If you’re Coyle, why do u keep Pitino

Donate To GopherHole
GopherPlaya said:
A coach should have enough depth to cover for some of those loses. Texas A & M have yet to play a game with their full roster including a projected NBA 1st rounder. We lost 2 bigs & have 0 options after. Our best options on the wing after Amir & Dupree injuries are Hurt & Fitz. It's not about the bad luck that we are experiencing. It's about not having viable alternatives in case those things happen. If Lynch & Curry were healthy, who do we turn to if both & Murphy are in foul trouble or foul out. How is the lack of effort & constant complaining to officials not on him. We were a top heavy to with minimal depth before the season & last year that's why we crumbled after Springs injury.
Click to expand...

Well, I'm pretty sure everything's been said about BK and GD. I guess you either give Pitino a pass on their recruitment or you don't.

You also need to remember that Fitzgerald is coming off of a second ACL tear, and likely isn't the player he was when he arrived on campus, so there's a bit of additional bad luck for you.

You're correct in stating that we don't have viable options behind many players, but next year's roster construction appears to be trending in the right direction, especially when/if RP gets the PG situation figured out.

The real question, and the purpose of this thread is to decide whether or not RP deserves to be fired. I believe it to be too soon for that. Those scholarships to BK and GD turned out to be disastrous. Those are nearly in the past, and the next season or two will be very telling for RP, when he has legitimate options on the bench. If he can't get it done with Stockman, and the stable of PF's at his disposal next year then I think we'll have to reassess.

I guess I think it's a bit funny that some people on here expect greatness, and they expect it immediately. Everything in life is temporary. The highs with this team will (hopefully not, but probably will) be temporary, the lows will be temporary. We're not Duke, we're not UCLA, hell we're not even Wisconsin. We're not in a position as a basketball program to demand greatness or even sustained (moderate) success over a four to five year period.

I agree with the posters griping about his roster construction, but you have to maintain perspective. The recruiting misses in basketball are a lot more glaring in basketball where you only get 13-14 scholarships. The mistake at Center was compounded by missing badly on two extremely substandard players four years ago. That is absolutely a ding against RP, but does it really constitute his being fired over? I think he's recruited well enough (and consistently) over the past four years to prove that he's better than making big reaches for unproven talent.

Honestly, the only other player on our roster that I disagree with the recruitment of is Michael Hurt. I understand that some people on here like him, and believe he can be a contributor, but I don't see it, not if this team wants to go places. HOWEVER, if RP thought it would help get Matthew on campus, then it was the right decision, because Michael's decent, and isn't really going to hurt (no pun intended) you in the 7 minutes he plays per game.

Pretty much every other recruit I think has been worth the chance taken.

Can he coach? Not as well as we'd all like, but I'm an optimist and believe that he can improve.
 

GopherHoopsFan said:
Well, I'm pretty sure everything's been said about BK and GD. I guess you either give Pitino a pass on their recruitment or you don't.

You also need to remember that Fitzgerald is coming off of a second ACL tear, and likely isn't the player he was when he arrived on campus, so there's a bit of additional bad luck for you.

You're correct in stating that we don't have viable options behind many players, but next year's roster construction appears to be trending in the right direction, especially when/if RP gets the PG situation figured out.

The real question, and the purpose of this thread is to decide whether or not RP deserves to be fired. I believe it to be too soon for that. Those scholarships to BK and GD turned out to be disastrous. Those are nearly in the past, and the next season or two will be very telling for RP, when he has legitimate options on the bench. If he can't get it done with Stockman, and the stable of PF's at his disposal next year then I think we'll have to reassess.

I guess I think it's a bit funny that some people on here expect greatness, and they expect it immediately. Everything in life is temporary. The highs with this team will (hopefully not, but probably will) be temporary, the lows will be temporary. We're not Duke, we're not UCLA, hell we're not even Wisconsin. We're not in a position as a basketball program to demand greatness or even sustained (moderate) success over a four to five year period.

I agree with the posters griping about his roster construction, but you have to maintain perspective. The recruiting misses in basketball are a lot more glaring in basketball where you only get 13-14 scholarships. The mistake at Center was compounded by missing badly on two extremely substandard players four years ago. That is absolutely a ding against RP, but does it really constitute his being fired over? I think he's recruited well enough (and consistently) over the past four years to prove that he's better than making big reaches for unproven talent.

