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everybody knows my name

everybody knows my name

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I want to believe in the Fleckster, and in my heart of hearts I do believe that we'll win at some point with Fleck at the helm, eventually. But I have absolutely no confidence that we'll win another game this season, and I seriously question whether his amazing 2016 season at W Michigan was just a once-in-a-lifetime flash in the pan, like Derrike Cope winning the 1990 Daytona 500 and then having a completely undistinguished career in NASCAR.

I didn't really expect 9 or 10 wins from this team in 2017, but I never imagined that we'd suck so badly with so much talent on the defense and an offense not devoid of talent. It doesn't even look like we'll go to the Oil Change Bowl this year.
 

Everybody knows patience is virtue.
 

It takes patience, what don't people understand about that? College football isn't the NFL where you can go from 4-12 one year to 11-5 the next year via draft and free agency and schedule.

This is about culture and recruiting and it's going to take time to bring in your own recruits. You recruit players to fit your scheme and culture so it can take a good 3-4 years before you even see results on the field.

You also need to build depth and sustain that recruiting success if you want to take your program to the next level. It's going to be 3-4 years before we start to see some results, just like they did at Western Michigan.

The 2018 recruiting class will be a good indicator of where this program is heading under PJ Fleck after his first full year on the job.

People just need to have some patience and understand how recruiting classes work and their effect on the depth of the roster. If you can have some success on the recruiting trail and sustain that success, the results on the field should follow. It just takes some time and so many people fail to realize that.
 

hungan1 said:
Everybody knows patience is virtue.
Click to expand...

It is what it is. Yes we need patience big time this year. Some people have it and some people have knee jerk type reactions in life.
 



Face it, we all want to win every game, every time out... admitting that it is going to take a year or 2 or three is hard, but...

This guy is going to get us there.

It's college football, enjoy the ride.
 

lmh839 said:
College football isn't the NFL where you can go from 4-12 one year to 11-5 the next year via draft and free agency and schedule.
Click to expand...

I am continually amazed at how many on this board are completely okay with the fact that we are likely to go from 9-4 to 4-8. Why is it okay, and to be expected to go in a negative direction, but no one should hope we maintain, or go forward?

Everyone is buying into a dream...one we hope will come to fruition one day, but unfortunately one stellar year in the lowly MAC is not a guarantee that anything like it will be replicated in the BigTen.
 

Fire coaches every year.... That we can compete with literally no passing game, quarterback and only one wide out is amazing to me... Things will get better and maybe we can beat the skunks!
 

Success always doesn't follow an exact linear path unless you are the exceptional few programs like tOSU and Alabama.

The Gophers 9-4 record last season whet our appetites and expectations for winning. We have some major loses of players from last season in addition to injuries in addition to instilling a new football "culture".

Winning consistently takes some time to bring program stability. We always pine for and crave for success like those at Iowa, Wisconsin, & Nothwestern. Wisconsin built a successful model predicated on a massive O-Line stable and Barry Alvarez overseeing the program hire from his AD perch.

Their success did not happen overnight. We have some formidable foes in B1G West that you have to equal and/or surpass. I don't expect to see perfection from the get-go which is what some fans are asking for - the impossible. We can't change Croft overnight for instance. He is who he is, and that is who we have to work with for the moment until PJ Fleck's recruits establish themselves. They can coach Croft up to be serviceable. We have to rely on the recruiting in the next three or four years.

I get it. I am frustrated at times. But, I learned to be patient.
 



everybody knows my name said:
I want to believe in the Fleckster, and in my heart of hearts I do believe that we'll win at some point with Fleck at the helm, eventually. But I have absolutely no confidence that we'll win another game this season, and I seriously question whether his amazing 2016 season at W Michigan was just a once-in-a-lifetime flash in the pan, like Derrike Cope winning the 1990 Daytona 500 and then having a completely undistinguished career in NASCAR.

I didn't really expect 9 or 10 wins from this team in 2017, but I never imagined that we'd suck so badly with so much talent on the defense and an offense not devoid of talent. It doesn't even look like we'll go to the Oil Change Bowl this year.
Click to expand...


