Nancy Pelosi...

DEGopher

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justthefacts;1761129) I think assuming people of color are from another country and should go back there is pretty much exactly what the phrase "make America white again" would mean. And that's racist. .[/QUOTE said:
See, that is the most intellectually vapid point of your whole argument. He didn’t say people of color (This tells me not even you believe your own arguments unless you falsely what was actually said), he was singling out politicians who violently disagreed with him. They weren’t separated and singled out by their color, but rather how they voted on his bill. As Pelosi said herself.

“All these people have their public whatever and their Twitter world,” Pelosi said in an interview with New York Times columnist Maureen Dowd. “But they didn’t have any following. They’re four people and that’s how many votes they got.”

Oh look, Pelosi called out 4 women of color. According to the application of your lack of logic, it’s racism. The reality is that it is due to their political stance.
 
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howeda7

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One of the more ignorant and partisan things Nancy Pelosi has said, “make America white again”.

She originally made those comments about Trump wanting to ask the citizenship question on the census. Counting people doesn’t change the racial make up of the country.

But this appears to be a narrative that she has decided to pursue. Dems are so used to defaming Republicans with insults, that they’ve begun to do it to each other when things don’t go their way.

And, Nancy is trying to calm the rift between her and “the Squad”. What better way than to use Trump as a deflection?
Telling 4 Americans to "go back where they came from" was Trump showing his racism once again. How sad that you will defend him no matter what. Blind, utter loyalty. And you say you didn't like him and didn't vote for him.
 
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howeda7

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At least we've moved past the "Trump isn't racist" phase and into the "racism is totally acceptable" phase.
It took longer than the "no contact with Russians" to "everyone colludes!" transition.
 
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howeda7

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Trump - the person - is not 'racist.' But Trump - the politician - is willing to say things that may sound racist in order to appeal to a certain segment of voters. He uses immigration as a wedge issue. It is more calculated than some think. and as DE suggested, it's becoming just another finger-pointing battle - "your party is racist" - "no, your party is racist."
Talk about a distinction without a difference. If he's willing to spew racism as the leader of the free world to rile up his base, who TF cares if he's not "really racist" in private?

And I know you're fond of both-sides-ism and often it's true. But on this issue it's not even close.
 

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Telling 4 Americans to "go back where they came from" was Trump showing his racism once again. How sad that you will defend him no matter what? Blind, utter loyalty. And you say you didn't like him and didn't vote for him.
If you accused him of being Ignorant, stupid, brash, bombastic with this tweet, I would agree with. You would make a strong argument that he was racist with other tweets.

Calling this one racist just reveals your desire to label him has racist regardless. Perhaps you too suffer from psychological projection.

“Psychological projection is a defense mechanism that occurs when a conflict arises between your unconscious feelings and your conscious beliefs. In order to subdue this conflict, you attribute these feelings to someone or something else.”

Perhaps the real racist is looking at you in the mirror.
 

justthefacts

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See, that is the most intellectually vapid point of your whole argument. He didn’t say people of color (This tells me not even you believe your own arguments unless you falsely what was actually said), he was singling out politicians who violently disagreed with him. They weren’t separated and singled out by their color, but rather how they voted on his bill. As Pelosi said herself.

“All these people have their public whatever and their Twitter world,” Pelosi said in an interview with New York Times columnist Maureen Dowd. “But they didn’t have any following. They’re four people and that’s how many votes they got.”

Oh look, Pelosi called out 4 women of color. According to the application of your lack of logic, it’s racism. The reality is that it is due to their political stance.
He didn't call them out. He told them to go back to their countries. What country would that be? Why would he think they were from a different country?

I've seen at least a dozen conservative commentators call him out for this. Only the Gopherhole and Fox News choose to pretend this wasn't racist.
 

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He didn't call them out. He told them to go back to their countries. What country would that be? Why would he think they were from a different country?

I've seen at least a dozen conservative commentators call him out for this. Only the Gopherhole and Fox News choose to pretend this wasn't racist.