Honestly, the only other player on our roster that I disagree with the recruitment of is Michael Hurt. I understand that some people on here like him, and believe he can be a contributor, but I don't see it, not if this team wants to go places. HOWEVER, if RP thought it would help get Matthew on campus, then it was the right decision, because Michael's decent, and isn't really going to hurt (no pun intended) you in the 7 minutes he plays per game.

Pretty much every other recruit I think has been worth the chance taken.

Can he coach? Not as well as we'd all like, but I'm an optimist and believe that he can improve.
Click to expand...

He's approaching year 7 so we will see.

Monson was here for 7 and a few games & went 118-106 .527
Tubby was here for 6 & went 124-81 .605 win %
Pitino is 89-71 .556 win %

We will see how it all plays out, but the others only got 7 years
 

short ornery norwegian said:
Some of these posts basically come down to this:

Something good happens - the Coach gets the credit.

Something bad happens - it's not the coaches' fault.

He's the head coach - he's responsible for the whole program, not just when things are going well.
Click to expand...

???

Dude, when the "bad" thing happens are not something the coach can do anything about, like several injuries, and like the Metoo movement starting up inspiring 2 gals who apparently wouldn't have otherwise to make accusations against a player?

If the "bad" thing that happens is a crap load of losses that can be directly traced to the coach, THEN YEAH, the coach deserves the blame.



AND, on the other side of the coin, you say that when something good happens - the coach gets the credit? Well, if he was the one who recruited all the players and coached them to wins, why wouldn't he take credit?
 

GopherPlaya said:
We had Colton Iverson, Ralph Sampson, Damian Johnson, & Paul Carter all able to take over for Royce & Trevor. Devoe Joseph took over for Al. Curry is ideally a backup for Jordan Murphy who can play spot Center minutes. Having our 2 worst players be at the same position is a problem. Losing isn't the problem for me it's effort & not having any other options. We have 13 Scholarships and Stockman is using one plus Fitz, Gaston, & Bakary are wasted ones. If you include Hurt in that group, that's basically 8 Big Ten Players with 2 being freshmen (Harris, Washington). So we had to have an injury/trouble free season for things to not go the direction it's headed. That isn't a problem to you. We were a 6 man rotation with foul prone big men. That was the reason we lost out after Springs went down.
Click to expand...

This pretty much sums up my thoughts on our current plight. Well stated.

I'm optimistic about next season (assuming we can find a competent PG somewhere). Pitino deserves 18-19 to get us back into the tourney. If he can't, it's 100% time to pull the plug.

1 tourney berth in 6 seasons is totally unacceptable regardless of bad luck with injuries and suspensions. Tubby suffered through a similar amount of bad luck and we (justifiably) fired him after 3 tourneys in 6 seasons.
 

Ok, his bringing in Konate and Gaston has really hurt this team THIS year.

Last year it only hurt when Lynch would get into foul trouble early. Pitino seemed to be making progress with Lynch in this regard in the 2nd half of last season and it showed in our winning a lot more, also in the first half of this season.



But seriously, I don't remember a ton of fans griping about Konate or Gaston when they got recruited? I even have a vague remembrance of people saying good things about them and seeing a lot of potential in them? Maybe that is the ever hopeful fan within us hoping recruits are better than they may seem and so not wanting to bad mouth them? Or maybe all of the Pitino haters are only using hindsight to pretend like those two being recruited was a HUGE mistake that Pitino should have known was a mistake.


It's not like he was a guy with a ton of Head Coaching experience? It's not like he was one of our Top 6 options, or that UMn's Top 6 options would even all be Top 10 options at other P5 schools?


But I bet he doesn't make the same kind of mistake again.
 


Zeppelin Gopher said:
Tubby suffered through a similar amount of bad luck and we (justifiably) fired him after 3 tourneys in 6 seasons.
Click to expand...

