Fleck: “By 2019, I will be able to fix the issues, but we will be young."

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MNVCGUY said:
Again, if you read the entire piece and not just the excerpt you will see that he doesn't say we are going to suck he is just acknowledging the fact that there are holes to fill and that is going to take some time to get to where we truly want to be. Not sure how any one can dispute that when they look at this roster that has no QB, one developing solid receiver, basically nobody at DE, and a secondary that lost guys to graduation/expulsion and its best player to injury. Outside of Winfield's injury, the other three issues all would have been there under Claeys as well.

Brewster came in talking Rose Bowls and fans destroyed him for it when the performance on the field fell short. Kill came in talking about a 6 year plan to get back to competing and people loved him for it. Much of this is a Minnesota thing in terms of the personality, guys like Fleck who are positive and upbeat scare a lot of our fans. They respond much better to the "aww shucks, I'm just a down home country boy trying to win some football games" routine.

It is Fleck's first year, there are going to be growing pains, there would have been plenty of issues this year no matter who was in charge. As frustrating as it is to see the team struggle, this was going to be a transition year roster wise based on what we lost and what we had coming back.
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Agree. But people with agendas will cherry pick statements and words and change the meaning of the whole statement.....just to get their time on the stage I guess... Just like politics....misdirection, with confusion the only goal.

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MNVCGUY said:
Apparently nobody remembers Kill saying it would take at least 6 years to compete.
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As a 25 year coach, I listened to Kill and heard a coach that didn't enjoy the public part of being a HC. He was a football coach to the core, and got the most out of the majority of his kids. The coach I heard within him gave me faith it would happen.

I'm concerned because I hear a life coach and not a football coach listening to PJ. Life coaching is/can be great for people, but it doesn't translate directly to success on the field. I worry about his and the coordinators' abilities to coach kids and implement effective strategy. I've posted my concerns about Smith in other threads.

I know we need patience, but the vibe I get from a coach's perspective leads to my skepticism this regime leading us to heights any different than what we've seen.
 

oak_street1981 said:
Well Claeys and Kill played two very meaningful games in Madison in came up short in the second half, but they were close to something that had not happened here in a very long time.

Make fun of Kill, TC and Mitch all you want, but the wretched offensive approach of this offensive staff is the worst coaching I have seen since Brewster. We kept hearing what a genius this new OC was and let us not forget that he had months to work with the current QBs and WRs to evaluate them and get them either to a point where they could run his stuff or find something they could run, and the crap we have seen all year is the result of that coaching .

Pure crap all around. Our team now looks a lot like the Illinois teams of the last few years.
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You can surely think the offensive staff sucks (they definitely haven't impressed to this point), but you haven't been watching the Gophers long if you think this is the most putrid offense you've ever seen. Even the good, competitive Gopher teams of the past 5 or so years have averaged very close to what this Gophers team is putting up in terms of offensive production: a measly 360 yards/game. There have been different mixes of run/pass ratios and success, but that's the typical output. Dude, our offenses have SUCKED for years.

Granted this team hasn't reached the meat of its schedule as far as opposing defenses go, so we'll have to revisit this at the end of the season. But I haven't seen anything worse than I saw out of the previous staff. I hated inside zone 15+ times in the first 5 games, but I saw similar stuff out of Kill/Limey/ and Claeys/Johnson.
 


Balanced said:
Huh?? Why did it take less than 20 games down in Bugtussle aka Ames, IA? Their new stadium? Facilities? Maybe the 365 day per year atmosphere?
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Iowa State players with two or less years in the program in two deeps (FR, RS-FR, SO)
Offense 7 and 3 starting
Defense 8 and 1 starting
Offensive Line total years in program for starting line 18

Minnesota
Offense 8 and 4 starting
Defense 9 and 6 starting
Offensive Line total years in program for starting line 12

Some may not agree, but a major part of hiring Fleck was to allow him to do it his way and build the Row the Boat Culture. That's what he is doing. Patience is of the essence.
 


Spoofin said:
We have had this conversation already. You can read what you want into his statement, but what I see is him saying we will still be young and developing in 2019 (year 3) and will finally see a spike in 2020 (year 4). Those were his words, not mine. IMO, that sends a terrible message to the players on this team that won't be around anymore in 3 years and is remotely close to saying they won't win a B1G title.


