Doogie article - New 7/27

[Bayfieldgopher]

Maturi is, well, Joel Maturi and even so I can't imagine him seriously accepting Brewsters alleged promise of a Rose Bowl in year four. If anyone, he should know how difficult Brewster's challenge is considering the past 45 or so years of Gopher football. Mason even acknowledged that he was rebuilding after 10 seasons which is what Brewster inherited!!

The advertised goal is to make the Gophers more competitive, improve recruiting and improve PR across the state. I doubt many signed on when Brewster oft mention the Rose Bowl. Likely a lot of rolling of the eyes and clearing of the throat rather than an emphatic YES!!!

Rose Bowl in 4 years? Yeh right. I can't believe you would even mention that. So I would rather we all put that comment in the smurf bag, throw it in the corner and move on to more realistic goals.

 

[Hates Monikers]

Doogie, your first sentence is a sterotype. Sure there are dyehard fans, but if you look closer you see the 30 year olds and younger. I am amazed at the number of female fans, in that 20-35 year old market segment that every advertiser craves. I see families, young kids. They are all invested with gopher gear, face paint, and a voice. To say they don't think about Gopher Football again until the next game, is an assumption the media in general makes. The idea that no one is interested in Gopher Football, is false. What the media favors is covering a winner. I noticed your list did not include the Wolves.

That being said, Gopher Nation has been ridiculed, and cut short on air. When a host says we are going to be spending time on Gopher Football its an invitation the experienced fan doesn't accept. The callers that do call bash the coach, the team, and the program in general and the host is all to happy to take the calls and cut the segment short. In the paper, they had a beat writer who was on vacation more than he was covering the program. The Gopher Football Program is a 12 month gig. He took it as a 3 month deal. He couldn't blog, tweet, or even submit a column inch about recruiting, a Coach's interview, or any insight into the roster. Hopefully Phil Miller will be more visible.

The thing the media needs to realize is there is a Loyal 35,000. These are avid fans, who take their time, and energy where they can get the information they want. They spend money not only for the information, but also with the advertisers. Be it rivals, scout, the gopherhole, leming, fringeteam blog et al. The day of the startribune, or wcco being the Home of The Gophers is over. The information sources have gone underground. It something they didn't either have the time or interest in doing.

And the dirty little secret is never brought up on radio, in the paper, or tv. The gig with the pro team is better on so many levels. From the buffet, player access, to payments for coverage.
It would seem never it is said a discouraging word and the skies are not cloudy all day when it comes to covering the Twins, Vikes, and Wild.

The fact ESPN 1500 and KSTP has thrown a bone on line, and on TV is an opening offer to Gopher Fans. More is better, I am waiting for the promised interview with either Coach Horton, or Coach Davis. Further proof that I look for coverage, think about the Gophers when they havent play a game in 6 months.

I was going to post something very similar on these issues. While I have been a BB season ticket holder for about 17 years, I didn't start going to football games regularly until about five years ago. I was shocked to see so many young people and families there, because all I had heard in the media is that these are 70-year-old, sweater-wearing alums from the 1940s. I have season tickets now, and when I take friends to games they have a blast. They are surprised that it's so much fun.

As for the media, MV has been metnioned in several posts, and I think he's a great example of what people would like to see. Sure he's a homer, and we don't need a homer. But it's clear that he likes the team and, more importantly, he assumes his readers like the team. He's trying to provide information that fans would like to see. The Reusses, Barrieros and Souhans treat the readers as if they know everybody dislikes the team. They make fun of the team and their fans. But if someone dislikes the Gophers, they wouldn't bother reading the columns, would they? Just treat us with some respect. Treat us like we're trying to learn something.

 

[Unregistered User]

I can promise you regular, informed talk on 1500-ESPN...

O.K. here is the latest part of my ranting.

I tuned into 1500 to listen to the Twin's game, and however was doing the pre-game show had Tom Pelissero, who was, of course talking about the Vikings. And he, along with the host, were lauding the depth of the coverage, new website gadgets, etc, etc, etc. Non stop joy, and talking about how excited everyone was that camp was starting soon.

So, before they hand it off for the first pitch, the host (sorry I don't know who it is) says that he should pass along a nugget about the Gophers. It was that the Texas games are cancelled.

