Michael Flynn expected to plea GUILTY! LOCK HIM UP!!!!!!

bga1

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Want to bet?
The judge is dirty, or is operating under threat, there is little doubt in my mind. The forces on the left want him to do it, expect him to do it, or they are going to throw him under the bus faster than Al Franken. I don't think he will over rule the DOJ, because he would have to justify it...which he cannot. He is in a real bad spot.
 

KillerGopherFan

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One on THE most important outcomes of this Flynn situation, besides the obvious further exposure of the phony Russia collusion hoax and the involvement Obama administration officials, is the exposure of MOST of the media complex that is totally in the bag for destroying Trump without regard for journalistic ethics, whatsoever.

Most of the media IS a totally political and agenda driven operation, and we know what side the vast majority come down on. It won’t get better until people demand accountability for what these “news journalists and analysts“ write and say.

For some, it feeds their TDS desires. For many, they are victims of the long held trust that people had for the news and journalism. For the rest of us, it is pure garbage.
 

Costa Rican Gopher

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The judge is dirty, or is operating under threat, there is little doubt in my mind. The forces on the left want him to do it, expect him to do it, or they are going to throw him under the bus faster than Al Franken. I don't think he will over rule the DOJ, because he would have to justify it...which he cannot. He is in a real bad spot.

It's not just that. The worst case scenario for the prosecution is that this goes to trial & all their misdeeds are exposed. They need the judge to not only overrule the DOJ, but to also reject Flynn's bid to withdraw his guilty plea & go to trial.
 

atsgopher

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Here's the most depressing thing of all though, when you think about it.

The doc released the last few days and everything they show will literally change nobody's mind. Zero. The folks who believed he got bent over and f'd now see the proof and the people who thought/WANTED to believe he was a dirty guilty bastard won't look at ANY of this and are still convinced of their righteousness.

That's how embedded everyone is right now.
That's how embedded everybody always is.... that's how cognitive dissonance works. Doesn't matter if your talking about "How the refs always seem to screw my team," or (R)s vs (D)s.

Flynn didn't get screwed, but he probably was over punished, as his lie wasn't that big (but technically a lie). Not really a scandal. The treatment he received is like we'd all get from law enforcement.
 

Bad Gopher

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Great read for people interested in truth and justice.
 

bga1

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Great read for people interested in truth and justice.
Asha's accuracy is not as good as a broken clock these past three years. She is a hack. You actually know this.
 

howeda7

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The judge is dirty, or is operating under threat, there is little doubt in my mind. The forces on the left want him to do it, expect him to do it, or they are going to throw him under the bus faster than Al Franken. I don't think he will over rule the DOJ, because he would have to justify it...which he cannot. He is in a real bad spot.
It's amazing how dirty everyone is (the judge, the FBI, the SC) EXCEPT for the guy who plead guilty to multiple felonies. He's a righteous GD hero!
 

Costa Rican Gopher

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That's how embedded everybody always is.... that's how cognitive dissonance works. Doesn't matter if your talking about "How the refs always seem to screw my team," or (R)s vs (D)s.

Flynn didn't get screwed, but he probably was over punished, as his lie wasn't that big (but technically a lie). Not really a scandal. The treatment he received is like we'd all get from law enforcement.

Completely false. Flynn was absolutely railroaded. We've seen the documents they hid from the defense, so there's no reason to pretend anymore. They targeted a 3* General with an impeccable resume & the incoming National Security Adviser because they didn't like his politics, or the politics of the incoming President as part of their coup attempt. It's the biggest political scandal in US history.
 

Costa Rican Gopher

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Great read for people interested in truth and justice.

I didn't dig through the first tweet, but the 2nd, 3rd, 4th & 5th are blatant lies, so I quit reading. Her track record for journalistic integrity is a joke, but I tried to give her an open minded read.

The MSM were not duped, they were accomplices. At this point, they're neck deep in the conspiracy and their only hope is to double down on the propaganda.
 

Costa Rican Gopher

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It's amazing how dirty everyone is (the judge, the FBI, the SC) EXCEPT for the guy who plead guilty to multiple felonies. He's a righteous GD hero!

He did not plead guilty to "multiple felonies". That's patently false. He pled guilty to one count of "willfully and knowingly" making "false, fictitious and fraudulent statements" to the FBI.
 

