Evidence of Structural Racism

howeda7

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Amazing that the system corrected that. There are always bad players. There is no longer systemic racism at play. As CRG states, it is an economic issue that we are dealing with.
"the system" didn't correct it. Big bad evil government regulations did. Are you saying some of them are good?
 

Nokomis

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supply and demand my friend. the kind of food you wish people in inner cities would eat is not what they want. it's not about price, and it's not about access.
What you just said is incredibly racist and exactly the type of stuff this thread is about. Not that you're racist, but you implicitly assume inner city people want junk food. You're an economist, so think like one. It's a lot cheaper to set up a fast food place on the corner than a grocer. So then the option is cheap accessible junk food or travelling for expensive healthy food. You're an economist, so I assume you understand that opportunity costs include more than just price. What if traveling to the supermarket takes away from time with their kids at home? It's not hard to start to connect the dots here and see how these things create institutional and societal barriers.
 

Nokomis

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Amazing that the system corrected that. There are always bad players. There is no longer systemic racism at play. As CRG states, it is an economic issue that we are dealing with.
I'll agree it's an economic issue once you guys start to show you actually understand economics.
 

BarnBurner

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What you just said is incredibly racist and exactly the type of stuff this thread is about. Not that you're racist, but you implicitly assume inner city people want junk food. You're an economist, so think like one. It's a lot cheaper to set up a fast food place on the corner than a grocer. So then the option is cheap accessible junk food or travelling for expensive healthy food. You're an economist, so I assume you understand that opportunity costs include more than just price. What if traveling to the supermarket takes away from time with their kids at home? It's not hard to start to connect the dots here and see how these things create institutional and societal barriers.
How many of them have even attempted to grow some of their own?? Easier to complain first.
 

BarnBurner

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Ahh.... What about Wells Fargo? They've recently paid out some large settlements, as STP has pointed out and linked.
“We do not agree with the claims in the lawsuit, but believe that putting this matter behind us is in the best interests of our team members, clients and investors,” Helen Bow, a spokeswoman for the San Francisco-based bank, said in an e-mail.
 

STPGopher

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Got it and I have done the same although I don't include secular vehicles because I don't trust them. That's not to say that there aren't good ones but I go where I can see the results more personally.

The problem I see STP is not that there isn't SOME bad policing. There is. There are some bad teachers, bad business people, bad employees and certainly tons of bad politicians. That's because this is the human race- flawed and sinful. There is not systemic racism. There are racists. You don't root them out with public unions.

Worse yet you don't paper over the real problem of broken families, poverty, low graduation and achievement by elevating police or system racism as the problem. Those aren't the problems. The core behaviors are the problems. When you make excuses then you don't ever solve the real problems.

If nothing more is done out of this than police reform then we all know what is going to happen next. More black deaths and more black poverty. Yes, more than before this started.
While we may agree on some things, I have to continue to say that I find it unacceptable to "chokeout" a cuffed suspect. I also think it is necessary to raise concerns about other bad practices. I also believe this is an opportunity to get necessary resources for officers. I have stated this continuously. Community partnerships have and can work.
 

STPGopher

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How many of them have even attempted to grow some of their own?? Easier to complain first.
Many more of "Them" then you think. Many more shouldn't without building a raised box due to lead and other contaminants in the soil.

Freddie Gray was a two time victim. The first was lead poisoning.
 

Nokomis

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“We do not agree with the claims in the lawsuit, but believe that putting this matter behind us is in the best interests of our team members, clients and investors,” Helen Bow, a spokeswoman for the San Francisco-based bank, said in an e-mail.
I wonder to which lawsuit she's referring? Overdraft fees, price gouging, subprime mortgages, credit cards, insider trading, racketeering, or fake accounts. WF's rap sheet is certainly long.
 

BarnBurner

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Many more of "Them" then you think. Many more shouldn't without building a raised box due to lead and other contaminants in the soil.

Freddie Gray was a two time victim. The first was lead poisoning.
No food desert then. Perfect.
 

