My problem with coaching this season and the Badgers will win by 20+ Saturday

You could have said the exact same things about Kills first couple of years. There were plenty that said he couldn’t coach, predictable play calling, bad defense etc. Turned out ok once he got his players on campus. Flecks coaching will look much better in the coming seasons.

So you'll agree then that this season has been disappointing and PJ hasn't done a great job as HC?
 

So you'll agree then that this season has been disappointing and PJ hasn't done a great job as HC?

I’m disappointed in losing the Purdue game, and not likely making a bowl game. Otherwise this season has played out about how I thought it would.
 

You could have said the exact same things about Kills first couple of years. There were plenty that said he couldn’t coach, predictable play calling, bad defense etc. Turned out ok once he got his players on campus. Flecks coaching will look much better in the coming seasons.

Players on current roster that are better than anyone Kill had to work with. However, since that's a very subjective metric here are the seniors from those respective teams.

2011
Bunders, Chris
Henderson, Kyle
Jacobs, Anthony
Johnson, Johnny
Kirksey, Brandon
Klitzke, Bryan
Lair, Eric
Lewis, Christyn
McGarry, Collin
McKnight, Da'Jon
Orton, Ryan
Royston, Kim
Salamon, Shady
Schwerman, David
Stoudermire, Troy
Sveum, Patrick
Tinsley, Gary
Wynn, Ryan


2017
McCrary, Kobe
Calhoun, Vincent
Richardson, Steven
Celestin, Jonathan
Lingen, Brandon
Stelter, Andrew
Juenemann, Justin
McGhee, Duke
Carter, Eric
Santoso, Ryan
Jackson, Merrick
Rhoda, Conor
Poock, Cody
Ayinde, Adekunle
Wozniak, Nate
Wright, Garrison

With the exception of McKnight, Tinsley, and Stoudermire, I don't know that any of Kill's seniors would make the 2-deep of our current team.
Frankly, I don't even think that Tinsley would play in our current LB rotation.
 

Players on current roster that are better than anyone Kill had to work with. However, since that's a very subjective metric here are the seniors from those respective teams.

2011
Bunders, Chris
Henderson, Kyle
Jacobs, Anthony
Johnson, Johnny
Kirksey, Brandon
Klitzke, Bryan
Lair, Eric
Lewis, Christyn
McGarry, Collin
McKnight, Da'Jon
Orton, Ryan
Royston, Kim
Salamon, Shady
Schwerman, David
Stoudermire, Troy
Sveum, Patrick
Tinsley, Gary
Wynn, Ryan


2017
McCrary, Kobe
Calhoun, Vincent
Richardson, Steven
Celestin, Jonathan
Lingen, Brandon
Stelter, Andrew
Juenemann, Justin
McGhee, Duke
Carter, Eric
Santoso, Ryan
Jackson, Merrick
Rhoda, Conor
Poock, Cody
Ayinde, Adekunle
Wozniak, Nate
Wright, Garrison

With the exception of Tinsley and Stoudermire, I don't know that any of Kill's seniors would make the 2-deep of our current team.

Jacobs, Kirksey, Lair, McKnight, Royston, Stoudermire, Tinsley, Bunders, Orton and Wynn would all 100% be on the 2-deep on this years team. McKnight would be far and away the best receiver on the roster and it would not even be close.
 

Jacobs, Kirksey, Lair, McKnight, Royston, Stoudermire, Tinsley, Bunders, Orton and Wynn would all 100% be on the 2-deep on this years team. McKnight would be far and away the best receiver on the roster and it would not even be close.

Are you high? I don't think that a single player on the defensive side of the ball in 2011 would make this team.
Royston and Jacobs certainly wouldn't.

As far as Tinsley, I don't think he starts over Barber, Cashman, Celestin, Coughlin, Huff, Martin, or Poock.
 


Jacobs, Kirksey, Lair, McKnight, Royston, Stoudermire, Tinsley, Bunders, Orton and Wynn would all 100% be on the 2-deep on this years team. McKnight would be far and away the best receiver on the roster and it would not even be close.

Yeah....now with all the injuries.
 

Are you high? I don't think that a single player on the defensive side of the ball in 2011 would make this team.
Royston and Jacobs certainly wouldn't.

