Video: Fleck on his critics: "People who want to be negative will always be negative"

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lmh839 said:
Why do so many people think PJ's first year is such a step back from the Kill/Claeys era? Does anyone not remember how much the Gophers struggled in Kill's first couple of years? If you want to compare apples-to-apples then you should be comparing year 1 for both coaches as in comparing 2017 to 2011.

It does not matter who the coach is, there are going to be ups and downs with every coaching transition.

PJ has a plan laid out and has the support from the administration, so let's have some patience and let the process play itself out. If we are still sitting here 3 or 4 years from now and struggling then it will probably be time for a coaching change. Give the guy some time to build his roster through his recruiting classes. We have new facilities opening in January that will also help the program.

We are all Gophers fans at the end of the day and not only want to see this program succeed but to sustain that success. If you want to sustain that success over the long-term, it's going to take time to build your program with some good recruiting classes. The early signing period is one month away and that will be one of the first indicators to how PJ has been doing in his first year.

He also mentioned on KFAN yesterday that there will be some non-conference schedule announcements coming soon that should get the fans excited.
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This is good. People today want instant success. We have a heck of a time with our high school players wanting to put the time in to be great. They want it right now.

It's tough as a Gopher fan to say wait for success when we've been starved of it for so long though. When success does arrive though, it will be glorious!
 

MNVCGUY said:
The second point is the key one. There are a lot of fans that saw the 9 win record and just assumed that this year's team was a lock to produce similar results.
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Yup, probabbly the best example of misunderstanding that was lot of the stuff you'd hear about how "terrible" Mitch was .... I don't think folks really understood where Mitch was on the scale of QB quality and what the impact of doing poorly just at that position can do. And that's just one position.
 

A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
I think fans expect (right or wrong) slow progress upward. After last year finishing on a high note (well football game wise....) they expected ... moar.

I think here was/is a big misconception amongst some fans about the depth of talent that we had going into this season and the impact of a whole new coaching staff.

Like it or not programs don't just better continuously and not really a good recognition about how fragile mid to low mid level P5 programs really are year to year.
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When you consider Kill/Claeys never put up back to back 9 win seasons in their time here, it is funny that people expected it this year.

What is even more interesting to me is that Kill/Claeys only had back to back 7+ win seasons once.
 

grumps said:
I spit my coffee when I read that.

Here are all 40 wins of the Kill / Claeys era. (Including both over ranked opponents. #21 Nebraska (twice)

What was your favorite victory?


2016 Opponent Result
Oregon State* W 30–23
Indiana State* W 58–14
Colorado State* W 31–24
at Maryland W 31–10
Rutgers W 34–32
at Illinois W 40–17
Purdue W 44–31
Northwestern W 29–12
vs. Washington State* W 17–12


2015 Opponent# Result
at Colorado State* W 23–20
Kent State* W 10–7
Ohio* W 27–24
at Purdue W 41–13
Illinois W 32–23
vs. Central Michigan* W 21–14


2014 Opponent# Result
No. 16 (FCS) Eastern Illinois* W 42–20
Middle Tennessee* W 35–24
San Jose State* W 24–7
at Michigan W 30–14
Northwestern W 24–17
Purdue W 39–38
Iowa W 51–14
at No. 21 Nebraska W 28–24

2013 Opponent# Result
UNLV* W 51–23
at New Mexico State* W 44–21
Western Illinois* W 29–12
San Jose State* W 43–24
at Northwestern W 20–17
No. 21 Nebraska W 34–23
at Indiana W 42–39
Penn State W 24–10

2012 Opponent Result
at UNLV* W 30–27 3OT
No. 12 (FCS) New Hampshire* W 44–7
Western Michigan* W 28–23
Syracuse* W 17–10
Purdue W 44–28
at Illinois W 17–3


2011 Miami (OH)* W 29–23
Iowa W 22–21
Illinois W 27–7
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Agree with your point, we are fans of a bad program. How exactly does that disprove his point?
 

lmh839 said:
Why do so many people think PJ's first year is such a step back from the Kill/Claeys era? .
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Easy, because it has been a big step back from 3 of the last 4 seasons. So far if you're strictly going by the Big Ten season, it's setting-up as the worst Big season since Brewster's 1-11 in 2007. That followed Mason's 6-7 overall and 3-5 Big Ten season. You have to back to Mason's 1st year for a Gopher team than only won a single game in the Big Ten.

