Geno Crandall

Bo Ryan= awful human but he could take a bunch of slow, unathletic farm kids plus some overlooked MN metro kids (due to Monsons crap relationship skills) and place top 3 B1G years after yr. He and Dick Bennett took a downtrodden program and made It into a winner.

the people slamming Gonzaga are stupid. The zags and mark few built that from nothing. Granted they play in a bad league but they still make the tourney and win games there.

Point is....both these programs found ways to develop winners. I dont care about 4 stars this or whatever. They found a way to develop guys who will have more points per possession than the other team....simple as that.

MN has not. We dont seem to be able to find a coach who can create a system to consistantly outscore the other team. 3 coaches have not found a consistent way.

When we get to the point where people are trying to beat our game vs MN having beat someone else's game, then we have arrived. Until then, I am going to cry for change.

Monson? i toally forgot about that guy. he beat the gophs so they hired him....it was the same thing with Kill. He beat the gophers so they hired him. It's like when the cops cannot catch the criminal------ the cops always say 'this criminal is a genius'
 

If all this is true then how in the world is he 31-59 in the Big 10? That's 13th out of the 14 B1G teams over the last 5 years.

Don’t be obtuse, you know why. Coaching Tubby’s bare cupboard the first 2 years, and crippling injuries/suspensions 2 of the last 3 years.

The only semi-normal year (I say semi because it ended with our 2 starting guards both needing surgery) we were the 2nd highest seeded team in the B1G and finished the conf season 8-1.

The question is, will he ever get the benefit of a normal year? Guys get nicked up now and then, but it’s not normal to be consistently losing guys for the season in basketball.
 

Don’t be obtuse, you know why. Coaching Tubby’s bare cupboard the first 2 years, and crippling injuries/suspensions 2 of the last 3 years.

The only semi-normal year (I say semi because it ended with our 2 starting guards both needing surgery) we were the 2nd highest seeded team in the B1G and finished the conf season 8-1.

The question is, will he ever get the benefit of a normal year? Guys get nicked up now and then, but it’s not normal to be consistently losing guys for the season in basketball.
I agree with what you're saying but the problem is this year he's set the roster up for a year like last year to happen again. Can't lose Washington, Coffey, Murphy or Oturu. Lose two of those guys and were in trouble. We have ten capable big ten players that are eligible, which is good. Geno was key because it would've given us more flexibility with the roster of their was an injury, Matz something in the front court. We don't have a pure center if Oturu isn't healthy. If you keep making the same mistake, it's no longer a valid excuse.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk
 

Don’t be obtuse, you know why. Coaching Tubby’s bare cupboard the first 2 years, and crippling injuries/suspensions 2 of the last 3 years.

The only semi-normal year (I say semi because it ended with our 2 starting guards both needing surgery) we were the 2nd highest seeded team in the B1G and finished the conf season 8-1.

The question is, will he ever get the benefit of a normal year? Guys get nicked up now and then, but it’s not normal to be consistently losing guys for the season in basketball.

There is so much to unpack here that I'm not going to get into all of it on a thread that is meant to be about Geno Crandall. All I'm going to say is that players on every team get injured. And I'd add that it is laughable to say the cupboard was bare his first two years. But again, not going to go further here. Feel free to start another thread to discuss it if you wish. Happy to school you in a more appropriate venue.
 

Don’t be obtuse, you know why. Coaching Tubby’s bare cupboard the first 2 years, and crippling injuries/suspensions 2 of the last 3 years.

The only semi-normal year (I say semi because it ended with our 2 starting guards both needing surgery) we were the 2nd highest seeded team in the B1G and finished the conf season 8-1.

The question is, will he ever get the benefit of a normal year? Guys get nicked up now and then, but it’s not normal to be consistently losing guys for the season in basketball.

If you want to use that excuse then you can't give Pitino any credit for the 13-14 team. That was all Tubby's guys.

No one expects Pitino to win a champion in the first couple of years. But hasn't built anything yet. You can talk about how great his recruiting is but the truth of the matter is that it is meaningless unless those recruits can actually do anything.

This year looks extremely promising but if we finish with even a below .500 record in the B10 then Pitino has to go.
 


