STrib: MIAC rivals plot ouster of St. Thomas

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short ornery norwegian said:
And - to Winona Gopher - I saw someone on another thread claiming that St. Thomas could petition the NCAA for permission to jump directly to D1 because they were forced out of their current conference. I have no idea if that's accurate, but that's what the poster was claiming.
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That could strain the NCAA's Wheel of Random Decisions.

A more realistic option might be joining the D-II Northern Sun. Augie is planning to go DI for the 21-22 season (I think also joining the Summit) so they could take their place.
 

Ope3 said:
Your are confusing "no sources" with "anonymous" sources.
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If they had actual anonymous sources they wouldn’t have posted everything with the words “might” “sounds like” “possibly”


They were trying to smoke out the story to gain an actual source. It played in st thomas’ favor because of this ImO which is okay because my bias lies with st Thomas.

Just not a huge fan of the news trying to make news more than report it.
 

MennoSota said:
All 13 Presidents agreed to a removal of St Thomas from the MIAC by Spring 2021. Go to the Football thread to see the documentation.
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I know.
My post was in response to a post about whether people still question the star tribune even after their rumors turned out to be true.


I was posting to say, the rumors were true and I still think the star tribune handled the story poorly
 

Some guy said:
I know.
My post was in response to a post about whether people still question the star tribune even after their rumors turned out to be true.


I was posting to say, the rumors were true and I still think the star tribune handled the story poorly
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Thanks for the clarification.
 

St Bens and St Johns Presidents both publicly stated to their students they did not support this. Did they really go back on what they said?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 


Some guy said:
If they had actual anonymous sources they wouldn’t have posted everything with the words “might” “sounds like” “possibly”


They were trying to smoke out the story to gain an actual source. It played in st thomas’ favor because of this ImO which is okay because my bias lies with st Thomas.

Just not a huge fan of the news trying to make news more than report it.
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None of those were used in Reusse's article that is on the original post of this thread.
 

When the going gets tough...teach kids to tuck their tails between their legs, pout like a little bitch, and send the "tough" packing. What an absolutely despicable example of how to retreat and blubber in the face of adversity. The MIAC school President's must be very proud of their "leadership".
 

Ope3 said:
None of those were used in Reusse's article that is on the original post of this thread.
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I’m not talking about one particular story.

Ruesse I actually have the least problem with because he is a columnist not a reporter anyways. My issue is probably with the editing more than the writing
 

Slim Tubby said:
When the going gets tough...teach kids to tuck their tails between their legs, pout like a little bitch, and send the "tough" packing. What an absolutely despicable example of how to retreat and blubber in the face of adversity. The MIAC school President's must be very proud of their "leadership".
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So, St. Thomas has a D2 level budget, and most of their facilities are D2-level quality, but they want to stay in a D3 conference. and they're the victim?

A conference is more than just teams that agree to schedule each other. It's about schools that have a common approach and generally share the same values. In the MIAC, you have 10 or more schools that all have a relatively similar approach to balancing athletics and academics. And then you have one school that has built up its athletic budget and facilities to a point that is completely out of balance with the rest of the league. A school that has its football games broadcast on a 50,000 watt clear-channel radio station. And they're the victim?

This is not just about the score of one or two football games. it's about one school that has gone in a completely different direction than the rest of the conference, and you want to blame the other schools for not following.
 



short ornery norwegian said:
So, St. Thomas has a D2 level budget, and most of their facilities are D2-level quality, but they want to stay in a D3 conference. and they're the victim?

A conference is more than just teams that agree to schedule each other. It's about schools that have a common approach and generally share the same values. In the MIAC, you have 10 or more schools that all have a relatively similar approach to balancing athletics and academics. And then you have one school that has built up its athletic budget and facilities to a point that is completely out of balance with the rest of the league. A school that has its football games broadcast on a 50,000 watt clear-channel radio station. And they're the victim?

This is not just about the score of one or two football games. it's about one school that has gone in a completely different direction than the rest of the conference, and you want to blame the other schools for not following.
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Holy **** they have their games on the radio? Thinking Baudette Tech should probably go D1 too
 

MinnGopher said:
Holy **** they have their games on the radio? Thinking Baudette Tech should probably go D1 too
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On a major station(WCCO), in a 3Mil + market, just like the Baudette broadcasts.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
So, St. Thomas has a D2 level budget, and most of their facilities are D2-level quality, but they want to stay in a D3 conference. and they're the victim?

