Report: Urban Meyer knew about 2015 domestic violence incident involving ex-assistant

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BarnBurner said:
It doesnt seem I did not say that; I did not say that. Nor have I ever demanded anything of Meyer.

Saban is no angel. Does that help you? College sports are simply slimy and dirty.

GH is full of bluster that the Big Ten (schools/sports/coaches) is so much better than nearly any other conference. Repeatedly.
Just isnt so.

Do tell - do you think if the exact same situation happened in dinkytown the coach would receive a 3 game suspension?
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Name a business/occupation that doesn’t have its share of shady characters in some way, shape, or form. I’ll wait.

The second bold I agree with - the pompous bluster gets a little nauseating at times.
 

BarnBurner said:
It doesnt seem I did not say that; I did not say that. Nor have I ever demanded anything of Meyer.

Saban is no angel. Does that help you? College sports are simply slimy and dirty.

GH is full of bluster that the Big Ten (schools/sports/coaches) is so much better than nearly any other conference. Repeatedly.
Just isnt so.

Do tell - do you think if the exact same situation happened in dinkytown the coach would receive a 3 game suspension?
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D1 FB and BB can be sketchy at times, but your comment is a huge overgeneralization.
 

Gophers_4life said:
Killer, time to give it a rest. You fought he good fight, and came out on the losing end.

There will be no public opinion that matters. The Buckeyes will win football games, and that will be that.
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Just b/c Ohio St decided that Urban Meyer and winning was more important than the integrity of the institution, that doesn’t mean that I lost. In fact, I think Ohio St is going to wear this decision like a lead jacket that will weigh it down for some time. There is significant and deserved criticism by many neutral observers.

I haven’t had time to read the report yet, but from the commentators that I heard, it is a picture of guilt rather than redemption.

Urban Meyer revealed further who he is at that pathetic press conference with his less than half-hearted, horribly read statement. As some observers have said, he looked like a child giving a pre-written apology to his little brother, fumbling through it unemotionally and insincerely. He is getting significant criticism for that b/c he let an opportunity to give a heartfelt apology to Courtney Smith and abused women in general for not doing all that he, as the admitted person responsible for all that goes on in his program (as I said before), could to make sure that his staff was not involved in violating the stated “Core Values” of the program and for being insensitive and ignorant toward allegations of spousal abuse.

Does anyone believe his wife didn’t tell him about the texts from Courtney Smith? Does anyone believe that he would reset his cell phone to destroy texts messages over a year old, the day after the announcement of the investigation, for no reason? Does anyone believe that he didn’t remember much about the 2015 incident as he suggested to the investigators? Answer: Only those that want to believe that.

No. Urban Meyer exposed himself to the college football world, and it’s not pretty.
 

KillerGopherFan said:
Just b/c Ohio St decided that Urban Meyer and winning was more important than the integrity of the institution, that doesn’t mean that I lost. In fact, I think Ohio St is going to wear this decision like a lead jacket that will weigh it down for some time. There is significant and deserved criticism by many neutral observers.

I haven’t had time to read the report yet, but from the commentators that I heard, it is a picture of guilt rather than redemption.

Urban Meyer revealed further who he is at that pathetic press conference with his less than half-hearted, horribly read statement. As some observers have said, he looked like a child giving a pre-written apology to his little brother, fumbling through it unemotionally and insincerely. He is getting significant criticism for that b/c he let an opportunity to give a heartfelt apology to Courtney Smith and abused women in general for not doing all that he, as the admitted person responsible for all that goes on in his program (as I said before), could to make sure that his staff was not involved in violating the stated “Core Values” of the program and for being insensitive and ignorant toward allegations of spousal abuse.

Does anyone believe his wife didn’t tell him about the texts from Courtney Smith? Does anyone believe that he would reset his cell phone to destroy texts messages over a year old, the day after the announcement of the investigation, for no reason? Does anyone believe that he didn’t remember much about the 2015 incident as he suggested to the investigators? Answer: Only those that want to believe that.