So, as he begins reading the statement from Brewster about the cancellation, Pelissero starts with some @sshole mocking tone "oh...they're afraid to play us", and when the statement read "...we had an agreement in priciple" Pelissero chimes in with "how did Brewster spell principle". And finally throws in a "does anyone really believe that Brewster will be the coach in 2015 or 2016?".

What a f^cking c0ck-jockey. Does this a-hole understand how insulting that is to a listener, like me, who has lived his whole life in Minnesota, chooses to live in Minnesota, attended the U, and has been going to games longer than he's been alive?

I hope he catches crabs at Mettlers.

This crap will continue if we don't tell them how we feel. So I'm starting with [email protected]

 

[Doogie]

Would you say that stuff about Tom if you saw him in person?

 

[GoAUpher]

Would you say that stuff about Tom if you saw him in person?

Would Tom mock someone that way if he was in their presence? It cuts both ways.

 

[Unregistered User]

Would you say that stuff about Tom if you saw him in person?

Well...I sent him an e-mail from my outlook which has my corporate e-mail addy, so yeah...he knows whoI am, where I work, and can get in touch with me if he wants to.

 

[josh087]

This is the problem for the Gophers, and one that I don't know will ever go away. To those of us who are actually fans of the team, and know how difficult the schedule is, and how difficult it is to win in the Big Ten, and how the Gophers have been ice-skating uphill for several decades, 8 wins this fall would be a miracle. The Minnesota populace is so poisoned against this team, though, that they won't get credit for anything short of a run to the Rose Bowl. Even if they win 8 or 9 games this year, people will still roll their eyes and say, "Yeah, but they couldn't beat Ohio St. (or Iowa or Wisconsin or USC, etc.)." The Gophers have to be unequivocally awesome to get any credit from the average sports fan in Minnesota. And I don't know if that will ever happen again.

As usual, DP, you hit the nail on the head. In order to stand out in this crammed sports town, the Gophers have to do something really exciting. This is where the 2 divisions could help us a little bit.

Let's say the Gophers go 8-4 or 9-3 with 5 wins in the BT (see 1999 or 2003 as proof it is possible) but with the two divisions, end up winning their half and advance to the BT Title game. That should at least capture the attention of the average fan around here. That extra Championship game with the possibility of advancing to a BCS bowl game is exactly what we need to get people excited around here. 8 or 9 wins typically won't even get us to one of the top 3 bowls in the BT, but that same record could now get us to a BT Title game. Currently, in order to go to a BCS game the Gophers have to go 8-0 or 7-1 at worst in the BT to get it done. Now, 5 BT wins is actually possible to get to a BCS game. It opens up a lot of possibility and hope.

While the typically smarky media types might spin this as "this crappy 5-3 BT team actually got a shot at a BCS game?" - I still think this would still bring a level of excitement to the team that hasn't been here since 1967, or since 10/10/2003. As we've seen, that is what it takes to get people to care in this town.

 

[dpodoll68]

As usual, DP, you hit the nail on the head. In order to stand out in this crammed sports town, the Gophers have to do something really exciting. This is where the 2 divisions could help us a little bit.

Let's say the Gophers go 8-4 or 9-3 with 5 wins in the BT (see 1999 or 2003 as proof it is possible) but with the two divisions, end up winning their half and advance to the BT Title game. That should at least capture the attention of the average fan around here. That extra Championship game with the possibility of advancing to a BCS bowl game is exactly what we need to get people excited around here. 8 or 9 wins typically won't even get us to one of the top 3 bowls in the BT, but that same record could now get us to a BT Title game. Currently, in order to go to a BCS game the Gophers have to go 8-0 or 7-1 at worst in the BT to get it done. Now, 5 BT wins is actually possible to get to a BCS game. It opens up a lot of possibility and hope.

While the typically smarky media types might spin this as "this crappy 5-3 BT team actually got a shot at a BCS game?" - I still think this would still bring a level of excitement to the team that hasn't been here since 1967, or since 10/10/2003. As we've seen, that is what it takes to get people to care in this town.

But....but....

a 12-team Big Ten is worse for us than an 11-team Big Ten. Haven't you heard? It will make it more difficult to win the conference.

