Offense and basketball “plays”

Bordergopher

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Calling on the Gopherhole basketball gurus for enlightenment. I’m a HUGE Gophers fan who understands the game pretty well. However, I don’t understand offensive philosophy or “plays”, other than a basic pick ‘n roll or ball screen. Some games, it seems like we move the ball and players around well, and get good looks. Some games, it seems like we do more standing around, and make desperate one-on-one moves to get off shots at the end of the clock.

Questions: What is going on there? What “plays” are we trying to run? Are those “plays” like a football play where all players have an assignment? Or is it more like “everyone clear out and let Nate drive the lane”? Why do some teams seem to get consistent “back door” layups? Do we generally have a type of offense that can be given a name, or isn’t there such a thing? So many questions and so little time. Educate me!


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It's not a 10 minute conversation. Teams have sets on offense...5 out, 4 out 1 in, 1-3-1 with high post and low post, 4 high, 4 down, 2 guard front, etc...they might disguise these sets by starting in something different than what the intended action is. Providence ran a pattern called Flex....each player has assignments, From within that basic structure there are counters and different actions. You could run flex from every one of those sets....each has false movement prior to the intended action, unless the defense is sleeping then you take advantage. All offense depends on how the other team is defending you. It changes with each game. It's all about matchups....where can you get an advantage versus their personnel and their scheme...each defense has a weakness.
There are a million different offenses. Probably not quite as many defenses but how each coaches defense is different...how far out on the floor do they pressure, do they deny passes? If they do those two things you can get back doors.
You can always get lobs with screens...these are generally set plays. Out bounds under are set plays for most teams. The Gophers are good coming out of timeouts, we often score or get a good shot with something we set up.
Spacing is critical, Screens and ball movement are very important to offense, but without proper spacing your team is easy to guard because the defense can easily help. You want to change sides of the floor with the ball to force defenses to rotate. The more times they rotate, the more likely to make a mistake.
Sometimes you go up tempo, rebound outlet and go. Attack the basket or shoot early transition 3's. Even in this you have sets and plays/actions depending what the defense gives you. Offensive players have spots to go to...you run to the baseline to stretch the defense.
Half court offense is typically harder to score than transition because the defense is set. Depending, it's why you might not call a timeout at the end of the game needing a basket.
Million things but watch with the knowledge Pitino is a very good coach.
 

It's not a 10 minute conversation. Teams have sets on offense...5 out, 4 out 1 in, 1-3-1 with high post and low post, 4 high, 4 down, 2 guard front, etc...they might disguise these sets by starting in something different than what the intended action is. Providence ran a pattern called Flex....each player has assignments, From within that basic structure there are counters and different actions. You could run flex from every one of those sets....each has false movement prior to the intended action, unless the defense is sleeping then you take advantage. All offense depends on how the other team is defending you. It changes with each game. It's all about matchups....where can you get an advantage versus their personnel and their scheme...each defense has a weakness.
There are a million different offenses. Probably not quite as many defenses but how each coaches defense is different...how far out on the floor do they pressure, do they deny passes? If they do those two things you can get back doors.
You can always get lobs with screens...these are generally set plays. Out bounds under are set plays for most teams. The Gophers are good coming out of timeouts, we often score or get a good shot with something we set up.
Spacing is critical, Screens and ball movement are very important to offense, but without proper spacing your team is easy to guard because the defense can easily help. You want to change sides of the floor with the ball to force defenses to rotate. The more times they rotate, the more likely to make a mistake.
Sometimes you go up tempo, rebound outlet and go. Attack the basket or shoot early transition 3's. Even in this you have sets and plays/actions depending what the defense gives you. Offensive players have spots to go to...you run to the baseline to stretch the defense.
Half court offense is typically harder to score than transition because the defense is set. Depending, it's why you might not call a timeout at the end of the game needing a basket.
Million things but watch with the knowledge Pitino is a very good coach.