Livingat45north

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Completely false. Flynn was absolutely railroaded. We've seen the documents they hid from the defense, so there's no reason to pretend anymore. They targeted a 3* General with an impeccable resume & the incoming National Security Adviser because they didn't like his politics, or the politics of the incoming President as part of their coup attempt. It's the biggest political scandal in US history.
It's more than they targeted Flynn. After Flynn spent everything he had on his defense they (the gov't with unlimited dollars and lawyers) told him that unless he plead guilty they'd do the same to his son. I don't care how much of a Blue minion you are, this isn't something you can defend and still claim any shred of ethics and interest in justice. And there are far more than Flynn that they did this to.
 

bga1

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He did not plead guilty to "multiple felonies". That's patently false. He pled guilty to one count of "willfully and knowingly" making "false, fictitious and fraudulent statements" to the FBI.
Flynn tells the agents that he knows that they have listened to the call. (so what is the point in lying?)
The agents walk away saying they think he was telling them the truth. (so why did they change their minds?)
Did he actually even lie? Or did he just admit to lying because A) they tangled up what he said in the altered 302 and put it at odds with what he remembered and B) the put him under the threat of them investigating his son and making him go broke defending himself as well.
To this day, I am not that certain of the substance of the lie other than that there was some gap between what he and Pence said, which would not be a crime.
 

scools12

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It's more than they targeted Flynn. After Flynn spent everything he had on his defense they (the gov't with unlimited dollars and lawyers) told him that unless he plead guilty they'd do the same to his son. I don't care how much of a Blue minion you are, this isn't something you can defend and still claim any shred of ethics and interest in justice. And there are far more than Flynn that they did this to.
The Blue minions as you call them don’t care. They want power. How they achieve that goal is irrelevant. In this case getting rid of Trump was the main goal no matter what the cost or how it was done.
 

Costa Rican Gopher

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Flynn tells the agents that he knows that they have listened to the call. (so what is the point in lying?)
The agents walk away saying they think he was telling them the truth. (so why did they change their minds?)
Did he actually even lie? Or did he just admit to lying because A) they tangled up what he said in the altered 302 and put it at odds with what he remembered and B) the put him under the threat of them investigating his son and making him go broke defending himself as well.
To this day, I am not that certain of the substance of the lie other than that there was some gap between what he and Pence said, which would not be a crime.

What was the lie specifically anyhow? Where's the transcript? Why can't we check the alleged lie vs the transcript? Why wasn't the defense allowed to see the transcript?
 

jamiche

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Nothing has changed. Flynny is guilty and has committed treason. Barr runs a DOJ that serves the interests of the WH and not the American people. Trump is going to pardon Stone after he cancels, postpones or steals the November election.
 

atsgopher

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Completely false. Flynn was absolutely railroaded. We've seen the documents they hid from the defense, so there's no reason to pretend anymore. They targeted a 3* General with an impeccable resume & the incoming National Security Adviser because they didn't like his politics, or the politics of the incoming President as part of their coup attempt. It's the biggest political scandal in US history.

Sorry, usually I'd back you up, but I read the docs. I read Barr's dismissal brief. I can see why you'd be mad. The facts don't bear a scandal. Although, I'll grant Comey did take advantage.

The following is a list of facts that are not in dispute:

1. Flynn contacted Kislayek in December. He said he didn't discuss sanctions.

2. Flynn admitted to lying about contact Kislayek to the FBI, and Vice President Pence. Done under oath, Twice. Also, he did so to the public (february 7th).

3. Had Flynn waited 25 days, the point would be moot. He did not wait those days.

4. Comey took advantage of the incoming administration. Normally, he figured they'd call him out and figure it out (Thus, shielding Flynn from an FBI interview). They didn't figure it out until much later. It isn't illegal. That's presidential politics 101.

5. Flynn admitted publicly on February 7th, That he did discuss Sanctions with Kislyak.

6. The lie to the FBI was illegal.

7. There was an open FBI investigation (You can read that in Barr's report, it was through FBI screwing up in closing it down).

My Opinions:
Dems think this means Trump ordered Flynn to contact Kislayek, thus proving collusion. However, they don't notice that this is contradicted by point 4. Trump didn't expect to win and didn't have his shit together.

Flynn lied, but to him the lie was minor. He was a political rookie. He should have been protected more, but the transition was disorganized. He wasn't prevented from Jumping the gun. He wasn't properly shielded from the FBI interview with privilege. Mueller tried to use this as leverage. This happens all the time. Not a scandal. Flynn did factually commit a crime. However, it was a little one. He got fired. He probably should have been pardoned, because the crime should have been prevented.

Barr's justification makes no logical sense. He shows the FBI screwed up by not closing their investigation, then he goes on to say they did. That's he justification for dropping the case. It is weird. it does not follow as his premise is directly contradicted in his own report.

