All Things Trump Conflicts of Interest Thread

Section2

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Probably close to all of them, yes; and probably all of them less than our POTUS. And that's a big, big, big reason why the US government can get called a "swamp" by a man who is a swamp creature coming to expand the swamp.

In this case, the conflict of interest is reasonably clear. She either should not be in her position, or should not be creating conflicts of interest. But, she's part of The Swamp. Corrupt? Yes. Something gunna happen about it? No, especially not by THIS POTUS or THIS Congress.

TRIGGGGGEEERRRED
 

Section2

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Doing everything they can to decrease (ideally eliminate) smoking and consumption of tobacco would dramatically decrease the incidence of disease in this country. The elimination of all tobacco companies in the U.S. would be a huge feather in the cap of the CDC. Conversely, tobacco companies getting bigger and stronger, enjoying record profits, would greatly increase Dr. Fitzgerald's net worth - assuming that she's in a long position. I mean, it's basically textbook conflict of interest.

Yeah, see I have an issue with these goals. CDC should be focused pretty much entirely on communicable diseases. Impacting tobacco company stock at all should be nowhere near a capability of an unelected bureaucracy. Eliminating them? I mean, my god. That's crazy.
I doubt it would greatly increase her net worth. And what exactly can she do to help tobacco companies get bigger and stronger?
 

dpodoll68

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Yeah, see I have an issue with these goals. CDC should be focused pretty much entirely on communicable diseases. Impacting tobacco company stock at all should be nowhere near a capability of an unelected bureaucracy. Eliminating them? I mean, my god. That's crazy.
I doubt it would greatly increase her net worth. And what exactly can she do to help tobacco companies get bigger and stronger?

Well sure, if you want to make up what you feel their mission statement should be instead of focusing on what it actually is, and then judge the situation by what you feel it should be, there's really nothing to discuss. I'm discussing things as they actually are, not how you want them to be.
 

mplarson7

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Yeah, see I have an issue with these goals. CDC should be focused pretty much entirely on communicable diseases. Impacting tobacco company stock at all should be nowhere near a capability of an unelected bureaucracy. Eliminating them? I mean, my god. That's crazy.
I doubt it would greatly increase her net worth. And what exactly can she do to help tobacco companies get bigger and stronger?

So the Center for Disease Control should only focus on communicable disease, eh?

Tell me S2, what are the top 10 causes of death in the United States?
 

dpodoll68

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Yeah, see I have an issue with these goals. CDC should be focused pretty much entirely on communicable diseases. Impacting tobacco company stock at all should be nowhere near a capability of an unelected bureaucracy. Eliminating them? I mean, my god. That's crazy.
I doubt it would greatly increase her net worth. And what exactly can she do to help tobacco companies get bigger and stronger?

P.S. I wasn't actually suggesting that the CDC could or should have the goal of eliminating tobacco companies, merely using a rhetorical device (as you often do yourself) of taking things to their extreme to illustrate a point. The point being - lowered tobacco consumption is good for the CDC and bad for Dr. Fitzgerald's pocketbook - again assuming she's long.
 

justthefacts

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I'm shocked that a man and family of such self-proclaimed Christian faith would be involved in a scandal.

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Section2

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So the Center for Disease Control should only focus on communicable disease, eh?

Tell me S2, what are the top 10 causes of death in the United States?

Yes. Their job is to control the spread of disease. Not get people to stop eating donuts.
 

Section2

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Well sure, if you want to make up what you feel their mission statement should be instead of focusing on what it actually is, and then judge the situation by what you feel it should be, there's really nothing to discuss. I'm discussing things as they actually are, not how you want them to be.

I made a broad overall point. But also asked, what exactly can she do to help tobacco companies get bigger and stronger?
 

howeda7

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I made a broad overall point. But also asked, what exactly can she do to help tobacco companies get bigger and stronger?

She can hurt them more easily than help them. Still a conflict of interest.
 

