Report: Urban Meyer knew about 2015 domestic violence incident involving ex-assistant

Donate To GopherHole
KillerGopherFan said:
I thought the article that I linked in post #181 explained why the police report did denote it as an arrest and then changed it. Why is that not an understandable explanation for the change by McMurphy?

And Meyer said they were lying about the story in general and that someone had made it up entirely.
Click to expand...

There is no document with the box checks. Either he went with a secondhand or third hand account which seems most likely, or he made it up, or the police have 3 different versions.

He can’t produce the document which is damning as far as I’m concerned.
 

Mulligan said:
Good God, the column was mainly about how to face the attacks and deal with toxic atmosphere journalists are facing today. Do your job according to what you have been taught because it is your job to hold the powerful accountable. He isn't saying you have brought it on yourselves. It's basically an epistle to remain true to journalism standards, not a call for a reform. But continue to cherry pick in an effort to appear more rational than the rest of us.
Click to expand...

No, I’m saying that. If you think the media as a whole is doing a good job I don’t know what to tell you. Trust in media is at an all time low and it’s a self-inflicted wound. There needs to be a purge of the bad apples but the rot is so deep particularly at the national outlets I don’t see it happening. Look at this thread - how many are demanding balanced reporting with actual facts regarding applicability of Title IX, other supposed incidents (public record if they exist), etc. Instead we get chestbeating sensationalism from the majority of sports journalists rather than actual research and fact-checking. Ordinary citizens on Reddit are doing their job which is simply embarrassing. The disrespect is well-earned.
 

Think we about beat this one completely to death, yeah?

All there is to do now is wait to hear what the OSU panel announces.
 

Gophers_4life said:
Think we about beat this one completely to death, yeah?

All there is to do now is wait to hear what the OSU panel announces.
Click to expand...

As it seems likely OSU would primarily fire Meyer for PR reasons, or bringing unfavorable attention to the school rather than any material crime or lack of procedure, it seems like the job of anyone concerned about the truth is to try to balance out the carnival barkers in the media.

There are a few voices of reason. Bruce Feldman, Clay Travis, Tim May have been voices of moderation. Kirk Herbstreit - to his credit he’s never been much of an OSU homer and has been a moderate voice in this episode as well. As a long time listener of the Feldman and Mandel podcast it has become apparent Mandel is the reactionary hothead while Feldman is the voice of reason on a number of issues. We need less of the former and more of the latter in all areas of the media.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
No, I’m saying that. If you think the media as a whole is doing a good job I don’t know what to tell you. Trust in media is at an all time low and it’s a self-inflicted wound. There needs to be a purge of the bad apples but the rot is so deep particularly at the national outlets I don’t see it happening. Look at this thread - how many are demanding balanced reporting with actual facts regarding applicability of Title IX, other supposed incidents (public record if they exist), etc. Instead we get chestbeating sensationalism from the majority of sports journalists rather than actual research and fact-checking. Ordinary citizens on Reddit are doing their job which is simply embarrassing. The disrespect is well-earned.
Click to expand...

Some of what you say may be true, but a lot of the mistrust of media is due to people just not liking what they read and hear. The President of the United States screams "fake news" about every story he disagrees with. When some people - not all, but some - call for "balanced reporting," what they are saying is they want a story that matches their pre-determined opinion. that's not how it works.

granted, there are poor reporters - just like there are poor plumbers and poor coaches - but I believe the vast majority of reporters are trying to present accurate information. One of the issues is that journalism has changed. there used to be very distinct boundaries between news, analysis and opinion. Now, it tends to get blurred together, so that reporters are including opinions or analysis in a news story. That is really true in the sports world - its all about opinions. So, I don't think the state of journalism is as bleak as you paint it.
 


https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...s-urban-meyer-didnt-do-whats-right/934729002/

Doing what's required doesn’t necessarily mean you’ve done the right thing.

