My problem with coaching this season and the Badgers will win by 20+ Saturday


You might want to give it a little longer then 11 games into the coach’s first year at the school.
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And you might want to wait a little more than 11 games before extending a guy that will win 4 games less than the one you just fired. No reason to do this now other than to signal to the rest of the world that they think they did the right thing in firing the old guy and giving a giant contract to the new guy that has proven nothing on the field in his first season. Don't even pretend that PJ's market value went up over the last 12 months and that a bigger name was out there looking to pay more money than we already are.
 

As my friends in Ark. warned me. Defensive CB playing 10 off and the safety 14 off, means that the offense has 11 within 3 yards of the LOS and the defense has 8 at most. And remember the offense knows where the play is going and when the ball will be snapped. 11 against 8, take that odds every time. Sad

The offense has been the problem the majority of the year not the defense. Trying to blame the defense now that’s sad.


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And you might want to wait a little more than 11 games before extending a guy that will win 4 games less than the one you just fired. No reason to do this now other than to signal to the rest of the world that they think they did the right thing in firing the old guy and giving a giant contract to the new guy that has proven nothing on the field in his first season. Don't even pretend that PJ's market value went up over the last 12 months and that a bigger name was out there looking to pay more money than we already are.

If the administration believe firing the previous guy and hiring then extending the new guy after one year is the right signal to send why should they wait?

Shows they believe they made the right move. If in a few years it doesn’t work you can tell everyone you knew it was the wrong move the whole time.




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Prior to our dismantling, many here were chalking up NW as a likely win. Just go back 3-4 weeks to get the true sentiment at the time and no amount of rear view mirror rationalization is going to change that. For the U to extend PJ now, they are simply rewarding mediocrity. To to be fair, I don't PJ will try less hard given the extension so it is a net zero from a motivational standpoint - but I think it sets the precedent that the U Administration will go out of its way to try to prove to themselves that they didn't make a mistake with their coaching change.

The people chalking the Northwestern game up to a likely win were doing it based on the name of the opponent and not based on what has actually been taking place on the field this year. They are the same people that refuse to really see the offensive personnel we are running out there each game.

Our current collection of receivers that have played may be the worst I have ever seen here. Johnson and Douglas were the only bright spots and Douglas got hurt and Johnson has dropped a ton of passes. Some of that can certainly be placed on the QB position as well but whether it is Croft or Rhoda they are getting little to no help from the receivers.

Cleays was never a long term option, he was a bridge to get to a new staff. Some of you might not want to accept that but it is just the reality of how things work in athletics.
 


If the administration believe firing the previous guy and hiring then extending the new guy after one year is the right signal to send why should they wait?

Shows they believe they made the right move. If in a few years it doesn’t work you can tell everyone you knew it was the wrong move the whole time.




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How are they going to pay this guy when nobody is going to the games because Gophers football sucks?
 

If the administration believe firing the previous guy and hiring then extending the new guy after one year is the right signal to send why should they wait?
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1.) Because their track record is terrible in coaching selections
2.) Because there is absolutely ZERO reason to do it now. Doing nothing is the smart move given his body of work thus far.
3.) Because it is showing that the admin is willing to reward a guy that, at a minimum, made no improvement vs. a guy they paid 90% less and in a realist case, took the team backward several steps.
4.) The removed a potential carrot they could have used in the future if PJ were to show even an ounce of that coaching brilliance you believe he has.

The admin has asymmetrical risk in doing these types of things. They never get punished for making poor coaching decisions - remember extending Mason and then firing him? However, if they make a gamble and it pays off, they leverage that to get a better gig.
 

How are they going to pay this guy when nobody is going to the games because Gophers football sucks?

No one was going to the games before he got here and somehow they still found a way to pay him. Your question is irrelevant.


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1.) Because their track record is terrible in coaching selections
2.) Because there is absolutely ZERO reason to do it now. Doing nothing is the smart move given his body of work thus far.
3.) Because it is showing that the admin is willing to reward a guy that, at a minimum, made no improvement vs. a guy they paid 90% less and in a realist case, took the team backward several steps.
4.) The removed a potential carrot they could have used in the future if PJ were to show even an ounce of that coaching brilliance you believe he has.

The admin has asymmetrical risk in doing these types of things. They never get punished for making poor coaching decisions - remember extending Mason and then firing him? However, if they make a gamble and it pays off, they leverage that to get a better gig.

Show me where this Administration has a track record of bad coaching hires.

Claeys was never a long term coaching solution.

What exactly does Mason have to do with this current Administration?


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Show me where this Administration has a track record of bad coaching hires.
What exactly does Mason have to do with this current Administration?
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With the known health problems of Kill, they admin needed to have a come to Jesus meeting with him prior to his unexpected exit. We got stuck with your 'never a long term solution' coach because the admin refused to see Kill for what he was and have a back-up plan - or worse (if you are correct) - they did and Tracy was that plan, until he wasn't because he made the admin look bad over the bowl fiasco. Personally, I think it is his actions over the bowl game fiasco that got him fired vs. any other reason.

