Ex-WI LB Borland: 15 guys lined up for injections

Pompous Elitist

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I’m about halfway through the second episode and it is indeed an interesting show along the lines of a 20/20 type crime piece but certainly insightful into his younger years, family dynamic (wow), bisexuality, violent tendencies, and the poor company he kept. I wasn’t even aware he was indicted for the second pair of murders. Fascinating.

I‘m not sure why they inserted Borland into the second episode. I suppose the producers maybe want to go down that track of examining football and toxic masculinity, head injuries and insinuate football led to his antisocial behavior some way some how even if that doesn’t jibe with known CTE neurodegenerative timelines. That angle may help garner more headlines and free advertising.
 

Bob_Loblaw

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I’m about halfway through the second episode and it is indeed an interesting show along the lines of a 20/20 type crime piece but certainly insightful into his younger years, family dynamic (wow), bisexuality, violent tendencies, and the poor company he kept. I wasn’t even aware he was indicted for the second pair of murders. Fascinating.

I‘m not sure why they inserted Borland into the second episode. I suppose the producers maybe want to go down that track of examining football and toxic masculinity, head injuries and insinuate football led to his antisocial behavior some way some how even if that doesn’t jibe with known CTE neurodegenerative timelines. That angle may help garner more headlines and free advertising.
I think Borland was inserted as a lazy attempt to blame football for Aaron Hernandez.
 

PMWinSTP

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I think the point is not whether the drug is harmful, but the fact that they are playing through injuries that they should be resting, but with the help of drugs are playing through pain.
Good grief. Have you ever taken Aleve? That's what it is. Everyone takes painkillers like this and either exercises or does strenuous work.
 

hello-world

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The NS in NSAID stands for NON STEROIDAL. Toradol is an injectable Naproxen like drug that MAY be harmful to the kidneys if one is dehydrated when it is given.
Borland has an axe to grind because he quit the NFL early to avoid lasting body and brain injuries and thinks everyone else is a fool not to do the same and there is no concern on the part of coaches , trainers or team physicians for the long term health problems of athletes in college and especially the NFL.
He well may be correct in his judgements.
There is not a shred of evidence the WI athletic department injected androgenic steroids to any of its athletes.
It may please some MN fans to have an explanation other than talent and coaching for the WI domination in football and basketball over the last decades but it is simply not true.
This is the correct read on this situation, thank you.

Toradol is a NSAID like Advil. Calling it a steroid is both inaccurate and disingenuous.
 

Pompous Elitist

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I think Borland was inserted as a lazy attempt to blame football for Aaron Hernandez.
By my count they insinuated:

toxic home life
non-empathetic nature of Gator’s team culture (except the Meyers)
non-empathetic nature of Patriot’s team culture (except Kraft)
Hood rat pack of pals
Belichick refusing to allow a trade elsewhere
societal disapproval of homosexuality in football players
multiple football injuries including concussions/CTE
chronic dosing of ketorolac, a relatively innocuous non-steroidal
a belief that the abatement law would compel the Patriot’s to fulfill some or all of his contract salary

as factors in Hernandez’s homicidal behavior and suicide.

Yeah, some of those things certainly can contribute to psychological problems and bad behavior but I’m not sure one can credibly argue led to the cold-blooded murder of at least three people. That’s psychopathy.

Its interesting (to me) they attempted to link homicidal urges to CTE rather than the psychopathic brain‘s structural changes. Changes that weren’t really explored or discussed by Dr McKee but that’s not really her or the Boston CTE center’s area of interest.
 

PMWinSTP

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This is the correct read on this situation, thank you.

Toradol is a NSAID like Advil. Calling it a steroid is both inaccurate and disingenuous.
Advil is ibuprofen, but yeah, OTC pain reliever.
 

Bob_Loblaw

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By my count they insinuated:

toxic home life
non-empathetic nature of Gator’s team culture (except the Meyers)
non-empathetic nature of Patriot’s team culture (except Kraft)
Hood rat pack of pals
Belichick refusing to allow a trade elsewhere
societal disapproval of homosexuality in football players
multiple football injuries including concussions/CTE
chronic dosing of ketorolac, a relatively innocuous non-steroidal
a belief that the abatement law would compel the Patriot’s to fulfill some or all of his contract salary

as factors in Hernandez’s homicidal behavior and suicide.

Yeah, some of those things certainly can contribute to psychological problems and bad behavior but I’m not sure one can credibly argue led to the cold-blooded murder of at least three people. That’s psychopathy.