If you want to use that excuse then you can't give Pitino any credit for the 13-14 team. That was all Tubby's guys.

No one expects Pitino to win a champion in the first couple of years. But hasn't built anything yet. You can talk about how great his recruiting is but the truth of the matter is that it is meaningless unless those recruits can actually do anything.

This year looks extremely promising but if we finish with even a below .500 record in the B10 then Pitino has to go.
False, Pitino brought in two starters, Deandre Mathieu and Joey King, the sixty man in Malik Smith and another rotation player in Daquan McNeil. Ruddy guys were the Hollins', slim down down Mo, which happened under Pitino, EE, Into, Mav, Biggs and Wally before he transferred. If anything that's the one year Pitino deserves credit managing roster, he did about well as he could to patch together the holes on that team. Had the Buckles been approved or if Gardner doesn't stomp on Andre ankle that team would have gone dancing.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk
 

Heres the players Tubby left Pitino:
Guards: Andre Hollins, Austin Hollins, Maverick Ahenmisi, Wally Ellenson, Kendall Shell(walkon)
Forwards: Oto Osenieks, Charles Buggs
Centers: Elliot eliason, Mo Walker
recruits at the time:
(Alex Foster Started at texas tech, transferred to bradley then finished his career at albany where he averaged 4 pts and 4 rebs his sr year)
(Alvin Ellis, bench player for 4 years at Michigan state, averaged 6 pts a game his sr year)

There was very little talent on that team, Pitino did a heck of a job that year.
 

Don’t be obtuse, you know why. Coaching Tubby’s bare cupboard the first 2 years, and crippling injuries/suspensions 2 of the last 3 years.

The only semi-normal year (I say semi because it ended with our 2 starting guards both needing surgery) we were the 2nd highest seeded team in the B1G and finished the conf season 8-1.

The question is, will he ever get the benefit of a normal year? Guys get nicked up now and then, but it’s not normal to be consistently losing guys for the season in basketball.

The answer is no. If you are looking for an excuses you can always find one. So every year can be considered an abnormal year. Just a matter of perception.
 

Heres the players Tubby left Pitino:
Guards: Andre Hollins, Austin Hollins, Maverick Ahenmisi, Wally Ellenson, Kendall Shell(walkon)
Forwards: Oto Osenieks, Charles Buggs
Centers: Elliot eliason, Mo Walker
recruits at the time:
(Alex Foster Started at texas tech, transferred to bradley then finished his career at albany where he averaged 4 pts and 4 rebs his sr year)
(Alvin Ellis, bench player for 4 years at Michigan state, averaged 6 pts a game his sr year)

There was very little talent on that team, Pitino did a heck of a job that year.

What grade do you give him overall. For 31-59 without a conference title or conference tourney title or a single tourney win i give him a D. So many excuses by fans and then all the off court stuff.
 



What grade do you give him overall. For 31-59 without a conference title or conference tourney title or a single tourney win i give him a D. So many excuses by fans and then all the off court stuff.

Not good overall but any coach was gonna have struggles with what was left here. Im not even a Pitino supporter but you cant look at that roster and expect success.
 

What grade do you give him overall. For 31-59 without a conference title or conference tourney title or a single tourney win i give him a D. So many excuses by fans and then all the off court stuff.

Same old lame attack on Pitino. Just get your head out of..... oh wait.

aed7921b7e8aee033027701051b9705b.gif



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Same old lame attack on Pitino. Just get your head out of..... oh wait.

aed7921b7e8aee033027701051b9705b.gif



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Guess your the one who watches strange stuff. I watch the basketball program. Was not attacking Pitino, was asking someones opinion on how he has done. ASKING A QUESTION. That is different then your personal attack and fetish video. Keep your personal video preferences yo yourself.
 

What grade do you give him overall. For 31-59 without a conference title or conference tourney title or a single tourney win i give him a D. So many excuses by fans and then all the off court stuff.

C

Bottom line doesn’t really justify any higher, but I think anything lower ignores some of the ridiculously bad luck the last couple years. (Eg, if Springs and Mason don’t suffer major injuries in the last 2 games of 2017, I firmly believe we win the BTT, win 1 or 2 games at least in the NCAA tourney, and this conversation is entirely different).

