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  1. #256

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bayfieldgopher View Post
    Here's the thing. Why is OK for the Flecksters to not have to defend their opinions but its always necessary to have those with doubts or concerns to fess up? The OP is a good example of this chiding the Fleck Critics when they are going to buy in. Huh? Where is it written that every Gopher fan needs to buy in to Fleck's way of doing things?

    Fleck himself has stated that he is not for everyone? He gets it. So why is that its so hard for you and others to accept?

    All that matters is the players and administration appreciate Fleck, his style and approach. Who cares what others think.

    I have been a ST holder for decades, go to away games and cheer as hard for the team as anyone. I have been waiting a very, very long time for the Gophers to win big and often and hope that Fleck will get us there.
    I can only speak for myself. If you don't like PJ, fine. Please do call him out when he misstates something or (clutches pearls) LIES. I only jumped in this thread because some absolute Tool was literally OFFENDED by PJ "Mr Positivity and trying to help everyone be their best and spend time with kids with cancer" Fleck. It's astounding. It needs to be absolutely blasted as the most preposterous statement I've ever read on this board.


  2. #257

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    Quote Originally Posted by mjfelton15 View Post
    Hold on, just because “Fleck was hired to win” does not mean he’s going to just hop off the damn plane from western Michigan and all of a sudden the Gophers are f’ing stellar. And Fleck said it was year zero because it wasn’t his recruiting classes, it wasn’t players that knew his coaching style, new playbooks, etc. Also, Fleck came into Minnesota with Demry Croft and Connor Rhoda....you’re saying he didn’t walk into a bit of a **** storm? Those two sucked ass. I’d say the only schools that could switch coaching staffs, and come back with the same strength the next season, are teams like OSU, Clemson, Bama. I’m not saying Fleck is the answer to get us to a national championship team, I’m not saying he’s not. But you know Kill and Claeys were never going to get us there. We lost Kill to medical issues, sadly, because I did enjoy what he created here. Even if it wasn’t going to be what made us a top tier team. Claeys was an uninspiring blob on the sideline that looked as confused at points in the game as those wives that get dragged along to a football game that don’t know what roughing the passer means, or how many points a team gets for a touchdown. Claeys would not have recruited at a level capable of sustaining anything great here. Also, to say Fleck’s challenges pale in comparison is inaccurate. I think the expectations of Fleck are way higher. Fans expect him to win back all the rivalry trophies, they expect him to start grabbing 4-5 star recruits, they expect a Big Ten Championship, they want a Rose Bowl. He has his team at 6-0, easy schedule or not, it’s not an easy task in the college football world. What were the expectations put on Jerry Kill, or Tracy Claeys? Not have a losing record? Keep rivalry games close? Maybe snag a win against a decent Iowa team? Have close losses with TCU or Michigan? Kill might not have complained while he was coach here, but he didn’t make himself look to mature after he left. He’s openly gone after Fleck, even when Fleck has never publicly insulted Kill. In fact I believe he’s been quoted praising Kill. What about Fleck has you so triggered?


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    To be fair Jerry Kill had this program on the right track. He and Fleck are basically on the same trajectory. Kill did it by coaching up kids and by having excellent defenses. PJ is trying to do it with better recruits and an offense that can move the ball at will.

    I wouldn't say Kill had no chance to get this program where you wanted them to be. He took them to a New Years Day bowl game and they were competiitve with teams in their division. Also, just a FYI, but Minnesota will never play for a National Championship. They just don't get the recruits and never will. Unless you want to get involved with pay for play like the SEC and THE OHIO STATE does, the best you can hope for it a top finish in the BT and New Years day bowl.

  3. #258

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    Quote Originally Posted by Section2 View Post
    I can only speak for myself. If you don't like PJ, fine. Please do call him out when he misstates something or (clutches pearls) LIES. I only jumped in this thread because some absolute Tool was literally OFFENDED by PJ "Mr Positivity and trying to help everyone be their best and spend time with kids with cancer" Fleck. It's astounding. It needs to be absolutely blasted as the most preposterous statement I've ever read on this board.
    You've several times now stated "lies" or LIES. Pray tell, what else do you call it when someone intentionally states something that they know isn't true?

  4. #259

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    Quote Originally Posted by Go Gophs View Post
    Also, just a FYI, but Minnesota will never play for a National Championship.
    Stupid. No one ever said it would be easy - nothing worth accomplishing ever is.

  5. #260
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    Gophers have an undefeated team.

    And yet some fans are upset, because other fans don't love the head coach as much as they do.

    that is like my brother getting mad at me because I don't like Adam Sandler movies, and he thinks "Happy Gilmore" is a work of art.

    different people can have different opinions.

    you cannot force someone to share your opinion. (well, I guess you could use torture, but that might be a bit excessive....)

  6. #261

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    Quote Originally Posted by dpodoll68 View Post
    You've several times now stated "lies" or LIES. Pray tell, what else do you call it when someone intentionally states something that they know isn't true?
    I don't "know" that for a fact, that he knowingly states something that is objectively untrue. I've always assumed that PJ tries to spin things that are technically true in some way. Maybe that's wrong, but that's my impression. It's possible that he was mistaken.

    So they are "lies" or LIES. I give him the benefit of the doubt, if you don't want to, that's ok. Neither of us has proof. But it's not offensive either way.

  7. #262

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    Quote Originally Posted by Section2 View Post
    I don't "know" that for a fact, that he knowingly states something that is objectively untrue. I've always assumed that PJ tries to spin things that are technically true in some way. Maybe that's wrong, but that's my impression. It's possible that he was mistaken.