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And I read it to mean that we'll be a top 25 team in 2019.
 


PJ's timetable reminds me of Scotty when he appeared on Star Trek: The Next Generation. He was having a conversation with LaForge that went something like this:

L: I told the captain I would have this diagnostic done in an hour.
S: And how long will it really take you?
L: An hour!
S: Oh, you didn't tell him how long it would really take, did you?
L: Of course I did.
S: Oh, laddie, you have a lot to learn if you want people to think of you as a miracle worker.

The point is, always add time to the task, and when you get it done sooner, you look good.
 

Ski U Mah Gopher said:
PJ's timetable reminds me of Scotty when he appeared on Star Trek: The Next Generation. He was having a conversation with LaForge that went something like this:

L: I told the captain I would have this diagnostic done in an hour.
S: And how long will it really take you?
L: An hour!
S: Oh, you didn't tell him how long it would really take, did you?
L: Of course I did.
S: Oh, laddie, you have a lot to learn if you want people to think of you as a miracle worker.

The point is, always add time to the task, and when you get it done sooner, you look good.
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I hope PJ doesn't drink like Scotty....
 



OddStack said:
As a 25 year coach, I listened to Kill and heard a coach that didn't enjoy the public part of being a HC. He was a football coach to the core, and got the most out of the majority of his kids. The coach I heard within him gave me faith it would happen.

I'm concerned because I hear a life coach and not a football coach listening to PJ. Life coaching is/can be great for people, but it doesn't translate directly to success on the field. I worry about his and the coordinators' abilities to coach kids and implement effective strategy. I've posted my concerns about Smith in other threads.

I know we need patience, but the vibe I get from a coach's perspective leads to my skepticism this regime leading us to heights any different than what we've seen.
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Having concerns is totally valid, but it is way too soon to draw any conclusions about the future based on what has happened to this point in the season.

My concern with Kill from day one was that he had a pretty obvious ceiling very similar to where Mason had things and that proved to be true. I still believe this program can take the steps to be at the same level as Iowa and Wisconsin year in and year out and I do believe that Fleck has the mix of recruiting and coaching that could bring in the players we need to get there. But only time will tell.

The part of this whole thing that bugs me is when people bring up the 9 wins last year and try to pin the current struggles all on Fleck, implying that without the coaching change we would have been looking at 9 wins again this season. The massive roster holes were going to be there no matter who was in charge, this season was not hard to see coming.
 

MNVCGUY said:
Having concerns is totally valid, but it is way too soon to draw any conclusions about the future based on what has happened to this point in the season.

My concern with Kill from day one was that he had a pretty obvious ceiling very similar to where Mason had things and that proved to be true. I still believe this program can take the steps to be at the same level as Iowa and Wisconsin year in and year out and I do believe that Fleck has the mix of recruiting and coaching that could bring in the players we need to get there. But only time will tell.

The part of this whole thing that bugs me is when people bring up the 9 wins last year and try to pin the current struggles all on Fleck, implying that without the coaching change we would have been looking at 9 wins again this season. The massive roster holes were going to be there no matter who was in charge, this season was not hard to see coming.
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Had there not been a change in regimes the roster wouldn't have as many holes. Two OL likely don't leave, Elmore likely is here, McLaurin is likely here (he had already enrolled prior to TC's firing; he didn't choose Fleck and likely may have thrown in the towel for various reasons b/c of that.)

I think we'd still be at 7 wins or above for the season w/o a regime change. I believe we'd be at 6 right now (Purdue and Maryland).
 

OddStack said:
Had there not been a change in regimes the roster wouldn't have as many holes. Two OL likely don't leave, Elmore likely is here, McLaurin is likely here (he had already enrolled prior to TC's firing; he didn't choose Fleck and likely may have thrown in the towel for various reasons b/c of that.)

I think we'd still be at 7 wins or above for the season w/o a regime change. I believe we'd be at 6 right now (Purdue and Maryland).
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Maybe, but JC players are always a massive question mark. He may have been a little better then Croft (not hard to do) but not sure it would have been enough to make a massive difference. Looking for info online it looks like he is back at community college and is playing WR now. So his long term outlook as a QB might not have bee that great.
 

