All Things Chet Holmgren Recruitment Thread (Class of 2021, Gophers Have Offered)

builtbadgers

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I have pulled the data and listed it all for you on a couple of occasions. I am not going to waste a couple of hours again and then have you ignore it and put your own spin on it.

The Zags have finally made a jump the last 2-3 years, but before that they did not have a good record against the P5 opponents and have counted on tromping a weak conference to get the automatic bid. Look it up yourself.
You never posted the data against power 6 teams. Their record this century against the power 6 is 121-62 for a winning % of 66%. Ours is 146 wins against 212 losses for a winning % of 40%. And for the vast majority of those they did not get games against the sludge at the bottom of those conferences. In fact they crush it when going against ranked teams. Their story is awesome. To do it, to become a national brand in the middle of nowhere is remarkable. Look at their record against the power 6, incredible. Damn they schedule a incredibly difficult schedule. Gonzaga is a very respectable 47-50 this century against ranked teams, we are 39-112 over that time.
 
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alchemy2u

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You never posted the data against power 6 teams. Their record this century against the power 6 is 121-62 for a winning % of 66%. Ours is 146 wins against 212 losses for a winning % of 40%. And for the vast majority of those they did not get games against the sludge at the bottom of those conferences. In fact they crush it when going against ranked teams. Their story is awesome. To do it, to become a national brand in the middle of nowhere is remarkable. Look at their record against the power 6, incredible. Damn they schedule a incredibly difficult schedule. Gonzaga is a very respectable 47-50 this century against ranked teams, we are 39-112 over that time.
So, you made me go back and look it up. There have been many threads where we have gone over how overrated Gonzaga is. One in particular was the Geno Crandall thread from 2018. You can go back and read the whole exchange, but here is one post I had:
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and here is one of your replies in the Suggs thread:
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builtbadgers

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Did not make you look it up. I took every game against every ranked team over 20 years for 47-50. Your ignoring the incredible record they racked up against power 6 teams. You intentionally left out the last two years where they beat #1 Duke, number 10, 11, 15, 22 and 23. Compare it to other top 10 programs and it stacks up really well. It blows us away by any measure and that power 6 record is awesome. That is to your claim that they would not measure up in a power conference , like us. Simply not true. They are a national brand of significance with a coach universally recognized as a great coach. You can not piddle around at less than 15 % winning % against ranked teams and think we are relevant on any level. When you travel to other basketball communities they are recugnized as a national brand. Think what you want. Each fan can look at all the data and decide for themselves if winning a higher % of power 6 games than nearly every program. Coaches, the national media and fans and recruits are talking Gonzaga.
 
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alchemy2u

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Did not make you look it up. I took every game against every ranked team over 20 years for 47-50. Your ignoring the incredible record they racked up against power 6 teams. You intentionally left out the last two years where they beat #1 Duke, number 10, 11, 15, 22 and 23. Compare it to other top 10 programs and it stacks up really well. It blows us away by any measure and that power 6 record is awesome. That is to your claim that they would not measure up in a power conference , like us. Simply not true. They are a national brand of significance with a coach universally recognized as a great coach. You can not piddle around at less than 15 % winning % against ranked teams and think we are relevant on any level. When you travel to other basketball communities they are recugnized as a national brand. Think what you want. Each fan can look at all the data and decide for themselves if winning a higher % of power 6 games than nearly every program. Coaches, the national media and fans and recruits are talking Gonzaga.
The comparison was 2 years ago! I couldn’t leave out games that had not yet been played! I claimed that Gonzaga was overrated, you said that I never listed P5 competition and obviously I did. But like I said, it would not be worth the effort to go back and prove it because you just would ignore it.

I also posted that Gonzaga has been a much better teams these last two years in another thread. They have been living up to the hype recently.

And why do you continue to bring the U into the conversation, it has nothing to do with them? Is it just another opportunity to criticize our team?

Sorry to others for the thread drift. I tried to deflect the questions, but when someone attacks my credibility I have to respond. We all have our own opinions, but at least we can try to base them on the details of the facts.
 

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The comparison was 2 years ago! I couldn’t leave out games that had not yet been played! I claimed that Gonzaga was overrated, you said that I never listed P5 competition and obviously I did. But like I said, it would not be worth the effort to go back and prove it because you just would ignore it.

I also posted that Gonzaga has been a much better teams these last two years in another thread. They have been living up to the hype recently.

And why do you continue to bring the U into the conversation, it has nothing to do with them? Is it just another opportunity to criticize our team?

