***OFFICIAL MINNESOTA AT BUTLER IN-GAME THREAD!!!***

This just isn't a very good team. The front court especially is horrible. Oturu is the only current player over 6'4" who could make the roster on a top tier B1G team. Pitino needed to land immediate impact bigs. The best he could do recruiting was projects like Freeman, Ihnen, & Martice Mitchell. All of whom could be solid in 2-3 years, but that doesn't help us, or Pitino in 2019-20. The best Pitino could find in the transfer market was Demir. Hurt is a notch below Joey King & Oto Osenieks. I don't see Jarvis ever being more than a back-up. The roster just isn't very good.
 

I am going to start with a postive: Daniel Oturu was the best player on the court tonight by a wide margin. It is an absolute shame that no other players or coaches were even adequate at their jobs tonight. I wasn't impressed with Butler, just extremely upset by everything other than Daniel Oturu.

There is no excuse for this type of roster in year 7 of the Richard Pitino era. None. It's extremely scary that we have at least two freshman (don't know if they actually would have played Inhen tonight for his first game or not) that can't get in this rotation.

Marcus Carr played the worst game from a Gopher point guard that I can remember. Maverick Ahanmisi had far worse stretches when Tubby would play him, but nobody who was allowed to handle the ball as much as Carr has played this bad in a long, long time. He couldn't even dribble tonight, he got zero penetration despite handling the ball for half the shot clock, almost never created a shot for anyone, made a bunch of terrible decisions leading to turnovers, took terrible shots, shot terribly, and missed a bunch of huge free throws. It is completely baffling how Pitino never took him off the ball in the second half and put it in Willis' hands. Hopefully this was just one game, but the thing that concerns me is that there is ZERO burst there. He simply can't get by guys off the bounce. Even when a big switched on to Carr he couldn't create separation for a layup and forced a contested shot.

It seems like Pitino made the exact same mistake with Alihan Demir that he made with Brock Stull. Two games in and it seems very apparent that Alihan cannot play high major basketball. It's absolutely baffling that we knew Murphy was graduating and Curry was 2 years removed from playing basketball and Pitino couldn't sell anyone better than this to come and be his starting power forward. The game turned around when Omersa was inserted for Demir and Jarvis made some nice plays. Unfortunately, Jarvis really seems to struggle with awareness. He gave up two really bad offensive rebounds that lead to 4 points (once a layup, once Jarvis committed a foul) that should have been incredibly easy defensive boards for him. When you really can't shoot, you can't take something else off the table too and Jarvis does that. I honestly don't know how they put two competent "big" men on the floor this year unless a light goes on for Jarvis or Isaiah is the real deal.

I don't know what this team does well. They are not particularly athletic at the 1-3, they haven't shot it well, they have a complete hole at the 4 spot, they turn it over, they don't run any sort of half court offense that has shown to create open looks, they take poor shots and lose their composure on offense, and they are not physical down low. The only positives I see is the guards/wings are willing to scrap for rebounds and the vast majority of the team at least competes on defense.

The officiating, especially in the first half, was absolutely brutal. There were a lot of tight off the ball calls made on the Gophers on one end and then no calls (and a charge!) that hurt the Gophers on offense and got Gabe and others in foul trouble. Butler got at least one possession if not two gifted to them by officials not knowing who the ball went off of. It would be on thing if it was just judgment calls, but it was literally a total different game on one end of the floor than the other when it came to the whistle.
 

I was at hinkle tonight! Man we need to get more out of demir. Not sure if that will ever happen. Cant shoot on the road as usual. Gabe and carr were no shows. Never gonna win a game with them being absent. Very frustrating as ting to say the least. Omersa was a huge upgrade to demir and omersa did nothing lol these tough games would have been better as game 8,9, and 10 as opposed to 2,3, and 4, but it is what it is! Were better than what people think, but its frustrating.
 

I just despise watching this kind of basketball where nobody does anything but shoot threes.

I agree, they run around the three point line till the shot clock runs out. Also my memory is not what it use to be. Everybody says Gabe was a great shooter last year. I know he had a couple good games but maybe an OK defender, fouls too much and spotty shooter is what I remember. To me he hasn't changed a bit since last year.
 

Next year won't be any better without a PG.