Thanks for the reply! Sounds way more complex than I thought. What’s so different vs football is how there is a longer time for the action to occur, which results in continually changing opportunities. I’m guessing that’s where having “basketball smart” players on the court makes a huge difference. I used to play a little pickup basketball at a gym, and there were certain guys that just seemed to have an uncanny sense of being in the right place at the right time.


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I think the simplest answer you might be looking for and can do some googling to look into it is we run a weave ball screen action the majority of the time. As 60s said there are a lot of variables that come from that, but the simplest form, against man to man, we are likely running a weave action with a high ball screen.
 

Here's a very basic overview of the weave action we run quite a bit, though we involve high ball screens from the 5 man. Where I see us running into trouble on offense is when the defense does a good job of hedging the ball screen and forces the ball handler out of the weave.



The goal of any offense (against man to man defense) is to force help defenders. You want to drive the lane, draw a second defender to hedge on you, and kick to the open man for a shot or another drive on a now-recovering defender.

On defense as a help defender, you want to be able to help enough to contend a shot or stop a drive if your teammate is beat, while still being able to recover to your man in time to defend a shot or drive if the ball is passed. This is why spacing is important on offense. If you're too close together, it is easier for a defender to recover.
 


I will just add this: I think in general, the game has gone to more of a free-flowing approach in the last decade or so.

There are teams that still run "set" plays, but more teams, as noted, have gone to the variations on the flex or motion offenses, where players have options within the action of the game. But it's not as simple as it used to be with more defined roles and specific actions: "player A passes to player B; player C comes up and sets pick on player B's defender........etc." I would venture a guess that 20 or 30 years ago, more teams ran a higher percentage of set plays. now, as noted, most set plays come in specific situations - out-of-bounds plays on the baseline, or the sideline, where you are looking for a specific result. Or, end-of half and end-of-game situations, where you're trying to free up a specific player for a shot.

Today, I would say that more teams run a motion-based offense, and look for good shots in the context of that offense, but they're not necessarily running a diagrammed set play that is designed to produce a specific result.

Also, I would say that more teams now try to turn defense into offense, with different half-court and full-court traps and presses, with the goal of forcing turnovers and creating fast-break situations.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents worth.

Bottom line - the team that scores the most points still wins.
 

I will just add this: I think in general, the game has gone to more of a free-flowing approach in the last decade or so.

There are teams that still run "set" plays, but more teams, as noted, have gone to the variations on the flex or motion offenses, where players have options within the action of the game. But it's not as simple as it used to be with more defined roles and specific actions: "player A passes to player B; player C comes up and sets pick on player B's defender........etc." I would venture a guess that 20 or 30 years ago, more teams ran a higher percentage of set plays. now, as noted, most set plays come in specific situations - out-of-bounds plays on the baseline, or the sideline, where you are looking for a specific result. Or, end-of half and end-of-game situations, where you're trying to free up a specific player for a shot.

Today, I would say that more teams run a motion-based offense, and look for good shots in the context of that offense, but they're not necessarily running a diagrammed set play that is designed to produce a specific result.

Also, I would say that more teams now try to turn defense into offense, with different half-court and full-court traps and presses, with the goal of forcing turnovers and creating fast-break situations.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents worth.

Bottom line - the team that scores the most points still wins.
That's a pretty good take, son.
The basic concept is to penitrate until stopped, then pass out to the three point circle. Recycle with an occasional skip pass to an open player.
 

That's a pretty good take, son.
The basic concept is to penitrate until stopped, then pass out to the three point circle. Recycle with an occasional skip pass to an open player.
Not an expert either but it often seems like the offense is more of a set type of rotation and movement rather than set plays. Run this motion or move to these areas as the ball moves. When you have an opening drive or take a shot.
 