Sorry to others for the thread drift. I tried to deflect the questions, but when someone attacks my credibility I have to respond. We all have our own opinions, but at least we can try to base them on the details of the facts.
Built loves taking potshots at our team in completely unrelated posts. I have yet to figure out WHY he rips our program at every opportunity... maybe he's only here because the Virginia basketball forum isn't active?
 

builtbadgers

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The comparison was 2 years ago! I couldn’t leave out games that had not yet been played! I claimed that Gonzaga was overrated, you said that I never listed P5 competition and obviously I did. But like I said, it would not be worth the effort to go back and prove it because you just would ignore it.

I also posted that Gonzaga has been a much better teams these last two years in another thread. They have been living up to the hype recently.

And why do you continue to bring the U into the conversation, it has nothing to do with them? Is it just another opportunity to criticize our team?

Sorry to others for the thread drift. I tried to deflect the questions, but when someone attacks my credibility I have to respond. We all have our own opinions, but at least we can try to base them on the details of the facts.
I include all data this century and it was a way to reflect that Gonzaga was a national brand as it relates to Chet Holmgren. You left out a decade that included a 10-1 season against power 6 conference teams to debunk a long time ago that they would not be mediocre in the Big 10. Hell being even .500 gets you in the tourney. They play above .500 against power 6 teams on a national achedule and recruits like Suggs and Chet are shown this.
 

builtbadgers

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Built loves taking potshots at our team in completely unrelated posts. I have yet to figure out WHY he rips our program at every opportunity... maybe he's only here because the Virginia basketball forum isn't active?
The GOPHERS are the team i cheer for . Not taking potshots by stating facts. Do not read it if you do not like it. There are plenty of people on here that i have a healthy exchange with both in agreement and disagreement. I simply do not look at things through a local bias of what i want to be and focus on what is.
 

Parcival

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The GOPHERS are the team i cheer for . Not taking potshots by stating facts. Do not read it if you do not like it. There are plenty of people on here that i have a healthy exchange with both in agreement and disagreement. I simply do not look at things through a local bias of what i want to be and focus on what is.
Taking potshots at our program and stating facts about our program are not mutually exclusive. Alchemy was talking about GONZAGA's success and you immediately compared it to the U... why? Literally nobody here has argued that we wouldn't love to have their success. And apparently me calling you out on doing this BS means I'm having an "unhealthy exchange" and I should have to avoid doing so?
 

builtbadgers

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Taking potshots at our program and stating facts about our program are not mutually exclusive. Alchemy was talking about GONZAGA's success and you immediately compared it to the U... why? Literally nobody here has argued that we wouldn't love to have their success. And apparently me calling you out on doing this BS means I'm having an "unhealthy exchange" and I should have to avoid doing so?
You have your points. Go back further in the thread where i am asked who these national brands are, Skyman gets on Alchemy for leaving out Gonzaga who for a whole generation has been excellent. Recruits notice. Not a big deal but if someone had a chance to go here or there and his priority was staying here, by all means he should pick here. If he was looking to play for a better coach and a better program, a national brand then he should go there. It is just reality that we have been mediocre and are not a player nationally. Very few people outside of Minnesota talk Minnesota basketball. People everywhere i go talk Gonzaga. Ripping Minnesota would be giving my opinion. I am giving facts and facts matter to a ton of recruits.
 

Parcival

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You have your points. Go back further in the thread where i am asked who these national brands are, Skyman gets on Alchemy for leaving out Gonzaga who for a whole generation has been excellent. Recruits notice. Not a big deal but if someone had a chance to go here or there and his priority was staying here, by all means he should pick here. If he was looking to play for a better coach and a better program, a national brand then he should go there. It is just reality that we have been mediocre and are not a player nationally. Very few people outside of Minnesota talk Minnesota basketball. People everywhere i go talk Gonzaga. Ripping Minnesota would be giving my opinion. I am giving facts and facts matter to a ton of recruits.
Fair enough. I wasn't looking that far back in the thread - but again, I have never disputed Gonzaga's success. I think staying home and making us a potentially great team also has its merits but we will see what Chet values.

On a side note, Chet definitely fits the mold of guys that Gonzaga has recruited as of late - Tillie, Collins, Sabonis... it will be tough to beat them out.
 

Spaulding!No!

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We chose Monson! We were sO close to better basketball and we chose Monson.
 

builtbadgers

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Fair enough. I wasn't looking that far back in the thread - but again, I have never disputed Gonzaga's success. I think staying home and making us a potentially great team also has its merits but we will see what Chet values.