Did you watch the game. Carr is one of the bright spots on this team. Willis and Oturu also. Demir has got to put his big boy pants on. He looks timid. And I would ask Williams just what is it about Gabes game that you can't compete with. I would out Hurt as an Afraidy Cat. Hurt thinks the game is 'Hot potato'. He can shoot if he could grow some balls. Demir also. The most practiced thing these players have been doing since they first started this sport was putting the ball in the hoop. Only five guys on the team could manage that for this game.
 


I am not giving up on Carr. It’s early. But looking at his skills, Isaiah Washington was a better player and Pitino kept him in the doghouse and couldn’t figure out how to use him. He could dribble, pass, and had a good looking shot (even though he missed a lot). Carr can’t dribble, can’t pass, and his shot looks bad and seemingly will be a similar percentage.

Yuck.


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If you think IW is a better player than Carr, you need to watch the game with someone that can explain whats happening to you.
 

Carr can't shoot. But he I think he can handle the ball. Nobody cuts. The choices he has are to pass to someone else on the perimeter. This offense reminds me of Tubby Smith's which I found very hard to watch.
 

If you think IW is a better player than Carr, you need to watch the game with someone that can explain whats happening to you.

Based on a two game sample size (I didn't see the Oklahoma game) IW was able to do more than Carr has done so far. IW could penetrate and dish. Carr hasn't done that yet. Neither player can shoot and neither player takes care of the ball.
 

Too early for me to address this but Craig Smith is a big time hire. Someone will hire him after this year.

You think he was the reason Miles did well? I know you're not a huge Tim Miles fan. Agree that Craig is really good
 



Based on a two game sample size (I didn't see the Oklahoma game) IW was able to do more than Carr has done so far. IW could penetrate and dish. Carr hasn't done that yet. Neither player can shoot and neither player takes care of the ball.

One can defend and get fouled more.
 

I am going to start with a postive: Daniel Oturu was the best player on the court tonight by a wide margin. It is an absolute shame that no other players or coaches were even adequate at their jobs tonight. I wasn't impressed with Butler, just extremely upset by everything other than Daniel Oturu.

There is no excuse for this type of roster in year 7 of the Richard Pitino era. None. It's extremely scary that we have at least two freshman (don't know if they actually would have played Inhen tonight for his first game or not) that can't get in this rotation.

Marcus Carr played the worst game from a Gopher point guard that I can remember. Maverick Ahanmisi had far worse stretches when Tubby would play him, but nobody who was allowed to handle the ball as much as Carr has played this bad in a long, long time. He couldn't even dribble tonight, he got zero penetration despite handling the ball for half the shot clock, almost never created a shot for anyone, made a bunch of terrible decisions leading to turnovers, took terrible shots, shot terribly, and missed a bunch of huge free throws. It is completely baffling how Pitino never took him off the ball in the second half and put it in Willis' hands. Hopefully this was just one game, but the thing that concerns me is that there is ZERO burst there. He simply can't get by guys off the bounce. Even when a big switched on to Carr he couldn't create separation for a layup and forced a contested shot.

It seems like Pitino made the exact same mistake with Alihan Demir that he made with Brock Stull. Two games in and it seems very apparent that Alihan cannot play high major basketball. It's absolutely baffling that we knew Murphy was graduating and Curry was 2 years removed from playing basketball and Pitino couldn't sell anyone better than this to come and be his starting power forward. The game turned around when Omersa was inserted for Demir and Jarvis made some nice plays. Unfortunately, Jarvis really seems to struggle with awareness. He gave up two really bad offensive rebounds that lead to 4 points (once a layup, once Jarvis committed a foul) that should have been incredibly easy defensive boards for him. When you really can't shoot, you can't take something else off the table too and Jarvis does that. I honestly don't know how they put two competent "big" men on the floor this year unless a light goes on for Jarvis or Isaiah is the real deal.

I don't know what this team does well. They are not particularly athletic at the 1-3, they haven't shot it well, they have a complete hole at the 4 spot, they turn it over, they don't run any sort of half court offense that has shown to create open looks, they take poor shots and lose their composure on offense, and they are not physical down low. The only positives I see is the guards/wings are willing to scrap for rebounds and the vast majority of the team at least competes on defense.