OddStack said:
Had there not been a change in regimes the roster wouldn't have as many holes. Two OL likely don't leave, Elmore likely is here, McLaurin is likely here (he had already enrolled prior to TC's firing; he didn't choose Fleck and likely may have thrown in the towel for various reasons b/c of that.)

I think we'd still be at 7 wins or above for the season w/o a regime change. I believe we'd be at 6 right now (Purdue and Maryland).
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I don't entirely agree with that argument, but the hire wasn't about this year, it was about getting above 7-8 wins.
 




Look next door at Williams. Look at what Pitino has built, the Gophers are in the talk Nationally for the first time in years. Almost everyone expects them to be one of the top 3-4 teams in the B1G.

It takes time to rebuild a program, especially in college.

I'm a Cubs fan, there will be dark days ahead but if you do it the right way the wait will be so worth it.
 

MNVCGUY said:
Having concerns is totally valid, but it is way too soon to draw any conclusions about the future based on what has happened to this point in the season.

My concern with Kill from day one was that he had a pretty obvious ceiling very similar to where Mason had things and that proved to be true. I still believe this program can take the steps to be at the same level as Iowa and Wisconsin year in and year out and I do believe that Fleck has the mix of recruiting and coaching that could bring in the players we need to get there. But only time will tell.

The part of this whole thing that bugs me is when people bring up the 9 wins last year and try to pin the current struggles all on Fleck, implying that without the coaching change we would have been looking at 9 wins again this season. The massive roster holes were going to be there no matter who was in charge, this season was not hard to see coming.
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I am not a Fleck fan and he chats too much, but a comment of fact and opinion.

Kill's best team faced an absolutely brutal schedule when they caught TCU as well as Ohio State and Michigan in crossover games in 14-15 along with TCU in non conference. By contrast, Iowa got Maryland, Indiana and Wisconsin got Maryland, Rutgers. Had the Big Ten not completely bent us over in the crossovers, we likely would have had better records.

While I don't like Fleck, if you have not been to an actual game in person, you wouldn't be aware that his team is VERY well organized on the sideline. They are well prepared and well coached in terms of who needs to be where/when. While I don't think he can out recruit his way past other teams to a championship like he did at Western Michigan, I cannot say he is any less of a sideline coach that Kills teams were in terms of being prepared and organized. The difference between his teams and Brewsters are night and day as much as he sounds like Brewsters used car salesman attitude.
 

JZsportswhiz said:
Look next door at Williams. Look at what Pitino has built, the Gophers are in the talk Nationally for the first time in years. Almost everyone expects them to be one of the top 3-4 teams in the B1G.

It takes time to rebuild a program, especially in college.

I'm a Cubs fan, there will be dark days ahead but if you do it the right way the wait will be so worth it.
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Um ... I believe it took the Cubs about a century? I don't have that long.
 

Mulligan said:
Um ... I believe it took the Cubs about a century? I don't have that long.
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Yea but Mulligan, we're half way through our century-long drought...do you have 50 more years? I'm not sure I do, but I'll give it a shot!

Go Gophers!!
 

Ski U Mah Gopher said:
PJ's timetable reminds me of Scotty when he appeared on Star Trek: The Next Generation. He was having a conversation with LaForge that went something like this:

L: I told the captain I would have this diagnostic done in an hour.
S: And how long will it really take you?
L: An hour!
S: Oh, you didn't tell him how long it would really take, did you?
L: Of course I did.
S: Oh, laddie, you have a lot to learn if you want people to think of you as a miracle worker.

The point is, always add time to the task, and when you get it done sooner, you look good.
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LOL...this is exacly right. Coach Kill did the same thing with his "6 year project" taking over MN. The Citrus bowl in year 4 made him look like a GD miracle worker! And he was treated as such...
 

OddStack said:
Had there not been a change in regimes the roster wouldn't have as many holes. Two OL likely don't leave, Elmore likely is here, McLaurin is likely here (he had already enrolled prior to TC's firing; he didn't choose Fleck and likely may have thrown in the towel for various reasons b/c of that.)