Our offense isn't very talented. We have good RB's and one good WR and no depth to an average OL
 

hungan1 said:
Success always doesn't follow an exact linear path unless you are the exceptional few programs like tOSU and Alabama.

The Gophers 9-4 record last season whet our appetites and expectations for winning. We have some major loses of players from last season in addition to injuries in addition to instilling a new football "culture".

Winning consistently takes some time to bring program stability. We always pine for and crave for success like those at Iowa, Wisconsin, & Nothwestern. Wisconsin built a successful model predicated on a massive O-Line stable and Barry Alvarez overseeing the program hire from his AD perch.

Their success did not happen overnight. We have some formidable foes in B1G West that you have to equal and/or surpass. I don't expect to see perfection from the get-go which is what some fans are asking for - the impossible. We can't change Croft overnight for instance. He is who he is, and that is who we have to work with for the moment until PJ Fleck's recruits establish themselves. They can coach Croft up to be serviceable. We have to rely on the recruiting in the next three or four years.

I get it. I am frustrated at times. But, I learned to be patient.
Click to expand...

Ditto, but we have no choice

Some gopher fans want to restart every year until we get lightning in a bottle it appears. This year is hard, but we've endured worse. At least we didn't lose to an FCS school and have their fans trump how they'd be winning the B1GW
 

People just keep repeating, "were terrible," as some kind of justification. Nobody is asking them to win the West. But, if you watched the Maryland, Purdue, and Iowa games, we're pretty similar in terms of the overall quality of talent (sure, there are areas where they were better, and areas we are better).

IMO, it's a cop out. It's shifting all blame to the players and previous regime, when in reality coaching played a significant role in all three of losses.

This team should not be a 4-win team this year. That should not be the expectation. It has nothing to do with last year's win total. "What is it about that that people don't understand."
 

Tlsbhansen said:
I am continually amazed at how many on this board are completely okay with the fact that we are likely to go from 9-4 to 4-8. Why is it okay, and to be expected to go in a negative direction, but no one should hope we maintain, or go forward?

Everyone is buying into a dream...one we hope will come to fruition one day, but unfortunately one stellar year in the lowly MAC is not a guarantee that anything like it will be replicated in the BigTen.
Click to expand...
So explain to me how Michigan State, with an experienced, long term coach went from 12-2 in 2015 to 3-9 in 2016. What is the reason? How did that happen?

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
 



All the confidence in the world that Fleck will be a far better recruiter than Claeys. That's how they won at WMU. They were at or near the top in MAC recruiting. That ain't gonna happen in the Big Ten.

Zero confidence that Fleck will be able to out-recruit the name schools in the Big Ten East. Luckily, they're in the West. That means that to get them past the level that Kill and Claeys had, 7 -9 wins a season, Fleck and Company have to be coaching at the Kill/Claeys level or better to get them consistently to the 9-11 win per season level.

All the talk was how Fleck and Company were gonna be better Offensive Coaches and would be much better game day decision makers too. Bought into that.

Problem is that hasn't been happened.
 

I'm fine with the 4-8 record.
We're competitive which is good.
If we had the same records, but all of our losses were blowouts, I'd be more concerned.

Some people think because Fleck could be a good recruiter, he might not be a good coach.
I don't think we have concrete evidence that Fleck isn't as good of a coach than Claeys or Kill were.
Just because he loses 8 games this year doesn't mean he can't coach.

People are drawing these conclusions to give themselves reasons to be outraged.
At this point, it's premature in my opinion.

But if you want to be outraged, go ahead. It's a millennial world.
 

Maverick said:
So explain to me how Michigan State, with an experienced, long term coach went from 12-2 in 2015 to 3-9 in 2016. What is the reason? How did that happen?

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Lots of reasons, but it was an aberration from an established pattern of remarkable success. I don't think we can say that about the Gophers this year.
 


Better recruiting and better position coaches is what PJ Fleck is bringing to MN. Just look at the QB recruiting. Claeys was willing to march forward with JUCO Neil McLauren and RS Fr Seth Green as the future of the program. Fleck came in and within hours of landing in MN secured Tanner Morgan in 2017 class. He also got Brennan Armstrong for 2018. Both Morgan and Armstrong have much better stats and skills than previous QB recruits. 2019 is speculative, but they have a Top 4 prospect has a high target for them.