He was called out because his statement was ignorant, and mean spirited. Which they were. .

What about the suggestion that if people don’t like here they to go back to their country of origin meets any of the following definitions of racism?

racism noun
rac·​ism | \ ˈrā-ˌsi-zəm also -ˌshi- \
Definition of racism
1 : a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race
2a : a doctrine or political program based on the assumption of racism and designed to execute its principles
b : a political or social system founded on racism
3 : racial prejudice or discrimination

Please advise. Oh wait, that’s right, you can’t support your argument using this definition of racism, without adding in words or falsifying what was actually said.
 
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howeda7

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Good to see you're now admitting which 4 he is talking about.

Now that we have settled that, he said they should go back to their countries to fix their problems. Why would he say that about Presley, AOC, or even Tlaib? Because of their radical views?
.
The "proud racist" is vehemently defending Trump's racist comments. I'm shocked.
 

howeda7

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I didn’t defend Trump’s tweet. I thought it was stupid and impulsive. If he’s going to tweet, he needs to get his facts straight beforehand.

I was commenting on Pelosi’s “make America white again” claim. Disparaging Trump, Republicans and Trump supporters with a comment like that, effectively calling him and his supporters racists, is disgusting rhetoric. It’s as bad as anything that Trump has said.

So don’t give me the “effing kidding me” sh!t.

We have different political opinions than you and believe in a different approach to solving problems, but that doesn’t make us racists.

Counting legal citizens in the US to better determine the distribution of government resources, congressional representatives, etc. is not an act of racism. But, when they can’t argue with logic and rationality, demeaning the character of the opponent is the way that she has chosen to go.

Pelosi first made this quote is response to the census citizen question. She has continued it to try to mend the rift between her and “the Squad”, and she used Trump’s stupid tweet to continue the narrative.
Telling 4 non-white Congresswomen to "go back where the came from" certainly sounds like it comes from someone wanting to make America white again.
 

howeda7

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Yeah, and because he either misspoke/or is ignorant to the fact that Ohmar is the only foreign born one of the group.
Are you really uncertain over which one it is? Come on.
 

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Are you really uncertain over which one it is? Come on.
I actually don’t care, so I won’t argue with either of them. If you tell me it’s because he is an ignorant baffon, I have no evidence otherwise. If you say he misspoke, people do that too. Either way he was severely mistaken and that reflects poorly on him.
 

short ornery norwegian

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I think Trump's critics go overboard with calling him a racist.

As I said before, I believe Trump uses racial issues as wedge issues for some perceived political gain. it's a strategy.

But yelling "racism" constantly - IMHO - diminishes the power of the word. it makes it commonplace. especially when both sides are accusing each other of being racist. it becomes just another word that is used for political purposes, and minimizes the problem of "real" racism.

There are plenty of things you can call Trump without going to the "racist" card.

What gets me about the whole deal - before Trump's tweets, the media was focusing on the perceived rift between Pelosi and the "gang of 4" in the House. After Trump's tweets, that became the story and the Dems suddenly were united in condemning Trump. So, in tweeting about Democrat inter-party squabbles, Trump actually took the focus away from those squabbles. His tweet did the opposite of what it was (I think) intended to do.
 

howeda7

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If you accused him of being Ignorant, stupid, brash, bombastic with this tweet, I would agree with. You would make a strong argument that he was racist with other tweets.
If this was the first ignorant/racist thing he ever said, you would have a point. He has shown us who he is over and over. Claiming Obama wasn't a citizen. Saying a an American born judge of Mexican ancestry couldn't give him a fair trial. Calling racists in Charlottesville "fine people" and on and on. If you defend him at this point, it's because you either find his racism to be a minor flaw among a sea of "great policies" and you're fine over-looking it or you find it an attribute.
 

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The "proud racist" is vehemently defending Trump's racist comments. I'm shocked.
Trumps a racist, Pelosi is a racist, I am a racist, you are a racist. We are all racist.

Now that we got that cleared up, can we move off the race card?
 