Its interesting (to me) they attempted to link homicidal urges to CTE rather than the psychopathic brain‘s structural changes. Changes that weren’t really explored or discussed by Dr McKee but that’s not really her or the Boston CTE center’s area of interest.

I haven't see it, but did the touch on the amount o drugs he was using? I thought I read that he was smoking weed and ketamine almost 24/7 contributing to an incredible amount of paranoia.

All of that said, I agree with you. He is a psychopath. I remember the footage of him like cuddling with his daughter 5-6 hours after killing Odin Lloyd.
 

Pompous Elitist

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I haven't see it, but did the touch on the amount o drugs he was using? I thought I read that he was smoking weed and ketamine almost 24/7 contributing to an incredible amount of paranoia.

All of that said, I agree with you. He is a psychopath. I remember the footage of him like cuddling with his daughter 5-6 hours after killing Odin Lloyd.
Implication was pot 24/7.
 

Pompous Elitist

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As a pain killer it's preferred. Far less side affects.
Perhaps, although that seems far from understood. Ignorance is bliss when it comes to potential medication side effects. Witness the recent hullabaloo over tetrahydrozoline poisoning in a murder and past issues with unintentional poisonings and date rapes. Who would have thought simple OTC redness reliever drops are capable of potent enough toxicity to kill or heavily sedate in relatively small doses?

Maybe marijuana is innocuous, maybe it has potentially significant psychiatric or other adverse effects in high enough doses that we aren’t fully aware of. I don’t know.
 

PMWinSTP

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Perhaps, although that seems far from understood. Ignorance is bliss when it comes to potential medication side effects. Witness the recent hullabaloo over tetrahydrozoline poisoning in a murder and past issues with unintentional poisonings and date rapes. Who would have thought simple OTC redness reliever drops are capable of potent enough toxicity to kill or heavily sedate in relatively small doses?

Maybe marijuana is innocuous, maybe it has potentially significant psychiatric or other adverse effects in high enough doses that we aren’t fully aware of. I don’t know.
Too much consumption of just about anything is probably bad for us.
 

btowngopher

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Good grief. Have you ever taken Aleve? That's what it is. Everyone takes painkillers like this and either exercises or does strenuous work.
Sorry I’m not a doctor. I didn’t know injecting something called tordal was the same as taking aleve. Borland was the one making it sound sketchy.
 

A nonymous

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Hernandez is almost textbook cluster B personality disorder, most consistent with Antisocial Personality Disorder with elements of comorbid Borderline Personality Disorder. Nearly all of his behavior can be attributed to this. I haven’t watched the documentary, do they comment on the psychiatric elements at all?
 

Face The Facts

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I’m about halfway through the second episode and it is indeed an interesting show along the lines of a 20/20 type crime piece but certainly insightful into his younger years, family dynamic (wow), bisexuality, violent tendencies, and the poor company he kept. I wasn’t even aware he was indicted for the second pair of murders. Fascinating.

I‘m not sure why they inserted Borland into the second episode. I suppose the producers maybe want to go down that track of examining football and toxic masculinity, head injuries and insinuate football led to his antisocial behavior some way some how even if that doesn’t jibe with known CTE neurodegenerative timelines. That angle may help garner more headlines and free advertising.
Well, the Borland angle was to setup the CTE discovery at the end. Not only did Hernandez have it at age 27, but one of the worst cases seen for a person that age and the Dr. implies he probably got an onset of it 10 years prior.

I think the show wanted to essentially point out multiple directions of blame.

1. Dad
2. Mom (she was nuts)
3. Bi-sexuality
4. Toxic masculinity
5. Bad friends
6. Drug use
7. CTE

It was interesting to see and learn the details. It definitely helps you understand how those things happened and it was probably a mix of all.

It didn't leave you wondering how this could have happened when that much stuff was going on and he probably was living in a world of paranoia for a good period of his life.
 

bigtenchamps1899

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The placebo and related expectations effect is powerful. Borland like some others may start to think his various aches and pains, mental fog, depression, anxiety and other ravages of age are a progressive and ultimately fatal neurodegenerative disease rather than common ailments of AGE syndrome. Is it a disservice to frighten millions of football and other sports survivors they are destined to descend into madness?