Tubby had 3 players out for the same season, and a 4th hobbled? I mean, I know 2010 he had some bad luck, but he was also a HOF bound former Natl Title winning coach, he SHOULD be expected to have a better lineup of players to back up guys that couldn't play, and he did, that year. Barely got into the tourney and lost right away. Btw, it was mentioned about the B1G title run that team made, its very possible the team only got in because of that run. So missing those players, despite a much deeper bench, almost cost them the tourney, too.



And Tubby wasn't fired because of his not getting to the tourney enough, although with his experience and resume, its possible people expected more out of his right off the bat. Did he suffer some bad luck? Sure, and I believe he was basically given a pass for that, but he was fired because his recruiting was GOING DOWNHILL, he was getting older and he seemed to be mailing it in basically and it seemed like things would not get better if he was left at the helm.

With Pitino the opposite is true, he is the opposite of Tubby in many ways, FAR LESS experience as a head coach, and started out much slower recruiting wise, but unlike Tubby his classes are getting better and there seems to be hope for the future. He's young and is no where near quitting yet. Our expectations of Pitino should be MUCH LOWER than the expectations we had of Tubby.

Is he running a perfect ship that can weather a huge storm? No, not yet. But hopefully he learns from all of this and by next year is at least getting into the NCAA tourney, and the years after that, is returning to the NCAA tourney a lot.


If we bring in a new guy, then we'll almost have to start over again and give him 4-5 years and he may not even pan out?


If we have to settle for our 7th choice again to replace Pitino, KEEP HIM!!!


IF, somehow we know we can snag someone like Musselman, then that might be something I could support? I just don't believe that we CAN get the guy we want.
 


KillmeNow said:
Tubby had 3 players out for the same season, and a 4th hobbled? I mean, I know 2010 he had some bad luck, but he was also a HOF bound former Natl Title winning coach, he SHOULD be expected to have a better lineup of players to back up guys that couldn't play, and he did, that year. Barely got into the tourney and lost right away. Btw, it was mentioned about the B1G title run that team made, its very possible the team only got in because of that run. So missing those players, despite a much deeper bench, almost cost them the tourney, too.



And Tubby wasn't fired because of his not getting to the tourney enough, although with his experience and resume, its possible people expected more out of his right off the bat. Did he suffer some bad luck? Sure, and I believe he was basically given a pass for that, but he was fired because his recruiting was GOING DOWNHILL, he was getting older and he seemed to be mailing it in basically and it seemed like things would not get better if he was left at the helm.

With Pitino the opposite is true, he is the opposite of Tubby in many ways, FAR LESS experience as a head coach, and started out much slower recruiting wise, but unlike Tubby his classes are getting better and there seems to be hope for the future. He's young and is no where near quitting yet. Our expectations of Pitino should be MUCH LOWER than the expectations we had of Tubby.

Is he running a perfect ship that can weather a huge storm? No, not yet. But hopefully he learns from all of this and by next year is at least getting into the NCAA tourney, and the years after that, is returning to the NCAA tourney a lot.


If we bring in a new guy, then we'll almost have to start over again and give him 4-5 years and he may not even pan out?


If we have to settle for our 7th choice again to replace Pitino, KEEP HIM!!!


IF, somehow we know we can snag someone like Musselman, then that might be something I could support? I just don't believe that we CAN get the guy we want.
Click to expand...

I'm trying to avoid having this become a Tubby discussion, but I can't help it with this one. People complained about Tubby's recruiting because of where it was in the recruiting rankings, but I guess those people never really came to understand how Tubby operates. He doesn't care about recruiting rankings, because he is good at finding underrated talent. Look at Texas Tech's roster right now. (They are 18-4 and ranked #10 in the country by the way.) Their stud is Kennan Evans. Brought in by Tubby. Ranked in the upper 200s in his recruiting class. Now he's possibly an All-American. TT's leading rebounder? Also brought in by Tubby. Ranked around 300 in his recruiting class. In fact, 4 of the 5 regular starters on that team (again, currently ranked number 10 in the nation) were brought in by Tubby.

Now, don't get me wrong, Chris Beard has done a great job there and deserves much of the credit. But I'm so sick of hearing this nonsense about recruiting rankings. If a coach is not getting good recruits, and also not getting it done record-wise then you have a problem. Earlier on this thread there was a discussion of how sometimes highly ranked recruiting classes don't produce results. And this is 100% correct. I'm not saying recruiting rankings don't matter at all, but with so many transfers/injuries/suspensions/etc. depth is also a very important aspect of building a roster. As is finding diamonds in the rough.