I think we'd still be at 7 wins or above for the season w/o a regime change. I believe we'd be at 6 right now (Purdue and Maryland).
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I can speculate on what could have been also.........

If you truly believe we would be at 6 wins now with prior regime and drop 4 of the last 5 and wind up at 7 wins, everyone on this board would be screaming to fire the coach.

Plus, the history of the previous regime in evaluating the QB position, I have zero faith the juco would be better than what we have now.

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Ski U Mah Gopher said:
PJ's timetable reminds me of Scotty when he appeared on Star Trek: The Next Generation. He was having a conversation with LaForge that went something like this:

L: I told the captain I would have this diagnostic done in an hour.
S: And how long will it really take you?
L: An hour!
S: Oh, you didn't tell him how long it would really take, did you?
L: Of course I did.
S: Oh, laddie, you have a lot to learn if you want people to think of you as a miracle worker.

The point is, always add time to the task, and when you get it done sooner, you look good.
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That was a great episode and I agree completely!

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BleedGopher said:
Yea but Mulligan, we're half way through our century-long drought...do you have 50 more years? I'm not sure I do, but I'll give it a shot!

Go Gophers!!
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At a 121 some young a**hole behind me will get upset because I don't stand on 3d downs or I leave 5 minutes early.
 

Mulligan said:
At a 121 some young a**hole behind me will get upset because I don't stand on 3d downs or I leave 5 minutes early.
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If you give him a high five when he offers after a score or a sack, all will be forgiven. :p
 

MaxyJR1 said:
Some may not agree, but a major part of hiring Fleck was to allow him to do it his way and build the Row the Boat Culture. That's what he is doing. Patience is of the essence.
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Minor detail, but I just wanted to point out that it's actually a H.Y.P.R.R. culture. Row the Boat is merely a way of life.

To wit:

See, Row the Boat is our way of life and our never-give-up mantra, but if you wanna actually talk about our culture, we have something very specific that we call it. Our culture's called the H.Y.P.R.R. culture, go figure, right? H-Y-P-R-R, it's an acronym.
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cf. Gopher Talk 101 with P.J. Fleck: "H.Y.P.R.R."
 

I'm sure it was done before, but this forum really spends a lot of time analyzing ever sentence Fleck speaks.

So I guess that's good, but it's also bad because it means threads and threads of people finding inconsistencies in their own interpretations of what PJ said.

Fleck says more in 12 minutes than Kill would say in 4 weeks.
When that much is being thrown out there, as many of you are already thinking of him as a BS'er, don't you already start to filter most of it away and discard it?

I know when I have someone who I think is BS'ing me, I believe about one out of ten sentences.
Posters on here who think Fleck is a BS'er could do the same. Instead the come on here, write down the 9 sentences they don't believe and try to nail him down as a liar because of it.
Ok. So he's a liar in your mind.
Write Coyle and email about it.
That would do more good than complaining to fans who are trying to support the program under Fleck.
 

Once the coach brings in his own recruits, improves at all the skill positions; improves the O-line, has time to develop the redshirts, has the kids in class and understanding the culture, has the fanbase base 100% behind him, has complete buy-in from the administration, has a favorable schedule, has zero injuries, transfers or suspensions; THEN we'll beat Purdue. Maybe even Maryland!

Coach em up Fleck. You've lost to some sad-ass teams.
 

2019 but were young? Ok so were just gonna suck forever..
 

Oregon Gopher said:
Just wish he hadn't used the noun 'I". Won't his coaches and players be involved in the resurrection?


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But then I'm sure some would complain about PJ not holding himself accountable
 

Oregon Gopher said:
Just wish he hadn't used the noun 'I". Won't his coaches and players be involved in the resurrection?


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I believe that "I" is a pronoun and not a noun .... sorry just not feeling like talking Gophers today
 

Spoofin said:
We have had this conversation already. You can read what you want into his statement, but what I see is him saying we will still be young and developing in 2019 (year 3) and will finally see a spike in 2020 (year 4). Those were his words, not mine. IMO, that sends a terrible message to the players on this team that won't be around anymore in 3 years and is remotely close to saying they won't win a B1G title.


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There is that salary cut comment too...
 

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