However Mason followed Wacker's 3 straight years of single win Big Ten seasons! Fleck certainly hasn't.

Now Fleck can certainly avoid that abysmal fate by winning in the last 3 games. Maybe even winning 2,3, 4 times more for the season.

The odd thing is that a few people will come here and tell people before every game that they have no chance to win. What they won't do is come out and say that they expect Fleck and Company to go 1-8 in the Big Ten.

Better question is why would anybody think it isn't a big step back? Because even math tells you it is.

Your 3rd and 4th paragraphs make sense. It's just that's there's no reason to pretend that, so far at least, the season hasn't been a huge disappointment The only place that people keep screaming "Stay calm! All is well!", is on Gopher Boards.
 


Johnnyboy18 said:
The previous regime brought us to heights not seen since the 60's???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
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We did go to the biggest bowl game we have been to since the 60's with Kill. That's kinda how these things are measured.

Care to point out the heights we reached between then that surpassed playing in a January 1 bowl game? I'm guessing you can't.
 

Some guy said:
When you consider Kill/Claeys never put up back to back 9 win seasons in their time here, it is funny that people expected it this year.

What is even more interesting to me is that Kill/Claeys only had back to back 7+ win seasons once.
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Yeah anyone who went through the 2014 season to 2015 Kent state game should remember how much things could swing even under the other coaches.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
We did go to the biggest bowl game we have been to since the 60's with Kill. That's kinda how these things are measured.

Care to point out the heights we reached between then that surpassed playing in a January 1 bowl game? I'm guessing you can't.
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Mason finished with a 9 win regular season. Kill and Claeys zero times.
They did a great job, but let’s not pretend that we had never seen it before.
 

MNVCGUY said:
The second point is the key one. There are a lot of fans that saw the 9 win record and just assumed that this year's team was a lock to produce similar results.
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A lock? Disagree.

A lot of fans witnessed the 2016 season, ending with a great performance from the D, and expected 6-8 wins this season. And a bowl game. Certainly not out of line by any means.

Rationalizing 4 wins being as good as it gets at this point in 2017 is only reality for some folks.
 



A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
Yeah anyone who went through the 2014 to 2015 Kent state game should remember how much things could swing even under the other coaches.
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Yup. We are slightly worse than my thinking told me. Expected 7-5.
Making 6-6 or 8-4 not surprising.

4-8 would be surprising. But would be no more surprising than 10-2 would’ve been.
 

PJ doesn't mind when folks don't like him. How do I know? He spends an awful lot of time telling us that. Wonder why?


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lmh839 said:
Why do so many people think PJ's first year is such a step back from the Kill/Claeys era? Does anyone not remember how much the Gophers struggled in Kill's first couple of years? If you want to compare apples-to-apples then you should be comparing year 1 for both coaches as in comparing 2017 to 2011.

It does not matter who the coach is, there are going to be ups and downs with every coaching transition.

PJ has a plan laid out and has the support from the administration, so let's have some patience and let the process play itself out. If we are still sitting here 3 or 4 years from now and struggling then it will probably be time for a coaching change. Give the guy some time to build his roster through his recruiting classes. We have new facilities opening in January that will also help the program.

We are all Gophers fans at the end of the day and not only want to see this program succeed but to sustain that success. If you want to sustain that success over the long-term, it's going to take time to build your program with some good recruiting classes. The early signing period is one month away and that will be one of the first indicators to how PJ has been doing in his first year.

He also mentioned on KFAN yesterday that there will be some non-conference schedule announcements coming soon that should get the fans excited.
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We were trending upwards the past four to five years. We were at a point of winning the games we should and being competitive in the rest. It took the program some time to get to that point.
PJ was brought in to take us to new levels. I agree it is going to take him some time. I don't agree or accept that we had to drop back down to a win total of 4 so far this season in order for us to take that next step. It is disappointing to lose the games we did and in the fashion that we did.

