Both Gach

Spottedmuskie

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He needed that almost and 1 so bad, then he missed a free throw, air balled a 3, and got benched
 

howeda7

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Gach almost went into the draft this year? Laughable.
 

tmvander

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It’s hard for him too because his minutes are so inconsistent. Today he didn’t get on the floor until about 4 minutes left in the 2nd.
He should have gotten in in the first half for sure...mashburn really added value there off the bench...isn't like maryland has a 2 or 3 that is a stud we need gabe to guard...their guy scoring all game was carrs guy...williams deserved some play
 

Spottedmuskie

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If I'm tre Williams I'm transferring with gach and gabe continuing to play over me...Williams isn't special but he needs a chance at this point
Word, the guy needs reps to be consistent. He needs to start cutting into Both's minutes big time
 

stocker08

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If I'm tre Williams I'm transferring with gach and gabe continuing to play over me...Williams isn't special but he needs a chance at this point

It really makes you wonder what is going on....with Gabe and Gach playing so poorly. Is Tre in the doghouse for something?
 

tmvander

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It really makes you wonder what is going on....with Gabe and Gach playing so poorly. Is Tre in the doghouse for something?
From what I've seen he's a better on ball defender than carr or mash...clearly on the same level scoring wise at least as gabe and can't be worse than gach
 

builtbadgers

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Have always praised the staff when it was earned and criticized for such poor foundational structure. Playing time is not one of them. He see's the team everyday and surely he puts players in that give them the best chance to win. After all he is measured by win and losses. If fans think he does not know who to play with and against then he must be truly terrible in their eyes. Players have to out play the other team on gameday. His job is to prepare.
 

MplsGopher

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Wasn't he one of Utah's best players? I realize the PAC is not the most amazing, but still a high major?
 

cjbfbp

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It really makes you wonder what is going on....with Gabe and Gach playing so poorly. Is Tre in the doghouse for something?

I don't get the obvious doghouse feeling with Williams yet that I got with some other players in Pitino's past but I could be wrong. Just doesn't seem as obvious as it did with some others.

It must be said that Williams has never really had a true breakout game so far in his career here. He's had only one double figure scoring game (10 points against Northwestern as a freshman). His Player Efficiency Rating this season is a lousy 9.5 (same as Gabe's) and was a lower 5.0 last year.

Two years ago with Washington, it was a little more obvious because Washington went multiple game stretches without playing at all and Washington might have been the best ball handler on a team that didn't have many good ball handlers. He was a good passer too.
 

cjbfbp

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Well, on this sub we have to at least say St. Thomas. But in all seriousness he looks like a summit league player

Sure. Heck, Greenlee is averaging 11.4 points/game (2nd on the team) with Florida Atlantic of Conference USA. Jamir Harris is averaging 13 pts and 6 assists per game with American University. They've played only two games though.
 

Breakin' The Plane

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I watched him early and marveled at how he did everything right. Shot, passed, played defense, rebounded, ran the floor. Now, he's average or worse in all those aspects.
 

AZGopher

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Yesterday Gach played some of the worst defense I have ever seen. His player continued to go right past him every time. He just looks total lost and disinterested.
 

bga1

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I watched him early and marveled at how he did everything right. Shot, passed, played defense, rebounded, ran the floor. Now, he's average or worse in all those aspects.
He essentially is a less basketball skills talented, Marcus Carr but with similar athletic skills. With Carr dribbling the mess out of the ball, you have to wonder if Gach who is also a dribbler and a basketball dependent player, just becomes disinterested because he is not getting the rock...
 

tmvander

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He essentially is a less basketball skills talented, Marcus Carr but with similar athletic skills. With Carr dribbling the mess out of the ball, you have to wonder if Gach who is also a dribbler and a basketball dependent player, just becomes disinterested because he is not getting the rock...
He needs an offense that requires passing and movement...1 on 1 and kick out won't be something that fits for him...he can't shoot at 45% From outside...get him some cuts to the hoop he can finish well there
 

Chico Gopher

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Word, the guy needs reps to be consistent. He needs to start cutting into Both's minutes big time
Is it possible that Tre is getting lots of reps in practice every week and not showing the consistency needed for me to trust that he's going to do the right things if I stick him in a game? In watching him this season, we've all seen that some games, he's OK, but other games, he's just not playing well on either side of the ball. I just know too many coaches in which that type of inconsistency doesn't give them confidence to trust what that player is going to provide in a game situation. For a lot of coaches, that is a huge factor on whether somebody gets game time or not.

