D Coordinator Firing is a Scapegoat, Plain and Simple

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I don't think anyone realized it when it happened, but shutting out ranked and offensively powerful Fresno State for 3 quarters was the high water point of the Robb Smith era. What happened to that?
 

fmlizard said:
I don't think anyone realized it when it happened, but shutting out ranked and offensively powerful Fresno State for 3 quarters was the high water point of the Robb Smith era. What happened to that?
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Fresno lost their mind and RUTM for no reason.
 

MNVCGUY said:
I'll be honest, your takes are really hard to follow and make heads and tails of but I will do my best. You are acting like this is a knee jerk reaction which it isn't. When a defense gets lit up week after week the coordinator almost always gets fired.

You keep posting all this vague information about Fleck being the problem and him trying to use this move to deflect blame away from himself when the reality is that what happened here is exactly what happens at most other programs when one side of the ball is failing to get it done week after week.

What you seem to be implying is that Fleck was keeping Smith from running the defense the way he wanted to. Maybe you are super plugged in to know what goes on in the meeting rooms on a daily basis but I find it hard to believe you have that kind of access and as I said in another post I would be really surprised to see Fleck being heavily involved on defense because his entire coaching and playing background is on offense. Not saying Fleck doesn't have influence on both sides of the ball but the head coach simply doesn't have the time to completely control the gameplan on one side of the ball or the other because they have too many other weekly responsibilities to devote that kind of time to gameplanning.

What Fleck did in regards to Smith is not the same as what Brewster did with his revolving door coordinators.

Offense
2007-2008 - Dunbar - Brew made his first critical error hiring a spread guy who went away from what had been very effective on offense for years here in favor a more exciting spread attack that they were never able to recruit the receivers to run.
2009 - Fisch - Dunbar "resigned" but he would have been fired. Brew interviewed Horton but made a critical mistake again and decided on Fisch who came in and tried to run a scheme that was setup for the NFL and had no chance of working in college.
2010 - Horton - The best decision Brew made in his run on offense was finally hiring Horton a year later but by then it was too late for him to undo the damage done by the previous bad decisions on that side of the ball.

Defense
2007 - Withers - Came in with a really complex system but he wasn't fired, he chose to make a lateral move for to North Carolina after the season. Move made sense for him because he was from out there.
2008 - Roof - Hired Ted Roof who came in and did some good things before jumping ship when he got offered double what he was making at the U.
2009-2010 - Cosgrove - Was never all that popular with fans but at least provided some stability

So in all of that the only coordinator Brew "fired" was Dunbar but he made some mistakes in who he hired. Withers, Roof both left on their own. Fisch was a horrible decision and he went back to the NFL after one year. The coordinator revolving door under Brew was a big part of why he got fired when he did but it wasn't like he was just firing coaches left and right.
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Nice of you to admit the coordinator revolving door gets HCs fired. See fleck 2018
 


CharchyCharch said:
Nice of you to admit the coordinator revolving door gets HCs fired. See fleck 2018
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So he gets rid of one coordinator in year 2 and that somehow qualifies as a revolving door similar to Brewster who had 6 different coordinators in 3.5 years....got it.
 


MNVCGUY said:
So he gets rid of one coordinator in year 2 and that somehow qualifies as a revolving door similar to Brewster who had 6 different coordinators in 3.5 years....got it.
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+1 for the box on alarmists.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
 


Face The Facts said:
Yeh, he basically says the Fleck recruits don't show promise, but then cites guys who were on defense as making progress, and then includes Durr who was not.

In the end, I'm thinking it might be Robb Smith himself (or Bryce Paup).
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I have given up trying to follow his line of thinking.
 

Winnipegopher said:
I am in favor of paragraphs.
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Reminded me of this classic:

“I see posts with interesting titles that I'd like to read but once I click, I end up with a wall of text and a headache. How annoying would it be if I wrote this entire post without pressing enter? Very annoying is the answer but it would also get across my point. Simply separating your points into individual paragraphs makes absorbing the information significantly easier for the reader. For example, this would've been a good spot for me to start a new paragraph since I've already stated my point above and am now trying to give examples of how beneficial it would be. You can even emphasize certain aspects of your post by leaving them in a separate paragraph. The human mind has a tendancy to categorize information into categories and a paragraph is a very visible form of categorization. When you see a new paragraph, you know to expect a new chapter of information and that helps digest everything you've read. Paragraphs also help avoiding redundancies. Writing the same point in a slightly different way isn't helpful and by separating your text into paragraphs you can avoid repetition. Using bold text can also separate and emphasize bits in a document which is helpful in getting your point across. Just to demonstrate how useful paragraphs are, I'm gonna write some gibberish here and see if anyone would even notice because I bet most everyone has already stopped torturing themselves. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, ea corpora pertinax duo, eu sint vocent diceret vim. Qui meis audire oportere et. Usu decore putant cu, te dicunt admodum efficiendi mea. Ad epicuri dissentias referrentur mei, ut mei paulo tantas. Facete consetetur mea ne, te mei volutpat vituperata deterruisset, eam corpora invidunt at. Ipsum dicta omnesque quo ne. That was just gibberish and not a Sombra code btw. Most important reason to use paragraphs however is simple courtesy. It's like pausing during a conversation, you wan to allow people time to understand your point and a non stop string of information is very annoying to comprehend. If for some reason you can't use paragraphs, at the very least have the courtesy to give us a tldr version of the text wall. That's all assuming you actually want people to read what you wrote. In any case, most people probably just skipped to this part, which is smart cuz the whole point I';m trying to make can be condensed into this; PLEASE Use Paragraphs.”

Source: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/overwatch/topic/20748556193

No offense meant to TrueGopherFballfan-1, who has every right to his position. Just a friendly suggestion.
 



scools12 said:
The idea of the OP is to wait until year four and if you’re still giving up yards and points near a historical level that is when you make a move with a coordinator.

Though it might not make any difference at that time since the HC is probably going to be fired anyway.

SMH
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Amen. Couldn’t be more spot on. Can we now shut this ridiculous thread down.
 

MrC said:
Reminded me of this classic:

“I see posts with interesting titles that I'd like to read but once I click, I end up with a wall of text and a headache. How annoying would it be if I wrote this entire post without pressing enter? Very annoying is the answer but it would also get across my point. Simply separating your points into individual paragraphs makes absorbing the information significantly easier for the reader. For example, this would've been a good spot for me to start a new paragraph since I've already stated my point above and am now trying to give examples of how beneficial it would be. You can even emphasize certain aspects of your post by leaving them in a separate paragraph. The human mind has a tendancy to categorize information into categories and a paragraph is a very visible form of categorization. When you see a new paragraph, you know to expect a new chapter of information and that helps digest everything you've read. Paragraphs also help avoiding redundancies. Writing the same point in a slightly different way isn't helpful and by separating your text into paragraphs you can avoid repetition. Using bold text can also separate and emphasize bits in a document which is helpful in getting your point across. Just to demonstrate how useful paragraphs are, I'm gonna write some gibberish here and see if anyone would even notice because I bet most everyone has already stopped torturing themselves. Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, ea corpora pertinax duo, eu sint vocent diceret vim. Qui meis audire oportere et. Usu decore putant cu, te dicunt admodum efficiendi mea. Ad epicuri dissentias referrentur mei, ut mei paulo tantas. Facete consetetur mea ne, te mei volutpat vituperata deterruisset, eam corpora invidunt at. Ipsum dicta omnesque quo ne. That was just gibberish and not a Sombra code btw. Most important reason to use paragraphs however is simple courtesy. It's like pausing during a conversation, you wan to allow people time to understand your point and a non stop string of information is very annoying to comprehend. If for some reason you can't use paragraphs, at the very least have the courtesy to give us a tldr version of the text wall. That's all assuming you actually want people to read what you wrote. In any case, most people probably just skipped to this part, which is smart cuz the whole point I';m trying to make can be condensed into this; PLEASE Use Paragraphs.”

Source: https://us.battle.net/forums/en/overwatch/topic/20748556193

No offense meant to TrueGopherFballfan-1, who has every right to his position. Just a friendly suggestion.
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Awesome
 

Ewert86PC said:
Is the Schiano tree all that good? The hire of the next D line coach and/or Defensive Coordinator should tell us if Fleck is Brewster 2.0.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
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Even that will be hard to say. If he gets a Roof quality DC who has the commitment to stay with the U, the result look should be longer, deeper, and catch and challenge the offense for team/locker room leadership.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
Next year will be year 3.
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And next year will only be 2 full recruiting classes. Gotta give Fleck more than that. His 2nd full recruiting class will be true freshman next year.