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I don't think you're racist. I think assuming people of color are from another country and should go back there is pretty much exactly what the phrase "make America white again" would mean. And that's racist. He didn't have a typo; he pluralized three different words. But Trump tweeted that, not you.

This answers DE's question as well, although it doesn't seem to have been in good faith given he proceeded to insult me personally.
The rhetoric here, from howie and others, is a suggestion that Trump supporters must be racist, whether they realize it themselves or not. That we must be uncaring, lack compassion and reason, etc. He’s as much as said that with his virtue signaling.

Anyone, including Nancy Pelosi, that suggests the Trump is attempting to “make America white again” implicitly is calling him and anyone who supports MAGA a racist. I have no doubt that this is a narrative that she will continue, if she gets no blowback from critics. It’s her way of appealing to the far left of the party. Frankly, I don’t think it’s smart.

In howie’s view, the only way for redemption from the implications of evil and degenerate morals is to repudiate Trump and anything he advocates for.

For it is only howie, in his humble view, and the likeminded that are rational, moral, intelligent, compassionate, (I could go on, but you can see it in all of howie’s virtue signaling posts), etc.
 

howeda7

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I actually don’t care, so I won’t argue with either of them. If you tell me it’s because he is an ignorant baffon, I have no evidence otherwise. If you say he misspoke, people do that too. Either way he was severely mistaken and that reflects poorly on him.
He's ignorant of where they're from, but assumes they weren't born here because they're not white.
 

howeda7

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The rhetoric here, from howie and others, is a suggestion that Trump supporters must be racist, whether they realize it themselves or not. That we must be uncaring, lack compassion and reason, etc. He’s as much as said that with his virtue signaling.

Anyone, including Nancy Pelosi, that suggests the Trump is attempting to “make America white again” implicitly is calling him and anyone who supports MAGA a racist. I have no doubt that this is a narrative that she will continue, if she gets no blowback from critics. It’s her way of appealing to the far left of the party. Frankly, I don’t think it’s smart.

In howie’s view, the only way for redemption from the implications of evil and degenerate morals is to repudiate Trump and anything he advocates for.

For it is only howie, in his humble view, and the likeminded that are rational, moral, intelligent, compassionate, (I could go on, but you can see it in all of howie’s virtue signaling posts), etc.
All Trump supporters are not racist, and I never said they were. Stop lying. Some are. Most are not. But they are willing to overlook it or live in denial of it, yes.

What does Trump bring to the table that a non-ignorant, non-racist Republican does not? What has Trump done that President Kasich or President Rubio would not have done that makes it necessary to put up with his ignorance and racism as a minor side effect of his otherwise brilliant leadership?
 
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howeda7

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Trumps a racist, Pelosi is a racist, I am a racist, you are a racist. We are all racist.

Now that we got that cleared up, can we move off the race card?
ZZZ. No because it's not true and a cop out to avoid addressing the issue.
 

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All Trump supporters are not racist, and I never said they were. Stop lying. Some are. Most are not. But they are willing to overlook it or live in denial of it, yes.
Or...they may not believe he is a racist.

Trump sometimes speaks and tweets impulsively, BEFORE THINKING OR CONSIDERING, how his comments may be interpreted. Trump is blunt, sometimes b/c he’s expressing his feelings or frustrations, and sometimes b/c he wants to strike back and hurt someone like they hurt him.

It’s not an admirable trait, but it is totally transparent, though it is subject to misstatement, misinterpretation and mischaracterization.
 

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ZZZ. No because it's not true and a cop out to avoid addressing the issue.
Ah yes the issue. The issue that everyone who disagrees with you is a racist. Please, let’s continue to discuss this issue.
 

howeda7

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Or...they may not believe he is a racist.

Trump sometimes speaks and tweets impulsively, BEFORE THINKING OR CONSIDERING, how his comments may be interpreted. Trump is blunt, sometimes b/c he’s expressing his feelings or frustrations, and sometimes b/c he wants to strike back and hurt someone like they hurt him.