 

[AhliBobwa]

RodentRampage: Of those 50,000, how many read the stories in the paper next day? How many devour talk radio the next few days, searching for information? I wish the passion was widespread... but it's not... If they make a sizable run, this will be a bandwagon town... but if they win 6 or less games, people will tune out by mid-Oct. Comparatively speaking, the TV rating for any 2:30p ABC game -- Penn State -- is about the same as the CBS SEC game rating.

THis is joke right? Ok, let´s see,

1) I am a rabid Gopher fan. I also never listen to talk radio. That´s because, frankly, I know a lot more about CFB than almost everyone who appears on talk radio. And while Doogie, you mean well, and I like some of your stuff, you yourself have admitted you know next to nothing about the Xs and Os of football. There are sites on the internet (say FBT, smartfootball.com, etc.) that have much better info and analysis.

2) People don´t read the newspaper for lots of reasons, but put it like this. Why should Gopher fans read the Trip or PP´s sports page? They don´t care about the Gophers and we do. I read the news section of the Trib and move on.

The fact that you think the lack of attention Gopher fans pay to talk radio and the newspaper directly correlates to a lack of interest in the Gophers is in fact----

The single dumbest and most arrogant thing I´ve ever seen you write. Pathetic. Again, I´m not a hater on you personally, but you have some serious thinking to do.

If you have any further questions about how sports journalism works, feel free to stop back here or just ask nadine babu directly.

 

[josh087]

But....but....

a 12-team Big Ten is worse for us than an 11-team Big Ten. Haven't you heard? It will make it more difficult to win the conference.

Of course - since there are more teams, it must be more difficult to win the conference. No need to even analyze the topic at all!

 

[Doogie]

THis is joke right? Ok, let´s see,

1) I am a rabid Gopher fan. I also never listen to talk radio. That´s because, frankly, I know a lot more about CFB than almost everyone who appears on talk radio. And while Doogie, you mean well, and I like some of your stuff, you yourself have admitted you know next to nothing about the Xs and Os of football. There are sites on the internet (say FBT, smartfootball.com, etc.) that have much better info and analysis.

2) People don´t read the newspaper for lots of reasons, but put it like this. Why should Gopher fans read the Trip or PP´s sports page? They don´t care about the Gophers and we do. I read the news section of the Trib and move on.

The fact that you think the lack of attention Gopher fans pay to talk radio and the newspaper directly correlates to a lack of interest in the Gophers is in fact----

The single dumbest and most arrogant thing I´ve ever seen you write. Pathetic. Again, I´m not a hater on you personally, but you have some serious thinking to do.

If you have any further questions about how sports journalism works, feel free to stop back here or just ask nadine babu directly.

Ask Nadine, who knows me very, very, very well, what she thinks of my journalistic skills. Pure BS is what your post is.
On the lack of attention... those were merely two examples... also cited the crowd at the Michigan game (or pick any number of games since Brew took over... he himself took out some frustration on marketing folks for the tiny crowd in his 1st game ever)... the PPM radio numbers with the WCCO broadcasts last year... the local TV ratings... many layers to that equation.

 

[howeda7]

This is the problem for the Gophers, and one that I don't know will ever go away. To those of us who are actually fans of the team, and know how difficult the schedule is, and how difficult it is to win in the Big Ten, and how the Gophers have been ice-skating uphill for several decades, 8 wins this fall would be a miracle. The Minnesota populace is so poisoned against this team, though, that they won't get credit for anything short of a run to the Rose Bowl. Even if they win 8 or 9 games this year, people will still roll their eyes and say, "Yeah, but they couldn't beat Ohio St. (or Iowa or Wisconsin or USC, etc.)." The Gophers have to be unequivocally awesome to get any credit from the average sports fan in Minnesota. And I don't know if that will ever happen again.

Yes and no. Will it take a run to the Rose Bowl to ever elevate Gopher football into even being in the same stratesphere with the Vikings and Twins? Yes. Will it take that to get a huge amount of positive press? No. Simply beating USC (assuming they are 2-0 beforehand) would do wonders. Whatever you think of Brew's 13-13 record the last two years, the reality is that in 3 years he doesn't have a single-win that moves the needle, even a little. His best wins to date are either @NW or MSU.