Improved recruiting and better position coaches will bring results in the next few seasons. But this season has all the things that make transitions painful (key position graduations, expulsions/suspensions, career ending injuries, new systems/schemes). Watching this team, you can see the future of the program. There is youth and some undersized players, but they seem to cut down on pre-snap penalties. The defense looks strong despite all the setbacks. The WR corps is young but better talent than we've seen for a while in this program.

This team is not expected to win much more this season, but they've hung close in every loss. It would be one thing if we were blown out or shutout by opponents, but that's not what is happening. If they can continue to hang close, they might upset a team or two before this season is over. Enjoy the ride.
 


everybody knows my name said:
Lots of reasons, but it was an aberration from an established pattern of remarkable success. I don't think we can say that about the Gophers this year.
Click to expand...
So how does PJ Fleck establish a "pattern of remarkable success" in one year....? Define a pattern of remarkable success. Does PJ's accomplishments at W Mich start that pattern? Should his first year here be compared to his first year there? And what was their record before his first year there? Is that all part of a pattern that needs to be considered? Should 4 years at Minnesota be part of a pattern? How many years did it take Dantonio to reach that 12-2 record??? Not picking on you specifically EKMN, I just think it's stupid to be using last year's team record as a basis for this year....using that thought process, every team that's ever won 12 games or 9 games or whatever should never again win less than 12 or 9 or whatever... Just plain stupid.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
 

book said:
Fire coaches every year.... That we can compete with literally no passing game, quarterback and only one wide out is amazing to me... Things will get better and maybe we can beat the skunks!
Click to expand...

salzie said:
Some gopher fans want to restart every year until we get lightning in a bottle it appears. This year is hard, but we've endured worse. At least we didn't lose to an FCS school and have their fans trump how they'd be winning the B1GW
Click to expand...

Zero. Z.E.R.O. posters have suggested PJ should be fired, but please, continue....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Spoofin said:
Zero. Z.E.R.O. posters have suggested PJ should be fired, but please, continue....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Sorry, I'm referring to sentiment I've seen on social media, etc. I know that's not best judge and minority
 

Heracles said:
People just keep repeating, "were terrible," as some kind of justification. Nobody is asking them to win the West. But, if you watched the Maryland, Purdue, and Iowa games, we're pretty similar in terms of the overall quality of talent (sure, there are areas where they were better, and areas we are better).

IMO, it's a cop out. It's shifting all blame to the players and previous regime, when in reality coaching played a significant role in all three of losses.

This team should not be a 4-win team this year. That should not be the expectation. It has nothing to do with last year's win total. "What is it about that that people don't understand."
Click to expand...


They could've ground out few wins potentially, but they're also trying to get young players to play system that fits the future, or I hope at least
 

everybody knows my name said:
I want to believe in the Fleckster, and in my heart of hearts I do believe that we'll win at some point with Fleck at the helm, eventually. But I have absolutely no confidence that we'll win another game this season, and I seriously question whether his amazing 2016 season at W Michigan was just a once-in-a-lifetime flash in the pan, like Derrike Cope winning the 1990 Daytona 500 and then having a completely undistinguished career in NASCAR.

I didn't really expect 9 or 10 wins from this team in 2017, but I never imagined that we'd suck so badly with so much talent on the defense and an offense not devoid of talent. It doesn't even look like we'll go to the Oil Change Bowl this year.
Click to expand...

The bold parts seem pretty much at odds. Not sure what it is about Fleck. Keep seeing folks saying they believe Fleck will win here and they support him, but then also hedging that with criticism that he's all show and really doesn't know what he's doing. Not talking about criticism every football coach faces. It's the type that allows people to say they were right either way: whether in several years we're playing in major bowls or we're starting all over again because the PJ was a bigger fool than Brewster ever was. Minnesota passive-aggressiveness at it's finest.