No. Urban Meyer exposed himself to the college football world, and it’s not pretty.
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Read the report. What part of of unsubstantiated allegations do you guys not understand? This really isn’t that difficult. By all means, keep beating your chest about totally unrelated issues and feigning outrage. He was obviously not comfortable with the report and/or punishment, and was probably tired after a marathon day.

He admitted that, in hindsight, he gave Smith too many chances.
He, along with a large group of other people that know way more about the Smiths than you and the other chuckleheads, did not believe everything Courtney stated and obviously still doesn’t given his answer to the posed question. Why? I don’t know. Her own mother stated she was on a vindictive crusade. Every pundit is understandably tiptoeing around this for fear of bringing down an angry mob. It’s a sensitive subject and nobody wins by going there.
He admitted that he erroneously did not inform the athletic and university compliance offices (Title IX and the police were informed).
He admitted to not being totally forthcoming on media day.
He admitted, in hindsight, his loyalty to his mentor clouded his view of Smith’s immaturity, and other red flags.

If you’re convinced Meyer knew more and Zach Smith is solely at fault in the relationship then sure, this all looks bad. However, I’d argue that’s a pretty one-sided view. I don’t think we have all the facts. I suspect as the Smith’s legal wrangling continue more trash will be spilled, and evidence will be vetted by people more professional and objective than Brett McMurphy and that may move the needle more one way or another.
 

KillerGopherFan said:
Just b/c Ohio St decided that Urban Meyer and winning was more important than the integrity of the institution, that doesn’t mean that I lost. In fact, I think Ohio St is going to wear this decision like a lead jacket that will weigh it down for some time. There is significant and deserved criticism by many neutral observers.

I haven’t had time to read the report yet, but from the commentators that I heard, it is a picture of guilt rather than redemption.

Urban Meyer revealed further who he is at that pathetic press conference with his less than half-hearted, horribly read statement. As some observers have said, he looked like a child giving a pre-written apology to his little brother, fumbling through it unemotionally and insincerely. He is getting significant criticism for that b/c he let an opportunity to give a heartfelt apology to Courtney Smith and abused women in general for not doing all that he, as the admitted person responsible for all that goes on in his program (as I said before), could to make sure that his staff was not involved in violating the stated “Core Values” of the program and for being insensitive and ignorant toward allegations of spousal abuse.

Does anyone believe his wife didn’t tell him about the texts from Courtney Smith? Does anyone believe that he would reset his cell phone to destroy texts messages over a year old, the day after the announcement of the investigation, for no reason? Does anyone believe that he didn’t remember much about the 2015 incident as he suggested to the investigators? Answer: Only those that want to believe that.

No. Urban Meyer exposed himself to the college football world, and it’s not pretty.
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It's not Urban's job to intervene in the relationship between two adults. He can't save an adult from being abused like superman just because he should fire a dude.

Urban's job is not to make an adult... leave an abusive relationship. Nobody can make that happen when adults are involved.

Firing his coach wouldn't do that either.
 


Yeah PE, the report and Meyer admitted he fell short on numerous occasions.

Here’s what I said in post #201:

I already highlighted a few knowns. Again:
He knew of 2009 and 2015. Whether he told the AD about 2009, we don’t know. If he didn’t, that’s a big problem.
He could’ve declined to answer specifics or personal questions. Instead, he chose to lie to the public, suggesting that reporters were lying. So he didn’t just lie, he accused others of lying. His #1 “core value” is Honesty. Sure.
Zach Smith has been fired, but only after the story was going to become public after the order against him. We can assume that this validates Mrs Smith’s account of prior events.
Mrs Smith has given a highly credible account, quite damning of Meyer’s & Ohio St’s handling, of the last 9 years, based on Meyer’s lack of public honesty about the circumstances, I believe her account.

Im more than happy to wait for anymore details, but if they don’t significantly change the above, he should be fired.

Urban Meyer’s first two core values for his team are Honesty and Treat Women with Respect. The others are no weapons, stealing, or drugs. Seriously? Don’t lie, hit your gf, have illegal guns, steal or do drugs.

