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  1. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by bottlebass View Post
    There obviously is a defensible argument or he'd be on every top 5 list ever. If you happened to search for some of those lists you'd see he probably isn't even on all the top 10 lists and he definitely isn't on most top 5 lists. All the stats you mentioned are all just padded because of the team he's been on and the system they run. He's had sh!tty defenses and has been forced his whole career to go out and win games in the 4th qtr while other QBs like manning and brady enjoyed the leads they built up and could sit back in the 4th qtr. And you are using stats that are more important in todays game than they were even just 20 years ago.

    It's pretty easy to complete short passes with only 1 ring on your finger.

    And for the record I'd also argue Brady as the GOAT.
    It's for another argument, but it's crazy to think that Brady could be considered greatest quarterback of all time in the NFL, and not even in the top 300/400/500 (just throwing those numbers out there) in college football.


  2. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by bottlebass View Post
    LOL. Top 15 sure. Top 10 maybe, you could definitely argue it and make a case. Top 5, laughable. I mean you are talking ever right? All time? Not just in the league right now?
    Quote Originally Posted by dpodoll68 View Post
    I would argue that Brady is #1, and it's pretty easy to defend that, but Brees is closer to #1 than #5 and it's not close. There's no defensible argument that he's not in the top 5.
    The argument for Brees being a top-5 QB slides if he never had won a Super Bowl. He'd have never have won a Super Bowl without Bounty Gate, and without the referees favoring the Saints in the NFC title game. Given that, Brees' one Super Bowl win is heavily tainted, and arguably should be removed altogether. Is Brees an all-time great, and worthy of consideration among the all-time greats? Sure. Top-5 in a bunch of statistics? Sure. But all of those great stats have also come after the passing era in the NFL came of age. There are a lot of modern QBs who are accumulating at the top of the all-time passing statistics leaderboards. I personally find leadership and winning to be as important as statistics when it comes to all-time-greatest QBs.

    So is Brees a top-5 all-time QB? eh... I'm not convinced.
    Last edited by cncmin; 08-10-2019 at 09:55 PM.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by dpodoll68 View Post
    I would argue that Brady is #1, and it's pretty easy to defend that, but Brees is closer to #1 than #5 and it's not close. There's no defensible argument that he's not in the top 5.
    Good lord you are looney and self-absorbed. I can think of more than 5 off the top of my head.

    Try normalizing stats by era and compare. You're aren't smart enough to figure that out. Nevermind.

    Go back to the Oreos and Doritos.

  4. #34

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gopherlife View Post
    It's for another argument, but it's crazy to think that Brady could be considered greatest quarterback of all time in the NFL, and not even in the top 300/400/500 (just throwing those numbers out there) in college football.
    Agreed, the bigger debate with Brady is whether Brady really turned out to be that good or if Belichick is really that good. I honestly hope when Brady retires so does Bill so we never know.
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  5. #35
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    Statistically, Brees is top 5, but overall, I would put Elway, Manning, Montana, Marino and Brady ahead of him.

  6. #36

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    Back to the vikings. Traded for a kicker?
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  7. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by cncmin View Post
    The argument for Brees being a top-5 QB slides if he never had won a Super Bowl. He'd have never have won a Super Bowl without Bounty Gate, and without the referees favoring the Saints in the NFC title game. Given that, Brees' one Super Bowl win is heavily tainted, and arguably should be removed altogether. Is Brees an all-time great, and worthy of consideration among the all-time greats? Sure. Top-5 in a bunch of statistics? Sure. But all of those great stats have also come after the passing era in the NFL came of age. There are a lot of modern QBs who are accumulating at the top of the all-time passing statistics leaderboards. I personally find leadership and winning to be as important as statistics when it comes to all-time-greatest QBs.

    So is Brees a top-5 all-time QB? eh... I'm not convinced.
    You are really jaded by that loss to the Saints.
    "Do Not Be Afraid to Be A Legend"

  8. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by Face The Facts View Post
    You are really jaded by that loss to the Saints.
    Isn't every vikings fan?
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  9. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by bottlebass View Post
    Isn't every vikings fan?
    Not to that degree.
    Let's move on already. That was a decade ago.
    I didn't like the officiating in that game but it was an epic game and to be honest, probably one of the last great football games where hitting was allowed.

    We sound like a bunch of whiners (and some of us are) when we act like the rest of the nation doesn't acknowledge that Super Bowl victory for the Saints.
    "Do Not Be Afraid to Be A Legend"

  10. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by Face The Facts View Post
    Not to that degree.
    Let's move on already. That was a decade ago.
    I didn't like the officiating in that game but it was an epic game and to be honest, probably one of the last great football games where hitting was allowed.

    We sound like a bunch of whiners (and some of us are) when we act like the rest of the nation doesn't acknowledge that Super Bowl victory for the Saints.
    The minneapolis miracle was a nice little pay back that felt pretty good, we totally should not have won that game just like the Saints shouldn't have won and gone to the super bowl.

    Every franchise has games like this that live on and are always talked about. My buddies and I still yell "wide left" whenever someone misses something left (out golfing and missing the green left or a drive left of the fairway etc). The saints game and bounty gate is just one of those games.
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  11. #41
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    Vikings o line gave up zero sacks and led the way for over 200 rush yards in the preseason game! Qb's passed for 247 yards and 3 td's. Preseason you'd rather look good than bad and we looked good on offense.

    Hercules has a sack and 2 tfl. Can he really play DT at 255 lbs?

  12. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by bottlebass View Post
    Back to the vikings. Traded for a kicker?
    The guy has potential, no doubt about it. We'll see if it works out.

    Meanwhile, Daniel Carlson is looking like the most fortunate pickup in the world for the Raiders. Carlson was fantastic for the Raiders last year and could be their kicker for the foreseeable future. It seemed like the appropriate move for the Vikings to cut bait with him at the time, given the goals the team still had for the season, but MAN, it's looking like a mistake now.
    - Respect is the ultimate currency

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ogee Oglethorpe View Post
    The guy has potential, no doubt about it. We'll see if it works out.

    Meanwhile, Daniel Carlson is looking like the most fortunate pickup in the world for the Raiders. Carlson was fantastic for the Raiders last year and could be their kicker for the foreseeable future. It seemed like the appropriate move for the Vikings to cut bait with him at the time, given the goals the team still had for the season, but MAN, it's looking like a mistake now.
    It's OK. We just traded a 5th round pick to the Ravens for a guy who's a kicker AND a punter. Or either. Or possibly neither. Zimm had Dan Bailey holding for FG's today. Um...what? Just bring back Kai Forbath already and call it a day.

  14. #44

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    Quote Originally Posted by howeda7 View Post
    It's OK. We just traded a 5th round pick to the Ravens for a guy who's a kicker AND a punter. Or either. Or possibly neither. Zimm had Dan Bailey holding for FG's today. Um...what? Just bring back Kai Forbath already and call it a day.
    The kicking game will forever be a distraction for Zim and he'll have nightmares about it until the day he dies.
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  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by bottlebass View Post
    The kicking game will forever be a distraction for Zim and he'll have nightmares about it until the day he dies.
    We hired a kicking game coordinator to keep Zim away from them. I guess it didn't work.

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