4* recruits in each of last six classes! Has Pitino turned the corner?

Sure, his durability was an asset, but to say it was his best ability is really underselling Murph. We've had plenty of durable players over the last few decades and none of them came close to being the prolific rebounder and a top scorer that Murph was.
We've also had players with his skill who could not stop from getting hurt (Trevor Mbakwe), having both durability and skill is what has made Murphy in to an all-time great with this team
 

Otis

New member
No. Not even close to true. That's blasphemy to a Gopher great.

Does availability get you to #2 in Big Ten history in rebounding? There's no ability in that? I honestly can't believe I just read that.
I believe he only missed one game. The last one and he still got PT in that one!

You don't get as high on the records list averaging under 20/game unless you play in all the games.

Do you have any idea how many coaches would be in line to sign a guy who you know will man the four spot for four years!
 

builtbadgers

Active member
I believe he only missed one game. The last one and he still got PT in that one!

You don't get as high on the records list averaging under 20/game unless you play in all the games.

Do you have any idea how many coaches would be in line to sign a guy who you know will man the four spot for four years!
Nearly every single one. Also, being durable is part of being great.
 

alchemy2u

Active member
I believe he only missed one game. The last one and he still got PT in that one!

You don't get as high on the records list averaging under 20/game unless you play in all the games.

Do you have any idea how many coaches would be in line to sign a guy who you know will man the four spot for four years!
Of course a player has to be durable to get the numbers to add up, but saying that is the primary reason he will be remembered is totally ignoring his talents. He almost averaged a double double over his career (9.8, 13.5). He did average a double double his last two years overall and in conference play! Many durable basketball players can only dream of doing that!


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bleedsmaroonandgold

Active member
Of course a player has to be durable to get the numbers to add up, but saying that is the primary reason he will be remembered is totally ignoring his talents. He almost averaged a double double over his career (9.8, 13.5). He did average a double double his last two years overall and in conference play! Many durable basketball players can only dream of doing that!


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+1

Jordan Murphy put up historical numbers while he was here. To put up those kind of career numbers, you do need to be durable, but there are plenty of guys who are consistently available to play during their career and don't become one of the top rebounders in conference history.
 

Former Goofer

New member
2020 Mitchell
2019 Ihnen, Williams
2018 Oturu (stud), Kalesheur 3* (diamond in the rough)
2017 Washington (flamed out)
2016 Coffey, Curry (ranked 114)
2015 Dorsey (flamed out), Murphy 3* (best recruit ever for Pitino)

That's a pretty good haul of talent for a team stuck in the bottom half of the B1G for a while. He is set up to land his best class yet if he gets 2 of Mashburn, Walton and Garcia. Recruiting definitely is showing an increase in quality as the years go by.

I'm not even including Carr and Willis, although I think Carr may have been a 4*.

You can complain about the teams records since he has been here, but you cannot say he isn't building up the program in talent despite missing the big fishes from Minnesota so far. Without the bad luck and poor off-court decisions by players, you could easily point out the program is going up!

You go Pitino!

Go Gophers!
4 stars?

Mitchell?
https://247sports.com/college/minnesota/Season/2020-Basketball/Commits/

Williams?
https://247sports.com/player/tre-williams-46046489/
 
Both Mitchell and Williams were four stars on Rivals as well. Guessing ESPN brings down their composites, but they don't pay attention past the top 100

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Former Goofer

New member
They are both composite 3 stars, but they are also both 4 stars in 247’s rankings. Gabe Kalscheur was also a 4 star in the 247 rankings.
I usually just go by 247 composite since I feel that's the most fair.
I really didn't mean to come across as a dick and I apologize for that.

I'mm not bashing the players but it isn't correct to say some of these guys are 4 star players. Their rankings could change in the future and I'm sure someone will bump this if it happens but right now they aren't.
 

bc2211

New member
I usually just go by 247 composite since I feel that's the most fair.
I really didn't mean to come across as a dick and I apologize for that.

I'mm not bashing the players but it isn't correct to say some of these guys are 4 star players. Their rankings could change in the future and I'm sure someone will bump this if it happens but right now they aren't.
I disagree. It’s actually incorrect to say they are not 4 stars, if they are being given 4 stars by at least one service. Unless you are giving them a ‘Former Goofer 3-star evaluation’, there’s really not much to argue.