As far as Mason goes - just because the U decides to flush the toilet every few years and actually turn over the AD position - it does not erase decades of inept guidance of our premier sports programs which includes bad coaching hire followed by bad coaching hire.
 

And you might want to wait a little more than 11 games before extending a guy that will win 4 games less than the one you just fired. No reason to do this now other than to signal to the rest of the world that they think they did the right thing in firing the old guy and giving a giant contract to the new guy that has proven nothing on the field in his first season. Don't even pretend that PJ's market value went up over the last 12 months and that a bigger name was out there looking to pay more money than we already are.

If this is turning into a talk about the extension, I like the move. I haven't seen the numbers for that 1 year extension, but I would think that doing so now vs after the team improves would be less expensive and it sends a positive message to recruiting.
Plus even with the on the field performance being poor this year, Fleck is holding the players accountable on and off the field which is a big reason why a coaching change needed to be made in my opinion.
 

With the known health problems of Kill, they admin needed to have a come to Jesus meeting with him prior to his unexpected exit. We got stuck with your 'never a long term solution' coach because the admin refused to see Kill for what he was and have a back-up plan - or worse (if you are correct) - they did and Tracy was that plan, until he wasn't because he made the admin look bad over the bowl fiasco. Personally, I think it is his actions over the bowl game fiasco that got him fired vs. any other reason.

As far as Mason goes - just because the U decides to flush the toilet every few years and actually turn over the AD position - it does not erase decades of inept guidance of our premier sports programs which includes bad coaching hire followed by bad coaching hire.

Wow....just wow. What Coyle has done is nearly a complete opposite of what the U has done in the past. Instead of hiring on the cheap they went out and spent good money on a very in demand coach. Instead of waiting around they then acted proactively to lock him up long term. The new administration is not following the patterns of the old ones and should not be blamed for or lumped in with what has happened in the past.

It could certainly fail (you already assume it will) but I love that they are trying something different.
 

"Plus even with the on the field performance being poor this year, Fleck is holding the players accountable on and off the field which is a big reason why a coaching change needed to be made in my opinion."

Unless it translates into wins, I don't really care at this point. Unfortunately, I think the odds are better that football will be banned at the college level over concussion concerns vs. the Gophers winning the West - never mind a Big Ten title or being relevant nationally.
 



Instead of waiting around they then acted proactively to lock him up long term. The new administration is not following the patterns of the old ones and should not be blamed for or lumped in with what has happened in the past.
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Tell me honestly, do you feel PJ's coaching stock is higher now than when he was hired? I don't know how anyone can credibly argue that. Hence, the U is bidding against themselves. Extending now is just plain out stupid.
 

With the known health problems of Kill, they admin needed to have a come to Jesus meeting with him prior to his unexpected exit. We got stuck with your 'never a long term solution' coach because the admin refused to see Kill for what he was and have a back-up plan - or worse (if you are correct) - they did and Tracy was that plan, until he wasn't because he made the admin look bad over the bowl fiasco. Personally, I think it is his actions over the bowl game fiasco that got him fired vs. any other reason.

As far as Mason goes - just because the U decides to flush the toilet every few years and actually turn over the AD position - it does not erase decades of inept guidance of our premier sports programs which includes bad coaching hire followed by bad coaching hire.

None of which has to do with the current AD.




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Tell me honestly, do you feel PJ's coaching stock is higher now than when he was hired? I don't know how anyone can credibly argue that. Hence, the U is bidding against themselves. Extending now is just plain out stupid.

His stock is likely the same. He coached a year and he was extended a year which will be through the next classes RS SR year. It’s a recruiting tool and further solidification that he’s not going anywhere anytime soon.
 

His stock is likely the same.

Are you being serious now? Tell me you thought the Gophers would win 5 games only when he was hired. This season was a big time under performance /disappointment and that does not keep your stock high.
 

Are you being serious now? Tell me you thought the Gophers would win 5 games only when he was hired. This season was a big time under performance /disappointment and that does not keep your stock high.

I thought they would win 6 this year by beating Purdue, which they should have. The step back this season was obvious to everyone outside of the of the biggest Claeys supporters on this site.
 

I thought they would win 6 this year by beating Purdue, which they should have. The step back this season was obvious to everyone outside of the of the biggest Claeys supporters on this site.

I mean I think we all knew that we would take a step back this year, but this has been miserable to watch. We should have won 5 straight to start the season and a lot of that can be blamed on poor play calling.
 

I thought they would win 6 this year by beating Purdue, which they should have. The step back this season was obvious to everyone outside of the of the biggest Claeys supporters on this site.

Win 6 and you have a shot at 7 with the bowl. Also, I don't see Claeys getting blow out vs. NW. The 5 wins sucks, the performance all around was an even greater disappointment than the win total. With the unexpected Nebraska dumpster fire, I think Claeys could have won 7 + the bowl for 8. So, PJ winning 5 in the manner he did was a big step back.
 