Ohio State is in the process of determining whether Urban Meyer met the school’s reporting requirements after learning in 2015 about more domestic violence allegations against then-assistant Zach Smith. Regardless of what the school finds, however, it’s clear Meyer fell far short of the moral high ground he likes to claim.

When Meyer found out Courtney Smith had again accused her husband of abuse – she provided former ESPN reporter Brett McMurphy with photos and text messages supporting the 2015 allegations – he should have alerted athletic director Gene Smith.

Then Meyer should have fired Zach Smith.

This was now a pattern, and Meyer damn well knew it. Smith had been arrested for beating his pregnant wife in 2009, when he was a graduate assistant on Meyer’s staff at Florida. In fact, Meyer said he and his wife Shelley had even counseled the young couple.

You can debate whether giving Smith a second chance in 2009 was the right thing to do. But when Meyer learned of additional allegations, it should have brought an immediate end to his benevolence. A man who hits, chokes and terrorizes his wife is not someone you want to associate with, let alone hold up as a role model for young men.

Especially in a program where “respect for women” is trumpeted as one of your core values.

Meyer issued a statement Friday saying he had followed Ohio State’s reporting procedures in 2015, an assertion that has the convenient advantage of both absolving himself and putting the blame on someone else. But Meyer’s excuse is the same one Joe Paterno gave for not reporting Jerry Sandusky to the authorities, and it’s as repugnant now as it was then.

Sure, they might have fulfilled their legal obligations. But what good is that if they also ignored the greater, moral one?

Meyer’s apologists will say policing the personal lives of his assistants is not his job, that he can’t control what someone does when he’s away from the Woody Hayes Athletic Center. You can’t have it both ways. If Meyer is going to tout his program as a model of accountability and responsibility, then he’d better make sure everyone is practicing what he's preaching.

And don’t tell me about “university procedure.” Meyer has a provision in his contract that gives him great latitude when it comes to hiring and firing his assistants. With one national title and a 73-8 record at Ohio State, if Meyer said he wanted Zach Smith gone, Gene Smith wouldn’t have tried to dissuade him. He’d have been too busy getting university counsel on the phone to draft a separation agreement.

But Meyer didn’t do that. For whatever reason – loyalty, ego, expedience – he enabled Zach Smith, allegedly following the letter of the law while flouting the spirit of it.

Passing judgment on what Meyer did isn't simply an existential exercise. If Ohio State fires him without cause on or before Jan. 31, it would owe Meyer nearly $38.1 million.

A USA TODAY Sports review of Meyer's contract found there would be other grounds to fire him for cause even if he did what was required in terms of reporting – if Ohio State has the stomach for it. One provision allows him to be fired for “fraud or dishonesty … in the course of his duties or responsibilities.” When Meyer was asked at Big Ten media day about his knowledge of the 2015 allegations, he lied repeatedly.

Another clause allows for his firing if he behaves in a way that reflects “unfavorably upon Ohio State’s reputation and overall primary mission and objectives.” Still another says he can be fired for failing to “perform his duties and personally comport himself at all times in a manner consistent with good sportsmanship and with the high moral, ethical and academic standards of Ohio State and its Department of Athletics.”

Aside from the considerable mud Ohio State is now covered in because of this situation, Meyer also disparaged the reputations of Courtney Smith and McMurphy with his comments at Big Ten media day.

“I don’t know who creates a story like that,” Meyer said then.

More than a week passed before Meyer, under siege, offered a new version of what he knew, when he knew it and what he did about it. Even then, his statement was glaring in its omission of any mention of Courtney Smith.

It's quite possible that Ohio State's investigation, which the school said Sunday will be completed in two weeks, will find Meyer followed the proper procedures in 2015, and president Michael V. Drake and the board will decide that’s enough to justify him keeping his job. Probable even, given Meyer’s success at Ohio State and his popularity with Buckeye fans.