Section2

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She can hurt them more easily than help them. Still a conflict of interest.

I agree with you that any official in that position should avoid doing anything that raises eyebrows. But I don't think having a financial manager buy some stock is really anything to get worked up about. Whatever, she resigned.
 

howeda7

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I agree with you that any official in that position should avoid doing anything that raises eyebrows. But I don't think having a financial manager buy some stock is really anything to get worked up about. Whatever, she resigned.

For about 100th time, posting about something on an obscure sports message board does not = "getting worked up" "being OUTRAGED!" etc.
 

Section2

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Poor diet is a massive factor in disease rates.

It is. It's not the CDCs job or anyone in government's job, to try to change individual diets. Frankly, the FDA and their bogus food pyramid, "healthy whole grains", anti "fat" campaign, etc, have probably played as much of a role in american poor diets as anything. Maybe they should stop trying to help. And I mean, I just checked out the CDC website, they are so far away from their needed mission, it's ridiculous.
Heart disease is a disease I guess. some people have poor genetics, and some people develop heart disease by their actions. There is no need for the CDC to be involved with heart disease.
 

mplarson7

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Yes. Their job is to control the spread of disease. Not get people to stop eating donuts.

Notice how it's the Center for Disease Control, and not the Center for Communicable Disease Control? Below is their mission statement for your perusal. Note ahead of time it is not in line with what you said:

CDC works 24/7 to protect America from health, safety and security threats, both foreign and in the U.S. Whether diseases start at home or abroad, are chronic or acute, curable or preventable, human error or deliberate attack, CDC fights disease and supports communities and citizens to do the same.

CDC increases the health security of our nation. As the nation’s health protection agency, CDC saves lives and protects people from health threats. To accomplish our mission, CDC conducts critical science and provides health information that protects our nation against expensive and dangerous health threats, and responds when these arise.


Nice question dodging, as per usual. Here they are for your convenience (per the CDC as of 2016):

1. Heart disease
2. Cancer
3. Chronic lower respiratory disease
4. Accidents
5. Stroke
6. Alzheimer's
7. Diabetes
8. Influenza and pneumonia
9. Kidney disease
10. Suicide

What do you know! Of the top 10, only one is communicable disease! Shocking. It's almost like the current health threats to our nation are non-communicable.
 

justthefacts

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Yes. Their job is to control the spread of disease. Not get people to stop eating donuts.

Wrong:

https://www.cdc.gov/maso/pdf/cdcmiss.pdf

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) serves as the national focus for
developing and applying disease prevention and control, environmental health, and health
promotion and health education activities designed to improve the health of the people of the
United States

https://www.federalregister.gov/agencies/centers-for-disease-control-and-prevention

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), as part of the Public Health Service, is charged with protecting the public health of the Nation by providing leadership and direction in the prevention of and control of diseases and other preventable conditions and responding to public health emergencies. Within the CDC, there are four coordinating centers, two coordinating offices, and the National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health.
 

howeda7

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Notice how it's the Center for Disease Control, and not the Center for Communicable Disease Control? Below is their mission statement for your perusal. Note ahead of time it is not in line with what you said:

CDC works 24/7 to protect America from health, safety and security threats, both foreign and in the U.S. Whether diseases start at home or abroad, are chronic or acute, curable or preventable, human error or deliberate attack, CDC fights disease and supports communities and citizens to do the same.

CDC increases the health security of our nation. As the nation’s health protection agency, CDC saves lives and protects people from health threats. To accomplish our mission, CDC conducts critical science and provides health information that protects our nation against expensive and dangerous health threats, and responds when these arise.


Nice question dodging, as per usual. Here they are for your convenience (per the CDC as of 2016):

1. Heart disease
2. Cancer
3. Chronic lower respiratory disease
4. Accidents
5. Stroke
6. Alzheimer's
7. Diabetes
8. Influenza and pneumonia
9. Kidney disease
10. Suicide

What do you know! Of the top 10, only one is communicable disease! Shocking. It's almost like the current health threats to our nation are non-communicable.