Many here (myself included) acknowledge that it isn't fair for us to expect to go to the sweet sixteen every year. We aren't a college basketball powerhouse. A really good decade for us means maybe 6-7 trips to the NCAA tournament, no years where we fall completely flat, and a couple years where we contend for a B1G championship along with a shot at the Final Four. The closest we have been to this in my lifetime was with Tubby. But then good ol' Norwood thought he was the smartest guy in the room, and decided he was going to go out and get us a coach that would take us to the promised land. And we got too enamored with recruiting rankings without seeing what we already had. The U of M is the type of place that needs to bring in under-the-radar players (brought in by someone who can identify under-the-radar talent) and have them stay for four years. Sure, we can bring in a transfer every now and then because we are inevitably going to lose a few transfers as well, but we are the type of program that needs four year guys.

It has been brought up before, but the 2009-10 team is a prime example of this.

And don't even get me started on the "expectations should be lower for Pitino" assertion. That's nonsense. It's year 5. Time for results.
 

bizzle22 said:
I'm trying to avoid having this become a Tubby discussion, but I can't help it with this one. People complained about Tubby's recruiting because of where it was in the recruiting rankings, but I guess those people never really came to understand how Tubby operates. He doesn't care about recruiting rankings, because he is good at finding underrated talent. Look at Texas Tech's roster right now. (They are 18-4 and ranked #10 in the country by the way.) Their stud is Kennan Evans. Brought in by Tubby. Ranked in the upper 200s in his recruiting class. Now he's possibly an All-American. TT's leading rebounder? Also brought in by Tubby. Ranked around 300 in his recruiting class. In fact, 4 of the 5 regular starters on that team (again, currently ranked number 10 in the nation) were brought in by Tubby.

Now, don't get me wrong, Chris Beard has done a great job there and deserves much of the credit. But I'm so sick of hearing this nonsense about recruiting rankings. If a coach is not getting good recruits, and also not getting it done record-wise then you have a problem. Earlier on this thread there was a discussion of how sometimes highly ranked recruiting classes don't produce results. And this is 100% correct. I'm not saying recruiting rankings don't matter at all, but with so many transfers/injuries/suspensions/etc. depth is also a very important aspect of building a roster. As is finding diamonds in the rough.

Many here (myself included) acknowledge that it isn't fair for us to expect to go to the sweet sixteen every year. We aren't a college basketball powerhouse. A really good decade for us means maybe 6-7 trips to the NCAA tournament, no years where we fall completely flat, and a couple years where we contend for a B1G championship along with a shot at the Final Four. The closest we have been to this in my lifetime was with Tubby. But then good ol' Norwood thought he was the smartest guy in the room, and decided he was going to go out and get us a coach that would take us to the promised land. And we got too enamored with recruiting rankings without seeing what we already had. The U of M is the type of place that needs to bring in under-the-radar players (brought in by someone who can identify under-the-radar talent) and have them stay for four years. Sure, we can bring in a transfer every now and then because we are inevitably going to lose a few transfers as well, but we are the type of program that needs four year guys.

It has been brought up before, but the 2009-10 team is a prime example of this.

And don't even get me started on the "expectations should be lower for Pitino" assertion. That's nonsense. It's year 5. Time for results.
Click to expand...
It wasn't about recruiting rankings it was about effort on the recruiting trail. Tubby had basically quit recruiting. He wasn't finding under the radar prospects he just wasn't getting out on the recruiting trail very much at all. He thought Minnesota was a retirement job for himself and he could coast to it. When he went to Texas Tech he was energized again and had something to prove so started putting in more time again. Pitino is a great recruiter and has brought in more and more talent and will continue to do so.
 



Goldy Gopher said:
It wasn't about recruiting rankings it was about effort on the recruiting trail. Tubby had basically quit recruiting. He wasn't finding under the radar prospects he just wasn't getting out on the recruiting trail very much at all. He thought Minnesota was a retirement job for himself and he could coast to it. When he went to Texas Tech he was energized again and had something to prove so started putting in more time again. Pitino is a great recruiter and has brought in more and more talent and will continue to do so.
Click to expand...