Those are “core values” everybody should live by? My god. All but number 1 are the law.
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Beyond the questions that I posted in my previous post, the above that I mentioned were answered by the investigation. That being, 1) and this is big, Meyer knew about 2009, but did not inform AD Smith when the 2015 incident occurred. 2) Meyer completely misrepresented the truth (lied) at the Big Ten Media days, even though AD Smith told him to limit his comments to a couple of points. Meyer embellished the story at other peoples’ expense. 3) Urban Meyer set the “Core Values” for the program and acknowledged that HE is responsible for basically everything that happens in that program, yet he continued to ignore violations of those “core values” repeatedly and only threatened Zach Smith in each case of a violation of the “core values’ after Smith’s misdeeds were going to become public. Only threatened. Never acted, until after it was going to go public.

Meyer lied, violated his program’s values, and protected a likely wife abuser. He DID NOT report everything as he suggested early in the investigation. He withheld knowledge about 2009 to AD Smith. If he had revealed that to Smith, I believe Smith would’ve recommended firing Zach Smith in 2015.
 

A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
It's not Urban's job to intervene in the relationship between two adults. He can't save an adult from being abused like superman just because he should fire a dude.

Urban's job is not to make an adult... leave an abusive relationship. Nobody can make that happen when adults are involved.

Firing his coach wouldn't do that either.
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Where have I said it was Urban Meyer’s job to be a marriage counselor? Meyer is responsible for the program and the integrity and ethics of the program. Period.

I will say, had Meyer fired Zach Smith earlier, Courtney Smith wouldn’t have had to worry about whether she would be responsible for him losing his job b/c she reported him to the police and followed through with an arrest. That was a major factor in her not filing arrest charges.
 

As far as Meyer was concerned The Story was false. It all depends on perspective. The erroneous McMurphy story of charges and an arrest was predicated on what can only be looked at as dubious evidence: an emailed jpeg (sender whited out...) of a police report that the police then called false and refused to corroborate, and in fact have issued reports from 2015 (in 2015) and 2018 that contradict the unnamed source of BM. I find that curious.

Why would BM hide his source for the email attachment, when these police documents are public record?

Why would BM solicit evidence from random tweeters to paint a one-sided picture/smear of Zach Smith, and refuse to cover contradicting interviews and evidence?

It starts to paint a picture. I could go on.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Name a business/occupation that doesn’t have its share of shady characters in some way, shape, or form. I’ll wait.

The second bold I agree with - the pompous bluster gets a little nauseating at times.
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You must throw up everytime damn everytime you go off on one of your sermons proving how much smarter you are.
 



Mulligan said:
You must throw up everytime damn everytime you go off on one of your sermons proving how much smarter you are.
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Correct, most accurate moniker every! And by only accepting legal convictions of a crime to determine if an action was right or wrong.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Pompous Elitist said:
As far as Meyer was concerned The Story was false. It all depends on perspective. The erroneous McMurphy story of charges and an arrest was predicated on what can only be looked at as dubious evidence: an emailed jpeg (sender whited out...) of a police report that the police then called false and refused to corroborate, and in fact have issued reports from 2015 (in 2015) and 2018 that contradict the unnamed source of BM. I find that curious.

Why would BM hide his source for the email attachment, when these police documents are public record?

Why would BM solicit evidence from random tweeters to paint a one-sided picture/smear of Zach Smith, and refuse to cover contradicting interviews and evidence?

It starts to paint a picture. I could go on.
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Maybe I missed it, but Meyer said in his initial statement he followed protocol in reporting the 2015 incident. The report says the AD told Meyer of it. May be a small point but does not seem to square with Meyer's statement.
 

PMWinSTP said:
Maybe I missed it, but Meyer said in his initial statement he followed protocol in reporting the 2015 incident. The report says the AD told Meyer of it. May be a small point but does not seem to square with Meyer's statement.
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Yes, that IS the impression he wanted to give the public as the investigation was beginning. It was a false impression, which obviously was his objective. Gene Smith was smart enough not to comment, but Meyer got his comment in and was then instructed to be quiet.