It’s not an admirable trait, but it is totally transparent, though it is subject to misstatement, misinterpretation and mischaracterization.
They may not believe that Hillary didn't gun down Seth Rich in cold blood, doesn't make them right. This was not a single hasty tweet. He has showed who he is repeatedly. You can ignore it and not care. Just admit that you don't care.

I'll ask again, what has Trump done that a non-racist, non-ignorant Republican President would not have done that warrants us having to put up with this? Name 2 things.
 

howeda7

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Ah yes the issue. The issue that everyone who disagrees with you is a racist. Please, let’s continue to discuss this issue.
I never said that or implied it. But "everyone's a racist to so let's just ignore our racist President and move on" is a cop out.
 

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He's ignorant of where they're from, but assumes they weren't born here because they're not white.

I won’t pick a fight with you on that, because I simply don’t know what he assumes.

You do realize how much your views are based on what you think you know about what he thinks and what motivates him, as opposed to empirical evidence, don’t you?
 

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I never said that or implied it. But "everyone's a racist to so let's just ignore our racist President and move on" is a cop out.

You did imply that by pointing to a tweet, that has no racist statements (per the definition of racism), as being a racist tweet.

The only link to racism in that tweet is not based on the explicit statement, but what the reader wants to think he meant.
 
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justthefacts

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I won’t pick a fight with you on that, because I simply don’t know what he assumes.

You do realize how much your views are based on what you think you know about what he thinks and what motivates him, as opposed to empirical evidence, don’t you?
Well, you can tell he assumes they're not from this country because he said so. What other explanation is there? He has criticized Pelosi, Schumer, and lots of other Congressmen without saying they should go back to their countries. Honestly, the only alternative explanation is the he is so senile and befuddled that he has can't be held accountable for tweeting nonsense.
 

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I'll ask again, what has Trump done that a non-racist, non-ignorant Republican President would not have done that warrants us having to put up with this? Name 2 things.
You don’t want to hear it, but Trump has taken on the news media in a way that no other Republican President has, as ugly as it gets. The MS news media has been an advocacy group for the Democrat Party. They needed to be shown for what they are.

Example, did you see the doofus, Brian Karem, CNN contributor, publicly yell “this is a group of people who are eager for demonic possession” to the gathered audience after Trump’s WH garden announcement about how he was going to collect citizenship data? Sebastian Gorka then confronted him, unwisely in my view, publicly after Karem threatened him from a distance by saying “come over here and say that”.

Now, if any member of the conservative media, especially a Fox News reporter, acted that way, it would’ve been headlines in multiple outlets for days and there would be calls for the reporter’s job. Karem just walks and it’s written off as two guys arguing publicly, even though the entire episode was instigated by loud, incredibly stupid comments by Karem.

Trump has exposed them.

Trump’s ability to do that one thing has lead to the second thing, unify the Republican Party in a functional, not necessarily aesthetically pleasing, way; which has lead to significant legislative accomplishment in the tax cut, two conservative SC Justices, and so on.
 

KillerGopherFan

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Well, you can tell he assumes they're not from this country because he said so. What other explanation is there? He has criticized Pelosi, Schumer, and lots of other Congressmen without saying they should go back to their countries. Honestly, the only alternative explanation is the he is so senile and befuddled that he has can't be held accountable for tweeting nonsense.
IMO, he was speaking of their countries/common wealth of heritage. Not particularly smart.
 

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My ancestors flew over here in 1628 from England. That was before the continental army captured the airports, and did what they had to do. If I ever have to go back to where I came from, I suppose it will be somewhere in Bedfordshire. Blimey!
 

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Telling 4 Americans to "go back where they came from" was Trump showing his racism once again. How sad that you will defend him no matter what. Blind, utter loyalty. And you say you didn't like him and didn't vote for him.
That’s not what he said. Why the need to lie about it?


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Section2

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He's ignorant of where they're from, but assumes they weren't born here because they're not white.
The fun thing is that he didn’t say 4, and didn’t call any of them by name, but you just run with it anyway. You just know his mind. CNN said so. He’s racist. Orange man very bad.


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