Yeah, well...the Founding Fathers (not including Hamilton) wouldn't have wanted their to be a CDC at all. But if they had, they would have wanted it narrowly focused, that is certain.
 

Section2

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Yeah, well...the Founding Fathers (not including Hamilton) wouldn't have wanted their to be a CDC at all. But if they had, they would have wanted it narrowly focused, that is certain.
I think a CDC would fit nicely in "promoting the general welfare". Pandemics and such seems like a worthwhile enterprise for government to try to prevent.
Global warming, transgender equality, etc, well now the CDC is just another swamp.
 

Section2

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Wrong:

https://www.cdc.gov/maso/pdf/cdcmiss.pdf

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) serves as the national focus for
developing and applying disease prevention and control, environmental health, and health
promotion and health education activities designed to improve the health of the people of the
United States

https://www.federalregister.gov/agencies/centers-for-disease-control-and-prevention

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), as part of the Public Health Service, is charged with protecting the public health of the Nation by providing leadership and direction in the prevention of and control of diseases and other preventable conditions and responding to public health emergencies. Within the CDC, there are four coordinating centers, two coordinating offices, and the National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health.

I'm aware that what I think they should do and what they actually do are different things.
 

Section2

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Notice how it's the Center for Disease Control, and not the Center for Communicable Disease Control? Below is their mission statement for your perusal. Note ahead of time it is not in line with what you said:

CDC works 24/7 to protect America from health, safety and security threats, both foreign and in the U.S. Whether diseases start at home or abroad, are chronic or acute, curable or preventable, human error or deliberate attack, CDC fights disease and supports communities and citizens to do the same.

CDC increases the health security of our nation. As the nation’s health protection agency, CDC saves lives and protects people from health threats. To accomplish our mission, CDC conducts critical science and provides health information that protects our nation against expensive and dangerous health threats, and responds when these arise.


Nice question dodging, as per usual. Here they are for your convenience (per the CDC as of 2016):

1. Heart disease
2. Cancer
3. Chronic lower respiratory disease
4. Accidents
5. Stroke
6. Alzheimer's
7. Diabetes
8. Influenza and pneumonia
9. Kidney disease
10. Suicide

What do you know! Of the top 10, only one is communicable disease! Shocking. It's almost like the current health threats to our nation are non-communicable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centers_for_Disease_Control_and_Prevention#History
"The Communicable Disease Center was founded July 1, 1946, as the successor to the World War II Malaria Control in War Areas program[4] of the Office of National Defense Malaria Control Activities"

I swear, I wasn't even aware of the name change. And it basically backs up my point. In the late 60s and 70s, it started becoming a left wing activist organization, and abandoned its prior role.

"Currently the CDC focus has broadened to include chronic diseases, disabilities, injury control, workplace hazards, environmental health threats, and terrorism preparedness. " No kidding. A government agency has broadened its focus. Who would have thought.
 

mplarson7

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centers_for_Disease_Control_and_Prevention#History
"The Communicable Disease Center was founded July 1, 1946, as the successor to the World War II Malaria Control in War Areas program[4] of the Office of National Defense Malaria Control Activities"

I swear, I wasn't even aware of the name change. And it basically backs up my point. In the late 60s and 70s, it started becoming a left wing activist organization, and abandoned its prior role.

"Currently the CDC focus has broadened to include chronic diseases, disabilities, injury control, workplace hazards, environmental health threats, and terrorism preparedness. " No kidding. A government agency has broadened its focus. Who would have thought.

Mmhmm.

Notice how it's not the Center for Communicable Disease Control? It's because with the improvements in medical care, sanitation, as well as improvements in vaccination coverage, communicable diseases are no longer the problem in our country.
 

howeda7

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I think a CDC would fit nicely in "promoting the general welfare". Pandemics and such seems like a worthwhile enterprise for government to try to prevent.
Global warming, transgender equality, etc, well now the CDC is just another swamp.

