All Things Gopher Transfers

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gotomn said:
Rumors from some people who know players on the team is that we have another 6 transfers coming besides Croft, Still, and Holland. Could be close to 10 transfers or guys quitting team, which would explain Fleck getting 28 recruits with only 18 scholarships. Also heard that at least 2 of the transfers are current defense starters.
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I posted last spring that they better win because his schtick was wearing thin on many of the players. I wouldn't be surprised if there are a handful of transfers.

PJF has to get his guys in. Dalton from Roadhouse said, "It'll get worse before it gets better." I feel this is true in many organizations when someone changes the way things are done.
 

hungan1 said:
I don't know the exact ins and outs, but you can bet that PJ Fleck knows how to play the rules legally. Don't PWOs get rewarded after they played one season?

We know that PJ FLeck has 7 PWO commitments so far.
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Walk-ons can’t get a scholarship in the first two years without it counting toward the yearly allowance.
 

gotomn said:
Rumors from some people who know players on the team is that we have another 6 transfers coming besides Croft, Still, and Holland. Could be close to 10 transfers or guys quitting team, which would explain Fleck getting 28 recruits with only 18 scholarships. Also heard that at least 2 of the transfers are current defense starters.

One other items is that I hear is there are some significant issues with Fleck and some of the MSHSL coaches while I was at the state high school playoffs. The Kill/Claeys staff had really good in state relationships. They said that Fleck basically badmouths the level of players in the state of Minnesota and does nothing to build relationships with the in-state coaches and that he is more focused on Illinois. Take it for what it is worth, but one coach told me look for all of the top 2019 and 2020 players to end up at Iowa and Wisconsin because those staffs have the relationships in state like Kill/Claeys did, and Flecks staff doesn't give the in-state guys any time.
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Just like there was going to be a mass exodus when Fleck was hired last year? I expect a few more transfers but I'll believe 10 when I see it.

And Fleck doesn't give the in-state guys any time? He got every in-state recruit he wanted this year. He goes out of his way to say how much they need Minnesota kids to stay home, and legacy recruits to stay at Minnesota. On top of that they only have 3 commits from IL and 5 from MN, including 3 MN kids who were lightly recruited by everyone else.

I'll take your post for what it's worth - nothing.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Just like there was going to be a mass exodus when Fleck was hired last year? I expect a few more transfers but I'll believe 10 when I see it.

And Fleck doesn't give the in-state guys any time? He got every in-state recruit he wanted this year. He goes out of his way to say how much they need Minnesota kids to stay home, and legacy recruits to stay at Minnesota. On top of that they only have 3 commits from IL and 5 from MN, including 3 MN kids who were lightly recruited by everyone else.

I'll take your post for what it's worth - nothing.
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You dismiss everyone who doesn’t fit your narrative. There is something to take away from people who think differently than you. Denigrating the work of those before you, no matter your profession, does no good. I have heard the same thing from a number of coaches, who across the state thought highly of previous regime. Doesn’t have to sink PJ, but he does have to build relationships, and stop talking negatively about current players and past regime - even if that has not been his intent, it is what people hear.


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GopherWeatherGuy said:
Just like there was going to be a mass exodus when Fleck was hired last year? I expect a few more transfers but I'll believe 10 when I see it.

And Fleck doesn't give the in-state guys any time? He got every in-state recruit he wanted this year. He goes out of his way to say how much they need Minnesota kids to stay home, and legacy recruits to stay at Minnesota. On top of that they only have 3 commits from IL and 5 from MN, including 3 MN kids who were lightly recruited by everyone else.

I'll take your post for what it's worth - nothing.
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I can see about 8-10. Some may have stayed and after 1 year decide it's not for them. When a coach is going out of his way to say "Those that stay will be champions", there are going to be transfers.

Winfield would be a concern.
 

Ozzy&Ray said:
You dismiss everyone who doesn’t fit your narrative. There is something to take away from people who think differently than you. Denigrating the work of those before you, no matter your profession, does no good. I have heard the same thing from a number of coaches, who across the state thought highly of previous regime. Doesn’t have to sink PJ, but he does have to build relationships, and stop talking negatively about current players and past regime - even if that has not been his intent, it is what people hear.


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As Fleck states, he is not for everyone and that probably includes the HS coaches. Out best coach in the last 50 years (Mason) did not have a great relationship with the coaches either. Fleck will offer and take the kids that want to be Gophers and his staff want to be Gophers.
 