Retirement job...IALTO. That's why he took two more job after. Probably doesn't have enough money saved up. And yes I'm sure going to the metropolis of Lubbock magically energized him.
 

GopherHoopsFan said:
Well, I'm pretty sure everything's been said about BK and GD. I guess you either give Pitino a pass on their recruitment or you don't.

You also need to remember that Fitzgerald is coming off of a second ACL tear, and likely isn't the player he was when he arrived on campus, so there's a bit of additional bad luck for you.

You're correct in stating that we don't have viable options behind many players, but next year's roster construction appears to be trending in the right direction, especially when/if RP gets the PG situation figured out.

The real question, and the purpose of this thread is to decide whether or not RP deserves to be fired. I believe it to be too soon for that. Those scholarships to BK and GD turned out to be disastrous. Those are nearly in the past, and the next season or two will be very telling for RP, when he has legitimate options on the bench. If he can't get it done with Stockman, and the stable of PF's at his disposal next year then I think we'll have to reassess.

I guess I think it's a bit funny that some people on here expect greatness, and they expect it immediately. Everything in life is temporary. The highs with this team will (hopefully not, but probably will) be temporary, the lows will be temporary. We're not Duke, we're not UCLA, hell we're not even Wisconsin. We're not in a position as a basketball program to demand greatness or even sustained (moderate) success over a four to five year period.

I agree with the posters griping about his roster construction, but you have to maintain perspective. The recruiting misses in basketball are a lot more glaring in basketball where you only get 13-14 scholarships. The mistake at Center was compounded by missing badly on two extremely substandard players four years ago. That is absolutely a ding against RP, but does it really constitute his being fired over? I think he's recruited well enough (and consistently) over the past four years to prove that he's better than making big reaches for unproven talent.

Honestly, the only other player on our roster that I disagree with the recruitment of is Michael Hurt. I understand that some people on here like him, and believe he can be a contributor, but I don't see it, not if this team wants to go places. HOWEVER, if RP thought it would help get Matthew on campus, then it was the right decision, because Michael's decent, and isn't really going to hurt (no pun intended) you in the 7 minutes he plays per game.

Pretty much every other recruit I think has been worth the chance taken.

Can he coach? Not as well as we'd all like, but I'm an optimist and believe that he can improve.
Click to expand...

This is a bit much, I don't think anyone expects greatness, we just want a competitive basketball team. Injuries don't mean the team shouldn't play defense. And the immediately part of your quote, really?? C'mon, man it's year 5, that's not really immediate is it? There are good reasons to not fire Pitino, but so many folks post this type of argument (Everyone expects us to win but we have a depleted roster) and a lot of folks know we aren't going to win, but we still want to be entertained when we go to Williams arena by a competitive game.
 

bizzle22 said:
Retirement job...IALTO. That's why he took two more job after. Probably doesn't have enough money saved up. And yes I'm sure going to the metropolis of Lubbock magically energized him.
Click to expand...
+1 for taking out a Tubby apologist.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
 

Who would you replace him with? Someone who would be willing to coach at Minnesota.

I think I would keep Pitino but I do not follow basketball anywhere near as close as some of you.
 



West Fargo Gopher Fan said:
Who would you replace him with? Someone who would be willing to coach at Minnesota.

I think I would keep Pitino but I do not follow basketball anywhere near as close as some of you.
Click to expand...
The name most bandied about is Eric Musselman.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
 

KillmeNow said:
Tubby had 3 players out for the same season, and a 4th hobbled? I mean, I know 2010 he had some bad luck, but he was also a HOF bound former Natl Title winning coach, he SHOULD be expected to have a better lineup of players to back up guys that couldn't play, and he did, that year. Barely got into the tourney and lost right away. Btw, it was mentioned about the B1G title run that team made, its very possible the team only got in because of that run. So missing those players, despite a much deeper bench, almost cost them the tourney, too.



And Tubby wasn't fired because of his not getting to the tourney enough, although with his experience and resume, its possible people expected more out of his right off the bat. Did he suffer some bad luck? Sure, and I believe he was basically given a pass for that, but he was fired because his recruiting was GOING DOWNHILL, he was getting older and he seemed to be mailing it in basically and it seemed like things would not get better if he was left at the helm.