A conference is more than just teams that agree to schedule each other. It's about schools that have a common approach and generally share the same values. In the MIAC, you have 10 or more schools that all have a relatively similar approach to balancing athletics and academics. And then you have one school that has built up its athletic budget and facilities to a point that is completely out of balance with the rest of the league. A school that has its football games broadcast on a 50,000 watt clear-channel radio station. And they're the victim?

This is not just about the score of one or two football games. it's about one school that has gone in a completely different direction than the rest of the conference, and you want to blame the other schools for not following.
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This is so spot on.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
So, St. Thomas has a D2 level budget, and most of their facilities are D2-level quality, but they want to stay in a D3 conference. and they're the victim?

A conference is more than just teams that agree to schedule each other. It's about schools that have a common approach and generally share the same values. In the MIAC, you have 10 or more schools that all have a relatively similar approach to balancing athletics and academics. And then you have one school that has built up its athletic budget and facilities to a point that is completely out of balance with the rest of the league. A school that has its football games broadcast on a 50,000 watt clear-channel radio station. And they're the victim?

This is not just about the score of one or two football games. it's about one school that has gone in a completely different direction than the rest of the conference, and you want to blame the other schools for not following.
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Thank you, I love how everyone is ripping the Davids and calling Goliath a victim. St. Thomas doesn't fit anymore. Move on and go to a different neighborhood. Not a bad thing against anyone involved. Just facts and truths.
 



jovs said:
On a major station(WCCO), in a 3Mil + market, just like the Baudette broadcasts.
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Yeah compared to Baudette its probably the Mecca of radio...is having a radio broadcast that beneficial to college programs? Lol

He does make valid points but at the end of the day it is because they are throttling everyone and people don't like it. If they would continue over another 6-10 years to whack everyone in the MIAC? Yeah you would probably have a much better case to boot them then, but there has been other similar runs of dominance in almost all sports by schools that aren't named UST. Teams have achieved that success without spending like UST before and it wasn't viewed as a problem.

That and come on just say you don't like getting your ass kicked. If they obliterated everyone for another 6-10, yeah I would get it, but I don't at this point.
 

MinnGopher said:
Yeah compared to Baudette its probably the Mecca of radio...is having a radio broadcast that beneficial to college programs? Lol

He does make valid points but at the end of the day it is because they are throttling everyone and people don't like it. If they would continue over another 6-10 years to whack everyone in the MIAC? Yeah you would probably have a much better case to boot them then, but there has been other similar runs of dominance in almost all sports by schools that aren't named UST. Teams have achieved that success without spending like UST before and it wasn't viewed as a problem.

That and come on just say you don't like getting your ass kicked. If they obliterated everyone for another 6-10, yeah I would get it, but I don't at this point.
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They have over double the amount of "all sports' trophies than anyone else. So adding 6 more of those to 61 all sport trophies would be the tipping point?
 

Siouxfan said:
Don’t personally believe the MIAC is out to get St Thomas. UST asked to be kicked out IMHO to move up and galvanize their fans for a move and the MIAC is obliging as the courteous admin thing to do.

What could a UST hockey team, which can’t play DII, do at DI? They could rival Duluth and St Cloud soon.

UST has been seen as a Marquette in waiting by Sid Hartman. Just 20 years to late.

DII isn’t good enough for UST, but they must pass through it for 8 years by rule to reach DI in everything.
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The MVC sees $ signs all over because of the MSP tv market.

UST is the school they want because it would offer major TV contract $s.

UST got out of the MIAC discretely because of its insistence as it didn’t want to torque off its own DIII fans. Now the whole school fan base will be together and supportive. Ingenious of the admin but dishonest.

The MVC won’t take a new DII school, so this will take more than a decade to play out. Loyola Chicago was taken by the MVC just a few years ago and the MVC won major $s because of it.

The Big East is probably that maximum for UST, but that if they win. UST already compares favorably to Creighton, Marquette, and DePaul. The MIAC is no longer the right academic league because UST increasingly a STEM, business and law school like much of the Big East.
 
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FWIW - my point in mentioning the radio coverage on WCCO -

there is an advertising value to having your name/logo mentioned or shown on the media. On TV, there is a formula for it - they can actually determine the equivalent value of advertising that it is worth. So, for St. Thomas - having their school talked about multiple times during the week on the morning show (Dave Lee promoting the games) - and having a 3-hour plus block of coverage on Saturday - that translates to an advertising value - promoting St. Thomas and its football program.