The off court stuff was becoming a significant, problematic trend, though I do not view the Lynch thing as a new “strike” ... Pitino appeared to have righted the ship culturally and had instituted new programs/focus on that kind of stuff, and then some campus people decided to reach back more than a year before these changes had been made and revive an old claim. If something else happens again now, though, that’s about it.
 



Guess your the one who watches strange stuff. I watch the basketball program. Was not attacking Pitino, was asking someones opinion on how he has done. ASKING A QUESTION. That is different then your personal attack and fetish video. Keep your personal video preferences yo yourself.

Agree w built here. I usually drink the kool aid but its been 5 years without a lot to show for it. It's like old wren always says: show me B1G wins or ill show you the door. Same is true in college bball. Show me NCAA wins or I'll show you the door.

This isn't a personal attack. The state pays him 3M a year and he has produced nothing. It doesnt mean he is a bad guy or even a bad coach. It just means he hasn't produced in his time here.

Teague fired tubby because he didnr produce in Feb and March. (Granted his new hire is in question) I'm sure Coyle is thinking the same. March is when the money is made and our coaches haven't done jack in that month since 1997.
 

C

Bottom line doesn’t really justify any higher, but I think anything lower ignores some of the ridiculously bad luck the last couple years. (Eg, if Springs and Mason don’t suffer major injuries in the last 2 games of 2017, I firmly believe we win the BTT, win 1 or 2 games at least in the NCAA tourney, and this conversation is entirely different).

The off court stuff was becoming a significant, problematic trend, though I do not view the Lynch thing as a new “strike” ... Pitino appeared to have righted the ship culturally and had instituted new programs/focus on that kind of stuff, and then some campus people decided to reach back more than a year before these changes had been made and revive an old claim. If something else happens again now, though, that’s about it.

Thank you. I can see how you could give a C. Tried myself to find a C but just could not get past 31-59. Thanks for your open minded response.
 

Agree w built here. I usually drink the kool aid but its been 5 years without a lot to show for it. It's like old wren always says: show me B1G wins or ill show you the door. Same is true in college bball. Show me NCAA wins or I'll show you the door.

This isn't a personal attack. The state pays him 3M a year and he has produced nothing. It doesnt mean he is a bad guy or even a bad coach. It just means he hasn't produced in his time here.

Teague fired tubby because he didnr produce in Feb and March. (Granted his new hire is in question) I'm sure Coyle is thinking the same. March is when the money is made and our coaches haven't done jack in that month since 1997.
He doesn't three million, not even close, think you're thinking of PJ salary. I think Pitino is around 1.7 mill, but I agree with the sentiment. When the same thing happens over and over again, it's time to make a change, Pitino has put himself in a spot to let injuries detail this team, which can do very well if they stay healthy. I thought 2015-2016 was a combo of bad recruiting at the end of the tubby era and Pitino gambling on guys like Lifting and McNeil who left program and some recruiting mistakes in konate, diediou and Martin, but you could see the step back coming the day he took the job. Pitino made it worse. I like what he did with the roster two years ago, you could also see that coming which made the previous year more tolerable. I like the current freshman class, I think he brought in some good transfers, unfortunately only Stull can help this year. Last year was unfortunate, but it put him in a spot where roster mismanagement will be his undoing if the injury bug strikes again. Tubby couldn't win in February that did him in. Pitino not having enough healthy bodies could be his and he will have no one to blame, but himself. May the ball god's be on our side.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk
 

Jesus, can we nuke this thread already? I think it is time to move on.

Sent from my LGL41C using Tapatalk
 

I think everyone here needs to take a step back from the ledge. Pitino said himself we were fine at pg without Crandall so not getting him leaves us in the same place pg wise. Getting him would have been a bonus and may have helped us get further in the tournament but it wasn't likely the difference between making the tournament or not this year. Obviously Pitino is comfortable at post depth as well or he would have told Matz to stick it out because we were going to need him. If he is fine with it so am I. If he didn't have a say in Matz leaving then there was no conspiracy there and nothing to complain about.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Agree w built here. I usually drink the kool aid but its been 5 years without a lot to show for it. It's like old wren always says: show me B1G wins or ill show you the door. Same is true in college bball. Show me NCAA wins or I'll show you the door.