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alchemy2u

Active member
I usually just go by 247 composite since I feel that's the most fair.
I really didn't mean to come across as a dick and I apologize for that.

I'mm not bashing the players but it isn't correct to say some of these guys are 4 star players. Their rankings could change in the future and I'm sure someone will bump this if it happens but right now they aren't.
They are labeled by the best ranking they are given by the services. All of them are ranked as 4 stars by a service. Plus all of the articles about Mitchell’s commitment say he is a four star. It is not just us reaching...


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Goldy Gopher

Active member
I usually just go by 247 composite since I feel that's the most fair.
I really didn't mean to come across as a dick and I apologize for that.

I'mm not bashing the players but it isn't correct to say some of these guys are 4 star players. Their rankings could change in the future and I'm sure someone will bump this if it happens but right now they aren't.
I'm not a fan of the composite only because it factors in ESPN. After the top 50ish players ESPN doesn't put a whole lot into their recruiting so it is kind of hard to take them seriously.
 

jovs

New member
No because I’ve seen our roster this year.
Tubby's first two years were better than any of Pitino's so far but after that his recruiting fell off a cliff, overall Pitino's has been much better, I don't think the program has been in this good of a shape since the Clem years.
 

John Galt

New member
If you look at the 247 composite team rankings, here is how we have fared in the B1G each year since 2015: https://247sports.com/Season/2015-Basketball/CompositeTeamRankings/?Conference=Big-Ten

2019- 4th
2018- 8th
2017 - 11th
2016- 5th
2015- 6th

So our average recruiting ranking in the B1G has been 7th since 2015, right in the middle. I would imagine our average finish is below this, possibly 9th or 10th would be my guess. So recruiting has been average, and B1G records have been below average. And we've turned a corner. Do I have this right?
 

alchemy2u

Active member
If you look at the 247 composite team rankings, here is how we have fared in the B1G each year since 2015: https://247sports.com/Season/2015-Basketball/CompositeTeamRankings/?Conference=Big-Ten

2019- 4th
2018- 8th
2017 - 11th
2016- 5th
2015- 6th

So our average recruiting ranking in the B1G has been 7th since 2015, right in the middle. I would imagine our average finish is below this, possibly 9th or 10th would be my guess. So recruiting has been average, and B1G records have been below average. And we've turned a corner. Do I have this right?
I added some more details.
Tubby
2008 Nat#26, B1G#3 8-10 conf record
2009 Nat#10, B1G#1 Royce, Rodney 9-9
2010 Nat#—, B1G#— 9-9
2011 Nat#54, B1G#8 6-12
2012 Nat#75, B1G#11 6-12

Pitino
2013 Nat#91, B1G#11 8-10
2014 Nat#64, B1G#9 8-10
2015 Nat#34, B1G#6 6-12
2016 Nat#30, B1G#5 2-16
2017 Nat#71, B1G#11 IW 11-7
2018 Nat#45, B1G#8 4-14
2019 Nat#37, B1G#4 9-11

Not quite the argument that you were trying to make.


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John Galt

New member
I added some more details.
Tubby
2008 Nat#26, B1G#3 8-10 conf record
2009 Nat#10, B1G#1 Royce, Rodney 9-9
2010 Nat#—, B1G#— 9-9
2011 Nat#54, B1G#8 6-12
2012 Nat#75, B1G#11 6-12

Pitino
2013 Nat#91, B1G#11 8-10
2014 Nat#64, B1G#9 8-10
2015 Nat#34, B1G#6 6-12
2016 Nat#30, B1G#5 2-16
2017 Nat#71, B1G#11 IW 11-7
2018 Nat#45, B1G#8 4-14
2019 Nat#37, B1G#4 9-11

Not quite the argument that you were trying to make.


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Color me confused by the point you're trying to make?

My argument was pretty clear. Under Pitino, our recruiting has been average in the B1G and our record has been below average.
 

Livingat45north

New member
Color me confused by the point you're trying to make?

My argument was pretty clear. Under Pitino, our recruiting has been average in the B1G and our record has been below average.
I do like the trend over that past three years -- pretty solid improvements. Granted, when you start low it's easier to show an improvement. Guess we'll find out soon about this year's class, right now it's looking very solid.
 
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