Moreover, Barr earlier, prevented disclosure of the Flynn conversation with Kislayek (that the FBI taped). He said it wasn't necessary for a guilty plea or sentencing. Otherwise, we wouldn't be having this conversation. However, Trump and Pence had access. They did Fire him over it. Clearly, he said something wrong, Otherwise, you'd be able to hear the tape right now. This wouldn't be a thing. They could still release it. Demand that, it holds your truth.

As for a scandal, I don't see one. A bunch of bumbling and the usual politics.
 

scools12

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Nothing has changed. Flynny is guilty and has committed treason. Barr runs a DOJ that serves the interests of the WH and not the American people. Trump is going to pardon Stone after he cancels, postpones or steals the November election.
This is a high level of delusion.
 

Costa Rican Gopher

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Nothing has changed. Flynny is guilty and has committed treason. Barr runs a DOJ that serves the interests of the WH and not the American people. Trump is going to pardon Stone after he cancels, postpones or steals the November election.

You're like the Japanese soldier trapped on the desert island who doesn't know the war's over yet.
 

BarnBurner

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Enough with the fake news, brokenbrain.

Nobody is as big a liar as YOUR hero, Prejudent Drumpf.
But but but Trump!!!

hahaha

Prez Barack is dirty and you and your cadre of liars won’t admit the facts!!!!

Stzroker
 

BarnBurner

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Sorry, usually I'd back you up, but I read the docs. I read Barr's dismissal brief. I can see why you'd be mad. The facts don't bear a scandal. Although, I'll grant Comey did take advantage.

The following is a list of facts that are not in dispute:

1. Flynn contacted Kislayek in December. He said he didn't discuss sanctions.

2. Flynn admitted to lying about contact Kislayek to the FBI, and Vice President Pence. Done under oath, Twice. Also, he did so to the public (february 7th).

3. Had Flynn waited 25 days, the point would be moot. He did not wait those days.

4. Comey took advantage of the incoming administration. Normally, he figured they'd call him out and figure it out (Thus, shielding Flynn from an FBI interview). They didn't figure it out until much later. It isn't illegal. That's presidential politics 101.

5. Flynn admitted publicly on February 7th, That he did discuss Sanctions with Kislyak.

6. The lie to the FBI was illegal.

7. There was an open FBI investigation (You can read that in Barr's report, it was through FBI screwing up in closing it down).

My Opinions:
Dems think this means Trump ordered Flynn to contact Kislayek, thus proving collusion. However, they don't notice that this is contradicted by point 4. Trump didn't expect to win and didn't have his shit together.

Flynn lied, but to him the lie was minor. He was a political rookie. He should have been protected more, but the transition was disorganized. He wasn't prevented from Jumping the gun. He wasn't properly shielded from the FBI interview with privilege. Mueller tried to use this as leverage. This happens all the time. Not a scandal. Flynn did factually commit a crime. However, it was a little one. He got fired. He probably should have been pardoned, because the crime should have been prevented.

Barr's justification makes no logical sense. He shows the FBI screwed up by not closing their investigation, then he goes on to say they did. That's he justification for dropping the case. It is weird. it does not follow as his premise is directly contradicted in his own report.

Moreover, Barr earlier, prevented disclosure of the Flynn conversation with Kislayek (that the FBI taped). He said it wasn't necessary for a guilty plea or sentencing. Otherwise, we wouldn't be having this conversation. However, Trump and Pence had access. They did Fire him over it. Clearly, he said something wrong, Otherwise, you'd be able to hear the tape right now. This wouldn't be a thing. They could still release it. Demand that, it holds your truth.

As for a scandal, I don't see one. A bunch of bumbling and the usual politics.
Did you intentionally miss the fact that Barack knew and didn’t utter a word?

legendary liar
 

Costa Rican Gopher

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Sorry, usually I'd back you up, but I read the docs. I read Barr's dismissal brief. I can see why you'd be mad. The facts don't bear a scandal. Although, I'll grant Comey did take advantage.

The following is a list of facts that are not in dispute:

1. Flynn contacted Kislayek in December. He said he didn't discuss sanctions.

2. Flynn admitted to lying about contact Kislayek to the FBI, and Vice President Pence. Done under oath, Twice. Also, he did so to the public (february 7th).

3. Had Flynn waited 25 days, the point would be moot. He did not wait those days.

4. Comey took advantage of the incoming administration. Normally, he figured they'd call him out and figure it out (Thus, shielding Flynn from an FBI interview). They didn't figure it out until much later. It isn't illegal. That's presidential politics 101.