As far as Tinsley, I don't think he starts over Barber, Cashman, Celestin, Coughlin, Huff, Martin, or Poock.

Yep definitely no room for Royston on this current roster.....Straight from his gophersports bio:

Kim Royston
2011 • SENIOR SEASON:
Started at safety in all 12 games • earned Honorable Mention All-Big Ten honors from both the media and coaches • was named winner of Carl Eller Award as team's outstanding defensive player • also earned Minnesota's defensive back of the year honor • led team and ranked No. 2 in the Big Ten and No. 16 in the nation with 123 tackles (71 solo, 52 assisted) • had 3.5 tackles for a loss with one sack • grabbed one interception • had two pass break-ups • earned second varsity letter.

If you really think there is no room for Royston on this current team then you are living in a fantasy world.

Anthony Jacobs:2011 • SENIOR SEASON:
Started all 12 games at defensive tackle • recorded 26 tackles (13 solo, 13 assisted) with six tackles-for-loss • notched one sack • forced two fumbles • earned fourth varsity letter.

Could definitely see him starting alongside Richardson and the criteria was 2-deep, he absolutely would have made it.

Gary Tinsley:
2011 • SENIOR SEASON:
Started all 12 games at middle linebacker • finished second on team in tackles with 87 (43 solo, 44 assisted) • recorded 9.0 tackles-for-loss and 4.0 sacks • broke up three passes • earned fourth varsity letter.

I do agree that with our current LB's he would have had a much tougher time but he still would have made the 2-deep in my opinion. But hey, maybe I am high.
 

Are you high? I don't think that a single player on the defensive side of the ball in 2011 would make this team.
Royston and Jacobs certainly wouldn't.

As far as Tinsley, I don't think he starts over Barber, Cashman, Celestin, Coughlin, Huff, Martin, or Poock.

None of them would make the team? I think you're the one that is high.
 

Our safety nearly led the big ten in tackles. What do you think that says about the rest of the defense?
That entire defense was horrible.
 




Our safety nearly led the big ten in tackles. What do you think that says about the rest of the defense?

It says that they were coached horribly. Really glad Claeys grew into a competent Big Ten coordinator.
 

Jacobs, Kirksey, Lair, McKnight, Royston, Stoudermire, Tinsley, Bunders, Orton and Wynn would all 100% be on the 2-deep on this years team. McKnight would be far and away the best receiver on the roster and it would not even be close.

Completely agree. Jacobs and Kirksey could both play well, but they weren't always consistent. I believe Stoudemire was a threat to return punts and kicks.
I don't think there is much of a talent difference between this year's seniors and 2011.
 

Our safety nearly led the big ten in tackles. What do you think that says about the rest of the defense?
That entire defense was horrible.

Nice deflection. Doesn't change the fact that a number of those guys were as good as or better then players on this current roster. Royston was a very good player not sure why you are so determined to prove otherwise. Oh yeah, because then your foolish statement about none of them making this years team wouldn't look so bad.

Oh and although he didn't lead the Big Ten in tackles last year the leading tackler on last years defense was Travis. 3 of the top 5 tacklers played in the secondary...
 



It says that they were coached horribly. Really glad Claeys grew into a competent Big Ten coordinator.

By this statement, then this years team has been coached horribly. Maybe PJ, Kirk and Rob can grow into competent BIG coordinators and a HC.
 

By this statement, then this years team has been coached horribly. Maybe PJ, Kirk and Rob can grow into competent BIG coordinators and a HC.

Exactly what I was going for.
 

Nice deflection. Doesn't change the fact that a number of those guys were as good as or better then players on this current roster. Royston was a very good player not sure why you are so determined to prove otherwise. Oh yeah, because then your foolish statement about none of them making this years team wouldn't look so bad.

Oh and although he didn't lead the Big Ten in tackles last year the leading tackler on last years defense was Travis. 3 of the top 5 tacklers played in the secondary...

Royston was not good enough to start over Huff or McGhee, let alone Winfield. The only foolish thing is defending one of the worst defenses in Gopher football history.
 

Royston was not good enough to start over Huff or McGhee, let alone Winfield. The only foolish thing is defending one of the worst defenses in Gopher football history.

You should really stop blaming the kids for being poorly coached.
 

Royston was not good enough to start over Huff or McGhee, let alone Winfield. The only foolish thing is defending one of the worst defenses in Gopher football history.

