Kentucky

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Gold Rush said:
OK, if you want to compare Minnesota hockey to Kentucky basketball, fine we can go there. I would say Minnesota hockey fans are just as passionate as Kentucky basketball fans....and I would say every team we play is gunning for us every time we play just like you do.
The Gophers were upset by Holy Cross (HUGE upset) in the NCAA's, they have struggled quite a bit the last couple years and were just swept last weekend by Mankato St.

You know what??? I don't see people putting up for sale signs or throwing garbage on Don Lucia's (Gopher hockey coach) lawn or spewing their venom after every loss and demanding that he be fired immediately. We know it's a long season and a lot can happen and we need to stand together when the going gets tough.

Our hockey team might be down a bit right now but you know -- we will be back very soon. You can count on it!!
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Dan Lucia also has two national championships (back to back titles as I recall) and three Frozen Fours (to go along with his countless conference titles) these past 10 seasons. If he only had one championship (coming in his first season in 99) and a lot of heartbreaking losses and a downgrade in performance and recruiting would their not be some fan unrest?

Not going to excuse individuals behavior though. Loss of civility in American society is something that is a national problem and not contained to the sporting world.
 

Not trying to make excuses for our hockey success, but 75% of the best collegiate hockey players come from MN.

Further, it's much easier for a program to dominate in D1 hockey than it is D1 basketball (58 D1 hockey teams vs 327 D1 basketball teams), not to mention the funding differences that schools give to their basketball programs vs their hockey programs nationwide.
 

ShowinGoldyLove said:
Do you seriously compare yourself to those schools every season as a measuring stick? Word of advice; you are going to have down years where you don't win as many games as some of the powerhouse schools. Get used to it. They are also going to have down years where they don't win as many games as others.

It's the reality of the collegiate game; the days of a handful of teams going to the Final Four 2, 3, 4 years in a row are simply over. So much more talent out there than there was 30 years ago, and a lot more parity to go with it.
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But 9 straight years is a lot in terms of the elite level. The 80's and the 60's were the "worst" decades in terms of national performance of Kentucky basketball but both at least featured 1 Final Four appearance.

In the 9 seasons following our national title we lost in the regional final three of those (which wasn't bad. Those were two good teams that couldn't get over the hump [thanks Izzo!] and one great team that got outplayed and outcoached and had it's best player hobbled by a bum ankle [thanks Kirk Penny!]] but in others we had multiple double digit loss seasons, some really bad performances in the tourney and Coach Smith was having problems attracting higher profile recruits. I wouldn't even say he was having problems with attracting higher profile recruits. He was having problems attracting consistent talent. We have a one man senior class this year. A kid who never panned out. I don't care who you are...you can't have a one man senior class consisting of a kid that doesn't play. It's going to hurt you.

Like I said, UCLA got rid of Lavin despite him having some success (and not as much as Tubby @ UK) because they saw their program slipping. Were they wrong. Is Kentucky some sort of special case here?
 

ShowinGoldyLove said:
Not trying to make excuses for our hockey success, but 75% of the best collegiate hockey players come from MN.

Further, it's much easier for a program to dominate in D1 hockey than it is D1 basketball (58 D1 hockey teams vs 327 D1 basketball teams), not to mention the funding differences that schools give to their basketball programs vs their hockey programs nationwide.
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You should never make excuses.

I'm not talking about domination. The era of domination by one program is over. It ended when John Wooden retired. The closest anyone's come since is probably Duke or Kentucky in the mid 90's.

You are measured by your peers to an extent. UCLA went through a rough spot but they rebounded with Ben Howland. North Carolina went through a rough spot but they rebounded with Roy Williams. Kentucky went through a rough period but rebounded with Coach Pitino I think it says something about the Kentucky program (and Coach Smith to an extent) that it's "rough period" wasn't as bad as Carolina's with Doh or IU's with Mike Davis/Kelvin Sampson but the slide itself was apparent.

I would have been the happiest person on the planet if Coach Smith could have returned us that status. Not the status of playing for three straight titles (and winning two) but the status where we didn't have to question were our place was with our peers.
 



The Truth said:
I agree totally with what you're saying here but I ask you to realize that we slipped under Coach Smith's watch. Coach Smith did a lot of good things-he won a national title, he won SEC championship, he won SEC tournament titles but things slipped. Our "peers" are North Carolina, UCLA, Kansas and IU in this sport. IU got into a similar situtation (not as bad. Tubby could coach circles around Mike Davis in his sleep) as us and made some really bad mistakes in terms of coaching hires. North Carolina and UCLA did as well but corrected those mistakes.

Would you put UK in the same class as UCLA and North Carolina Coach Smith's last three seasons?
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Slipped from Pitino in the mid 1990's? Who wouldn't? Even Pitino has slipped from that level.

UK averages 76% all-time - Tubby won 76% at UK.

UK averages 69% in NCAA games - Tubby won 72% of NCAA games at UK.

UK averages 1 NC every 10 years - Tubby won 1 NC in 10 years.

UK averages 1 SEC and 1 SECT every 2 years - Tubby won 5 SEC and 5 SECT in 10 years (1 / 2).

UK averages 6 Sweet 16 every 10 years - Tubby made 6 Sweet 16 in 10 years.

Rupp/Hall/Sutton/Pitino (combined) averaged 24 W at UK - Tubby averaged 26 W at UK.

Slipped from what?
 

The Truth said:
You should never make excuses.

I'm not talking about domination. The era of domination by one program is over. It ended when John Wooden retired. The closest anyone's come since is probably Duke or Kentucky in the mid 90's.

You are measured by your peers to an extent. UCLA went through a rough spot but they rebounded with Ben Howland. North Carolina went through a rough spot but they rebounded with Roy Williams. Kentucky went through a rough period but rebounded with Coach Pitino I think it says something about the Kentucky program (and Coach Smith to an extent) that it's "rough period" wasn't as bad as Carolina's with Doh or IU's with Mike Davis/Kelvin Sampson but the slide itself was apparent.

I would have been the happiest person on the planet if Coach Smith could have returned us that status. Not the status of playing for three straight titles (and winning two) but the status where we didn't have to question were our place was with our peers.
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In the 10 years under Tubby Smith, UK outperformed (W-L record) North Carolina, UCLA, and IU. Not Duke (although Tubby is the only UK coach to beat them in the past 30 years) though. And about the same as Kansas (in those 10 years).

UK was Top 5 in Most W, Best W-L (%) Record, Most W in NCAA games, and Best W-L (%) in NCAA games in the 10 year period from 1998 through 2007 compared to all Div I basketball teams.
 

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