5. Flynn admitted publicly on February 7th, That he did discuss Sanctions with Kislyak.

6. The lie to the FBI was illegal.

7. There was an open FBI investigation (You can read that in Barr's report, it was through FBI screwing up in closing it down).

My Opinions:
Dems think this means Trump ordered Flynn to contact Kislayek, thus proving collusion. However, they don't notice that this is contradicted by point 4. Trump didn't expect to win and didn't have his shit together.

Flynn lied, but to him the lie was minor. He was a political rookie. He should have been protected more, but the transition was disorganized. He wasn't prevented from Jumping the gun. He wasn't properly shielded from the FBI interview with privilege. Mueller tried to use this as leverage. This happens all the time. Not a scandal. Flynn did factually commit a crime. However, it was a little one. He got fired. He probably should have been pardoned, because the crime should have been prevented.

Barr's justification makes no logical sense. He shows the FBI screwed up by not closing their investigation, then he goes on to say they did. That's he justification for dropping the case. It is weird. it does not follow as his premise is directly contradicted in his own report.

Moreover, Barr earlier, prevented disclosure of the Flynn conversation with Kislayek (that the FBI taped). He said it wasn't necessary for a guilty plea or sentencing. Otherwise, we wouldn't be having this conversation. However, Trump and Pence had access. They did Fire him over it. Clearly, he said something wrong, Otherwise, you'd be able to hear the tape right now. This wouldn't be a thing. They could still release it. Demand that, it holds your truth.

As for a scandal, I don't see one. A bunch of bumbling and the usual politics.

The bottom line is in order for the FBI to interview Flynn there had to be a legal predicate. Since there was no legal predicate, everything else is a moot point.

The FBI investigated Michael Flynn because they hated Flynn & Trump. They ran undercover agents against him, they even coordinated with the CIA & in the end, despite their best efforts they found nothing. Therefore, they decided to close the case.

Then James Comey decided, despite having no legal predicate, to keep it open anyhow because apparently, the WH wanted it kept open for some reason. At this point, everything the FBI did was null & void.

The interview wasn't business as usual for the FBI as evidenced by the panicked texts and notes on the eve of the interview by Lisa Page & Bill Priestap worrying about what they were going to do the following day.

We don't even know that Flynn lied. The FBI said they didn't believe Flynn lied. The FBI has the burden of showing the interviewing agents' 302 interview notes, which allegedly showed Flynn did not lie. No sane person believes the FBI "lost" those notes, but that's their claim. Then the FBI broke the law by doctoring the notes, having Lisa Page, who was not even present at the interview, help write Pientka's notes, along with Strzok, who was not the note taker in the interview. They changed Pientka's notes to such a degree that Page-Strzok discussed having to try to preserve Pientka's original voice. Then, from the world of the bizarro, they had to submit them to Andrew McCabe to be Ok'd before "launching". Why on earth would McCabe need to Ok the notes for an interview he did not attend? Remember Flynn blew the whistle on McCabe for sexual discrimination against a female FBI employee, so McCabe had all the motive in the world to screw Flynn.

Then the prosecution withheld the exculpatory evidence from the Flynn defense team for 2+ years that the case had been closed due to lack of evidence, that senior FBI officials had major reservations about the legality of the Flynn interview & they refused to let the Flynn defense have a copy of the transcript. The prosecution also lied to the court stating there were no side deals of any kind. Then the prosecution broke the law again by entering into a side deal for Flynn to plea in exchange for not attacking his son, but insisting it not be in writing so as to avoid Giglio Disclosures against future defendants Flynn would testify against.

There was never a legitimate reason to investigate Flynn to begin with, but the rule bending & outright illegality are scandalous. Worse yet, it appears Flynn's original defense team were colluding with the WH & the prosecution against Flynn.
 

bga1

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Sorry, usually I'd back you up, but I read the docs. I read Barr's dismissal brief. I can see why you'd be mad. The facts don't bear a scandal. Although, I'll grant Comey did take advantage.