BarnBurner

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I wonder to which lawsuit she's referring? Overdraft fees, price gouging, subprime mortgages, credit cards, insider trading, racketeering, or fake accounts. WF's rap sheet is certainly long.
My family member meets with people daily, and cant (and wouldn't do) what you are suggesting. Very diverse people. Needing banking services.
 

howeda7

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How many of them have even attempted to grow some of their own?? Easier to complain first.
Why don't people who live in the inner-city just grow a garden? Really? This is your answer to food deserts? Why don't they get a couple cows too? Problem solved!
 

Ogee Oglethorpe

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There's a compromise that can be reached on this. The R proposal is mostly to "study" this and "look at" that. That doesn't really get us anywhere either. It's "there we did something, now leave us alone!"
The left has zero interest in coming to any resolution before the election, or at the very least any resolution that they can allow Trump to take any credit for whatsoever. The only thing the Pelosi/Schumer/Schiff crew would accept prior to November is something they can brand almost 100% as their own.

This isn't rocket science, you know better
 

howeda7

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The left has zero interest in coming to any resolution before the election, or at the very least any resolution that they can allow Trump to take any credit for whatsoever. The only thing the Pelosi/Schumer/Schiff crew would accept prior to November is something they can brand almost 100% as their own.

This isn't rocket science, you know better
I don't think anyone really objects to much in the Senate bill, they object that it does too little. Which parts of the House bill do you find acceptable?
 

Ogee Oglethorpe

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I don't think anyone really objects to much in the Senate bill, they object that it does too little. Which parts of the House bill do you find acceptable?
You know exactly what's going on and that this has absolutely nothing to do with police reform. This is a political football in an election year, neither side wants the other to get credit for anything whatsoever. Nobody in the Senate or House really gives two shits out police reform at this point in time
 

KillerGopherFan

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This is such a red herring, but if you care so much, you'll call for more gun control. Most of the guns being used in Chicago are coming in from Indiana.
JTF, FYI - the Democrats notion of defunding and/or dismantling police departments along with violent protesting is having an impact on guns sales. They’re going through the roof.

If you cared about law and order, you’d call for more police, not less.

According to the National Shooting Sports Foundation, June 2020 saw the highest number of gun purchases since the FBI started keeping track 20 years ago. Further, this year's June number increased over June 2019 by 135.7 percent. According to the unadjusted number from the FBI's National Instant Criminal Background Check System, 3,909,502 background checks were conducted.

 

forever a gopher

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Walz & Ellison hinted at some of this stuff at the height of the Floyd protests. Things like residential housing restrictions, banking access, food deserts all contribute to structural racism. Statues, lake names, and body cams won't do much of anything until we address some of these root causes.
The banking and the food desserts are tough, as how do you provide services like these when they are run by businesses that are locating based on potential revenue/profit? I have an anecdote on the banking thing as I was a teller at a credit union in Brooklyn Center between undergrad and grad school. The credit union was for a local corporation, but it was open to all residents of BC. So we had members that were employees of the company, and numerous locals. Almost exclusively, the non-employee members were black. The vast majority of those were living paycheck to paycheck, and using the credit union as a check cashing place. They would come in with their work check and want it cashed for the full amount. Being a credit union, you saw the same faces over and over, and chatting to them as they came in, you got to learn about them a little. Most would cash their check and then spend the day driving around to the Comcast store, the phone store, Minnegasco, Xcel energy, etc. paying their bills in cash. The vast vast majority of them didn't have enough credit to get a checking account, so they dealt exclusively in cash.

Being a business, the credit union made no money on these members, as they didn't keep money in their accounts long enough for us to make money, and they never took out loans, etc. as they didn't have credit. The point remains valid regarding these "desserts", but a business is only going to go where it's feasible to make money. It's not a systemic racism issue as much as its a socio-economic issue.
 

GSUsTALON

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I do belive in stronger gun controle through better back ground checks especilly with pistoles or high capasity military type wepons. If it takes 2 weeks than so be it.

I also believe tat if you sell your personal gun, no matter what type, you should go to a dealer and send in the paper work to get your registered gan out of yor name and into the buyers name.