Whatever you think of Mason's last few years, he always had at least one win that registered with the average MN sports fan whether Iowa (2006) Michigan (2005) Alabama (2004) or Wisconsin (2003). Even then, this team was never beloved post-Michigan 2003. But leading up to that game, they were stealing headlines from the play-off bound Twins. It's not actually that hard to get the media/bandwagon fans on board. But you have to give them something tangible to get excited about. Given the 2006 Iowa game occured only upon salvaging a once 3-6 season, it's fair to say the last time this really occured was when they beat Michigan on October 8th 2005. That's a long time to wait for an excitement-generating win.

 

[Iceland12]

Since you've mentioned it twice, the 2008 Michigan game had an announced attendance of 55,040. Given this state's history of inflated attendance figures of all sorts: Winter Carnival and Aquatenial Parades, T-Wolves and Lynx games, capitol protesters, Vikings fans willing to pay higher taxes etc. I assume that the actual number of Gopher fans was lower, but 30,000?

A lot of us were unhappily there. 52% of the seats weren't empty.

I call shenanigans.

Back to the p*(&&$@g contest.

 

[howeda7]

It's an old crowd. Many of those folks leave the game, and don't think about Gophers football again until they go to their next game. Many students are also in the same boat. Many showed up last year to a) be seen and b) see TCF ... think about the last few years of the Dome... there were maybe 30,000 people in there for the Michigan game in '08. We are debating semantics a bit... but it's hard to disagree that Gophers is anything higher than the 4th most popular team in town -- Vikings, Twins, Packers... then the Wild or Gophers hoops?

#1 in the MSP market is the Vikings. Always has been. Probably always will be. The Twins are the only ones with a shot to over-take them. #2 is the Twins, no doubt. When they are going well, Gopher basketball is #3. The tv ratings generally bear this out, though I've never seen any local ratings since they went to the BTN. #4-6 are variable depending on who's doing well. If they ever start winning some meaningful games, there's no reason Gopher football can't be the #4 team in the market or even overtake Men's hoops for #3. Currently, they battle the Wild for 4th, but I tend to think the Wild get over-rated because the hockey fan-base is vocal. Likewise the T-wolves have been as high as #4, but are basically irrelavent right now.

As for the Packers, the very thought of them ranking that high makes me ill. It may actually be true, but how can you measure it accurately when so many of those tuning in are rooting for them to lose? I disqualify them from this list.

 

[josh087]

Yes and no. Will it take a run to the Rose Bowl to ever elevate Gopher football into even being in the same stratesphere with the Vikings and Twins? Yes. Will it take that to get a huge amount of positive press? No. Simply beating USC (assuming they are 2-0 beforehand) would do wonders. Whatever you think of Brew's 13-13 record the last two years, the reality is that in 3 years he doesn't have a single-win that moves the needle, even a little. His best wins to date are either @NW or MSU.

Whatever you think of Mason's last few years, he always had at least one win that registered with the average MN sports fan whether Iowa (2006) Michigan (2005) Alabama (2004) or Wisconsin (2003). Even then, this team was never beloved post-Michigan 2003. But leading up to that game, they were stealing headlines from the play-off bound Twins. It's not actually that hard to get the media/bandwagon fans on board. But you have to give them something tangible to get excited about. Given the 2006 Iowa game occured only upon salvaging a once 3-6 season, it's fair to say the last time this really occured was when they beat Michigan on October 8th 2005. That's a long time to wait for an excitement-generating win.

The average MN sports fan does not remember any of the wins you just cited (Iowa (2006) Michigan (2005) Alabama (2004) or Wisconsin (2003). Nor did they even care at the time. The 2005 Michigan win was the most significant, and my roommate at the time wasn't even watching the game - and only knew what was going on because I started screaming when Gary Russell took off on that 3rd and 10 run. Even after the FG, he seemed unimpressed with a win, and it certainly didn't pique his interest in the team. This is a guy who is the classic average MN sports fan.

