Did PJ semi-sandbag this season because of early signing day??

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Bring back the Axe

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I'm not saying he out-and-out tanked it, but with the new early signing day, not having to do bowl prep or hold
practices freed him up to really hit recruiting hard for next season, and gave him a leg up on similar mediocre but bowl-bound teams.

With the new recruiting schedule, it seems to me that if you're not an 8+ win team, you're better off being a 5 win team and devoting yourself completely to closing on recruits in December.
 


Bring back the Axe said:
I'm not saying he out-and-out tanked it, but with the new early signing day, not having to do bowl prep or hold
practices freed him up to really hit recruiting hard for next season, and gave him a leg up on similar mediocre but bowl-bound teams.

With the new recruiting schedule, it seems to me that if you're not an 8+ win team, you're better off being a 5 win team and devoting yourself completely to closing on recruits in December.
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In the words of Common Man, you are either on something or on to something. I don't know if I agree with you, but I don't think I disagree with you either. I still think making a bowl game is good for a program, but definitely get what you are saying. I don't know what the players had for commitments since the Wisconsin game but the coaches were able to recruit 100% of the time without dealing with practice prep and other duties that go along with that.
 

If by "semi-sandbag" you mean tried to lose - no. If by "semi-sandbag" you mean he was a-ok with losing games, then yes.


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Bowl games are good for the program, no matter what. I wouldn't think it would heed the recruiting at all........
.....then again, I suppose the coaches have more time to travel and less time in the film room deciding game plans and match ups.........
Ohhhhhh myyyyyyyyyy gaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwrrrrsh!

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If he intentionally lost games he should be fired immediately.
 


zman said:
Trust the process.
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Let me put it another way, if he ever set a goal prior to a game as “lose the game” he should be fired. He may have made decisions based on the long-term interest of the program over the short-term, and that’s ok in my book - as long as they’re still trying to win games via preparation and game planning. But to making losing an intentional goal at any point is batty.
 

this may be splitting hairs, (or splitting hares) - but I would say there is a (subtle) difference between "trying to lose" and "not doing everything possible to win."

I can't believe that any D1 coach would deliberately try to lose a game for whatever reason. But, I can believe that a coach (not just Fleck - other coaches too) could and would make a calculated decision that going all-out to win a game may not be in the best long-term interest of the program. For example, if a key player is injured, you could pressure him to play in a game, and that might help the team win, but it might also risk the player's future. Another example - pulling multiple red-shirts for one or two games late in a season. That might help win a game, but would cost players a year of eligibility. Is it worth the trade-off?

So, I think it certainly is possible that the coaching staff made decisions that did not increase their chances of winning a particular game, because it didn't jibe with some long-range goal for the program.

That is not the same as tanking or playing to lose.

But - if they literally tanked a game because they did not want to be bowl-eligible, then that is a different kettle of fish.
 



No way.
They just made bad calls in games which cost them 2 to 3 wins this year. PJ and his coaches know this. They're not idiots. They know they F'd up
 

No chance. He might have stuck with his plan for instilling a system and testing players, but he seems to be way too competitive to be fine with just losing. After all, did you see him bean his kid playing dodgeball in their house on Being PJ Fleck?

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No. I think the team simply ran out of gas. He wasn't about to burn red shirts the last part of the season to eke out a victory.
 

I agree with what most have said.
 



20 of the 26 recruits verbally committed before the season started. So no.
 

People his size don't make it on an NFL roster without being borderline crazy competitive at the least. Don't think it's possible to turn that off when you switch to being a coach. But he also is committed to what he thinks will work here and stuck to that even if it meant a loss or two. Fine with holding onto to the RS's, the suspensions, sticking to his systems, and all that. Not sure about the sprint between quarters, the goose decoys, the mantras, etc. but he's the guy in charge and still believing there is a method to his madness.
 



I would think he'd have preferred to focus 100% on recruiting AND half-ass his focus on a bowl game to no bowl game at all. And for CPJF, half-ass focus on a bowl game probably means working on it during normal sleeping hours.
 

Well, there was no scenario that Minnesota could have come up with that would have gotten them a win in either of those last two games of the season.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
20 of the 26 recruits verbally committed before the season started. So no.
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This, plus the Recruitapalooza would have looked a lot nicer with an Axe in the middle of it. Or even not losing the last 2 games 70-0.
 

HoustonTXGopher said:
Well, there was no scenario that Minnesota could have come up with that would have gotten them a win in either of those last two games of the season.
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There is a difference between losing and not even competing
 


hungan1 said:
No. I think the team simply ran out of gas. He wasn't about to burn red shirts the last part of the season to eke out a victory.
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I agree with this.

In hindsight, sticking with Croft was a mistake. But I do trust that he was assuming Croft was going to be here and likely be the starter next year (didn’t know for sure about a JUCO QB at that time during he season).

Other than that ... team simply was too hurt and didn’t have enough players. Not saying they mailed it in the last two games, but the results were essentially the same.
 

So what's our excuse next year?
On the far, off chance, that Fleck mailed it in, how does that fit with the culture change he says he is creating?
I can't see Fleck mailing in anything. However, there is no benefit to playing someone who is not ready to play in a B1G game. The kids Fleck had in the wings were not going to change the outcome of the games we lost.
Don't go looking for a miracle improvement for next year as I think we are a couple years away.
 

MennoSota said:
So what's our excuse next year?
On the far, off chance, that Fleck mailed it in, how does that fit with the culture change he says he is creating?
I can't see Fleck mailing in anything. However, there is no benefit to playing someone who is not ready to play in a B1G game. The kids Fleck had in the wings were not going to change the outcome of the games we lost.
Don't go looking for a miracle improvement for next year as I think we are a couple years away.
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I agree with this. Winning and success are what you reap from all the elements of Fleck's culture. The future is bright, I hate to continue to have to be patient, but patient I will be, for a while longer anyway. Wink Wink
 

Maybe if college football had a high-school/JUCO player draft, id buy the tank for better recruits angle.

IMO, if he wasn't out to win games this year (and let's be honest, it seemed that way at times), there are motivations I can see to do that. The narrative was built around the firing of Claeys that he couldn't recruit, the team desperately needed a cultured change, etc. Not beating either one of those dead horses, but how would it look if Fleck stepped into this thing this year and had a great year without his recruits and then struggled going forward with a young team? It blows the "program builder" narrative, and Coyle starts catching hatemail for going rouge and destroying the program.

Again, to keep JB and GWG from getting homicidal: Love Fleck and what he's doing here, honestly. Not disparaging him.
 

The guy who started most of the games at QB is taking his talents to Tennessee State.

There’s some question as to why they didn’t make a bowl game?
 

Early in the season, PJ quit on the team (Year Zero nonsense), late in the season, the team quit on PJ. There was no method to this madness and we are in worse shape entering next season than we were entering this one. Losing is a cultural issue and this season will stick with the players for the next few years. I don't think there was a single game this season where the team really played above their ability - you could argue Nebraska but I think that was more Nebraska's doing than ours.
 

I think there was a poisoned relationship between PJF and DC. If the QB and the coach cannot see eye to eye, it is best to move on.

Whatever really happened about the broken door is symptomatic of the maturation of DC. I sure hope DC have learned from his experience and will emerge as a leader for his new team.
 

PJ just answered this question with PA on the FAN. Said they are always recruiting and would schedule bowl practices around recruiting using 4 guys out recruiting. Said it helped having 9 guys out recruiting, but he doesn’t want that to be the trend with this team.


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