But as this whole mess has made abundantly clear, just because something falls within the rules doesn't make it right.
 

This from an avid Buckeye fan and athlete, and writer:

https://www.theringer.com/2018/8/9/17665722/ohio-state-urban-meyer-zach-courtney-smith-case

...Based on what we know, it seems clear, at the least, that Meyer could have done more, and that he could have done it sooner. In a vacuum, I don’t know whether he should lose his job solely because of that.

But adding in context very much changes things. I can’t ignore that O’Brien was fired because he gave $6,000 to a Serbian prospect who was dealing with a personal hardship and never went on to play for Ohio State. I can’t ignore that Bruce won more than 75 percent of his games and that Cooper posted four straight double-digit-win seasons, yet both were fired because they didn’t win enough. I can’t ignore that Tressel resigned in the wake of Tattoogate, a scandal that had no victims, and that Matta was let go only because he couldn’t sustain the unprecedented level of success that he had established over an entire decade. I’m not saying that these coaches should have kept their jobs. Coaches at other programs have been fired for much less. I’m just saying that when you step back, think about what led to each of these departures, and compare those reasons with Meyer’s handling of the accounts involving Zach and Courtney Smith, it’s hard to rationalize Meyer returning to the Ohio State sideline. Should he keep his job, I’m not sure how it can be interpreted as anything other than Ohio State expressing that the one thing it values most within its athletic department is winning...

...Based on what we know now, I just can’t imagine a scenario in which Meyer keeps his job and I’m not left thinking that football was prioritized over the reputation of the entire university.
 

Writers write. That's their job.

If they can write something that agitates people, and thus causes a lot of people to pay attention to their writing ... well, sometimes they do that. Doesn't make their writing more authentic, or more truthful .... except for people who want what they've written to be the truth, regardless if it actually is.
 

I don't want any part of this. I'm retracting my post.
 
Last edited:



Gophers_4life said:
Writers write. That's their job.

If they can write something that agitates people, and thus causes a lot of people to pay attention to their writing ... well, sometimes they do that. Doesn't make their writing more authentic, or more truthful .... except for people who want what they've written to be the truth, regardless if it actually is.
Click to expand...
If they wanted to “agitate people”, they’d be defending Meyer. Frankly, this is the easiest position to take.
 

Well, this is damning. Some of you and some in the media appear to owe a big apology. Courtney’s mother states she doesn’t believe her. Courtney instigated many incidents...Not really surprising when all the known facts and stories are examined, the police never arresting. McMurphy with huge egg on his face.

https://www.elevenwarriors.com/ohio...n-and-take-urban-meyer-down-with-him#comments


From Snook's report:

“Each time the police would arrive and investigate, and each time there was nothing to back her claims of physical abuse,” she said. “It was her way at getting back at Zach. She would just call 911 over an argument, which she usually started. The Powell police got to know the situation. I don’t believe for a minute he ever struck her one time and neither does her own mother – and neither do the Powell police.”

Bruce said she never would have defended Zach if she thought her son had struck his wife.

“I was raised by my dad and when my kids were in school, I told them if anything happens that they are guilty until proven innocent,” she explained. “I would back the teachers or administrators. I talked to him about these issues and I would still love him, but if I thought he hit her, I would force him to get professional help. He was raised to respect women. I believe him and I witnessed so many incidents in which she was the aggressor … I know what happened and I also know he would never hit a woman.”

Snook also exchanged text messages with Courtney's mother, Tina Carano, who also told Snook that she did not believe Zach was physically violent toward her daughter.

Reached this afternoon, Tina Carano would only communicate via text messages and backed Lynn Bruce’s version.

When asked if she believed her daughter’s claims of physical abuse, she replied, “I believe that Zach was removing himself from an argument and I do not believe he intentionally abused her. I do not believe he actually intentionally swung or punched her … no.”

As far as ever hearing her daughter say she would “take Zach down,” she replied, “Yes.”