On a side note, Chet definitely fits the mold of guys that Gonzaga has recruited as of late - Tillie, Collins, Sabonis... it will be tough to beat them out.
Make no mistake, i want him to stay home but support his success wherever he goes . I have zero doubt that he is serious about considering coming here.
 

alchemy2u

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I include all data this century and it was a way to reflect that Gonzaga was a national brand as it relates to Chet Holmgren. You left out a decade that included a 10-1 season against power 6 conference teams to debunk a long time ago that they would not be mediocre in the Big 10. Hell being even .500 gets you in the tourney. They play above .500 against power 6 teams on a national achedule and recruits like Suggs and Chet are shown this.
I included all of the recent history (remember that it was complied two years ago). Why would I included data going back a century? Obviously, the Gonzaga coach thought Minnesota was a better program when he left them for us. Why would I go back into those days.

As I posted above, even YOU would pick Minnesota over Gonzaga “not even close”.... It is your words!
 

builtbadgers

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I included all of the recent history (remember that it was complied two years ago). Why would I included data going back a century? Obviously, the Gonzaga coach thought Minnesota was a better program when he left them for us. Why would I go back into those days.

As I posted above, even YOU would pick Minnesota over Gonzaga “not even close”.... It is your words!
I did not go back a century. i went to the start of this one. That starts with Mark Few, a far better coach than Monson. Any 5 or 10 year period you pick this century they have a better winning % by far than we do against power 6 teams. They are nationally relevant. We are not. I prefer Minnesota because i would be near family, i like a large public school and campus in a big city, a larger arena, the facilities, the Carlson school, the conference. But the vast amount of recruits will have different reasons than i do. They want to play for a winner. All things for me point to playing here but of course it would be contingent on who the coach was. I would pick the school but i would not pick to play for a coach who won less than 40 % of his conference games and less than 20 % of his games against ranked teams , with the best finish being 4th place over 7 years. Hope Chet will.
 

gophereric30

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I did not go back a century. i went to the start of this one. That starts with Mark Few, a far better coach than Monson. Any 5 or 10 year period you pick this century they have a better winning % by far than we do against power 6 teams. They are nationally relevant. We are not. I prefer Minnesota because i would be near family, i like a large public school and campus in a big city, a larger arena, the facilities, the Carlson school, the conference. But the vast amount of recruits will have different reasons than i do. They want to play for a winner. All things for me point to playing here but of course it would be contingent on who the coach was. I would pick the school but i would not pick to play for a coach who won less than 40 % of his conference games and less than 20 % of his games against ranked teams , with the best finish being 4th place over 7 years. Hope Chet will.
I do think Gonzaga a top 15 program, but if it's up to me I want to play in big ten and be challenged every game. That's just me though!
 

builtbadgers

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I do think Gonzaga a top 15 program, but if it's up to me I want to play in big ten and be challenged every game. That's just me though!
And i completely understand. Each kid is different and has several factors in play.
 

builtbadgers

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I'd imagine Chet and Suggs have more to lose playing in the B1G then to gain. If they truly are one and done's they're less likely to get exposed playing in the WCC
Guys like Suggs and Chet seek out testing their games. They both already played against guys that are better than what the Big 10 or any conference offers. The conference is not loading up on the top end players.
 

builtbadgers

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I'd imagine Chet and Suggs have more to lose playing in the B1G then to gain. If they truly are one and done's they're less likely to get exposed playing in the WCC
Guys like Suggs and Chet seek out testing their games. There is not a player in the Big 10 they would fear.
 

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Guys like Suggs and Chet seek out testing their games. There is not a player in the Big 10 they would fear.
Suggs more than Chet imo. Chet has all the potential in the world but he's skeleton thin which could present problems in the B1G. Hopefully, he gets some good trainers around him to add at least a little size ASAP. Kids definitely a competitor though.
 

GopherBlood666

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Guys like Suggs and Chet seek out testing their games. They both already played against guys that are better than what the Big 10 or any conference offers. The conference is not loading up on the top end players.
Really? Who? That is quite a statement. Have they played in a series of pro-am tournaments?
 

builtbadgers

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Really? Who? That is quite a statement. Have they played in a series of pro-am tournaments?
They have already played against NBA guys, they have gone against the guys at USA basketball. They are not afraid of being exposed by playing in the Big 10.
 

alchemy2u

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Guys like Suggs and Chet seek out testing their games. They both already played against guys that are better than what the Big 10 or any conference offers. The conference is not loading up on the top end players.
Really? So now you are claiming that AAU basketball or Minnesota 2A basketball is better than College basketball? That is all Chet has ever played (outside of camps).
 

alchemy2u

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They have already played against NBA guys, they have gone against the guys at USA basketball. They are not afraid of being exposed by playing in the Big 10.
Just put down the shovel. It is not hard to admit you made an over statement....
 
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