Ah, so it's OK for you to use "promoting the general welfare" as an excuse to create a government program but when someone else does it, it's socialism. Got it. Clear lines. Rock sold principles of granite.
 

Section2

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Ah, so it's OK for you to use "promoting the general welfare" as an excuse to create a government program but when someone else does it, it's socialism. Got it. Clear lines. Rock sold principles of granite.

I’m not using anything. Im fine with or without it. It’s the kind of thing I’m willing to compromise on. Which I guess I shouldn’t do according to you, because it violates principles for reasons
Not all government actions are socialism


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Section2

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Mmhmm.

Notice how it's not the Center for Communicable Disease Control? It's because with the improvements in medical care, sanitation, as well as improvements in vaccination coverage, communicable diseases are no longer the problem in our country.
Then we don’t need the agency at all. Not sure you are correct though doc. Little bit of a communicable disease problem happening as we speak.
Wait. Did you even read my post? Do you know the original name of the agency?


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howeda7

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I’m not using anything. Im fine with or without it. It’s the kind of thing I’m willing to compromise on. Which I guess I shouldn’t do according to you, because it violates principles for reasons
Not all government actions are socialism


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You can compromise, but you've gone to the mat over things far less intrusive than the CDC. I assume the EPA is OK too then?

It's good to know. Are all taxes still theft?
 

cncmin

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You can compromise, but you've gone to the mat over things far less intrusive than the CDC. I assume the EPA is OK too then?

Box. Oops. Stop being a bully to poor S2.
 

mplarson7

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Then we don’t need the agency at all. Not sure you are correct though doc. Little bit of a communicable disease problem happening as we speak.
Wait. Did you even read my post? Do you know the original name of the agency?


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1. Heart disease
2. Cancer
3. Chronic lower respiratory disease
4. Accidents
5. Stroke
6. Alzheimer's
7. Diabetes
8. Influenza and pneumonia
9. Kidney disease
10. Suicide

I am correct. Backed up by data. I also forgot to touch base on this when I posted this before; 1, 2, 3, and 5 are all associated with smoking, since you were discussing tobacco companies before.

What is the name of the agency today, S2? In case you hadn't noticed, it isn't 1946.
 

Section2

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You can compromise, but you've gone to the mat over things far less intrusive than the CDC. I assume the EPA is OK too then?

It's good to know. Are all taxes still theft?

The fact that the CDC and EPA and every govt agency grow far beyond their original purpose is the point. The reason I argue principle and not compromise generally is because it seems that this growth is a result of compromise. Maybe you need hard stops and strict limits or what you get is overgrowth. It’s a lot easier to grow government than shrink it.


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Section2

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1. Heart disease
2. Cancer
3. Chronic lower respiratory disease
4. Accidents
5. Stroke
6. Alzheimer's
7. Diabetes
8. Influenza and pneumonia
9. Kidney disease
10. Suicide

I am correct. Backed up by data. I also forgot to touch base on this when I posted this before; 1, 2, 3, and 5 are all associated with smoking, since you were discussing tobacco companies before.

What is the name of the agency today, S2? In case you hadn't noticed, it isn't 1946.

I see. So the CDC changed from communicable to everything in the 70s. Kindly pull some stats for me on how well they have controlled heart disease and cancer and diabetes since their evolution? Have the rates of ANY of your top 10 declines in that span?


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mplarson7

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I see. So the CDC changed from communicable to everything in the 70s. Kindly pull some stats for me on how well they have controlled heart disease and cancer and diabetes since their evolution? Have the rates of ANY of your top 10 declines in that span?


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Why? This information is not relevant to the discussion and won't change the fact that you were wrong.
 

Section2

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Why? This information is not relevant to the discussion and won't change the fact that you were wrong.

Wrong about what? I have an opinion on what the agency should do.
It is relevant. As a supporter you need to defend the results. And of course you can’t


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