    So they are "lies" or LIES. I give him the benefit of the doubt, if you don't want to, that's ok. Neither of us has proof. But it's not offensive either way.
    How is "won 4 of the past 5 games" in any way spin? I'd love to know a way in which that's not objectively untrue. And how could he not know that it was a false statement before he said it? He's either lying or stupid - neither paints him a favorable light. That's just the most easily refutable lie - there are many others. Spin away on things that are subjective. Don't lie on things that are objective and demonstrably false.

    To be clear, the reason this sh1t bothers me so much is that, in my mind, it takes Fleck's performance to date at the U from a 100 to a 95. Everything else is great and continuing to trend very positively in the right direction. As you've accurately stated, it serves no purpose and does nothing to advance the cause. There is no upside and only drawbacks. But make no mistake, he is lying, not "lying" or LYING.

  8. #263

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    Quote Originally Posted by dpodoll68 View Post
    How is "won 4 of the past 5 games" in any way spin? I'd love to know a way in which that's not objectively untrue. And how could he not know that it was a false statement before he said it? He's either lying or stupid - neither paints him a favorable light. That's just the most easily refutable lie - there are many others. Spin away on things that are subjective. Don't lie on things that are objective and demonstrably false.

    To be clear, the reason this sh1t bothers me so much is that, in my mind, it takes Fleck's performance to date at the U from a 100 to a 95. Everything else is great and continuing to trend very positively in the right direction. As you've accurately stated, it serves no purpose and does nothing to advance the cause. There is no upside and only drawbacks. But make no mistake, he is lying, not "lying" or LYING.
    It's not, won 4 of 5 is either a misstatement or a lie. the percentage of the roster stuff, there are a handful of other things that sound like spin, and I assume there's some lens to view the statement where at least PJ believes it's technically true.

    My point isn't whether the things he's said are true or false, but whether he thinks they are true or false.

  9. #264

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    Quote Originally Posted by short ornery norwegian View Post
    Gophers have an undefeated team.

    And yet some fans are upset, because other fans don't love the head coach as much as they do.

    that is like my brother getting mad at me because I don't like Adam Sandler movies, and he thinks "Happy Gilmore" is a work of art.

    different people can have different opinions.

    you cannot force someone to share your opinion. (well, I guess you could use torture, but that might be a bit excessive....)
    No fans are upset because of this.

    Try reading post #131.

    It has nothing to do with how anyone feels about Fleck.
    Last edited by scools12; 10-16-2019 at 02:53 PM.

  10. #265

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    Quote Originally Posted by Section2 View Post
    I can only speak for myself. If you don't like PJ, fine. Please do call him out when he misstates something or (clutches pearls) LIES. I only jumped in this thread because some absolute Tool was literally OFFENDED by PJ "Mr Positivity and trying to help everyone be their best and spend time with kids with cancer" Fleck. It's astounding. It needs to be absolutely blasted as the most preposterous statement I've ever read on this board.
    And you wonder why I question your reading comprehension? I never claimed any of those things offended me - although you claimed I did 3 times now. Please, continue. I understand with each post why PJ’s lies don’t bother you.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Consensus Top 25 Class, 4 of final 5, 80% underclassmen, Youngest Team, 2nd Youngest Team, Best Back-To-Back Classes Ever, 9 Scholarship Seniors, HS Teacher, 8-Hour Radius, Major Paycut

  11. #266

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    Quote Originally Posted by Section2 View Post
    It's not, won 4 of 5 is either a misstatement or a lie.
    He has said it many times and still you think it could be a misstatement. THAT is why you are a Fleckster. One with very poor reading skills unfortunately.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Consensus Top 25 Class, 4 of final 5, 80% underclassmen, Youngest Team, 2nd Youngest Team, Best Back-To-Back Classes Ever, 9 Scholarship Seniors, HS Teacher, 8-Hour Radius, Major Paycut

  12. #267

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    Post #131 is underrated.

    I went back and read it. If I could "like" a post, I would like that one multiple times.


    I'm fine with a coach "coach-speaking" or "lying" about 5 out of six wins if he goes out and then does was he was lying about.
    We are well past winning 5 out of our last 6 at this point, so even if that lie bothered me, I'd probably be okay with it now.

    I hope he lies about wanting to make the CFP next.
    "Do Not Be Afraid to Be A Legend"

  13. #268

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  14. #269

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spoofin View Post
    Just so I understand - these “high horse crusaders” are those that don’t see things the same as you, right?

    And, the things that these folks are compelled to keep talking about have been deemed “insignificant” by you, right?

    Whew, you go after those self-righteous jerks.
    Your stance on this particular issue has been abundantly clear to even the most casual of observers, even prior to the proliferation of posts in this thread.
    - Respect is the ultimate currency

  15. #270

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    Quote Originally Posted by MennoSota View Post
    I still find the RTB, HYPPER, FAMILY, and ELITE acronyms to be hokie. Get the beaver tail off the helmet and enough with the anthracite. These things will not impress me. They are unnecessary for public consumption.
    That being said. I appreciate winning so if Fleck keeps winning I will appreciate the results. I won't become a lover of silly acronyms, however.
    Fleck doesn’t need all that crap — and that IS what it is, crap — to win. He could win just as well as he is right now, with plain/traditional uniforms, and without all the jargon. Kids don’t buy into that, no matter what he says.

    Kids do buy into the family/values/doing the right thing/working hard stuff, when it works, and most importantly winning! Fleck has all that to offer, along with a decent scheme, and great recruiting/eye for talent. He doesn’t need all the weirdness.

    An ideal model for him, that I wish he would more closely emulate, is James Franklin at Penn St.

    Would highly recommend watching the inside look at their program this season on HBO. They’re doing things right there.


    But in the end, of course I’m going to take the wins.

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