One of the problems with gags is that their are so many guns in the U.S. they can buy them on the street.

I think that ant law abiding citocen in the U.S. should be able to buy a gun. I also think that the buyer of a hand gun should be able to get a carry permit, but he must go through basic classes to obtain that permit especily if your a first time buyer that wants to carry. Unless you already have a carry permit.
 

howeda7

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JTF, FYI - the Democrats notion of defunding and/or dismantling police departments along with violent protesting is having an impact on guns sales. They’re going through the roof.

If you cared about law and order, you’d call for more police, not less.

According to the National Shooting Sports Foundation, June 2020 saw the highest number of gun purchases since the FBI started keeping track 20 years ago. Further, this year's June number increased over June 2019 by 135.7 percent. According to the unadjusted number from the FBI's National Instant Criminal Background Check System, 3,909,502 background checks were conducted.

The Boogalo boys ("Your people! Own it!" as Beeg would say) are also prepping for a 2nd Civil War....
 

Bob_Loblaw

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Just going to start a thread with these studies.
I used to think this was semantics, but I actually think it's an important point now. I don't see how these issues are "structural" or "systemic". The system isn't designed in a way that is unfair, it just does not fully eliminate racism. Almost all systems are going to allow human beings to make some decisions and humans are going to be impacted by their biases. The reason why money trumps this kind of racism is because money smashes the biases. I'm not arguing that isn't a problem, I'm just arguing that calling it systemic is kind of missing the point and therefore making the potential solution less narrowly tailored to solve the problem.

If company A is not hiring the best people because of some bias in the interviewer, they will lose in the marketplace to any company that has reduced their biases. The same can be said for owners of rental properties.
 

Bob_Loblaw

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Walz & Ellison hinted at some of this stuff at the height of the Floyd protests. Things like residential housing restrictions, banking access, food deserts all contribute to structural racism. Statues, lake names, and body cams won't do much of anything until we address some of these root causes.
People are having a hard time finding banks and foods? In the US?
 

Costa Rican Gopher

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I don't know about St. Paul, but much of this was NOT done by Minneapolis residents.
It seems pretty clear Mpls was an organized riot by Antifa & outside agitators, using local wannabes & useful idiots as their foot soldiers. There was a game plan. St Paul though, was mostly just spur of the moment looting by hoodrats from Frogtown.
 

Costa Rican Gopher

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Central, Highland and Harding are all IB schools. I'd argue it is more about retention, than attraction. Yes, different floors for different scores. The alternative is to make it all crap.
So racial segregation in public education is for the best?

Or maybe it's not racial at all? Maybe it's class? I'll bet you a finger, what we're really talking about are middle & upper middle class homes with two parents, living above the poverty line who're in those accelerated programs, while the others are single parent homes, living below the poverty line. That's class, not race. It just looks like race because so many Black students are living in single parent homes, below the poverty line.
 

Costa Rican Gopher

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Like Trump did?
It's not just creating jobs either. Dems will ship 100k union jobs that pay $25 p/h + benefits overseas and replace them with 110k jobs that pay $12.50 p/h with no benefits and brag they created 10k new jobs. Not only did Trump create all those new jobs, but he created jobs that paid so well it enticed people off the welfare rolls back into the workforce and addressed bridging the wealth gap.
 

Costa Rican Gopher

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What an amazing thing it would be if everyone actually understood what you just said. What if this were in the media where the masses could digest it. Maybe there would be less anger and more hope!
Maybe things would actually change.
Ironically this was what the Democrats promised to do for the past 25 years if elected & it took Trump to do it as a Republican. That's how the Democrats lost F & L, in the DFL.
 

Bob_Loblaw

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Ironically this was what the Democrats promised to do for the past 25 years if elected & it took Trump to do it as a Republican. That's how the Democrats lost F & L, in the DFL.

Hell, Bruce Springsteen's entire Ghost of Tom Joad album is full of ballads asking for precisely what Trump's policies towards bringing jobs back.

Also, one small nit, there ain't much Democratic about the DFL either.
 
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