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TrueGopherFballfan#1 said:
Will this firing really solve anything? Hell no! The University of Minnesota put their trust in Fleck when they hired him, therefore they put trust into who he hires to fill these critical roles. Fleck hired Smith, and still oversaw the Defense in some capacity in these abysmal games where we gave up huge yardage plays to below average offenses and saw no improvement week in and week out. In the end, this goes back to Fleck. I think the NFL is different in this aspect of coaching, but college is different when it comes to hiring and firing of coordinators. We already seen in a past coaching regime here at Minnesota, one that shall go unnamed, where we went through offensive coordinators every year, changing coordinators after the first season. And how did that turnout? Did it solve anything? No. This is all but a scapegoat, and Smith is the sacrificial lamb taking the hit for mistakes that go through the entire coaching staff. Fleck is only in his second year, and all his coaches are only in their second year as well. We bring Fleck in, and we are willing to give him time to build this team up and trust in the process. You let this thing play out. You do not dismantle the process and place the blame on one person for issues that cycle through the whole team and the entire coaching staff. If you want Smith gone, might as well fire the entire coaching staff and start over because when we can't fix issues week after week after week of giving up 40 to 50 points to below average teams, there is an issue beyond Smith. To say that Fleck had no involvement whatsoever in how this defense has been performing and being coached is completely asinine. After the Maryland game, and then the Iowa game, two games where we gave up over 40 points, I highly doubt Fleck was just staying out of Smith's way and letting him do all the defensive coaching. Fleck still had influence in the past month of games to how our defense has played, and we have seen our defense, and some parts of our offense, deescalate. We have seen nothing but excuses out of Fleck about how young this team is, and how inexperienced they are, and that is true to some extent. We are a very young team, but there has been no sign of improvement, and these players are continuing to make the same mistakes when young teams like Purdue are improving on a weekly basis. This firing is nothing but another excuse. I am not saying to give up on Fleck. We must give him time. He is only in his second year, but he has issues beyond the Defensive Coordinator that needs to be addressed and issues that go back to him as the head coach of the Gopher football team. This is a scapegoat, and I fear Fleck is not going to take responsibility to fix issues within his own coaching strategy to help the program succeed in the future.

Disagree with me all you want, but it is what it is. A Scapegoat. Plain and Simple.
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Watched football before?
 

gopherveteran said:
This defense is largely the same defense that beat Washington State in the Holiday Bowl.
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Largely the same, except for the small detail that the following players started the game:

Hank Ekpe
Scott Ekpe
Steven Richardson
Jack Lynn
Blake Cashman
Jonathon Celestine
Jalen Myrick
Kunle Ayinde
Duke McGee
Damarius Travis
Coney Durr

So, yeah, if by largely the same you mean two starters who were both bench players all year (Durr, Cashman) who started because of suspension and injury, then I guess you're right. Coughlin and Martin came off the bench to play in that game.
 

tjgopher said:
Largely the same, except for the small detail that the following players started the game:

Hank Ekpe
Scott Ekpe
Steven Richardson
Jack Lynn
Blake Cashman
Jonathon Celestine
Jalen Myrick
Kunle Ayinde
Duke McGee
Damarius Travis
Coney Durr

So, yeah, if by largely the same you mean two starters who were both bench players all year (Durr, Cashman) who started because of suspension and injury, then I guess you're right. Coughlin and Martin came off the bench to play in that game.
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Yes. So exactly the same, and that was the greatest Gopher victory in 10 years.
Someday we hope to recapture the glory of beating a team like WSU that year.
 





I nominate this thread for the most stupid thread of the year!


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zman said:
Clearly a scapegoat.
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I thought the D would play better but never would have predicted that performance. Given that the personnel hasn't really changed you have to give Rossi a ton of credit for way the D played today. Hopefully it isn't a one week flash in the pan and that same D shows up next week against Northwestern and in a few weeks against Wisconsin. If it does we have a shot in both of those games.
 

Face The Facts said:
Yes. So exactly the same, and that was the greatest Gopher victory in 10 years.
Someday we hope to recapture the glory of beating a team like WSU that year.
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No one said it was the greatest Gopher victory in 10 years. We've only said winning 9 games, for the U of MN, is a heck of an accomplishment. We get it, you both like to pretend it's nothing and an unrealistic expectation at the same time.

Let this sink in, we think winning 9 games at the U of MN is a heck of an accomplishment. So do you. You just hate admitting it.
 



Bob_Loblaw said:
No one said it was the greatest Gopher victory in 10 years. We've only said winning 9 games, for the U of MN, is a heck of an accomplishment. We get it, you both like to pretend it's nothing and an unrealistic expectation at the same time.

Let this sink in, we think winning 9 games at the U of MN is a heck of an accomplishment. So do you. You just hate admitting it.
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The TC Gophers crapped the bed against PSU. That game was won and then the Masonesque collapse happened. If TC beats PSU he is still the coach today.
 





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