Meyer wanted to float the info that he had done his job, reported it as procedure calls for. In fact, it was Gene Smith that reported it to him. And again, Meyer DID NOT bother to report the 2009 incident to Gene Smith at that time. DID NOT REPORT to his superiors. Wouldn’t that seem the obvious thing to do? Of course, Meyer forgot everything about what happened in 2015. I guess b/c he’s got so many more important things on his mind.

Gene Smith didn’t do his job, but he was handicapped by Meyer not fully informing him of Zach Smith’s history. Of course Meyer lied about this to create the narrative during the two week investigation that he had done everything appropriately.

Smart move by Meyer. More like conniving and scheming move by Meyer. He’s an expert.
 

alchemy2u said:
Correct, most accurate moniker every! And by only accepting legal convictions of a crime to determine if an action was right or wrong.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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When you or I don’t know the facts, yeah that’s a crazy stance.
 




KillerGopherFan said:
Yes, that IS the impression he wanted to give the public as the investigation was beginning. It was a false impression, which obviously was his objective. Gene Smith was smart enough not to comment, but Meyer got his comment in and was then instructed to be quiet.

Meyer wanted to float the info that he had done his job, reported it as procedure calls for. In fact, it was Gene Smith that reported it to him. And again, Meyer DID NOT bother to report the 2009 incident to Gene Smith at that time. DID NOT REPORT to his superiors. Wouldn’t that seem the obvious thing to do? Of course, Meyer forgot everything about what happened in 2015. I guess b/c he’s got so many more important things on his mind.

Gene Smith didn’t do his job, but he was handicapped by Meyer not fully informing him of Zach Smith’s history. Of course Meyer lied about this to create the narrative during the two week investigation that he had done everything appropriately.

Smart move by Meyer. More like conniving and scheming move by Meyer. He’s an expert.
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Can you get anything right about this story? The police contacted Title IX, who contacted Gene Smith, who contacted Urban. They followed the investigation for several months per the report. From there all your assumptions kick in about what happened and what they knew about alleged abuse.
 

PMWinSTP said:
Maybe I missed it, but Meyer said in his initial statement he followed protocol in reporting the 2015 incident. The report says the AD told Meyer of it. May be a small point but does not seem to square with Meyer's statement.
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The report said he believed he did follow protocol. Turns out there was some directive to get compliance officed involved in addition to Title IX and the police. The committee didn’t fault him too harshly- perhaps it was buried in legalese or otherwise not commonly known. I’m not sure what compliance could do vs Zach other than offer guidance to the decision makers.

All of the reporting, etc is immaterial in light of the police getting involved, counselors involved in regards to ending the alleged abuse which is really what you’re concerned about, right?
 

KillerGopherFan said:
Just b/c Ohio St decided that Urban Meyer and winning was more important than the integrity of the institution, that doesn’t mean that I lost. In fact, I think Ohio St is going to wear this decision like a lead jacket that will weigh it down for some time. There is significant and deserved criticism by many neutral observers.
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I certainly can appreciate your passion. And I'm not here to tell you that you were "wrong", for having wanted the outcome to go a certain way.

Me personally (my opinion, only), I think it's silly to expect this to have any damage on the OSU program, whatsoever. Even if Meyer was fired ... they'd just hire some other hot shot guy, keep all the recruits, and sign some of the best new recruits. That program recruits itself, at this point.
 
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PE (and some others),

I think you're wasting your time, at this point. Killer is convinced that he is right, and that OSU, the police, and everyone else are wrong. He won't change his mind, no matter what.

It was one thing when the outcome was unknown, but now the thing is done and adjudicated (for all intents and purposes, this is as much as it ever will be). I don't see the point in arguing that the outcome was "wrong", or anything like that, any further. It's over, it's not going to be revisited, and the football world is going to move on to the next newsworthy thing.
 

Gophers_4life said:
PE (and some others),

I think you're wasting your time, at this point. Killer is convinced that he is right, and that OSU, the police, and everyone else are wrong. He won't change his mind, no matter what.