To my knowledge the genetic susceptibility to very rare CTE has not been beaten from the bushes yet and perhaps the interested parties are not interested to know for various reasons. Are there any updates on the epidemiology of CTE in former players?
lol, the guy is 29 years old. i’m 41 and i feel great. if he’s feeling decrepit at 29, then there’s a good chance it is from the ravages of playing a gladiatorial sport for most of his life.
 

bigtenchamps1899

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Good grief. Have you ever taken Aleve? That's what it is. Everyone takes painkillers like this and either exercises or does strenuous work.
there is a slight difference to popping an aleve once a month cuz you over did it and mainlining toradol. not everyone does that.
 

Bob_Loblaw

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Well, the Borland angle was to setup the CTE discovery at the end. Not only did Hernandez have it at age 27, but one of the worst cases seen for a person that age and the Dr. implies he probably got an onset of it 10 years prior.

I think the show wanted to essentially point out multiple directions of blame.

1. Dad
2. Mom (she was nuts)
3. Bi-sexuality
4. Toxic masculinity
5. Bad friends
6. Drug use
7. CTE

It was interesting to see and learn the details. It definitely helps you understand how those things happened and it was probably a mix of all.

It didn't leave you wondering how this could have happened when that much stuff was going on and he probably was living in a world of paranoia for a good period of his life.
I ended up watching up. It was entertaining but I think the documentary was trying to explain something that can't really be explained - why do psychopaths do terrible things.

I agree with your assessment of what the documentary was trying to push, but in reality, he is just a cold-blooded murderer who had zero regard for other human life.

Personally, I don't think his sexual orientation had anything to do with it. Maybe he was a bit more paranoid, but I think his paranoia had much more to do with being worried about getting caught for his previous murders.

The "toxic masculinity" angle that they tried to shoehorn into the show was a stretch.

As for the "bad friends" angle, I thought it was insane. Aaron Hernandez WAS the bad friend. His associates were small time crooks trying to impress him. He took advantage of his cousin. He was the bad guy!
 

Bob_Loblaw

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lol, the guy is 29 years old. i’m 41 and i feel great. if he’s feeling decrepit at 29, then there’s a good chance it is from the ravages of playing a gladiatorial sport for most of his life.
I think everyone agrees that football will make your body hurt.
 

Stuff

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Well, the Borland angle was to setup the CTE discovery at the end. Not only did Hernandez have it at age 27, but one of the worst cases seen for a person that age and the Dr. implies he probably got an onset of it 10 years prior.

I think the show wanted to essentially point out multiple directions of blame.

1. Dad
2. Mom (she was nuts)
3. Bi-sexuality
4. Toxic masculinity
5. Bad friends
6. Drug use
7. CTE

It was interesting to see and learn the details. It definitely helps you understand how those things happened and it was probably a mix of all.

It didn't leave you wondering how this could have happened when that much stuff was going on and he probably was living in a world of paranoia for a good period of his life.

I found it odd how his mom just asked Aaron to give her 1 million dollars so that she would be set for life. She was like well you just got 40 million dollars just give me one. Maybe this happens a lot to pro athletes when they get their multi-million dollar contracts.
 

Pompous Elitist

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lol, the guy is 29 years old. i’m 41 and i feel great. if he’s feeling decrepit at 29, then there’s a good chance it is from the ravages of playing a gladiatorial sport for most of his life.
I can assure you a huge number of people that never played gladiatorial sports feel awful.
 

A nonymous

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I ended up watching up. It was entertaining but I think the documentary was trying to explain something that can't really be explained - why do psychopaths do terrible things.

I agree with your assessment of what the documentary was trying to push, but in reality, he is just a cold-blooded murderer who had zero regard for other human life.

Personally, I don't think his sexual orientation had anything to do with it. Maybe he was a bit more paranoid, but I think his paranoia had much more to do with being worried about getting caught for his previous murders.

The "toxic masculinity" angle that they tried to shoehorn into the show was a stretch.

As for the "bad friends" angle, I thought it was insane. Aaron Hernandez WAS the bad friend. His associates were small time crooks trying to impress him. He took advantage of his cousin. He was the bad guy!
Totally agree. Sociopaths are sociopaths. He was exposed to childhood trauma no doubt, however most normal people do not respond in this way. Similarly, “toxic masculinity” does not drive normal people to commit a series of crimes with blatant disregard for humanity. Further, his pattern of behavior was consistent with sociopathy well before “CTE” could reasonably explain it. It is much more likely that the degree of chaotic relationships, bisexuality, narcissism, social charisma and disregard for human life is related to an underlying sociopathy than simply due to being a product his environment. It is also likely that his poor response to said trauma is due to maladaptive coping strategies associated with such a personality disorder. It is textbook.
 
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