The average MN sports fan only knows 4 things about Gopher Football in the last decade
1) They upset #2 Renn State in 1999
2) The blew a 21-point 4th Quarter lead on 10/10/2003
3) A bunch of players allegedly sexually assaulted an intoxicated young woman and got kicked off the team
4) "I never knew it at the time, but did you know that the Gophers had both MBIII and Maroney in the same backfield? - Isn't it cool that they've done well in the NFL??????!!!!! I wish I would have watched them more when they were in college."

 

[AhliBobwa]

Ask Nadine, who knows me very, very, very well, what she thinks of my journalistic skills. Pure BS is what your post is.
On the lack of attention... those were merely two examples... also cited the crowd at the Michigan game (or pick any number of games since Brew took over... he himself took out some frustration on marketing folks for the tiny crowd in his 1st game ever)... the PPM radio numbers with the WCCO broadcasts last year... the local TV ratings... many layers to that equation.

Thin skin much?

So you´re citing the attendance of one game that took place at the metrodome in 2008 to prove your point? Or ´any number of games´ since Brew took over? That conveniently leaves out the fact that every single game last year at The Bank was designated as a sellout by NCAA standards.

Again, as for the radio thing, Gopher fans don´t listen to talk radio because almost no one on talk radio knows anything about the Gophers, and most are overwhelmingly negative despite their ignorance. (the Fargo flash can be a nice breath of fresh air when he is used).

The point is there are a lot of Gopher fans out there. If there weren´t they wouldn´t sell out every home game. Are lots of Gopher fans fair weather fans? yeah of course, that´s true of most fanbases. But there are plenty of die hards who would be happy to consume Gopher literate media if it existed. It is not the biggest group in the twin cities, but it is far too large a group to be constantly ignored or condescended to.

I applaud your efforts to do more stories about the Gophers, and aside from your penchant for bad Reusse-esque non sequitur jokes you are doing a good job. Keep it up. Bring MV on the radio to talk about the Gophers from time to time. Challenge yourself to write the same articles you are writing now, only without the tin ear pop culture references (like that lame Justin Bieber joke). No need to flip out because I pointed out that you were (demonstrably) wrong about the state of Gopher fandom, and that you aren´t exactly an Xs and Os football guy (which I thought you had admitted yourself in the past).

Again, by and large you are doing a good job.

 

[Doogie]

When you're calling me out, even in a semi-mild way, and wrongly so on a public forum, damn right I'm gonna defend myself.

 

[Bayfieldgopher]

Doogie. I suggest you do your thing and stick to writing about the Gophers. I think many of us appreciate that even though at times the masses aren't in total agreement with your style or views. We all want to see more ink for the Gophers.

Coming to the GH and making remarks that raises the ire of many of the GH crowd will likely result in being called out. Bingo!! So go ahead and defend yourself if you must. But you, and you alone. are putting yourself in the spotlight. Maybe you should rethink your position. In the meantime, expect the flak to be there.

 

[gopherkinta]

Doogie. I suggest you do your thing and stick to writing about the Gophers. I think many of us appreciate that even though at times the masses aren't in total agreement with your style or views. We all want to see more ink for the Gophers.

Coming to the GH and making remarks that raises the ire of many of the GH crowd will likely result in being called out. Bingo!! So go ahead and defend yourself if you must. But you, and you alone. are putting yourself in the spotlight. Maybe you should rethink your position. In the meantime, expect the flak to be there.

Agreed, this is a forum where we can critique the work of the media coverage of our beloved Gophers as the media publicly critiques the work of the Gopher Program. As far as getting in a pissing match of who puts more work in I'll let than one go as you have no idea what I do for work or know my situation. Keep up the good interviews doogs that seems to be your niche...

 

[Unregistered User]

Coming to the GH and making remarks that raises the ire of many of the GH crowd will likely result in being called out.

I really appreciate the fact that Doogie continues to comment on this board. We all give a rash of sh|t to Reusse, Souhan, et al, but I can't imagine them ever posting on this board and becoming part of the conversation rather than the butt of jokes.

Take it for what it's worth Doogie, but the posters here are trying (in an often indelicate way) to help you become a better journalist.

No one expects you to fall out of bed tomorrow and become Red Smith. Just keep working hard, we need more people in the media to help inform the unwashed masses.