With Pitino the opposite is true, he is the opposite of Tubby in many ways, FAR LESS experience as a head coach, and started out much slower recruiting wise, but unlike Tubby his classes are getting better and there seems to be hope for the future. He's young and is no where near quitting yet. Our expectations of Pitino should be MUCH LOWER than the expectations we had of Tubby.

Is he running a perfect ship that can weather a huge storm? No, not yet. But hopefully he learns from all of this and by next year is at least getting into the NCAA tourney, and the years after that, is returning to the NCAA tourney a lot.


If we bring in a new guy, then we'll almost have to start over again and give him 4-5 years and he may not even pan out?


If we have to settle for our 7th choice again to replace Pitino, KEEP HIM!!!


IF, somehow we know we can snag someone like Musselman, then that might be something I could support? I just don't believe that we CAN get the guy we want.
Click to expand...

Wow, what an interesting concept, Pitino isn't a very good coach so we must lower our standards for evaluating him and his teams. OUCH, wonder how he would feel about this defense. I think its ridiculous, judge him as a Big Ten coach. I mean seriously, what kind of culture says the coach ain't no good so cut him some slack, ya can't expect too much from him.
 

bizzle22 said:
Retirement job...IALTO. That's why he took two more job after. Probably doesn't have enough money saved up. And yes I'm sure going to the metropolis of Lubbock magically energized him.
Click to expand...
He took another job because he needed to he thought he'd be able to coast in Minnesota for another 10 years and instead got fired because he and parts of his staff weren't putting in the work they needed to. It wasn't really going to Lubbock that energized him it was that he actually got fired that woke him up and made him realize he needed to put in more time.
 

bizzle22 said:
I'm trying to avoid having this become a Tubby discussion, but I can't help it with this one. People complained about Tubby's recruiting because of where it was in the recruiting rankings, but I guess those people never really came to understand how Tubby operates. He doesn't care about recruiting rankings, because he is good at finding underrated talent. Look at Texas Tech's roster right now. (They are 18-4 and ranked #10 in the country by the way.) Their stud is Kennan Evans. Brought in by Tubby. Ranked in the upper 200s in his recruiting class. Now he's possibly an All-American. TT's leading rebounder? Also brought in by Tubby. Ranked around 300 in his recruiting class. In fact, 4 of the 5 regular starters on that team (again, currently ranked number 10 in the nation) were brought in by Tubby.

Now, don't get me wrong, Chris Beard has done a great job there and deserves much of the credit. But I'm so sick of hearing this nonsense about recruiting rankings. If a coach is not getting good recruits, and also not getting it done record-wise then you have a problem. Earlier on this thread there was a discussion of how sometimes highly ranked recruiting classes don't produce results. And this is 100% correct. I'm not saying recruiting rankings don't matter at all, but with so many transfers/injuries/suspensions/etc. depth is also a very important aspect of building a roster. As is finding diamonds in the rough.

Many here (myself included) acknowledge that it isn't fair for us to expect to go to the sweet sixteen every year. We aren't a college basketball powerhouse. A really good decade for us means maybe 6-7 trips to the NCAA tournament, no years where we fall completely flat, and a couple years where we contend for a B1G championship along with a shot at the Final Four. The closest we have been to this in my lifetime was with Tubby. But then good ol' Norwood thought he was the smartest guy in the room, and decided he was going to go out and get us a coach that would take us to the promised land. And we got too enamored with recruiting rankings without seeing what we already had. The U of M is the type of place that needs to bring in under-the-radar players (brought in by someone who can identify under-the-radar talent) and have them stay for four years. Sure, we can bring in a transfer every now and then because we are inevitably going to lose a few transfers as well, but we are the type of program that needs four year guys.

It has been brought up before, but the 2009-10 team is a prime example of this.

And don't even get me started on the "expectations should be lower for Pitino" assertion. That's nonsense. It's year 5. Time for results.
Click to expand...

I don't care about rankings. His last two classes had nothing. Wally and Buggs was his last official class and he had Alex Foster who did nothing at TT and the Ellis kid that went to MSU and was average. So one average B1G player total in two classes. We were trending in a bad direction. He would have had to pull off some very good Spring recruiting to salvage things. His prior Spring recruiting (Ingram, Maverick, etc.) says that wouldn't have happened.
 