And when Meyer’s name was mentioned, she added, “I cannot quote her exact words as I don’t remember them word for word, but something to that extent. This is my daughter and I love her but I do not approve of what she has done and how it was done.”

Following that text, she did not respond to follow-up questions.

Bruce told Snook that Courtney and her mother have become estranged over Courtney's allegations against Zach.

“Tina believes Zach and she is on his side through all this," Bruce told Snook. "She knows what her own daughter is like. She thinks she has serious problems and she knows she planned this whole thing.”
 
Last edited:

short ornery norwegian said:
Some of what you say may be true, but a lot of the mistrust of media is due to people just not liking what they read and hear. The President of the United States screams "fake news" about every story he disagrees with. When some people - not all, but some - call for "balanced reporting," what they are saying is they want a story that matches their pre-determined opinion. that's not how it works.

granted, there are poor reporters - just like there are poor plumbers and poor coaches - but I believe the vast majority of reporters are trying to present accurate information. One of the issues is that journalism has changed. there used to be very distinct boundaries between news, analysis and opinion. Now, it tends to get blurred together, so that reporters are including opinions or analysis in a news story. That is really true in the sports world - its all about opinions. So, I don't think the state of journalism is as bleak as you paint it.
Click to expand...

This has been going on for long before Trump. The Wikileaks revelation in 2016 of private dinners between the media and political campaigns solidified in some minds that the non-partisan journalism priesthood if not dead has one foot in the grave.

Nobody wants opinion in their news except the partisans (and there are a lot of them).

My theory is that many journalists went into the field as they believed in being “change agents” and wanted to influence events to their personal leanings. Many are arrogant, narrow-minded, and feel it’s their duty to inform the rest of us of our failings. My advice to help restore respect is to stay out of the editorializing business.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
This has been going on for long before Trump. The Wikileaks revelation in 2016 of private dinners between the media and political campaigns solidified in some minds that the non-partisan journalism priesthood if not dead has one foot in the grave.

Nobody wants opinion in their news except the partisans (and there are a lot of them).

My theory is that many journalists went into the field as they believed in being “change agents” and wanted to influence events to their personal leanings. Many are arrogant, narrow-minded, and feel it’s their duty to inform the rest of us of our failings. My advice to help restore respect is to stay out of the editorializing business.
Click to expand...

There’s no money in just reporting facts. People want to read opinions that match their own slanted viewpoints and ideologies. Supply for demand.
 



Mods: It's seems to be about time that this was moved to the "Off Topic Board". It doesn't seem to have much to do with football anymore.

The only connection to this board is the possibility Meyer may not be coaching tOSU this season. Perfectly reasonable subject to be posted here. However that connection seems pretty tenuous now. Keep occasionally checking to see if there has been any news on Meyer's employment.

There hasn't been.

No reason not to keep the thread going, but not much reason to keep it on here.
 

Iceland12 said:
Mods: It's seems to be about time that this was moved to the "Off Topic Board". It doesn't seem to have much to do with football anymore.

The only connection to this board is the possibility Meyer may not be coaching tOSU this season. Perfectly reasonable subject to be posted here. However that connection seems pretty tenuous now. Keep occasionally checking to see if there has been any news on Meyer's employment.

There hasn't been.

No reason not to keep the thread going, but not much reason to keep it on here.
Click to expand...

This is all about the events around Meyer and Ohio State (and football, by extension). Every bit of it is relevant to the conversation.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
Some of what you say may be true, but a lot of the mistrust of media is due to people just not liking what they read and hear. The President of the United States screams "fake news" about every story he disagrees with. When some people - not all, but some - call for "balanced reporting," what they are saying is they want a story that matches their pre-determined opinion. that's not how it works.

granted, there are poor reporters - just like there are poor plumbers and poor coaches - but I believe the vast majority of reporters are trying to present accurate information. One of the issues is that journalism has changed. there used to be very distinct boundaries between news, analysis and opinion. Now, it tends to get blurred together, so that reporters are including opinions or analysis in a news story. That is really true in the sports world - its all about opinions. So, I don't think the state of journalism is as bleak as you paint it.
Click to expand...

