Marcus reporting Amir got a two way contract with the Clippers

Already giving up on next year? Obviously having Coffey back would have been preferable, and yes, maybe the team takes a step back. However, I'm excited to see how all the new pieces fit together. Next year is the deepest and most athletic Gopher basketball team that we've had here in quite some time. I think the team has a chance to surprise...

Giving up? No. Adjusting expectations? Yes. With Coffey, I felt a top 6 finish and a single digit NCAA seed were reasonable expectations. Now, just being on the bubble would be a success. Most forecasts have us 11-13 in conference. That's NIT territory if that.
 

We're gonna be very good in 2020-21.

Who knows what 2020-2021 will bring? Oturo could declare for the draft after this season, then what?

The best thing for the program, by far, would have been Coffey returning for this season.
 

Giving up? No. Adjusting expectations? Yes. With Coffey, I felt a top 6 finish and a single digit NCAA seed were reasonable expectations. Now, just being on the bubble would be a success. Most forecasts have us 11-13 in conference. That's NIT territory if that.

You specifically said that next year's team will be NIT at best. That means you believe there's no possible way they can make the NCAA tournament. And people read too much into forecasts. Three seasons ago, most national critics had us forecasted 10th or worse. We wound up with a 5 seed in the NCAA tournament. Same with last season when many had us even missing the NIT.

Every Gopher fan knows that the ceiling for the team would have been much higher if Coffey would've returned. We all realize that next year's team is a bit of a question mark as well. However, I won't say there's no chance for a NCAA tournament berth without seeing all of these new players on the court together.
 

Who knows what 2020-2021 will bring? Oturo could declare for the draft after this season, then what?

The best thing for the program, by far, would have been Coffey returning for this season.

Then that helps us recruit Chet and Treyton Thompson and we reload. I think our team would've been better with Amir next year sure(at the start of the year at least), but I also don't think he was our make or break point. At some point we needed some guys to get NBA contracts. It was becoming a huge hurdle to jump over in recruiting.
 

Who knows what 2020-2021 will bring? Oturo could declare for the draft after this season, then what?

The best thing for the program, by far, would have been Coffey returning for this season.
He's not here.
Our team will get better and players will fill in the void. I prefer to see the new opportunities rather than wallow in the what ifs.
 


He's not here.
Our team will get better and players will fill in the void. I prefer to see the new opportunities rather than wallow in the what ifs.
I agree, it's college sports, there's always new faces

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk
 

He's not here. Our team will get better and players will fill in the void. I prefer to see the new opportunities rather than wallow in the what ifs.

Yep, that's what I like about every season. No matter the expectations, there are always new pieces to the puzzle. Looking forward to seeing what we really have with all the newcomers (Carr, Willis, Demir, Ihnen, Williams, etc.). No seasons are ever the same.
 

He's not here.
Our team will get better and players will fill in the void. I prefer to see the new opportunities rather than wallow in the what ifs.

Strongly disagree that the team will get better because Coffey left, regardless of whether we are talking short term or long term (I don't buy that you actually believe this either), but I agree that there is no need to live in the past. Still plenty to look forward to. Coffey leaving makes next season that much more interesting as there are so many possibilities for who takes his spot and where this team finishes. I'm even more excited to see what we have with Ihnen now that we may depend on him more. If he can have a similar impact as a freshman that Gabe or Oturu did, we could still be in for a good season.
 

Strongly disagree that the team will get better because Coffey left, regardless of whether we are talking short term or long term (I don't buy that you actually believe this either), but I agree that there is no need to live in the past. Still plenty to look forward to. Coffey leaving makes next season that much more interesting as there are so many possibilities for who takes his spot and where this team finishes. I'm even more excited to see what we have with Ihnen now that we may depend on him more. If he can have a similar impact as a freshman that Gabe or Oturu did, we could still be in for a good season.

We will play a different style without Murphy and Cofey. Just like every other team in college basketball, the U will have to reload. Part of the optimism stems from having a few new upper class man instead of counting on just new freshman to step up. We will be younger and miss a couple of keys players, but we will be more versatile, athletic and defensive minded. We are not starting from scratch, the team still has some very good players coming back from last year.
 



Strongly disagree that the team will get better because Coffey left, regardless of whether we are talking short term or long term (I don't buy that you actually believe this either), but I agree that there is no need to live in the past. Still plenty to look forward to. Coffey leaving makes next season that much more interesting as there are so many possibilities for who takes his spot and where this team finishes. I'm even more excited to see what we have with Ihnen now that we may depend on him more. If he can have a similar impact as a freshman that Gabe or Oturu did, we could still be in for a good season.
Odd...you think that more experience and playing time will make the team worse?
 

Then that helps us recruit Chet and Treyton Thompson and we reload. I think our team would've been better with Amir next year sure(at the start of the year at least), but I also don't think he was our make or break point. At some point we needed some guys to get NBA contracts. It was becoming a huge hurdle to jump over in recruiting.