Goldy Gopher said:
It wasn't about recruiting rankings it was about effort on the recruiting trail. Tubby had basically quit recruiting. He wasn't finding under the radar prospects he just wasn't getting out on the recruiting trail very much at all. He thought Minnesota was a retirement job for himself and he could coast to it. When he went to Texas Tech he was energized again and had something to prove so started putting in more time again. Pitino is a great recruiter and has brought in more and more talent and will continue to do so.
Click to expand...

Everything you've said is absurd. Pitino's a better recruiter on paper - compare the W/L records through 5 seasons and let me know who's the better recruiter.
 

I think this is pretty simple. If Coyle feels he has a shot at getting a guy like Musselman to come here...it is worth it to pay the buyout and go and get the guy that you want.

I think the more likely scenario is that Coyle can't find a coach that is worth paying the buyout for and Pitino gets one last crack at proving everyone wrong.
 

Gogogopher said:
Wow, what an interesting concept, Pitino isn't a very good coach so we must lower our standards for evaluating him and his teams. OUCH, wonder how he would feel about this defense. I think its ridiculous, judge him as a Big Ten coach. I mean seriously, what kind of culture says the coach ain't no good so cut him some slack, ya can't expect too much from him.
Click to expand...

Good response. Really funny too.
+10
 

This season feels too much like two years ago. In looking at the schedules, it's actually worse. We lost a lot of close games two years ago. Through the 15th conference game (when all of our guards were suspended) we only lost 6 games by double digits, 2 non-conference and 4 conference games. This year we have already lost 7 games by double digits, 2 non-conference and 5 conference through the 11th B1G game. There's really no excuse for it. There's still more talent on this team than there was on that one.
 

dpodoll68 said:
Everything you've said is absurd. Pitino's a better recruiter on paper - compare the W/L records through 5 seasons and let me know who's the better recruiter.
Click to expand...
Everything I said is true and no matter how you compare it the better recruiter is easily Pitino.
 

The who you going to hire that is better than Pitino and no one would want this job are pretty lazy takes.

This is a decent enough job in a power conference. Brand new facilities and more than enough instate talent if you convince them to stay to home you can be consistently competitive.

If Coyle decides to move on from Pitino unlikely he will have to go as far down the list for the hire as Teague did.
 

bizzle22 said:
And don't even get me started on the "expectations should be lower for Pitino" assertion. That's nonsense. It's year 5. Time for results.
Click to expand...

Someone else already addressed the idea that Tubby was basically just mailing it in at the end of his time here, so I won't expand on that.


But my comment about lowered expectations for Pitino was referring to his first 5 years as a whole, compared to Tubby's first 5 years. Tubby was a Natl Title winning coach, and a future HOFer, so YEAH, HELL YEAH in fact, the expectations for him should be higher than for Pitino.

Pitino was a nobody basically. 2 yrs as a HC??? I'm not saying he shouldn't be making progress by now, he should, and HE DID, LAST YEAR!!! This year would have been additional progress, had everyone not gotten injured or suspended. And next year will be more closer to last year than to this year, easily. As long as 3-4 guys don't get injured or suspended that is.


Expecting results for this years squad, right now, down so many players completely out of the games, others hobbled and not even practicing? Is just not fair.


If in game 6 of the Vikings season, the QB, RB and #1 WR all went out, for the rest of the season, would you expect them to have still gotten to the NFC title game???


And that is just 3 out 20+ starters, not 3 out of just 6.
 

Goldy Gopher said:
Everything I said is true and no matter how you compare it the better recruiter is easily Pitino.
Click to expand...

It's not. And as I said, he's the better recruiter on paper. Recruiting rankings are only important insofar as they translate to wins. Pitino has a worse record than both of his predecessors while inheriting a far better situation than either of them.
 

Gogogopher said:
This is a bit much, I don't think anyone expects greatness, we just want a competitive basketball team. Injuries don't mean the team shouldn't play defense. And the immediately part of your quote, really?? C'mon, man it's year 5, that's not really immediate is it? There are good reasons to not fire Pitino, but so many folks post this type of argument (Everyone expects us to win but we have a depleted roster) and a lot of folks know we aren't going to win, but we still want to be entertained when we go to Williams arena by a competitive game.
Click to expand...