PJ has admin support and will be given time. He also has a great new recruiting tool in the Athletes Village. I am just as hopeful as any Gopher fan that he can have sustained success and can get us to the BIG title game multiple times. Really interested to see what kind of a class they can sign this year. Also, very interested to see how the rest of this season finishes out.
 

Spoofin said:
PJ doesn't mind when folks don't like him. How do I know? He spends an awful lot of time telling us that. Wonder why?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Because people ask him questions about it in this case
 



Some guy said:
Because people ask him questions about it in this case
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IMO, it is quite obvious PJ is bothered by the high level of skepticism directed towards him.


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MNVCGUY said:
2014 was clearly the high water mark. That list really illustrates where Kill had the program in terms of beating the teams it was supposed to and rarely beating the teams it was not supposed to. That keeps you out of the basement but certainly is not the formula you need to contend for championships. Very similar to what we had under Mason, better then what we had under Wacker and much of Brewster's time here.
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Not similar to Mason. Mason beat Ohio State, Penn St & Wisconsin. Something Kill/ Claeys never accomplished.



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Some guy said:
Mason finished with a 9 win regular season. Kill and Claeys zero times.
They did a great job, but let’s not pretend that we had never seen it before.
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Since College Football includes Bowl Games in season stats and in school's record that's meaningless. Mason won 10 games, best the other guys did was win 9. That's a meaningful comparison.

Or you could look at Big Ten conference records. Mason peaked at winning 5 games. Something he did twice. Kill did it once. While Claeys' team won 5 in 2016, he had 9 games to get there. Though to be fair he won the 5 games in the first 8 games.

Luckily for Fleck, though he can't get to .500 in the Big Ten, he can still win 3 more Big Ten games this season and can still get to a possible 7-5 record.
 

Iceland12 said:
Since College Football includes Bowl Games in season stats and in school's record that's meaningless. Mason won 10 games, best the other guys did was win 9. That's a meaningful comparison.

Or you could look at Big Ten conference records. Mason peaked at winning 5 games. Something he did twice. Kill did it once. While Claeys' team won 5 in 2016, he had 9 games to get there. Though to be fair he won the 5 games in the first 8 games.

Luckily for Fleck, though he can't get to .500 in the Big Ten, he can still win 3 more Big Ten games this season and can still get to a possible 7-5 record.
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7-5 wouldn't fit the graph


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New coach, new system. a step back is not shocking. I would argue that this year's team has taken more of a step back than a lot of people expected. Certainly more than I expected. Fleck was sold as the hottest young coaching prospect in college FB - a motivator and hot-shot recruiter. So, he comes to MN, and this is what we get. Meanwhile, the coach keeps telling us what bad shape the program is in.

Yes, if the team is winning 8 or 9 games in a couple of years, the first year will be largely forgotten.

On the bigger picture, a constant theme in this thread is disappointment in previous coaches who did not take the team "to the next level."

That supposes that the program is capable of advancing to that next level. I submit that, in today's college FB landscape, it is possible - not a certainty, but possible - that 8 or 9 wins and a mid-level bowl game is the best this program can hope for. if the program was going to go to "the next level," then you think it should have happened at some point in the last 50 years, even by accident.

it may very well be that Mason's 10-win season is the best this program will accomplish in our lifetimes. I hope I'm wrong, but if you're going to consider all possibilities, that is a possibility you have to consider. If Fleck was a miracle worker, then maybe the next level is possible. I don't see him as a miracle worker.
 



Bob_Loblaw said:
Agree with your point, we are fans of a bad program. How exactly does that disprove his point?
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Because not beating a top 20 team for 6 consecutive years isn't a level we hadn't seen before.

In the 80's we beat #1 Michigan I believe.
In the 90's we beat #2 Penn St.
2000's we beat OSU when they were Top 10.
We beat Wisconsin in the 90's when they were top 15.



But for some reason a Bowl Game again is trumping any level of success had before.
 