The officiating, especially in the first half, was absolutely brutal. There were a lot of tight off the ball calls made on the Gophers on one end and then no calls (and a charge!) that hurt the Gophers on offense and got Gabe and others in foul trouble. Butler got at least one possession if not two gifted to them by officials not knowing who the ball went off of. It would be on thing if it was just judgment calls, but it was literally a total different game on one end of the floor than the other when it came to the whistle.

Holy preposterous statement man here. Dan Cole would be proud. I'm mad and don't think hunk we played well. Gabe and Carr need to play better. Gabe hid and hasn't been aggressive enough. Remember with Alihan he was not their first, second, or third choice on the grad transfer market, so we need to temper expectations of him. I will say he defends better than I thought (I expected him to be god awful he's bad to below average but works hard).

I think our identity will be defense and ball movement. Those require cohesion and can take a little time. Hopefully this adversity will help speed it up. I just don't see this team shooting that poorly all year.
 

Holy preposterous statement man here. Dan Cole would be proud. I'm mad and don't think hunk we played well. Gabe and Carr need to play better. Gabe hid and hasn't been aggressive enough. Remember with Alihan he was not their first, second, or third choice on the grad transfer market, so we need to temper expectations of him. I will say he defends better than I thought (I expected him to be god awful he's bad to below average but works hard).

I think our identity will be defense and ball movement. Those require cohesion and can take a little time. Hopefully this adversity will help speed it up. I just don't see this team shooting that poorly all year.

I think eg nailed it.

You continue to think the shooting will improve. That would require the offense to be considerably better moving the ball. I don't see it.

I see disaster on the horizon with RP being shown the door before the end of the season. I hope I am wrong. I just don't see the level of talent on the floor to be able to compete, even marginally, with the better teams.
 




I think eg nailed it.

You continue to think the shooting will improve. That would require the offense to be considerably better moving the ball. I don't see it.

I see disaster on the horizon with RP being shown the door before the end of the season. I hope I am wrong. I just don't see the level of talent on the floor to be able to compete, even marginally, with the better teams.

He’s not going to be shown the door because of rebuilding. Most have low expectations for this team this year to begin with. They lost far too many pieces to expect the same results as last year.

We have good recruits coming in. IF he gets shown the door expect to go from this to much worse...


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Roster management is brutal. How you end up with so many projects is ridiculous. You take Oturu off this team and our talent is easily the worst in the Big Ten. The hype about Carr had me optimistic but he’s not a starter for most D1 programs after an admitted small sample size. Hope I’m overreacting.
 

Also my memory is not what it use to be. Everybody says Gabe was a great shooter last year. I know he had a couple good games but maybe an OK defender, fouls too much and spotty shooter is what I remember. To me he hasn't changed a bit since last year.

your memory has failed

Gabe was the best defender on the team by a large margin and he shot the ball very well.
 

Holy preposterous statement man here. Dan Cole would be proud. I'm mad and don't think hunk we played well. Gabe and Carr need to play better. Gabe hid and hasn't been aggressive enough. Remember with Alihan he was not their first, second, or third choice on the grad transfer market, so we need to temper expectations of him. I will say he defends better than I thought (I expected him to be god awful he's bad to below average but works hard).

I think our identity will be defense and ball movement. Those require cohesion and can take a little time. Hopefully this adversity will help speed it up. I just don't see this team shooting that poorly all year.

My memory was that Shakur Juiston was our clear #1 choice, but Alihan Demir was #2 or #3? Shakur put up a 17PT 10REB effort in Oregon's win over Memphis. Would be really nice to have him right now.
 

Honestly this three game stretch is tough for a young team, trying to gel with alot of new pieces. This would have been the year to load up the OOC with home games against bad competition to get some familiarity with each other. But I understand why the staff did what they did. Probably thought Coffey was going to still be here.
 

From what I saw last night, I think I would play Omearsa at center and Oturu at PF until Demir shows some fight. We miss Curry BADLY.

If Oturu stays one more year, we will have the 2020 version of Mychal Thompson. His development has been terrific. Another year of strength training and he is a high draft choice.

BTW- Okla beat Oregon State in Oregon last night.
 