Frustrating as the season is, I still think this guy is going to get us over the hump. Could have we won a game or two more if some people had played? Maybe, but I'm willing to believe that him establishing his rules is more important in the long run. Is every single one of the players buying into stuff like sprinting down the sidelines, the slogans, or the collared shirts? Seriously, seriously doubt it. We'll see at the end of the year when the transfers are revealed. But I do think the ones who stay with him are going to believe even more strongly in the vision (or culture) he's selling. Will that eventually mean other, better players are going to come here? Yep, I really believe that and the new facilities won't hurt either.

Easy to say we should have beaten so and so, but the fact remains we're a program where most years there are 4 or 5 games where it comes down to a handful of plays. Hasn't broken right this year. But I think we're going to start seeing him developing and getting the players to make those handful of plays. Can see it already on defense; wish we'd start seeing it on offense. And then I expect him to have players where it's only going to be trophy or bowl games that hinge on those plays and we're going to win our share of those.
 

Tlsbhansen said:
I am continually amazed at how many on this board are completely okay with the fact that we are likely to go from 9-4 to 4-8. Why is it okay, and to be expected to go in a negative direction, but no one should hope we maintain, or go forward?

Everyone is buying into a dream...one we hope will come to fruition one day, but unfortunately one stellar year in the lowly MAC is not a guarantee that anything like it will be replicated in the BigTen.
Click to expand...

I don't think people are "okay" with it, I think they are being realistic and have accepted that this is what the first year is. Anything close to a 9-wins season this year was a pipe dream.
 

everybody knows my name said:
I want to believe in the Fleckster, and in my heart of hearts I do believe that we'll win at some point with Fleck at the helm, eventually. But I have absolutely no confidence that we'll win another game this season, and I seriously question whether his amazing 2016 season at W Michigan was just a once-in-a-lifetime flash in the pan, like Derrike Cope winning the 1990 Daytona 500 and then having a completely undistinguished career in NASCAR.

I didn't really expect 9 or 10 wins from this team in 2017, but I never imagined that we'd suck so badly with so much talent on the defense and an offense not devoid of talent. It doesn't even look like we'll go to the Oil Change Bowl this year.
Click to expand...

To be fair Derrike Cope also won the 1990 Budweiser 500. 2 Career wins. :p
 

everybody knows my name said:
I want to believe in the Fleckster, and in my heart of hearts I do believe that we'll win at some point with Fleck at the helm, eventually. But I have absolutely no confidence that we'll win another game this season, and I seriously question whether his amazing 2016 season at W Michigan was just a once-in-a-lifetime flash in the pan, like Derrike Cope winning the 1990 Daytona 500 and then having a completely undistinguished career in NASCAR.

I didn't really expect 9 or 10 wins from this team in 2017, but I never imagined that we'd suck so badly with so much talent on the defense and an offense not devoid of talent. It doesn't even look like we'll go to the Oil Change Bowl this year.
Click to expand...

No doubt, it has been disappointing - and don't buy into that "year zero" or "rebuilding" nonsense. Gophers could be 5-2 now.
 

Great Plains Gopher said:
No doubt, it has been disappointing - and don't buy into that "year zero" or "rebuilding" nonsense. Gophers could be 5-2 now.
Click to expand...

But they are not.

So are you going to accept that, or do you need more time to grieve?
Or are you asking for some change of some sort?

You seem to have three options.
 

grumps said:
But they are not.

So are you going to accept that, or do you need more time to grieve?
Or are you asking for some change of some sort?

You seem to have three options.
Click to expand...

Obviously, the only rational choice, if you are going to remain a Gopher fan, of your three choices: We all need until September to grieve.
 

Vandy said:
Face it, we all want to win every game, every time out... admitting that it is going to take a year or 2 or three is hard, but...

This guy is going to get us there.

It's college football, enjoy the ride.
Click to expand...

Fully agree with the bold. And it is hard to be patient, especially when were are competitive and big play here or there and we win some of the games we have lost. Its anyone's guess if he leads us to the promised land (a few great seasons and prestigious bowl games). But he's got as good or better chance than anyone else we could have realistically hired. I'm with him for the long run, Go Gophers!
 

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