Agree! Good post.
 

I never knew one had to take an oath of truth when answering questions from the press.
 

STPGopher said:
Agree! Good post.
Click to expand...

The point is that just like one cannot allow a policeman that’s caught planting evidence to continue as a police officer, or a clergyman caught abusing boys to continue in that occupation, journalists have a singular job of reporting events and facts without comscious bias. When they fail miserably at that single purpose (eg Brett McMurphy eg al) they can no longer continue in that occupation. Join the ranks of talking heads, political operatives, etc.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
This is all about the events around Meyer and Ohio State (and football, by extension). Every bit of it is relevant to the conversation.
Click to expand...

Understood, it's the bolden part that I was referring too.

Not my call either way.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
Some of what you say may be true, but a lot of the mistrust of media is due to people just not liking what they read and hear. The President of the United States screams "fake news" about every story he disagrees with. When some people - not all, but some - call for "balanced reporting," what they are saying is they want a story that matches their pre-determined opinion. that's not how it works.

granted, there are poor reporters - just like there are poor plumbers and poor coaches - but I believe the vast majority of reporters are trying to present accurate information. One of the issues is that journalism has changed. there used to be very distinct boundaries between news, analysis and opinion. Now, it tends to get blurred together, so that reporters are including opinions or analysis in a news story. That is really true in the sports world - its all about opinions. So, I don't think the state of journalism is as bleak as you paint it.
Click to expand...

:drink:
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Well, this is damning. Some of you and some in the media appear to owe a big apology. Courtney’s mother states she doesn’t believe her. Courtney instigated many incidents...Not really surprising when all the known facts and stories are examined, the police never arresting. McMurphy with huge egg on his face.
Click to expand...
Oh, but I thought you didn’t want to jump to conclusions, wanted all the facts before deciding, etc.?

I guess not. You seem to want to believe anyone that supports your opinion. Like Zach Smith’s mother’s opinion about her son’s innocence and her daughter-in-law’s guilt. Or Courtney Smith’s estranged mother, who apparently clammed up after a short comment. The one who told her not to have Zach Smith arrested after his ADMITTED abuse in 2009. Nice.

You seem to desperately want to believe Zach Smith, the abuser, over Courtney Smith, the abused, when Urban Meyer’s own wife was saying that Zach Smith “scared her” and appeared to very much side with Courtney Smith.

But you don’t want to jump to conclusions. Sure.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
The point is that just like one cannot allow a policeman that’s caught planting evidence to continue as a police officer, or a clergyman caught abusing boys to continue in that occupation, journalists have a singular job of reporting events and facts without comscious bias. When they fail miserably at that single purpose (eg Brett McMurphy eg al) they can no longer continue in that occupation. Join the ranks of talking heads, political operatives, etc.
Click to expand...

Personally, I like how AllSides handles things. It's fascinating to see how journalists present the same happenings. (Sorry for the digression)
 

KillerGopherFan said:
Oh, but I thought you didn’t want to jump to conclusions, wanted all the facts before deciding, etc.?

I guess not. You seem to want to believe anyone that supports your opinion. Like Zach Smith’s mother’s opinion about her son’s innocence and her daughter-in-law’s guilt. Or Courtney Smith’s estranged mother, who apparently clammed up after a short comment. The one who told her not to have Zach Smith arrested after his ADMITTED abuse in 2009. Nice.

You seem to desperately want to believe Zach Smith, the abuser, over Courtney Smith, the abused, when Urban Meyer’s own wife was saying that Zach Smith “scared her” and appeared to very much side with Courtney Smith.

But you don’t want to jump to conclusions. Sure.
Click to expand...

