Realistic expectations for 2023-24?

[SelectionSunday]

Well...I do think that Shrewsbury would like to start Payne at PSU.

I’m pretty sure Izzo would love to have Payne, as well. MSU usually has a bruising big guy, but that’s one thing they lack this season. But Izzo is pretty loyal to his vets (to a fault sometimes), so he’d probably still be starting Sissoko.

 

[cjbfbp]

I don't disagree with your post here. The line you quoted was largely a throwaway line by me that I probably shouldn't have written.. Expectations of a third year coach are not the same as those of an 8th year coach and frankly results aren't linear year over year. Pitino wasn't fired due to the number of wins he had in year eight. It was a cumulative feeling he had taken this program as far as he would be able to. His dismissal was overwhelmingly supported on this board.

Rationally.....I understand Ben Johnson deserves more time to prove his coaching chops and allow his recruits to get more experience. I don't agree with those on this board that are calling for a change already. The university would never make a change at this point regardless, barring a serious scandal. We will get to see year three and likely year four of the Ben Johnson regime.

Emotionally.....I'm still bothered the university went this route. I look at the resumes of all the conference coaches and I don't see anybody comparable to Ben Johnson. Shrewsberry would be the best comp but he sat on the bench of a hall of fame coach which I believe accounts for something. This is a complete lottery ticket. That doesn't mean it can't or won't work but early returns haven't been all that promising. I know there isn't anything we can do about that so why not enjoy the ride, I suppose. But I don't blame others for feeling frustrated.

I agree with pretty much everything you've said although, if he has another terrible year next season and isn't fired, I'll probably be angry myself.

I'd like to address my view of the bolded sentences. I'll be as polite as I can be about this hire and simply state that the hire "was not what the doctor ordered at that particular point in time." I believe this hire was indicative of not caring a whole lot about the success of basketball. I believe this university has relatively shallow pockets for its premier athletic league stature so they prioritize their spending. They want to be successful in something so they are prioritizing football and hockey (which also provides significant in-state competition) for their investments but they're willing to let a number of other sports just tread water. Even if the basketball team stinks, the program still shares in the TV revenue. If nothing else, Ben costs less than a coach of stature would have.

 

[GopherBlood777]

I agree with pretty much everything you've said although, if he has another terrible year next season and isn't fired, I'll probably be angry myself.

I'd like to address my view of the bolded sentences. I'll be as polite as I can be about this hire and simply state that the hire "was not what the doctor ordered at that particular point in time." I believe this hire was indicative of not caring a whole lot about the success of basketball. I believe this university has relatively shallow pockets for its premier athletic league stature so they prioritize their spending. They want to be successful in something so they are prioritizing football and hockey (which also provides significant in-state competition) for their investments but they're willing to let a number of other sports just tread water. Even if the basketball team stinks, the program still shares in the TV revenue. If nothing else, Ben costs less than a coach of stature would have.

Pretty much. This hire was made by the president and her search committee because it felt good, not because it was best for the program. As stated ad nauseum, there are many coaches with better qualifications who would be willing to strap up at the U for $2 million/year. Even if we have shallow pockets, we didn't effectively utilize the funds we did have to offer at that time. Of course, this is all wrong if Ben somehow becomes that lottery ticket and is competing for conference titles. We fired Pitino for being a middle of the pack to worse coach in the B1G. The idea with hiring a new coach should have been to compete at the top, not leave us buried at the bottom.

 

[bga1]

I agree with pretty much everything you've said although, if he has another terrible year next season and isn't fired, I'll probably be angry myself.

I'd like to address my view of the bolded sentences. I'll be as polite as I can be about this hire and simply state that the hire "was not what the doctor ordered at that particular point in time." I believe this hire was indicative of not caring a whole lot about the success of basketball. I believe this university has relatively shallow pockets for its premier athletic league stature so they prioritize their spending. They want to be successful in something so they are prioritizing football and hockey (which also provides significant in-state competition) for their investments but they're willing to let a number of other sports just tread water. Even if the basketball team stinks, the program still shares in the TV revenue. If nothing else, Ben costs less than a coach of stature would have.