Win 6 and you have a shot at 7 with the bowl. Also, I don't see Claeys getting blow out vs. NW. The 5 wins sucks, the performance all around was an even greater disappointment than the win total. With the unexpected Nebraska dumpster fire, I think Claeys could have won 7 + the bowl for 8. So, PJ winning 5 in the manner he did was a big step back.

And I don’t think there’s any chance Claeys would have won even 5 with McLaurin or Green at QB, which is who he was going to go with.
 

I mean I think we all knew that we would take a step back this year, but this has been miserable to watch. We should have won 5 straight to start the season and a lot of that can be blamed on poor play calling.
There was a lot of chatter here about starring 7-0. As a group we underestimated Maryland Purdue and MSU. There was a lot of overestimating of the talent on this roster. I have not been impressed with the PJ but I am hoping in two years from now we aren't having this same conversation about a 5-6 team.

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There was a lot of chatter here about starring 7-0.
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Of course there was. Then again, given the gnat like memory of most posters, those days didn't exit and we all knew we were in for a 5 win season. Tell me another school that extends a coach when they under perform.
 

Of course there was. Then again, given the gnat like memory of most posters, those days didn't exit and we all knew we were in for a 5 win season. Tell me another school that extends a coach when they under perform.

I most certainly did not know we were in for a 5 win season. I thought 7 was attainable and if Fleck had run the football in the red zone like any reasonable coach then we would have won 5 to start the year.
 

In a nutshell, here is my problems with the coaching staff:

1 - in 3 games (Maryland, Michigan, and Northwestern) we looked completely and totally unprepared - not even a whiff of either an offensive or defensive strategy that would give us a chance to win the game.

2 - an unwillingness to adapt to maximize the talents that we have - instead we stick to some predestined strategy that fails to work. I give just 2 examples of the many instances. In several games, when Croft was under center, Mason would comment - "they are going to run the jet sweep - its their only play under center" followed by ...... a jet sweep!. And recognizing that Croft does not have the touch to throw deep balls, we continue to feature that as our main passing option. If its that obvious - make a change!

3 - in no game this year, did I see a major halftime adjustment that took away something our opponent was doing with great success in the 1st half and force them do something different in the 2nd half. NW continued to pound the ball on us while we stayed in 7 an fronts. I always thought this was one of Kill/Claeys best traits - one that rarely got discussed.

While there has been so much talk about talent (or lack there of) and limited numbers, it's time to face another issue. Our administration, in an attempt to save face from a terribly bungled controversy, hired a young, energetic coach who is not Power 5 conference HC ready. This is year zero for Fleck as much as anyone - he was not prepared to be a B1G head coach with all the responsibilities that go with it. He needs serious work on team preparation, strategy, and maximizing the ability of the players he has. I give him a rock solid D for his grade in this zero year.

This is not to say that Fleck will not learn and ultimately be a good or even great coach. But I am more than a little tired of throwing this all on the players without some balanced acknowledgment that our HC was not ready for prime time this season either.
 

I wish PJ would explain why he does this JR High antic and how it could possibly help with 'culture' in any way...
all it does is take a spent defense and wears them down more to sprint like that and then go back out there...unreal
He is just a big show. All hat. No cows
 

Why do people keep saying the sprinting and fists in the air is a JR high antic or JVish? Has anyone ever seen JR high or JV teams doing these things? But I have seen many NFL players raise their fist many times on 4th down so maybe the correct term should be NFLish?

Even worse
 

And I don’t think there’s any chance Claeys would have won even 5 with McLaurin or Green at QB, which is who he was going to go with.

Exactly. It's your thought.
I think Claeys would have won 10 with McLaurin or Green at QB. Maybe even Croft would have played as well. Neither you nor I can be sure what would have happened had Claeys remained.

It is PJ's team and this season has been disappointing as far as wins and losses go. It has also been disappointing in HOW this season has unfolded. Lack of Off. and Def. adjustments. Poor game planning in most games. Injuries have played a role, but they happen every year.
 

It is PJ's team and this season has been disappointing as far as wins and losses go. It has also been disappointing in HOW this season has unfolded. Lack of Off. and Def. adjustments. Poor game planning in most games. Injuries have played a role, but they happen every year.

Unfortunately, many on here seem to think accountability is only applicable to the players.
 

Exactly. It's your thought.
I think Claeys would have won 10 with McLaurin or Green at QB. Maybe even Croft would have played as well. Neither you nor I can be sure what would have happened had Claeys remained.

It is PJ's team and this season has been disappointing as far as wins and losses go. It has also been disappointing in HOW this season has unfolded. Lack of Off. and Def. adjustments. Poor game planning in most games. Injuries have played a role, but they happen every year.

You could have said the exact same things about Kills first couple of years. There were plenty that said he couldn’t coach, predictable play calling, bad defense etc. Turned out ok once he got his players on campus. Flecks coaching will look much better in the coming seasons.
 




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