The following is a list of facts that are not in dispute:

1. Flynn contacted Kislayek in December. He said he didn't discuss sanctions.
Right there is a tricky one. Flynn didn't discuss the specific sanctions. He just asked the Russians not to do anything rash during the transition phase. Perfectly appropriate- DOJ agrees. Flynn may not have been sure about how to answer that one

2. Flynn admitted to lying about contact Kislayek to the FBI, and Vice President Pence. Done under oath, Twice. Also, he did so to the public (february 7th).
There is disagreement between statements Pence made and Flynn made- no crime there. He did say to the FBI that he had talked to Kisylak- that's what they were talking about

3. Had Flynn waited 25 days, the point would be moot. He did not wait those days.
It is standard practice to meet with foreign countries during the transition. Again the DOJ says that the meeting and the transcript of same are not a problem

4. Comey took advantage of the incoming administration. Normally, he figured they'd call him out and figure it out (Thus, shielding Flynn from an FBI interview). They didn't figure it out until much later. It isn't illegal. That's presidential politics 101.


5. Flynn admitted publicly on February 7th, That he did discuss Sanctions with Kislyak.
See first response
6. The lie to the FBI was illegal.
Not if he didn't lie AND not if there was no legal investigation. Fruit of the poisonous tree. The FBI had no pretense on which to interview Flynn- per the DOJ ruling

7. There was an open FBI investigation (You can read that in Barr's report, it was through FBI screwing up in closing it down).
But not a legally based investigation. The investigation was started based on a rumor filled document that the FBI already knew was shady

My Opinions:
Dems think this means Trump ordered Flynn to contact Kislayek, thus proving collusion. However, they don't notice that this is contradicted by point 4. Trump didn't expect to win and didn't have his shit together.

Flynn lied, but to him the lie was minor. He was a political rookie. He should have been protected more, but the transition was disorganized. He wasn't prevented from Jumping the gun. He wasn't properly shielded from the FBI interview with privilege. Mueller tried to use this as leverage. This happens all the time. Not a scandal. Flynn did factually commit a crime. However, it was a little one. He got fired. He probably should have been pardoned, because the crime should have been prevented.

Barr's justification makes no logical sense. He shows the FBI screwed up by not closing their investigation, then he goes on to say they did. That's he justification for dropping the case. It is weird. it does not follow as his premise is directly contradicted in his own report.

Moreover, Barr earlier, prevented disclosure of the Flynn conversation with Kislayek (that the FBI taped). He said it wasn't necessary for a guilty plea or sentencing. Otherwise, we wouldn't be having this conversation. However, Trump and Pence had access. They did Fire him over it. Clearly, he said something wrong, Otherwise, you'd be able to hear the tape right now. This wouldn't be a thing. They could still release it. Demand that, it holds your truth.

As for a scandal, I don't see one. A bunch of bumbling and the usual politics.
You are wishing and dreaming. It's a massive scandal. They framed a general. They knew what they were doing and we know they discussed it all the way at the top in the January 5th meeting with Obama, Brennan, etc- yep the meeting memorialized by Susan Rice- "we did it by the book". hmmm

Why did they frame the general? Because his time in the Obama administration gave him access to what they were doing and how they were doing it. He became opposed to their goals and methods and they hated him and they made no secret of it. They absolutely could not have him in the Trump administration because they were concurrently running a spies and wiretapping Trump and Trump associates. They knew that Flynn would get in the way of that if he were in a position of power in the Trump administration. The "insurance policy" the coup against Trump would never work with Flynn around. That's why they had to get him to lie to get him fired.

The Mueller investigation which nabbed Trump was never an attempt to find Russian collusion- they knew that was a non- starter day one. That is now a matter of record. 53 testimonies and Russian collusion went 0-53. No one had any evidence of it. Strzok himself said there was "no there, there." It was an attempt to freeze the wheels of the Trump administration while they hoped to badger Trump into an obstruction or perjury trap. The arrest of Flynn was one way to lock him down while they did their work.

Finally, you have to put in context the fact that the Obama administration had massively broken the law with abuse of unmasking to spy on Americans. They spied on congress, the press (maybe how they got control of some of them?), and obviously their political enemies. There is a publicly available 99 page report on it by Judge Collyer who wrote it after Admiral Rogers exposed the program and shut it down. When he shut it down they went to other types of spying in 2016 and that's where they really got deep into criminal activity and perhaps treason. Flynn is the tip of the iceberg.

One more thing- I just checked some history on that transcript.... It was Van Grack who wanted to withhold the transcript because he said to the court (Sullivan) that their case did not rely on the transcript. Yeah, van Grack the government prosecutor that got slapped down and had to remove himself from a bunch of cases because of his misconduct. He knew that the transcript supported Flynn's story and not the Mueller team's. Now you are demanding that Barr release it- another conversation with a foreign government, just like the Ukrainian hoax? Nope.

See this article from 2019 on the transcript issue...

 
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