This isn't a personal attack. The state pays him 3M a year and he has produced nothing. It doesnt mean he is a bad guy or even a bad coach. It just means he hasn't produced in his time here.

Teague fired tubby because he didnr produce in Feb and March. (Granted his new hire is in question) I'm sure Coyle is thinking the same. March is when the money is made and our coaches haven't done jack in that month since 1997.

Tubby was fired because of other outside factors too. He had totally lost confidence within the state and with AAU and HS coaches. We also had the big 3 (eventually 4 with Macura) and other classes with good players coming up (Jarvis J and Amir C). Tubby also had lost confidence with boosters and was god awful fundraising because he felt above it. This convo has been done quite a bit.

Crandall would've been nice addition in March. Guards win in the tournament. I do believe however that we got guards and enough depth to be good this year with or without Crandall. Pree, Stull, and Amir can take PT for spot minutes. Teams don't always have more than one dominant PG. same with back to the basket centers which is why I was fine seeing Matz choose to play elsewhere.
 

Tubby was fired because of other outside factors too. He had totally lost confidence within the state and with AAU and HS coaches. We also had the big 3 (eventually 4 with Macura) and other classes with good players coming up (Jarvis J and Amir C). Tubby also had lost confidence with boosters and was god awful fundraising because he felt above it. This convo has been done quite a bit.

Crandall would've been nice addition in March. Guards win in the tournament. I do believe however that we got guards and enough depth to be good this year with or without Crandall. Pree, Stull, and Amir can take PT for spot minutes. Teams don't always have more than one dominant PG. same with back to the basket centers which is why I was fine seeing Matz choose to play elsewhere.

Hmmmm....the head coach losing in state recruits and losing fan confidence. Sounds familiar.

It may not be as bad as the tubby era but Pitino is losing ground in MN AAU circles. Kids are telling others not to come here. Pitino is likely to strike out on the hugely talented MN 2019 class and doesnt look good for 2020 either.
 

Hmmmm....the head coach losing in state recruits and losing fan confidence. Sounds familiar.

It may not be as bad as the tubby era but Pitino is losing ground in MN AAU circles. Kids are telling others not to come here. Pitino is likely to strike out on the hugely talented MN 2019 class and doesnt look good for 2020 either.

As a general rule I think most high-major players can be expected to play outside their home state and see no reason why this really matters. For some, staying near home makes sense and those kids are somewhat special to me as a fan (current and incoming guys for sure). However, in the end all that really matters is the overall talent level (and respectability/decency) of the incoming players. I for one do not care where they come from. I am a HUGE Jordan Murphy fan. Ditto Nate Mason; Dupree McBrayer; Eric Curry so-on and so-forth. None of them from the great state of Minnesota.

My own kids left their backyard to attend college and no reason this does not extend to student athletes.
 

Hmmmm....the head coach losing in state recruits and losing fan confidence. Sounds familiar.

It may not be as bad as the tubby era but Pitino is losing ground in MN AAU circles. Kids are telling others not to come here. Pitino is likely to strike out on the hugely talented MN 2019 class and doesnt look good for 2020 either.
Do you have proof of "kids telling other kids not to come here"? Curious to hear more.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk
 

Hmmmm....the head coach losing in state recruits and losing fan confidence. Sounds familiar.

It may not be as bad as the tubby era but Pitino is losing ground in MN AAU circles. Kids are telling others not to come here. Pitino is likely to strike out on the hugely talented MN 2019 class and doesnt look good for 2020 either.

For sure needs to do better this year, but please slow down on losing confidence with AAU coaches. Also we just had 3 2018 recruits that are coming here and we're recruiting kids. We had a turnover of our two top recruiters. That is a fall out that happens because new relationships need to be made. Remember we struck out in 2017 and followed it with 2018. 2020 is is still two years (closer to 1 1/2) away. It's a great class and if we don't get any 2019 we can hopefully get some of them. If not let someone hope our new connections can get us some quality kids from outstate. Bigger issue for us AAU wise is that Pulley didn't have any 2019 kids. As I mentioned earlier it seems D1 pushes kids away. We had good pull with Pulley kids, grassroots Sizzle( UA program) is a wild card still, but have Damn and Chet Holmgren (Not even counting on Suggs). Let's see what Jeter can do as our local guy now. Ben was good instate no doubt.
 