It was one thing when the outcome was unknown, but now the thing is done and adjudicated (for all intents and purposes, this is as much as it ever will be). I don't see the point in arguing that the outcome was "wrong", or anything like that, any further. It's over, it's not going to be revisited, and the football world is going to move on to the next newsworthy thing.
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I’m not sure some will let it go. Will it lead anywhere? I doubt it. The haters (and they are legion) are already yelling about hiding a bonafide wife beater for 10 years. These fan spats and media vomits have become almost unreadable. We really haven’t evolved as far as we’d like to think.
 

Well, I guess someone could file a Title IX lawsuit against OSU. I doubt it, and if they did I think it would get dismissed. But I suppose we'll see ...
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Name a business/occupation that doesn’t have its share of shady characters in some way, shape, or form. I’ll wait.

The second bold I agree with - the pompous bluster gets a little nauseating at times.
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Ya But. Impressive PE. Garbage.

Were we discussing other business/occupations or were we discussing Meyer and the Big Ten Conference?

I'll wait......
 

PMWinSTP said:
D1 FB and BB can be sketchy at times, but your comment is a huge overgeneralization.
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Really. Allow me to clarify, if I might - BB and FB.

The evidence against you continues to mount.
 

Gophers_4life said:
Ok we’re on the same page then. I agree that college football is filled with figures who aren’t the most ethical, put it that way.
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Again - care to answer the question gophersforlife?
 
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Pompous Elitist said:
Can you get anything right about this story? The police contacted Title IX, who contacted Gene Smith, who contacted Urban. They followed the investigation for several months per the report. From there all your assumptions kick in about what happened and what they knew about alleged abuse.
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I said Gene Smith informed Meyer. Meyer didn’t inform Smith as Meyer said.

I’m making no assumptions. Meyer didn’t tell Smith about 2009. It’s in the report.

Just ignore the facts that you don’t like.
 

BarnBurner said:
Again - care to answer the question gophersforlife?
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"Do tell - do you think if the exact same situation happened in dinkytown the coach would receive a 3 game suspension?"

It would entirely depend on the lie told to the media and the context surrounding it. I do not automatically think he would get 3 game suspension, or worse (which I think is what you were implying??). It depends
 

KillerGopherFan said:
I said Gene Smith informed Meyer. Meyer didn’t inform Smith as Meyer said.

I’m making no assumptions. Meyer didn’t tell Smith about 2009. It’s in the report.

Just ignore the facts that you don’t like.
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Why would he tell him about it? The attorneys on the committee said that wasn’t a breach of rule, law, or protocol.
 

Gophers_4life said:
"Do tell - do you think if the exact same situation happened in dinkytown the coach would receive a 3 game suspension?"

It would entirely depend on the lie told to the media and the context surrounding it. I do not automatically think he would get 3 game suspension, or worse (which I think is what you were implying??). It depends
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Nice hedge.

We both know the knives would be out.
 

BarnBurner said:
Ya But. Impressive PE. Garbage.

Were we discussing other business/occupations or were we discussing Meyer and the Big Ten Conference?

I'll wait......
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Are you waiting for me to agree? I do. I’m saying there are shady people everywhere so I’m not sure why the special call out vs sports.
 

KillerGopherFan said:
Where have I said it was Urban Meyer’s job to be a marriage counselor? Meyer is responsible for the program and the integrity and ethics of the program. Period.

I will say, had Meyer fired Zach Smith earlier, Courtney Smith wouldn’t have had to worry about whether she would be responsible for him losing his job b/c she reported him to the police and followed through with an arrest. That was a major factor in her not filing arrest charges.
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Well let's clarify then, you talked about Urban not apologizing to Courtney Smith... should he have? If so why?
 

BarnBurner said:
Nice hedge.

We both know the knives would be out.
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Let's say for the sake of discussion that I would agree to this. I don't understand how that fits in with your narrative from our overall discussion so far. It would help me a lot of you could essentially summarize your overall point, especially with how it relates to the Urban Meyer/OSU scandal.
 

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