I hope your belief in Fleck is warranted, and he is keeping the players he wants and puts a fence up around Minnesota.

If not, we might be looking at the 2nd coming of Jim Wacker, when the highlights of the pregame football shows was discussing how good Brad Maynard was for Ball State. At that point getting Brewster back might be a step up for the program...
 

gotomn said:
I hope your belief in Fleck is warranted, and he is keeping the players he wants and puts a fence up around Minnesota.

If not, we might be looking at the 2nd coming of Jim Wacker, when the highlights of the pregame football shows was discussing how good Brad Maynard was for Ball State. At that point getting Brewster back might be a step up for the program...
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Ouch! Geezobeezo!
 



We have a badly demoralized team with very high highs and very low lows. Blowing out Nebraska and then got routed themselves in the last two games of the season.

The coaches and players need time to cool off. They finished 5-7 instead of 1-10. Sure, they missed going to a bowl game. But, there are lessons learned that will make them a better team next year. Thank goodness for resisting temptations to burn more red shirts. The team has to take the long view that they are building for the future.

Emotions must be raw. A malcontent in the leadership position is like a cancer that spreads quickly. I heard that Bud Grant was quick to trade whiners now matter how good they were.

Did Gaelin Elmore ever crack the starting lineup at ECU (3-9, 2-6)? We could sure have used him. His decision to leave was not a win-win situation.

I hope players do not make rash decisions to the detriment of the team and to themselves. There are players that will transfer out no matter what. But, if we start losing key contributors it is not good.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Just like there was going to be a mass exodus when Fleck was hired last year? I expect a few more transfers but I'll believe 10 when I see it.

And Fleck doesn't give the in-state guys any time? He got every in-state recruit he wanted this year. He goes out of his way to say how much they need Minnesota kids to stay home, and legacy recruits to stay at Minnesota. On top of that they only have 3 commits from IL and 5 from MN, including 3 MN kids who were lightly recruited by everyone else.

I'll take your post for what it's worth - nothing.
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Very surprising to see you dismiss anything that isn't pro-PJ and run to his defense.


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Spoofin said:
Very surprising to see you dismiss anything that isn't pro-PJ and run to his defense.


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Pretty easy when my opinion is backed up by facts and not baseless speculation
 

Spoofin said:
Well, if we had, we likely wouldn't have made a bowl game and been creamed something like 70-0 in out last two games, but would have someone with some experience come 2018. I'd take that over the current situation.
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As painful as it has been, especially the last two games, I would not be happy if Fleck had burned redshirts for promising freshman like Morgan, Autman-Bell, etc.

To me this is evidence of the "year zero" approach that Fleck talked about. This is the year to take major lumps (Western Michigan was win-less in Fleck's first year), and figure out who will buy in to the new program and culture. The ones who choose to transfer may have some talent, but if they weren't on board with the culture they could be net negatives to the program as a whole.

I am prepared for next year to be a bit rocky, but the optimist in me still feels pretty good about the incoming recruiting class for 2018. I'm assuming that Fleck will redshirt some of the most promising players from that class, and we'll see a big jump in consistency and talent on the field in 2019.
 



MaxyJR1 said:
I can see about 8-10. Some may have stayed and after 1 year decide it's not for them. When a coach is going out of his way to say "Those that stay will be champions", there are going to be transfers.

Winfield would be a concern.
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I have a hard time believing Winfield would leave after staying after last years debacle. He already lost a year this year, I’d be surprised if he’s willing to lose another.
 

dbaldrich1 said:
As painful as it has been, especially the last two games, I would not be happy if Fleck had burned redshirts for promising freshman like Morgan, Autman-Bell, etc.

To me this is evidence of the "year zero" approach that Fleck talked about. This is the year to take major lumps (Western Michigan was win-less in Fleck's first year), and figure out who will buy in to the new program and culture. The ones who choose to transfer may have some talent, but if they weren't on board with the culture they could be net negatives to the program as a whole.

I am prepared for next year to be a bit rocky, but the optimist in me still feels pretty good about the incoming recruiting class for 2018. I'm assuming that Fleck will redshirt some of the most promising players from that class, and we'll see a big jump in consistency and talent on the field in 2019.
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I don't think we'll have the ability to redshirt many guys next year. We'll need the bodies.
 

hungan1 said:
We have a badly demoralized team with very high highs and very low lows. Blowing out Nebraska and then got routed themselves in the last two games of the season.