I would hope every Gopher fan is disappointed by the current season. That is OK. I will not criticize anyone for wanting to see more wins. I didn't expect this team to be as good as last year and I'm very disappointed in how bad it's been.

That isn't the issue. The issue is how many people just assume the team would be better with Claeys. Do you think Croft has regressed that much since last year? Or that McLaurin (who isn't even playing QB at Mississippi Central CC anymore, now a WR) would have taken this program to new heights? Or that Seth Green would have magically excelled?

As far as defense, Jay Sawvel, now DC at Wake Forest:

Minnesota D: 5.32 Yds/Play, 23 TD's/9 games, 329 YPG
Wake Forest D: 5.43 Yds/Play, 26 TD's/9 games, 418 YPG

How many excuses will folks make up for him there but NOT give the same leeway to Robb Smith?

I don't know if Fleck will be successful here. In three years I may be leading the charge to fire him. But to act like this team could be some B1G West contending team because it beat 8 bad teams in the regular season last year before losing many critical players with no reasonable replacements in place is nonsense.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
On the bigger picture, a constant theme in this thread is disappointment in previous coaches who did not take the team "to the next level."

That supposes that the program is capable of advancing to that next level. I submit that, in today's college FB landscape, it is possible - not a certainty, but possible - that 8 or 9 wins and a mid-level bowl game is the best this program can hope for. if the program was going to go to "the next level," then you think it should have happened at some point in the last 50 years, even by accident.

it may very well be that Mason's 10-win season is the best this program will accomplish in our lifetimes. I hope I'm wrong, but if you're going to consider all possibilities, that is a possibility you have to consider. If Fleck was a miracle worker, then maybe the next level is possible. I don't see him as a miracle worker.
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So should they not even try to go to the next level? The feeling for many was that Kill/Claeys were content to just win 6-9 games on a yearly basis. There was never much drive or attention put on trying to achieve something greater. Which is fine, but for folks who hoped for the potential of something more, it was a letdown.

You can call this year a letdown too. But it was never about reaching those heights in the first season. It's a process. They aren't going to sway too far from the plan they had when they got here. This probably won't be another panic move to change all systems in the offseason like other coaches have done.

As for coach telling us what bad shape the program is: do you disagree? If Big Ten titles and even competing for national titles are the goals this program is striving for, did we come into the season with a roster that was ready to compete on that level? How about now, with all our injuries? He's saying those things because they're true. We don't have the roster to compete on that level yet, and it's not going to happen overnight either.

That's why some of us predicted 5 to 7 wins this summer. We knew what we were talking about, maybe...
 

grumps said:
Because not beating a top 20 team for 6 consecutive years isn't a level we hadn't seen before.

In the 80's we beat #1 Michigan I believe.
In the 90's we beat #2 Penn St.
2000's we beat OSU when they were Top 10.
We beat Wisconsin in the 90's when they were top 15.

But for some reason a Bowl Game again is trumping any level of success had before.
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This year that would mean that they'd win more than 1 Big Ten game. Something you don't care about I guess.
 

Iceland12 said:
This year that would mean that they'd win more than 1 Big Ten game. Something you don't care about I guess.
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I want them to win as much as anyone else.

I just found it hilarious that the Kill/Claeys era was heights we hadn't seen in 40-50 years, by beating two top 25 teams. (a quickly downward spiraling Nebraska who subsequently fired their coach).

At some point I hope we beat top 25 teams who don't feel the need to fire their coach after we do it.
 

Josh - my point is that people talk about going to the next level as if it was some simple equation: right coach + right players + facilities + admin support = Conference Champs, National Title contenders.

if it was easy, everyone would be doing it.

it's not easy. Most teams never do it. and if most teams never do it, that means that there is a possibility the Gophers will never do it. Of course, there is a possibility they will do it. I just don't see Fleck as the guy who makes it happen. I see Fleck as more noise than substance. Maybe I'm wrong. we'll see.

But for the Gophers to go to the next level, the recruiting would have to take a quantum leap forward. High 3* players aren't going to cut it. If the Gophers are going to become this college FB juggernaut, they will have to be able to consistently recruit multiple 4* and 5* players. Or the coaches would have to pull off one of the great coaching jobs in college FB history. if you believe Fleck is capable of that, more power to you. I don't believe.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
We did go to the biggest bowl game we have been to since the 60's with Kill. That's kinda how these things are measured.