Except that Amir wasn't even drafted. No one outside of the B1G has ever heard the name Amir Coffey. Playing in a few NBA games won't remotely move the needle on anyone that is considering MN as a college destination. Having someone drafted in the lottery or even in the 1st round moves the needle somewhat, but it pales in comparison to winning games.
 

He's not here.
Our team will get better and players will fill in the void. I prefer to see the new opportunities rather than wallow in the what ifs.

But the team won't be better. Our best player isn't coming back. You might be okay with it. You might be interested in seeing the young guys play. You can be excited about seeing a different style of basketball. But our team will be worse. Which won't benefit the program either next year or in the long-term.
 

You specifically said that next year's team will be NIT at best. That means you believe there's no possible way they can make the NCAA tournament. And people read too much into forecasts. Three seasons ago, most national critics had us forecasted 10th or worse. We wound up with a 5 seed in the NCAA tournament. Same with last season when many had us even missing the NIT.

Every Gopher fan knows that the ceiling for the team would have been much higher if Coffey would've returned. We all realize that next year's team is a bit of a question mark as well. However, I won't say there's no chance for a NCAA tournament berth without seeing all of these new players on the court together.

Fair enough. I'd revise it to bubble team at best, with an NIT bid most likely. These days you have to be a bubble team to make the NIT in most cases, so it's not a big distinction. Obviously we have a lot of new players, so the space between the true floor and the ceiling is hard to know for certain. But at the end of the day, we are trying to replace a huge part of our team in Murphy and Coffey and matching last year's results would be about as good as we could hope for. Most likely, we will fall a few games short of that.
 
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But the team won't be better. Our best player isn't coming back. You might be okay with it. You might be interested in seeing the young guys play. You can be excited about seeing a different style of basketball. But our team will be worse. Which won't benefit the program either next year or in the long-term.
I never said this upcoming season we would win more games without Coffey. I said that our team will be better off for getting the experience they would not have received had Coffey returned. The kids that are actually here will benefit now that Coffey is gone.
 

I never said this upcoming season we would win more games without Coffey. I said that our team will be better off for getting the experience they would not have received had Coffey returned. The kids that are actually here will benefit now that Coffey is gone.

This is like the delusional Badger fans who are arguing they are better off without Happ. They're not and we're not.
 

Impossible to predict until they get to play a bit.

So this early, I would just say that I still feel like this team should make the tourny. 68 teams, and how many P5 teams get at large each year?? We can be an every year program. Ohio State wasn’t special last year, still made it.
 

This is like the delusional Badger fans who are arguing they are better off without Happ. They're not and we're not.
Get your head out of your ass and actually comprehend what I have said before you post.
 

I never said this upcoming season we would win more games without Coffey. I said that our team will be better off for getting the experience they would not have received had Coffey returned. The kids that are actually here will benefit now that Coffey is gone.

You said "our team will get better." I don't think you even believe what you're typing.

Why will it be better for Ihnen and Williams to be thrust into starting roles or playing heavy minutes if they aren't ready? They best thing for them would be to get experience in practice and to play fewer minutes as they adjust to the college game. They also won't have the benefit of learning from Amir on and off the court.
 

Get your head out of your ass and actually comprehend what I have said before you post.

Your take is ridiculous. Quit saying stupid sh*t if you don't want to be taken to the carpet.

Losing Coffey isn't better for the Gophers in any way. The point of college basketball is to win games. We will win fewer this year by not having Amir. By winning fewer this year, it has a strong chance to negatively impact recruiting, which will hurt us for the long-term. The Gopher basketball program is in no way "better off" by not having Amir on the team this season.
 

Is it humanly possible to say something like, the absence of Coffey allowed us to get a player who would not have come here otherwise (ie, he wouldn’t get to play as much this year), who could, somehow, end up being an incredibly good player?

That’s the best chance you have at saying we’re better off this year.
 

Fair enough. I'd revise it to bubble team at best, with an NIT bid most likely. These days you have to be a bubble team to make the NIT in most cases, so it's not a big distinction. Obviously we have a lot of new players, so the space between the true floor and the ceiling is hard to know for certain. But at the end of the day, we are trying to replace a huge part of our team in Murphy and Coffey and matching last year's results would be about as good as we could hope for. Most likely, we will fall a few games short of that.

No doubt that losing Murphy and Coffey hurts, but my guess is that Pitino is really going to space the floor now. At a minimum, some things have to go right next year, but it's not out of the question:

Carr - needs to have a significant impact. From everything I've heard, sounds like a safe bet he'll be ready for it.
Willis/Williams/Greenlee - need at least one to have a significant impact and one other to provide depth.
Demir/Curry/Omersa/Freeman - need at least one to have a significant impact and two others to provide depth.
Ihnen/Hurt - need at least one to have a solid impact.
Oturu/Gabe - need both to take the next step in year two.
 
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Get your head out of your ass and actually comprehend what I have said before you post.