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Did you watch the game. Carr is one of the bright spots on this team. Willis and Oturu also. Demir has got to put his big boy pants on. He looks timid. And I would ask Williams just what is it about Gabes game that you can't compete with. I would out Hurt as an Afraidy Cat. Hurt thinks the game is 'Hot potato'. He can shoot if he could grow some balls. Demir also. The most practiced thing these players have been doing since they first started this sport was putting the ball in the hoop. Only five guys on the team could manage that for this game.

You must have missed last nights game. Carr was brutal. One of the worst games a PG can have.
 

Gophs bench is worse than last season

Well, I don't know for sure yet, but, if that statement even has a 50% probability of being true, then that is an extremely depressing thought. One thing is for sure: we don't have a big man coming off the bench who is anywhere close to even the Matz level of last year.
 

your memory has failed

Gabe was the best defender on the team by a large margin and he shot the ball very well.

I would like to know where the rose colored glasses come from, Baldwin exposed him, would have loved to have had Coffey or McBrayer guarding him last night.
 

I would like to know where the rose colored glasses come from, Baldwin exposed him, would have loved to have had Coffey or McBrayer guarding him last night.

Baldwin would've went for 40 or 50 then. I don't understand this idea of Pree and Amir being good defenders. Both were average at best.
 

He’s not going to be shown the door because of rebuilding. Most have low expectations for this team this year to begin with. They lost far too many pieces to expect the same results as last year.

We have good recruits coming in. IF he gets shown the door expect to go from this to much worse...


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They have one good recruit coming in in Mashburn, though he is kind of iffy as a undersized shooting guard. The other is a project they beat out Rutgers for. The future does not look bright. I think it depends on Garcia if they get him Pitino should get another year.
 

Baldwin would've went for 40 or 50 then. I don't understand this idea of Pree and Amir being good defenders. Both were average at best.

Pree was pretty solid last year...on defense. Amir played defense at times but not always.
 

They have one good recruit coming in in Mashburn, though he is kind of iffy as a undersized shooting guard. The other is a project they beat out Rutgers for. The future does not look bright. I think it depends on Garcia if they get him Pitino should get another year.

Recruits coming in should never be the sole reason you keep a guy. Need to see continued development with the players he has who I still think are talented. I'm still not as down on this roster. I see a team that will move the ball better and shoot better (those are opinions and guesswork), but defensively this team is better than last years positionally.
 

When Gabe gets the ball standing still, makes no moves or takes no dribbles before he shoots, he is one of the best 3-4 shooters in the entire country, he simply doesnt miss. But man when he takes even one side step/movement/dribble it is not good, its one of the craziest things I have seen.

I can't tell if the transfers need some time or are just who they are. Carr missed Oturu about 40 times on the PnR, Willis looks confident when he shoots but man his numbers are brutal the last two games. Demir is in the konate/diedhou model of worthless.

So far I think our best hope for the season is coming next Wednesday, maybe we can get Garcia to reclassify!
 

You think he was the reason Miles did well? I know you're not a huge Tim Miles fan. Agree that Craig is really good

Actually like Miles as a person but he had his chance at Nebraska and failed with a mediocre record. I would not take away what Miles did elsewhere by giving Smith the credit but he did play a big role. My take is his ability to get a team sound and to win conference titles, the proof of someone who builds a winner. Plus, a great many coaches have been talking about him the last few years, especially at this years convention.
 

When Gabe gets the ball standing still, makes no moves or takes no dribbles before he shoots, he is one of the best 3-4 shooters in the entire country, he simply doesnt miss. But man when he takes even one side step/movement/dribble it is not good, its one of the craziest things I have seen.

I can't tell if the transfers need some time or are just who they are. Carr missed Oturu about 40 times on the PnR, Willis looks confident when he shoots but man his numbers are brutal the last two games. Demir is in the konate/diedhou model of worthless.

So far I think our best hope for the season is coming next Wednesday, maybe we can get Garcia to reclassify!
he was not even close to being one of the best free throw shooters in the big ten last season
 

Really hard for me to believe that we couldn't find a top juco kid to play the 4 and offer him a starting spot on a Big Ten team.
Were we just looking for a one year grad transfer rental player? It's only a few games, but Demir needs to earn his playing time. Or will he be another one who plays because "who else do we have?"
 




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