You’re flailing. Numerous calls to police - no arrest. Courtney’s mother corroborates Lynn Smith’s assertions and numerous examples of how she’s unbalanced. Read Snook’s story. Just let it go. Barring the possibility sports writer Jeff Snook just made it all up and is putting himself at risk for libel...it’s over. You lost.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
You’re flailing. Numerous calls to police - no arrest. Courtney’s mother corroborates Lynn Smith’s assertions and numerous examples of how she’s unbalanced. Read Snook’s story. Just let it go. Barring the possibility sports writer Jeff Snook just made it all up and is putting himself at risk for libel...it’s over. You lost.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I’m sure they’ll be wrapping up the official investigation with this news.:rolleyes:
 

Has anyone corroborated Courtney’s story? When family members are saying somebody has issues, particularly the mother that seems to be significant. Sure, maybe Courtney’s mom is making it all up, Lynn Smith crafted all manner of character assassination to help her son, numerous policemen over many years are in on it, Urban is in on it, his wife is on it, and Ohio State is in on it. Step back for a minute and just calm down. How likely is all of that?

Like you said, the investigation should be wrapping up soon. The victims here seem to be the kids, mostly. Maybe they’ll still find some procedural deficiency and your wet dream will come true.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Has anyone corroborated Courtney’s story? When family members are saying somebody has issues, particularly the mother that seems to be significant. .... numerous policemen over many years are in on it, Urban is in on it, his wife is on it, and Ohio State is in on it. Step back for a minute and just calm down. How likely is all of that?
Click to expand...

How likely you ask? I don't know but I think a bit more likely with domestic violence than many other crimes. You ask for corroboration is if that was a regular thing. How many battered wives have corroborating witnesses? Couples need witnesses to get married, they don't wait for witnesses before they strike or choke or commit other acts of violence. Although the texts to Urban Meyer's wife seem like some corroboration. Why has the sports -- college and professional -- put such an emphasis on this issue? One reason is because people, including the police, have ignored domestic violence maybe in part because of celebrity, maybe because folks think its normal thing or maybe because its so hard to know what actually happened.

I do find this is an interesting bind for Urban Meyer -- if he didn't fire Smith when he should have, then he's in trouble. But now OSU fans seem to be claiming it was all on Courtney Smith -- if that's the case, then isn't Urban Meyer in trouble for firing Smith without cause?
 
Last edited:

Dunceswithwolves said:
How likely you ask? I don't know but I think a bit more likely with domestic violence than many other crimes. You ask for corroboration is if that was a regular thing. How many battered wives have corroborating witnesses? Couples need witnesses to get married, they don't wait for witnesses before they strike or choke or commit other acts of violence. Although the texts to Urban Meyer's wife seem like some corroboration. Why has the sports -- college and professional -- put such an emphasis on this issue? One reason is because people, including the police, have ignored domestic violence maybe in part because of celebrity, maybe because folks think its normal thing or maybe because its so hard to know what actually happened.

I do find this is an interesting bind for Urban Meyer -- if he didn't fire Smith when he should have, then he's in trouble. But now OSU fans seem to be claiming it was all on Courtney Smith -- if that's the case, then isn't Urban Meyer in trouble for firing Smith without cause?
Click to expand...

The difficult thing is, it's unlikely we will ever know what truly happened (think the Gopher's sexual assault case all over again) and people are going to, very likely, stay rigid in what they believe is true according to what their moral compass said regarding the issue coming in. It's going to be easy to view the "facts" as whatever you want them to be by believing whichever version of the story suits you (and I think this is what PE is trying to get at to some degree of effectiveness). We will never know if this intimate partner violence was committed only by Mr. Smith, or if Courtney played a role in physical violence or committed acts of psychologic violence on him. I think the professional sports world has taken a stance because they've had to due to the large number of episodes where it has been shown quite publicly, due to their celebrity, that there are domestic abusers amongst their ranks due to the further advent of social media and the me too movement to some extent.