There are a lot of good coaches that have the philosophy that what you do in practice determines whether you get used in a game. It's pretty rare when you see a coach get desperate enough to abandon all the lessons he might be trying to teach his team through practice/meetings and just decide to toss another mudball up on the wall to see if it sticks.

Obviously, I have not been to any Gopher practices, but I have been to plenty of other team practices over the years, and that is a pretty common requirement to earn playing time. At 11-5, are we really desperate enough to screw the "playing time" philosophy/requirements and start tossing mud against the wall and hoping?

I'm not giving up on Tre Williams yet. Sometimes it takes a couple of seasons for the light to come on.
 
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leib0039

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So a question for all those who think Pitino is the messiah. I have heard/read over and over on these boards "Both is great its just in his head" "Gabe is amazing, its just in his head". "Tre is great, its just a mental thing" Are these not the exact things a coach is supposed to help figure out? Obviously its a bit on the player sure, but is Pitino not supposed to coach them up so its not in their head? Or get them in comfortable areas so they can maximize what they do? Everyone seems to think these wing players we have have real basketball talent, is it not concerning that the coach seems to not get the best out of them?
 

Chico Gopher

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So a question for all those who think Pitino is the messiah. I have heard/read over and over on these boards "Both is great its just in his head" "Gabe is amazing, its just in his head". "Tre is great, its just a mental thing" Are these not the exact things a coach is supposed to help figure out? Obviously its a bit on the player sure, but is Pitino not supposed to coach them up so its not in their head? Or get them in comfortable areas so they can maximize what they do? Everyone seems to think these wing players we have have real basketball talent, is it not concerning that the coach seems to not get the best out of them?
That's a valid question. However, it's tough to put a timetable on breaking/developing habits or building confidence. Just speaking from personal experience, it happens when it happens for some people, no matter what other people might be trying to do in an effort to help you. In my head, doubt lingers a LOT longer than confidence does.
 

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Is it possible that Tre is getting lots of reps in practice every week and not showing the consistency needed for me to trust that he's going to do the right things if I stick him in a game? In watching him this season, we've all seen that some games, he's OK, but other games, he's just not playing well on either side of the ball. I just know too many coaches in which that type of inconsistency doesn't give them confidence to trust what that player is going to provide in a game situation. For a lot of coaches, that is a huge factor on whether somebody gets game time or not.

There are a lot of good coaches that have the philosophy that what you do in practice determines whether you get used in a game. It's pretty rare when you see a coach get desperate enough to abandon all the lessons he might be trying to teach his team through practice/meetings and just decide to toss another mudball up on the wall to see if it sticks.

Obviously, I have not been to any Gopher practices, but I have been to plenty of other team practices over the years, and that is a pretty common requirement to earn playing time. At 11-5, are we really desperate enough to screw the "playing time" philosophy/requirements and start tossing mud against the wall and hoping?

I'm not giving up on Tre Williams yet. Sometimes it takes a couple of seasons for the light to come on.
Tre looks like one of those players who doesn't show much until his senior year. If he sticks with the Gophers, I expect the above to happen.
 

cjbfbp

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So a question for all those who think Pitino is the messiah. I have heard/read over and over on these boards "Both is great its just in his head" "Gabe is amazing, its just in his head". "Tre is great, its just a mental thing" Are these not the exact things a coach is supposed to help figure out? Obviously its a bit on the player sure, but is Pitino not supposed to coach them up so its not in their head? Or get them in comfortable areas so they can maximize what they do? Everyone seems to think these wing players we have have real basketball talent, is it not concerning that the coach seems to not get the best out of them?

I do agree with most of what you've said. However, I can't believe there is anyone on this board who truly believes that Pitino is the messiah. I think at best people believe in sticking with him for one reason or another (at least for now).
 

tmvander

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Mashburn needs to start. Williams needs to play more.
See I think Williams should start a game and see how it goes. Either start him for Gach or Gabe. If we're playing a team like Illinois who has a stud guard maybe just have Gabe in for defense and expect that he'll clank 3s. Williams can then start over Gach.
 
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