I don't know what it would cost to buy a 3-hour bloc of airtime on WCCO, but I bet it's not cheap. St. Thomas is getting that every week during the season. A value that no other team in the conference receives. Now, Gustavus has its games on KNUJ out of New Ulm, but it's not quite the same. (no disrespect meant to Tom Wheeler at KNUJ - he does a better job on play-by-play than Dave Lee).
 

SVP chimes in:

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Go Gophers!!
 




manderson1984 said:
They have over double the amount of "all sports' trophies than anyone else. So adding 6 more of those to 61 all sport trophies would be the tipping point?
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Does 61 not include boys and girls? Also it would be 12 more minimum because I am referencing their success in girls as well.
 

per Shooter:

It’s likely the University of St. Thomas is ultimately headed for Division I athletics. That will take some required time in Division II, but the Tommies have some extremely deep-pocketed alumni willing to do what it takes.

The uncertainty of the Tommies’ future has to be a recruiting concern.

St. Thomas’ expulsion from the MIAC has become a national story. Now, the buzz at St. John’s is that some MIAC athletics directors have expressed concern that the Johnnies have 680 student-athletes among their 11 sports, and there’s fear that might be too many to remain in the conference.

https://www.twincities.com/2019/05/...wner-jim-pohlad-excited-with-a-grain-of-salt/

Go Gophers!!
 


BleedGopher said:
per Shooter:

It’s likely the University of St. Thomas is ultimately headed for Division I athletics. That will take some required time in Division II, but the Tommies have some extremely deep-pocketed alumni willing to do what it takes.

The uncertainty of the Tommies’ future has to be a recruiting concern.

St. Thomas’ expulsion from the MIAC has become a national story. Now, the buzz at St. John’s is that some MIAC athletics directors have expressed concern that the Johnnies have 680 student-athletes among their 11 sports, and there’s fear that might be too many to remain in the conference.

https://www.twincities.com/2019/05/...wner-jim-pohlad-excited-with-a-grain-of-salt/

Go Gophers!!
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How many of that 680 are on the football team of which many will never ever get close to being on the field no matter what the score, I am assuming that all are still welcome and no one is cut.
 

jovs said:
How many of that 680 are on the football team of which many will never ever get close to being on the field no matter what the score, I am assuming that all are still welcome and no one is cut.
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they are always between 175-200 players on the roster.
heck even baseball this season had close to 50 guys on the roster
 

Gophs24 said:
they are always between 175-200 players on the roster.
heck even baseball this season had close to 50 guys on the roster
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Sounds really unfair to me. When will the Johnnies get expelled?
 

Holy Man said:
Sounds really unfair to me. When will the Johnnies get expelled?
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Yes, a lack of fairness on one side, and a total lack of self awareness on the other side by StT. Really, no ability to reach some sort of mutual resolution with the conference ahead of a vote by the presidents? You didn't see the freight train blaring its horn at you for the last few years before it ran you over?

This whole thing is akin the UND nickname/logo issue with the NCAA and tribes. When your response is arrogance and lack of effort, these things happen. The consolation prize, plenty of sympathy I guess, based on most people's comments here.
 
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Herd said:
Yes, a lack of fairness on one side, and a total lack of self awareness on the other side by StT. Really, no ability to reach some sort of mutual resolution with the conference ahead of a vote by the presidents? You didn't see the freight train blaring its horn at you for the last few years before it ran you over?

This whole thing is akin the UND nickname/logo issue with the NCAA and tribes. When your response is arrogance and lack of effort, these things happen. The consolation prize, plenty of sympathy I guess, based on most people's comments here.
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You have no idea what kind of outreach or tone the UST administration has communicated with to other MIAC schools.

UST has ambition, something this market is often suspicious of. They want to grow into something bigger while St. Olaf and many others within the MIAC want to stay the same. Both approaches are fine, so long as stakeholders are being served.

Signing up to be an MIAC member shouldn’t consign one to an eternity of sameness. That’s actually pretty ridiculous to me.

UND comp is horrendous. I’d delete that if I were you. That’s a school that was behind the times and not understanding the impact a name can have on a community. UST’s model is progressive, by MIAC standards. Would love to see Bethel follow suit.


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Siouxfan said:
UST got out of the MIAC discretely because of its insistence as it didn’t want to torque off its own DIII fans. Now the whole school fan base will be together and supportive. Ingenious of the admin but dishonest.
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You are the first person I've seen post on this topic that gets this.
 

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