The coaches and players need time to cool off.

Emotions must be raw. A malcontent in the leadership position is like a cancer that spreads quickly. I heard that Bud Grant was quick to trade whiners now matter how good they were.

Did Gaelin Elmore ever crack the starting lineup at ECU (3-9, 2-6)? We could sure have used him. His decision to leave was not a win-win situation.
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+100. I remember at a couple points last season people around here were pondering if the Gophers could even field a 2017 team with all the certain transfers and expulsions. Hardly anyone of significance left. I think once the players cool off a bit (as do the fans) we can all see it for what it was...an injury plagued rebuilding year with a new coach and QB where the team took a step back. Which is what most outside observers, computer models, and even the ever-optimistic, hype-happy head coach himself predicted.

BTW, ECU was dead last in defense nationally this year. Elmore appeared to have been a sometimes player who recorded about 15 tackles and no sacks.
 


MaxyJR1 said:
Walk-ons can’t get a scholarship in the first two years without it counting toward the yearly allowance.
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I think PJF needs to reward a one-year scholarship to a PWO or two deserving of praise for their hard work in this challenging transition season. That is, if they become available due to transfers.
 

TBrew said:
Jesus H. Christ. This is the Big 10, not Pop Warner. If you want lollipops and rainbow kisses when you play like manure, then go some where else. Fleck is demanding accountability and full commitment. And frankly it's about time. Five decades of lousy, half-assed, excuse-filled football is enough.
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Yes!
 

fmlizard said:
+100. I remember at a couple points last season people around here were pondering if the Gophers could even field a 2017 team with all the certain transfers and expulsions. Hardly anyone of significance left. I think once the players cool off a bit (as do the fans) we can all see it for what it was...an injury plagued rebuilding year with a new coach and QB where the team took a step back. Which is what most outside observers, computer models, and even the ever-optimistic, hype-happy head coach himself predicted.

BTW, ECU was dead last in defense nationally this year. Elmore appeared to have been a sometimes player who recorded about 15 tackles and no sacks.
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From a season overview standpoint: I think the Gophers have done as well as they could given that they lost quite a few players thru injuries, graduation, transfers, medical issues, and expulsions. It must be hard for player that have been around three or four years going through several coaching transitions.

We can't build successful programs in a constancy of change like that.

My hope is that PJ Fleck will rebuild the program and hopefully stay for the long haul. The program needs stability even if he decides to leave.

If he does and he leaves a winning program (choice is that he decides to stay for the long haul), I'd like to see the AD and Kaler and the BOR sign a coach to a longer term contract with a high buyout in exchange for elevating the salaries of the head coach and the assistance coaches. We want to make it attractive for the coaches and their families to think of long term stability here and as a place to establish deep roots and be part of a winning program and tradition.

Furthermore, we want recruits to have reasonable assurances that they have the same coaches for the entire duration of their playing days.

The first vision was what Glen Mason, etal (building of TCF Bank stadium) and Jerry Kill, etal (Athletic Village) accomplished - The infrastructure.

The second vision - Taking care of people. Put a vision in place to take care of your coaches and personnel, and back it up with funding. That is the only way to break the cycle of mediocrity. It takes more than four years to build a successful program as the history of our neighbors have shown. It takes a firing or the head coach leaving to see a program come crashing down and it is Ground Hog Day all over...

It is rather tiresome for me to see decades of coaching carousels and broken promises. I think fans will appreciate a winning program that regularly is in the conversation of vying for the B1G West title and winning the B1G title out right every so often. We don't want to forever have a ceiling of 5th place in the B1G West.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Just like there was going to be a mass exodus when Fleck was hired last year? I expect a few more transfers but I'll believe 10 when I see it.

And Fleck doesn't give the in-state guys any time? He got every in-state recruit he wanted this year. He goes out of his way to say how much they need Minnesota kids to stay home, and legacy recruits to stay at Minnesota. On top of that they only have 3 commits from IL and 5 from MN, including 3 MN kids who were lightly recruited by everyone else.

I'll take your post for what it's worth - nothing.
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There wasn't as many last year due to most guys not having any options to go anywhere else, things happened so quickly they didn't have a chance to explore possible options or just thinking Fleck may work out or there would have easily been double digit transfers etc.... There are quite a few guys still on the team that are weighing their options more in depth this year and could easily see 10+ less on the roster pretty soon.
 