Not an expert either but it often seems like the offense is more of a set type of rotation and movement rather than set plays. Run this motion or move to these areas as the ball moves. When you have an opening drive or take a shot.
My rather uneducated observation is that Coach Pitino starts in a 1-4 high (four people across the foul line extended) and movement starts based upon where the pass is made or the screen takes place. What happens after that is beyond my skills, but perhaps son can add more.
 



I will just add this: I think in general, the game has gone to more of a free-flowing approach in the last decade or so.

There are teams that still run "set" plays, but more teams, as noted, have gone to the variations on the flex or motion offenses, where players have options within the action of the game. But it's not as simple as it used to be with more defined roles and specific actions: "player A passes to player B; player C comes up and sets pick on player B's defender........etc." I would venture a guess that 20 or 30 years ago, more teams ran a higher percentage of set plays. now, as noted, most set plays come in specific situations - out-of-bounds plays on the baseline, or the sideline, where you are looking for a specific result. Or, end-of half and end-of-game situations, where you're trying to free up a specific player for a shot.



Today, I would say that more teams run a motion-based offense, and look for good shots in the context of that offense, but they're not necessarily running a diagrammed set play that is designed to produce a specific result.

Also, I would say that more teams now try to turn defense into offense, with different half-court and full-court traps and presses, with the goal of forcing turnovers and creating fast-break situations.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents worth.

Bottom line - the team that scores the most points still wins.
Son has it.
Definitely, today's sets are nothing like the patterned sets of the old days. The Flex maybe has that beginning but there are so many possibilities out of even that initial action. Motion and drive and kick/dribble drive are the most popular. Blend in read and react off of principles...do you pass and screen away or cut to the hoop and go away or go ball screen or wait for somebody to come and screen for you...offenses have principles like that, that makes it harder to scout because the next action is based on ability and what the defense does. Same offense with IW running it versus Mason is going to look pretty different. But it starts with a set for spacing.

Emphasis is something to watch for...how often does a team look to get it into the post? Wisconsin, a lot. Michigan State pretty often. Why are they going inside? Are they going inside to score or are they going inside to kick it out for an inside out three? What's their primary intention?

Michigan St probably runs the most set plays of anybody. They disguise them with different entries. Set plays in 2017 have multiple options...you may not recognize it as "Punch" because what happens is a read on how the defense defends it and who you have on the floor offensively. Izzo has lots of coaching dvds on his set plays. He's not afraid to share them because if you defend the action this way, we do this, if you do it that way...we do this...oh, okay well, maybe you haven't seen this...boom. Set plays in 2017 are quick hitters...one, two passes to a shot. Maybe there are some passes before that to move people, change sides of the floor to make the defense move or to disguise your intended action. My point is it's more sets than set plays or set plays in 2017 are quick hitters.

You can run one play with 5 different entries pretty easily and be hard to defend because you have disguised your intent. Players have freedom to make decisions within a framework. Set plays in 2017 are not rigid assignments, you read the defense to achieve the desired intent of the call...your team knows what you are trying to accomplish so your spacing doesn't get messed up. If guys just freelance cut to hoop on their own without any structure Reggie can be left holding the ball at the three point line with four guys under the basket as the shot clock expires...not the best idea. The sets, give you spacing...that's the biggest thing. Floor balance for rebounding and transition defense but also for the freedom for Murphy, Coffey, Mason or IW to have the space to dribble drive to the hoop. You disguise how you create that space by different entries with the idea of proper spacing to allow freedom to attack.
 

Great and helpful answers everyone. Thanks. I guess this gets back to what I initially thought. For the most part, it is a structure or system more than set plays. Given how the defense is also always moving, the opportunities are also very fluid. Hence, the value of intuitively smart basketball players. I wonder sometimes if that “intangible” is a bit under-valued because it is hard to measure? It’s nice to have the tallest, strongest, quickest, most athletic guy, but does he have the nack for making the right judgements on the fly? Making the right passes? Moving to the right spots without the ball? We seem to have a group right now that has that intangible factor in addition to athleticism, etc. Pretty exciting.


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