The 5 games played in 11 days, before the Iowa game,

First of all, they WON one of those games, so obviously that one was probably entertaining.

3 of the other 4, they led at halftime. But with the depleted roster, they struggled in the 2nd half, got tired I'm sure.

And that was 5 games in just 11 days, THREE of them on the road out on the east coast.


You telling me that they shouldn't have gotten tired???


Then the Iowa game? They were just 4 points down with just a couple of minutes to go. So that one wasn't at least competitive and entertaining???


Guys ARE trying, to claim that they are not is just something, I don't know? ignorance, a lie maybe even? and you should be ashamed of yourselves.
 

dpodoll68 said:
Everything you've said is absurd. Pitino's a better recruiter on paper - compare the W/L records through 5 seasons and let me know who's the better recruiter.
Click to expand...


No one is saying Pitino came in and right off the bat was blowing Tubby away at recruiting, and it would be ABSURD of anyone to expect him to, as Tubby came in with a Natl Title ring on his finger and a HOF induction probably penciled in somewhere, and Pitino came in with NADA, 2 years as a HC, that's it.

But Pitino's recruiting has trended UPWARDS!!!

And Tubby's recruiting trended DOWNWARDS!!!


So comparing the w/l records through 5 seasons wouldn't be right way to make the comparison.



Sorry, but trending upwards is ALWAYS better than trending downwards.
 

KillmeNow said:
No one is saying Pitino came in and right off the bat was blowing Tubby away at recruiting, and it would be ABSURD of anyone to expect him to, as Tubby came in with a Natl Title ring on his finger and a HOF induction probably penciled in somewhere, and Pitino came in with NADA, 2 years as a HC, that's it.

But Pitino's recruiting has trended UPWARDS!!!

And Tubby's recruiting trended DOWNWARDS!!!


So comparing the w/l records through 5 seasons wouldn't be right way to make the comparison.



Sorry, but trending upwards is ALWAYS better than trending downwards.
Click to expand...

You keep advocating for the kid gloves argument. It's a poor one. Big Ten coaches aren't graded on a curve.
 

KillmeNow said:
The 5 games played in 11 days, before the Iowa game,

First of all, they WON one of those games, so obviously that one was probably entertaining.

3 of the other 4, they led at halftime. But with the depleted roster, they struggled in the 2nd half, got tired I'm sure.

And that was 5 games in just 11 days, THREE of them on the road out on the east coast.


You telling me that they shouldn't have gotten tired???


Then the Iowa game? They were just 4 points down with just a couple of minutes to go. So that one wasn't at least competitive and entertaining???


Guys ARE trying, to claim that they are not is just something, I don't know? ignorance, a lie maybe even? and you should be ashamed of yourselves.
Click to expand...

I have no shame, lol, none whatsoever. Playing well in one half of game doesn't mean much, sorry. Teams have to compete for the second half as well. There were some games where the kids really competed, good coaches don't have so many games where there teams are out played. Big time college basketball is rough business. Pitino makes a lot of money to coach this team and he is not performing. If you don't like people criticising the coach I don't know what to tell ya, maybe stay off threads about replacing the coach?
 

KillmeNow said:
The 5 games played in 11 days, before the Iowa game,

First of all, they WON one of those games, so obviously that one was probably entertaining.

3 of the other 4, they led at halftime. But with the depleted roster, they struggled in the 2nd half, got tired I'm sure.

And that was 5 games in just 11 days, THREE of them on the road out on the east coast.


You telling me that they shouldn't have gotten tired???


Then the Iowa game? They were just 4 points down with just a couple of minutes to go. So that one wasn't at least competitive and entertaining???


Guys ARE trying, to claim that they are not is just something, I don't know? ignorance, a lie maybe even? and you should be ashamed of yourselves.
Click to expand...

Even though you are 100% correct, you are never going to convince people who have their minds made up that we should win no matter what the circumstances, and if we can't, we should fire a last year's Big Ten Coach of the Year for it.
 

You must log in or register to reply here.



Top Bottom