a "peaceful protest" or riot with thousands of people is not.

I'd like my college freshman daughter to be able to go to a football game. I would like my sophomore in high school to play on her tennis team. I want my fourth grader to be able to go to school with her friends. If that means we need to change how we interact with my senior citizen parents, then so be it. I'm ok with that and so are they by the way.
 

MplsGopher

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I'd let a dog smell my spit if the result is me walking in to TCF Bank stadium to watch the Gophers.

Probably only need like 100 of these Corona pups on game day if the stadium is limited to quarter capacity. These dogs are highly trained and effective in their craft.
Agree, good point. For a very specific event/use, it could be helpful.
 

golfing18now

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Car accidents are not highly contagious.
Correct, but they are also far more dangerous to the demographic we are talking about than COVID.

For the record, I'm most bothered by the loss of opportunity for the kids -- in college and high school. You only get one shot to be an athlete at those levels.
 

MplsGopher

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Then what is the solution MplsGopher?

I've been pretty consistent from the start in thinking we never went far enough in the beginning. If you aren't willing to close your liquor stores, abortion clinics, gun shops, and weed dispenseries because these are "essential businesses" then you aren't taking things as seriously as other countries. Now four plus months in and policy seems to be dictated by where the least resistance will come from. A school classroom or football game is dangerous but a "peaceful protest" or riot with thousands of people is not.

I'd like my college freshman daughter to be able to go to a football game. I would like my sophomore in high school to play on her tennis team. I want my fourth grader to be able to go to school with her friends. If that means we need to change how we interact with my senior citizen parents, then so be it. I'm ok with that and so are they by the way.
The solution is to wait for the vaccine to be distributed starting late his year and early next year.
 

howeda7

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If there was a Marlins-like outbreak that hit most or all of the offensive line, then "next man up" would be an absolute farce and likely impact the QB/RBs physical health going forward.
Yep. If 4 of my top 5 lineman are out and we're playing say, Michigan, I'm forfeiting instead of getting TM killed in a sure loss.
 
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