I'm comprehending it fine. It's the same basic argument. "Young guys will have a chance to step up" and "the offense will flow better" etc. Wisconsin is worse off without Happ and we are worse off without Coffey. There's no rational argument otherwise. Yes specific players who get his minutes may benefit. But the net to the program as a whole is still a significant negative.
 

Is it humanly possible to say something like, the absence of Coffey allowed us to get a player who would not have come here otherwise (ie, he wouldn’t get to play as much this year), who could, somehow, end up being an incredibly good player?

That’s the best chance you have at saying we’re better off this year.

If a great player comes and takes his open scholarship, sure. That's unlikely. It seems likely to go to Rudrud.
 

No doubt that losing Murphy and Coffey hurts, but my guess is that Pitino is really going to space the floor now. At a minimum, some things have to go right next year, but it's not out of the question:

Carr - needs to have a significant impact. From everything I've heard, sounds like a safe bet he'll be ready for it.
Willis/Williams/Greenlee - need at least one to have a significant impact and one other to provide depth.
Demir/Curry/Omersa/Freeman - need at least one to have a significant impact and two others to provide depth.
Ihnen/Hurt - need at least one to have a solid impact.
Oturu/Gabe - need both to take the next step in year two.

I believe that the improvement of having a real PG and the expected internal improvement of Oturu/Gabe could offset the downgrade at the 4 spot. If Ihnen/Williams can be 80-90 % of what Coffey was, we can come close to last year. But that's a lot to ask from a freshman.
 

You said "our team will get better." I don't think you even believe what you're typing.

Why will it be better for Ihnen and Williams to be thrust into starting roles or playing heavy minutes if they aren't ready? They best thing for them would be to get experience in practice and to play fewer minutes as they adjust to the college game. They also won't have the benefit of learning from Amir on and off the court.
Our team will get better. Anyone who watches and understands basketball knows this happens as a group of players play more games together.
Do you think our team will get worse this upcoming year?
 

Your take is ridiculous. Quit saying stupid sh*t if you don't want to be taken to the carpet.

Losing Coffey isn't better for the Gophers in any way. The point of college basketball is to win games. We will win fewer this year by not having Amir. By winning fewer this year, it has a strong chance to negatively impact recruiting, which will hurt us for the long-term. The Gopher basketball program is in no way "better off" by not having Amir on the team this season.
We will ultimately be better. You're just thinking short term.
 

If a great player comes and takes his open scholarship, sure. That's unlikely. It seems likely to go to Rudrud.

No it would be a player already here. I’m saying, someone who came here to play this year, who wouldn’t have if Coffey had still been here and likely to take up that playing time.
 

No it would be a player already here. I’m saying, someone who came here to play this year, who wouldn’t have if Coffey had still been here and likely to take up that playing time.

Every new signee except Greenlee signed before Coffey decided to stay in the draft, so presumably their decisions were not influenced by his status.
 

Except that Amir wasn't even drafted. No one outside of the B1G has ever heard the name Amir Coffey. Playing in a few NBA games won't remotely move the needle on anyone that is considering MN as a college destination. Having someone drafted in the lottery or even in the 1st round moves the needle somewhat, but it pales in comparison to winning games.

I was referencing Oturo being gone hence naming Thompson and Holmgen. Coffey playing in the league is better than what we had previously so it won't hurt our recruiting. Obviously winning games is the best way to move the needle and I didn't say this was more beneficial.

Amir was a great player and to think we'd be better without him is ridiculous. It's also ok to think our team will be as good as last year. I felt with Amir we were top 5 big ten. Without Amir I still think we are top 7-8 at worst. Big Ten isn't as good in my opinion. Also I loved Murph, Pree, and Amir. Great students, citizens, and basketball players, but they also had limitations (outside shooting specifically)

Our team next year is full of unknowns, but some guarantees of more depth and better shooting. Beyond that I just have confidence in our staff to develop and improve.
 
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I think I have a different take on this. I think the Gophers will miss Murphy more than Coffey.

If you look at what Coffey provided - scoring, defense, ball-handling - the team will likely not have 1 player who provides all of that to the same level. But they don't need 1 player to fill Coffey's spot. They need 2 or 3 or 4 different players to each provide part of the puzzle. some points here, some ball-handling there, some defense over there, and you fill the gap. And - to be fair - Coffey had some up-and-down games during the season. We remember how well he played down the stretch - but we may not remember some of the other games during the season when he wasn't as efficient.

On the other hand, with Murphy, it was a near-guaranteed double-double every night. Oturu should be able to pick up some of the points and rebounds - but who picks up the rest? And who provides the presence Murphy gave the team, and the ability to hit big shots or get to the free-throw line when the team needed it?

I guess I just feel better about the prospects for replacing Coffey's production than I do about the prospects of replacing Murphy's production.

Would I have like to have Coffey back? Yes - no doubt. But, he's gone, and the team (and coaches) need to find a way to replace what he provided. I don't think the team is doomed to failure. This can still be a good season.
 




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