Deckergopher said:
Idk, there’s loopholes, sir . 2016 class Texas Longhorns sign 28 total with 4 early enrollees..
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Exactly- 28 total and at least 3 have to be early enrollees to attribute to the prior year assuming only 22 were in the the prior years class.


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GopherWeatherGuy said:
I have a hard time believing Winfield would leave after staying after last years debacle. He already lost a year this year, I’d be surprised if he’s willing to lose another.
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Purportedly he won't lose this year as he'll likely qualify for a medical hardship waiver.


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gotomn said:
Rumors from some people who know players on the team is that we have another 6 transfers coming besides Croft, Still, and Holland. Could be close to 10 transfers or guys quitting team, which would explain Fleck getting 28 recruits with only 18 scholarships. Also heard that at least 2 of the transfers are current defense starters.

One other items is that I hear is there are some significant issues with Fleck and some of the MSHSL coaches while I was at the state high school playoffs. The Kill/Claeys staff had really good in state relationships. They said that Fleck basically badmouths the level of players in the state of Minnesota and does nothing to build relationships with the in-state coaches and that he is more focused on Illinois. Take it for what it is worth, but one coach told me look for all of the top 2019 and 2020 players to end up at Iowa and Wisconsin because those staffs have the relationships in state like Kill/Claeys did, and Flecks staff doesn't give the in-state guys any time.
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Two defensive starters would be concerning, but I can't imagine who they would be. The linebacker trio (Martin, Barber and counting Coughlin) are all from Minnesota and have been playing regularly. I'm not sure who we consider starters in the d-backfield -- Winfield, Thomas, Shenault, Craighton? All four were hurt extensively, and all will have used a redshirt year, assuming Winfield gets his for this season. On the line, Moore, Umlor and DeLattiboudere are the underclassmen who played, and only Umlor hasn't redshirted.

It's always hard to imagine players leaving if they're playing and part of the plan, but you never know what goes on in the program.
 

Desertbobcat said:
This is another first, your starting QB quits the day after last game. I hope Flect was blindsided by this or we are in bigger trouble than we thought with this team.
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Or Fleck was straight with him and said he was probably not starter next year.
 

The thing I like about Jerry Kill is how he approaches his players. He treats them differently individually and with heart. Some, he knows to handle with kid gloves. For some, he knows he can push full throttle. Each kid come from diverse family backgrounds, maturity level, and emotional state.

He and Rebecca truly act like second parents. Didn't they have some players over for a meal at their house when they are lonely or homesick?

I don't know if PJ Fleck is like that. He'll learn real quickly that you can lost kids rather quickly if their psychological needs are not being met.
 

Oregon Gopher said:
Exactly- 28 total and at least 3 have to be early enrollees to attribute to the prior year assuming only 22 were in the the prior years class.


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There is the grayshirt option to consider also
 

hungan1 said:
The thing I like about Jerry Kill is how he approaches his players. He treats them differently individually and with heart. Some, he knows to handle with kid gloves. For some, he knows he can push full throttle. Each kid come from diverse family backgrounds, maturity level, and emotional state.

He and Rebecca truly act like second parents. Didn't they have some players over for a meal at their house when they are lonely or homesick?

I don't know if PJ Fleck is like that. He'll learn real quickly that you can lost kids rather quickly if their psychological needs are not being met.
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Especially when they want to smoke a lot of weed and the new coach won't let them. I can see how that would be hard for a player...
 

Oregon is a nice transfer option. They go green on MaryJane.
 

MNVCGUY said:
Nebraska was bad and we may have still beaten them with Rhoda at the helm but Croft's 183 rushing yards were a huge key in the victory on offense. You replace him with Rhoda and all that yardage has to come from someone else because Rhoda might have rushed for 3 but he wouldn't have gotten the other 180.
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Sorry, but this is a ridiculous argument. This is right up there with, "Croft's running ability makes the running game more effective" argument.

Against Iowa - Gophers rush for 144 yards

Against Michigan - Gophers rush for 91 yards

Against Northwestern - Gophers rush for 139 yards

Against Wisconsin - Gophers rush for 93 yards

Sure, hindsight is 20/20 but at this point, it's virtually impossible to look back with the information available and say that Croft gave the Gophers the best chance to win in each of the games he started this year. He was the worst QB the Gophers have trotted out in decades.
 

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