Care to point out the heights we reached between then that surpassed playing in a January 1 bowl game? I'm guessing you can't.
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Yes, 2003 was easily a better season than any season under Kill/Claeys. Don't know how anyone with a brain could possibly dispute that. Pretending that Kill/Claeys did anything substantially better than Mason is delusional.
 

You've got to appreciate PJ FLeck's Dilbert-like comic strip chart of the Gophers vision and direction.

I like the zig-zags as long as the trend line keeps rising in a positive slope.

My sense early in the season was that the Gophers are going to finish anywhere between 5-7 and 9-3.

It is looking more like it will be closer to 5-7 unless a miracle happens.

Just think - We lost four guys in the defensive secondary to the expulsions, we lost Jonah Pirsig, Gaelin Elmore, Conner Mayes, Tyler Moore, Mitch Leidner graduated early, and others. Now we lost Nick Connelly, and how many injuries are there so far?

The Gophers are having a discombobulated season in transition with new coaches, approaches, and personnel upheavals. Take "Year Zero" as a learning and transition experience for everyone. In a couple of years, something good will happen. It is a slow process.
 

Lakeville Goldy said:
I would hope every Gopher fan is disappointed by the current season. That is OK. I will not criticize anyone for wanting to see more wins. I didn't expect this team to be as good as last year and I'm very disappointed in how bad it's been.

That isn't the issue. The issue is how many people just assume the team would be better with Claeys. Do you think Croft has regressed that much since last year? Or that McLaurin (who isn't even playing QB at Mississippi Central CC anymore, now a WR) would have taken this program to new heights? Or that Seth Green would have magically excelled?

As far as defense, Jay Sawvel, now DC at Wake Forest:

Minnesota D: 5.32 Yds/Play, 23 TD's/9 games, 329 YPG
Wake Forest D: 5.43 Yds/Play, 26 TD's/9 games, 418 YPG

How many excuses will folks make up for him there but NOT give the same leeway to Robb Smith?

I don't know if Fleck will be successful here. In three years I may be leading the charge to fire him. But to act like this team could be some B1G West contending team because it beat 8 bad teams in the regular season last year before losing many critical players with no reasonable replacements in place is nonsense.
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Very well put. Really it all swings on the Purdue and Maryland games for a number of people. Win 1 or both of those and the complaining is probably far less. There is no guarantee what-so-ever that those games were wins with Claeys in charge given the holes on the roster. Sucks to take a step back but it was going to happen with this team this year no matter who was in charge.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
Josh - my point is that people talk about going to the next level as if it was some simple equation: right coach + right players + facilities + admin support = Conference Champs, National Title contenders.

if it was easy, everyone would be doing it.

it's not easy. Most teams never do it. and if most teams never do it, that means that there is a possibility the Gophers will never do it. Of course, there is a possibility they will do it. I just don't see Fleck as the guy who makes it happen. I see Fleck as more noise than substance. Maybe I'm wrong. we'll see.

But for the Gophers to go to the next level, the recruiting would have to take a quantum leap forward. High 3* players aren't going to cut it. If the Gophers are going to become this college FB juggernaut, they will have to be able to consistently recruit multiple 4* and 5* players. Or the coaches would have to pull off one of the great coaching jobs in college FB history. if you believe Fleck is capable of that, more power to you. I don't believe.
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I disagree on the bold part.
I think he's reaching far deeper behind the scenes to work several angles more than has been before.

Marketing change has been #1. Not only is he helping to change and improve it, he definitely understands the importance of it.
Support of the program within the University. I think he's doing far more there so the University itself is on the side of the football team instead of fighting against it.
Support outside the program. I trust PJ far more than Mason or any previous coach to gather support from business / fans / media.

During PJ's press conference yesterday, PJ talked about all of these different things. Facilities, marketing, administration, etc. He gets it and 90% of what he doing is stuff regarding football that doesn't take place on the field.
 

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