In all, this story is not anything "special" but is made out to be because of the high powered people involved. Were this anywhere else, you would hope the facts, as best as are able to be obtained by people who are professionals at the job (ie the police and judicial system-at least we hope but that's another story) and a verdict is reached before we as a society condemn people, fire people, or essentially tar and feather them. People love to rush to things and it's entirely what we're doing because people have taken on a mob mentality regarding this, and it's looking like Meyer could easily become the next to fall to this mindset (obviously he may deserve it pending on what we find out).
 

Dunceswithwolves said:
How likely you ask? I don't know but I think a bit more likely with domestic violence than many other crimes. You ask for corroboration is if that was a regular thing. How many battered wives have corroborating witnesses? Couples need witnesses to get married, they don't wait for witnesses before they strike or choke or commit other acts of violence. Although the texts to Urban Meyer's wife seem like some corroboration. Why has the sports -- college and professional -- put such an emphasis on this issue? One reason is because people, including the police, have ignored domestic violence maybe in part because of celebrity, maybe because folks think its normal thing or maybe because its so hard to know what actually happened.

I do find this is an interesting bind for Urban Meyer -- if he didn't fire Smith when he should have, then he's in trouble. But now OSU fans seem to be claiming it was all on Courtney Smith -- if that's the case, then isn't Urban Meyer in trouble for firing Smith without cause?
Click to expand...

I heartily agree domestic violence is a real issue. However, a thinking person cannot and should not have blanket prejudice on this issue or any other. People are not that simple, I’m sorry. Some require more life experience to come to that realization than others.

None of what you wrote applies to this case. How do the texts corroborate anything? Corroboration requires a third party to confirm or deny a statement. We don’t know what Shelley Smith knew. Whether or not Courtney Smith is entirely making the allegations up, or the marriage was a bilaterally messy, toxic cesspool of dysfunction, or ZS masterfully conned everyone into taking his side and was beating her to a pulp behind closed doors as is the narrative pushed by most media this case illustrates the need to get all the facts before jumping to conclusions.

Regarding the firing it may be that he had run out of second and third chances when the arrest for taking the kids to her house arose. ZS was a poor husband at the very least and there may have been some requirements about keeping his nose clean and he failed. These are all questions that will be fleshed out over time.
 

"This is my own daughter and I love her but I do not approve of what she has done and how it was done."

-Tina Carano
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Corroboration requires a third party to confirm or deny a statement.
Click to expand...

Feels like you are offering a straw man argument -- or at least cousin-to-straw-man. You asked where's the corroboration for a crime where there is rarely anything but tenuous corroboration. DV is not generally a spectator sport. When Shelly Meyer texted -- he scares me. That sounds like some kind of corroboration especially someone who was counseling them earlier and probably has some reason to be more than just a sympathetic.

As for you comment that -- none of this applies to this case. Let me say it in a different way -- we know that police have ignored DV and we know that its difficult for police to sort through a he said, she said. So that might apply when we know that the police don't always get this right. We know that school administrations have ignored a lot of problems and crimes -- so might apply. I mean geez, OSU is already in the middle of a scandal where folks ignored -- as we hear it -- pretty blatant sexual assault. You could easily argue that away saying that was impossible that it would have happened without more complaints -- but we know that shame and crazy-confusion that victims feel and we know their actions can defy common sense because of the humiliation associated with these acts.

It would be interesting what all they considered when they fired him and did Urban Meyer tell the administration about 2009 in that context.

I am still stuck on why Meyer lies about this one day after Smith was fired. Any organization in that situation is reviewing everything that happened -- again and again -- till you hand someone their walking papers. Why does he say what he does the very next day? I can only think that is showed a guilty conscience -- but then I'm speculating, I think, just like you. And best to see what the evidence is.
 

You must log in or register to reply here.



Top Bottom