The true cost of Ben- appears to be quite high right now...when one adds in the present and future loss of ticket revenue. If they become relevant at some point next year, ticket sales are going to rebound on a game by game basis but season tickets are going to take a serious hit.

 

[cjbfbp]

This hire was made by the president and her search committee because it felt good, not because it was best for the program.

Well, I suspect the pressure was a little more subtle than that but that reasoning was probably the main difference between who we hired and some other cheap hire. I guess it's fair to say that we could have gotten a mid-major coach with some track record for what we were paying but the expectations usually are higher at this level (although that's not completely clear from our recent history).

My main point in the prior post was that if the university really cared about the success of the sport, they would have aimed higher. Look at Nebraska in football. They hired a hometown hero with some record of significant accomplishment (although not a particularly long one), fired him and paid an estimated $15 million payout, then gave a bigger name coach a very hefty contract. Nebraska may not be very successful in football recently but there can be no doubt that they care and they'll keep trying.

 

[Bad Gopher]

The bare minimum is an NCAA tourney berth and that only guarantees a 4th season. That would put his conference record at somewhere beween 14-46 and and 17-43 depending on how this season finishes out and how weak the bubble is next year. On the high end, that's a 28% conference winning percentage through 3 seasons...

Objectively this might make sense. Realistically it doesn't. Don't get me wrong: I love the idea of competing for a tourney berth, but personally I just hope they can get out of last place and have a legitimate shot to win a game on Weakling Wednesday. And yes, I mean hope, not expect.

 

[EasyThere Pilgrim]

They hired a hometown hero with some record of significant accomplishment (although not a particularly long one), fired him and paid an estimated $15 million payout, then gave a bigger name coach a very hefty contract. Nebraska may not be very successful in football recently but there can be no doubt that they care and they'll keep trying.

Nebraska's AD Trev Alberts and Frost are friends...I'm pretty sure they split that $8M+ they got by not waiting another month to fire him.

Even the U of Minnesota gave Maturi an extra $800K to be a 'consultant' for 6 months after he retired. That was probably split with whoever gave it to him.

 

[Wet_Blanket_Guy]

I’m pretty sure Izzo would love to have Payne, as well. MSU usually has a bruising big guy, but that’s one thing they lack this season. But Izzo is pretty loyal to his vets (to a fault sometimes), so he’d probably still be starting Sissoko.

Sissoko is a good defender, Payne is a foul machine.

 

[SelectionSunday]

Sissoko is a good defender, Payne is a foul machine.

I can’t argue that.

 

[Ewert86PC]

You are quite mistaken. Ninety-eight years of season tickets brought 26 years of pure enjoyment for me, my family, and friends. Were you ever in the Barn when Muss brought the show and when Clem and Dutch coached some of the best players in the land?

Im not saying those were bad years, but we haven't had anything close to that in twenty-five years. I love the Barn, but we need a vibrant home court in a building with modern accommodations.

My father-in-law is a Hawkeye fan and many of my in-laws are Cornhusker fans. The shame and embarrassment so many athletic teams create is intolerable. It's both on and off the court. If we had winning big money programs, then it might be tolerable. We don't even have departments with high academic standards anymore, despite the political talking points used by the administration and alumni association.

This is not the glorious days of Golden Gophers achievements from my parents' day (late 1940s and early 1950s). It's not even the Golden 1960s. We've hired administrators and staff that encouraged fiddling while Rome burned ever since. This forty-plus years of decline needs to stop. That is the death by a thousand cuts which mediocrity invites to happen. That is what has infected the University of Minnesota communities. Its not even a matter of where to start, just pick one and start insisting on meeting team and department standards. Make the thing you do be done at a higher level. Sports teams play to win. Academic studies are done at levels to gain notice in the field of study. Make the University of Minnesota a place which people would be proud to be associated, because it's not right now, in and outside of the school.