You didn't say anything about starting. You said they wouldn't even make the team.
 

Are you high? I don't think that a single player on the defensive side of the ball in 2011 would make this team.
Royston and Jacobs certainly wouldn't.

As far as Tinsley, I don't think he starts over Barber, Cashman, Celestin, Coughlin, Huff, Martin, or Poock.

How do people convince themselves of this stuff? It’s amazing really.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Royston was not good enough to start over Huff or McGhee, let alone Winfield. The only foolish thing is defending one of the worst defenses in Gopher football history.

Royston would absolutely have started over Huff or McGhee. And at no point have I tried to defend the defense as a whole from that year, the question was in regards to individual players and whether or not they were as good as players on the current roster. The fact of the matter is that a number of individual players from that team could have started or at least been in the 2-deep on this year's team.
 

You didn't say anything about starting. You said they wouldn't even make the team.

Every time he gets proven wrong he shifts the argument to something else equally as stupid to try and prove his point. Still trying to figure out what that point is.
 

Every time he gets proven wrong he shifts the argument to something else equally as stupid to try and prove his point. Still trying to figure out what that point is.

I didn't shift the argument, you proved my point for me. Our safety came close to leading the league in tackles in 2011. Hence, the rest of the defense must have been pretty freaking awful.
 

I didn't shift the argument, you proved my point for me. Our safety came close to leading the league in tackles in 2011. Hence, the rest of the defense must have been pretty freaking awful.

Or they were poorly coached.
 

I’m disappointed in losing the Purdue game, and not likely making a bowl game. Otherwise this season has played out about how I thought it would.

You expected to lose to Maryland? Beat Nebraska?

Before the season many were scared of OSU, Neb.

Like every season we really don't know exactly what to expect but dropping a terribly-called game vs a bad Maryland team and losing to a (admittedly improved) Purdue team wasn't expected and stings. Nebraska certainly is far worse than expected.

We should be bowling.
 

You expected to lose to Maryland? Beat Nebraska?

Before the season many were scared of OSU, Neb.

Like every season we really don't know exactly what to expect but dropping a terribly-called game vs a bad Maryland team and losing to a (admittedly improved) Purdue team wasn't expected and stings. Nebraska certainly is far worse than expected.

We should be bowling.

I don't think the Maryland game was poorly called, they punted three times the entire game. The defense failed to tackle the skill position players leading to a loss. The Purdue game should have been a win and I think that's on Rhoda for turning it over and whoever made the personnel call to go into the week with Durr as the 3rd corner.
 

Laughable, but expected response.

Yeah, it was a brilliant game plan. It was another example of the stubbornness of PJ.
 

Laughable, but expected response.

Yeah, it was a brilliant game plan. It was another example of the stubbornness of PJ.

How is a game where the team punted three times the entire game poorly called? They turned the ball over in the redzone and missed a field goal.
 

I don't think the Maryland game was poorly called, they punted three times the entire game. The defense failed to tackle the skill position players leading to a loss. The Purdue game should have been a win and I think that's on Rhoda for turning it over and whoever made the personnel call to go into the week with Durr as the 3rd corner.

Looking at the Maryland game stats...309 yards, matching FCS Towson. Only Michigan went for less but they dominated on defense and ball-controlled to 35-10 victory. Our RBs combined for 80 yards on 31 carries. Towson was able to rush for more.

Terrible, imagination-free game plan. We treated them like Kent State or SJSU and ran up the middle 53 times for 2 yards a pop. To their credit, they started showing some imagination as the season went on starting at Purdue but the players couldn't execute.
 

How is a game where the team punted three times the entire game poorly called? They turned the ball over in the redzone and missed a field goal.

I guess I'm assuming you watched the game, and aren't just looking at a play by play.
 

I didn't shift the argument, you proved my point for me. Our safety came close to leading the league in tackles in 2011. Hence, the rest of the defense must have been pretty freaking awful.

Wow....Congratulations, can't even come up with a good response to this strange of an argument. I hope you are just trying to be argumentative and don't actually believe what you are saying but I honestly can't tell. Not sure how we got from a discussion about individual players on both sides of the ball to in your mind some argument about the quality of the defense as a whole from 2011 but I guess you....win?
 




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