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  1. #1

    Default QBs who are "too short", passes knocked down

    Interesting exploration of long-standing conventional attitudes regarding shorter quarterbacks and passes knocked down at the line of scrimmage.

    https://www.sbnation.com/2019/2/15/1...y-height-short
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  2. #2
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    Isn't there something to being 4-8 inches shorter than your offensive linemen too? Doesn't that make it difficult to see your receivers? Also, the article using Kirk Cousins as an example of a tall QB who had passes batted is funny - the Vikings had one of the all-time worst O-lines last year. Not sure I'd put that all on Cousins.
    I wish Murray the best, but I just don't see him being a great NFL quarterback.

  3. #3
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    it's not just about the height of the QB. It's about the arm slot, release angle, and the scheme. set up plays to create passing lanes. use roll-outs and play-action.

    Fran Tarkenton was not very tall, but he was very effective.

    And, I suspect defenses have made this more of an emphasis in recent years.

    Would be interesting to see historical data on batted balls.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Word View Post
    Isn't there something to being 4-8 inches shorter than your offensive linemen too? Doesn't that make it difficult to see your receivers? Also, the article using Kirk Cousins as an example of a tall QB who had passes batted is funny - the Vikings had one of the all-time worst O-lines last year. Not sure I'd put that all on Cousins.
    I wish Murray the best, but I just don't see him being a great NFL quarterback.
    If a quarterback is, say, 2 inches shorter would that somehow be better than 4-8 inches shorter? Does a QB who is even just one inch shorter than his offensive lineman actually have a better view downfield than one who is 4-8 inches shorter?

    Kyle Murray has had a pretty good college career as a quarterback, despite his lack of height. So... does that mean that the lineman at Oklahoma are substantially shorter than NFL linemen, enabling the 5'10" Murray a better view down field?

    I don't know the actual stats on this, but if I had to guess I'd bet that the average lineman — offensive as well as defensive — is taller than the average QB, in college and in the NFL.

    If so... does that hamper the QB's vision downfield?
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  5. #5
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    What a great non-article about a non-issue. It's about ability.

    Drew Brees.
    Gopher football fan since 1924. DNA-wise.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by highwayman View Post
    What a great non-article about a non-issue. It's about ability.

    Drew Brees.
    To be fair, I think that's exactly the point. I believe the author is saying that height is way over-rated as a factor.
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    "7 National Titles...

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  7. #7
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    Default QBs who are "too short", passes knocked down

    Quote Originally Posted by short ornery norwegian View Post
    it's not just about the height of the QB. It's about the arm slot, release angle, and the scheme. set up plays to create passing lanes. use roll-outs and play-action.

    Fran Tarkenton was not very tall, but he was very effective.

    And, I suspect defenses have made this more of an emphasis in recent years.

    Would be interesting to see historical data on batted balls.
    Also look at Kirk Cousins. Not short but lower release point and has a high number of passes batted down. He had this issue in Washington too so the vikings oline wasn't the issue.


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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Word View Post
    Isn't there something to being 4-8 inches shorter than your offensive linemen too? Doesn't that make it difficult to see your receivers? Also, the article using Kirk Cousins as an example of a tall QB who had passes batted is funny - the Vikings had one of the all-time worst O-lines last year. Not sure I'd put that all on Cousins.
    I wish Murray the best, but I just don't see him being a great NFL quarterback.
    Cousins had this issue in Washington too so the vikings o line isn't the issue. Take a look at game tape and you can see his low release. It's been well documented.


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  9. #9
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    This is one of the dumbest articles I’ve read. The guys who get passed batted are immobile guys who sit in the pocket or are under center. Murray won’t be that because they will design the offense for him to not be, which you have to be 100% all in on if you draft him. No one isn’t taking him or is worried about him because he’ll “get passes batted “ but rather you have to have the game plan and personnel to execute a different style game plan with a short scrambling QB versus what you may have had prior

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    Wouldn’t touch him before third rd, then I’d make him a slot receiver.

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by upnorthkid View Post
    This is one of the dumbest articles I’ve read. The guys who get passed batted are immobile guys who sit in the pocket or are under center. Murray won’t be that because they will design the offense for him to not be, which you have to be 100% all in on if you draft him. No one isn’t taking him or is worried about him because he’ll “get passes batted “ but rather you have to have the game plan and personnel to execute a different style game plan with a short scrambling QB versus what you may have had prior
    To me, the article basically makes the claim that batted passes are more due to the trajectory of the throw, and that the trajectory of the throw is mainly based on the type of pass being thrown (among other factors). The Qb's height is far less important (according to the article).

    In my opinion the author makes a fairly reasonable case. Comparative examples, video, etc.

    And it does seem like NFL teams sometimes shy away from shorter QBs. At least the "draft experts" seem to talk about height a lot, especially in quarterbacks.
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    "7 National Titles...

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  12. #12

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    Batted balls also depend on the offensive scheme you play.

    For instance, the amount of RPO in college football likely has increased batted balls because d linemen are being taught to play for batted balls at time knowing they aren’t going to get to the quarterback.

    Quick passing games and RPOs are naturally going to have More batted balls than traditional schemes because linemen will play for batted balls rather than sacks

  13. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by highwayman View Post
    What a great non-article about a non-issue. It's about ability.

    Drew Brees.
    This board has a really hard time with understanding statistics. The fact that Drew Brees is 6'0" doesn't mean that height of a QB is a non-issue.

    It's something like 85% of American men are under 6'0", yet ~ 2% of NFL QBs are under 6'0".

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deckergopher View Post
    Wouldn’t touch him before third rd, then I’d make him a slot receiver.
    If I'm the Cards with Kingsbury, I take him #1 overall.

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by CentralGopher View Post
    Cousins had this issue in Washington too so the vikings o line isn't the issue. Take a look at game tape and you can see his low release. It's been well documented.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Yep, avoiding batted down passes is mostly about finding passing lanes in between your offensive lineman, something Kyler does very well.

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