Guess your the one who watches strange stuff. I watch the basketball program. Was not attacking Pitino, was asking someones opinion on how he has done. ASKING A QUESTION. That is different then your personal attack and fetish video. Keep your personal video preferences yo yourself.

Quick google gif search, was going to post the dead horse again... just trying to be funny.
It seems we have this discussion every couple of weeks. Pitino took a couple of long shots his first recruiting class, got fooled by a couple of top players that said we were in their top three, etc.. this along with player issues gave us a roster with several holes in it. Last year was the first year of his tenure that we was going to have the right players in the right positions. His bench was still very weak and injuries and prior player issues gave him too many holes to fill. Also, he had dropped off on his opponent scouting, which may have been one of the reasons we had a few coaching changes (I don’t know). He has had two very good recruiting classes and is now poised to have a good year. You can not just blindly look at his record and judge his coaching ability. He has had flashes of in game coaching brilliance with his NIT run, his shift to the freshman at the end of that terrible year, his run down in Florida, etc. He has learned on the job, what you expect if you hire a young (most likely too early) coach. Has his tenure at the U been acceptable? No, but he shows the potential to be a great coach with his player development, recruiting (of course we want him to lock down more of the in-state players, but with the average fan thinking we suck he has no chance). Believe me, if we kick him out the door, their will be other schools scrambling for him. We have gone through his growing pains, we should be the one that gets the rewards.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

Respect your opinion. I am all in favor of him coaching this year and expecting a huge year in year 6. That would earn him more time. But for me to consider him to be even average based on what he has done does not compute. Also do wonder who are all the schools that would scoop him up if he was let go ? Few if any power 5 schools would take him over what they have. Can not think of one. Other coaches at other schools have overcome fans thinking they suck by winning ! The way others did it under very difficult circumstances was to instill a culture of defense that gives no quarter and strong fundamentals in addition to very strict rules for off the court behavior. Those 3 areas all get very low marks from me. Each person can decide for themselves. Again, just for me i could care less about winning the NIT. Contend in the conference, qualify for the tourney and occassionally win a game in the NCAA. Do that and fans here would build a statue. Win the conference now, it is doable. The conference is down and it will not be long before Indiana, Ohio State and UW are all really strong.
 

Hmmmm....the head coach losing in state recruits and losing fan confidence. Sounds familiar.

It may not be as bad as the tubby era but Pitino is losing ground in MN AAU circles. Kids are telling others not to come here. Pitino is likely to strike out on the hugely talented MN 2019 class and doesnt look good for 2020 either.

Where does the idea that Tubby was bad at in-state recruiting come from? He literally got a commit from almost every in-state player he offered while he was coach here.
 

Where does the idea that Tubby was bad at in-state recruiting come from? He literally got a commit from almost every in-state player he offered while he was coach here.
I agree, what did him in was the lack of in state talent between 2010-2013. He only offered Coleman and got him. It does seem like there was some sort of fall off though, I don't think a change would've been made if relationships were good with the 2014 and 2015 kids.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk
 

I agree, what did him in was the lack of in state talent between 2010-2013. He only offered Coleman and got him. It does seem like there was some sort of fall off though, I don't think a change would've been made if relationships were good with the 2014 and 2015 kids.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

This is 100% correct. Relationships with incoming recruits, HS coaches, and AAU coaches were basically all dissolved or nonexistent. He'd kept his job if there was a chance at any of those guys. Best chance was at Vaughn because his handler wanted him to be the guy so he wasn't ever going to a blue blood.
 

Do you have proof of "kids telling other kids not to come here"? Curious to hear more.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

I would be interested in this as well. People continue to ignore that Pitino just signed 3 of the top 4 in-state recruits, and continue to write off the 2019 and 20 classes as if they know what will happen in the future.
 

It may not be as bad as the tubby era but Pitino is losing ground in MN AAU circles. Kids are telling others not to come here. Pitino is likely to strike out on the hugely talented MN 2019 class and doesnt look good for 2020 either.

I'm also curious as to who these kids are who are telling other players not to come to Minnesota. We breathlessly await a link or other proof of some sort.
 




Top Bottom