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  1. #1

    Default Trump Tax Plan and the deficit

    I know there are more pressing issues going on in the world right now, but this quote from Trump's cabinet solidifies that this administration's base is just fringe loonies and not actual people who care about conservative policies.

    Trump budget director on tax plan: “We need new deficits. If deficit-neutral, you’re never going to get 3% growth.”

    https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/a...ts-early-bumps


  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by gopher_alum_2005 View Post
    I know there are more pressing issues going on in the world right now, but this quote from Trump's cabinet solidifies that this administration's base is just fringe loonies and not actual people who care about conservative policies.

    Trump budget director on tax plan: “We need new deficits. If deficit-neutral, you’re never going to get 3% growth.”

    https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/a...ts-early-bumps
    Deficits only matter when there's a Democrat in the White House.
    Follow me on twitter: @skiumahgopher

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by gopher_alum_2005 View Post
    I know there are more pressing issues going on in the world right now, but this quote from Trump's cabinet solidifies that this administration's base is just fringe loonies and not actual people who care about conservative policies.

    Trump budget director on tax plan: “We need new deficits. If deficit-neutral, you’re never going to get 3% growth.”

    https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/a...ts-early-bumps
    Deficits only matter when there's a Republican in the white house.

  4. #4
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    Deficits only matter when you do not understand government and economics.
    Kingdom Warriors

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ski U Mah Gopher View Post
    Deficits only matter when there's a Democrat in the White House.
    You obviously don't believe in capitalism. There is no solution going forward to unending deficits without a booming economy.

    A booming economy would result in more people employed, more people becoming taxpayers and less people on various forms of government aid (takers). To accomplish that you need less tax and less regulation.

    The solutions Democrats provide is punitive taxation on those who already pay 90+% of the taxes. Those are the job providers. JFK and Reagan both realized that punitive progressive taxation stifles the economy. So increasing taxes just won't solve the problem of huge deficits- Obama tried it an produced the worst recovery in history and was the only president in history never to have the GDP growth rate get as high as 3% in any year.

    The other solution Dems provide is more free stuff (college and health care are now their offers) which only provides greater deficits and a further drag on the economy. See Europe.

    A tax decrease will add up to a reduction in revenue for the CBO and people who don't understand capitalism or history. But a tax decrease can and will provide more overall revenue as it did for Kennedy, Reagan and Bush.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by bga1 View Post
    You obviously don't believe in capitalism. There is no solution going forward to unending deficits without a booming economy.

    A booming economy would result in more people employed, more people becoming taxpayers and less people on various forms of government aid (takers). To accomplish that you need less tax and less regulation.

    The solutions Democrats provide is punitive taxation on those who already pay 90+% of the taxes. Those are the job providers. JFK and Reagan both realized that punitive progressive taxation stifles the economy. So increasing taxes just won't solve the problem of huge deficits- Obama tried it an produced the worst recovery in history and was the only president in history never to have the GDP growth rate get as high as 3% in any year.

    The other solution Dems provide is more free stuff (college and health care are now their offers) which only provides greater deficits and a further drag on the economy. See Europe.

    A tax decrease will add up to a reduction in revenue for the CBO and people who don't understand capitalism or history. But a tax decrease can and will provide more overall revenue as it did for Kennedy, Reagan and Bush.
    The sad part is that you believe every word of that post is correct.

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gopherguy0723 View Post
    The sad part is that you believe every word of that post is correct.
    Yes I do. Because it is all true. The interesting thing is that you were unable to refute even one of my points. I guess I am not sure why you posted.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by bga1 View Post
    You obviously don't believe in capitalism. There is no solution going forward to unending deficits without a booming economy.

    A booming economy would result in more people employed, more people becoming taxpayers and less people on various forms of government aid (takers). To accomplish that you need less tax and less regulation.

    The solutions Democrats provide is punitive taxation on those who already pay 90+% of the taxes. Those are the job providers. JFK and Reagan both realized that punitive progressive taxation stifles the economy. So increasing taxes just won't solve the problem of huge deficits- Obama tried it an produced the worst recovery in history and was the only president in history never to have the GDP growth rate get as high as 3% in any year.

    The other solution Dems provide is more free stuff (college and health care are now their offers) which only provides greater deficits and a further drag on the economy. See Europe.

    A tax decrease will add up to a reduction in revenue for the CBO and people who don't understand capitalism or history. But a tax decrease can and will provide more overall revenue as it did for Kennedy, Reagan and Bush.
    Beeg forgot to include salary increases from companies large and small.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by bga1 View Post
    You obviously don't believe in capitalism. There is no solution going forward to unending deficits without a booming economy.

    A booming economy would result in more people employed, more people becoming taxpayers and less people on various forms of government aid (takers). To accomplish that you need less tax and less regulation.

    The solutions Democrats provide is punitive taxation on those who already pay 90+% of the taxes. Those are the job providers. JFK and Reagan both realized that punitive progressive taxation stifles the economy. So increasing taxes just won't solve the problem of huge deficits- Obama tried it an produced the worst recovery in history and was the only president in history never to have the GDP growth rate get as high as 3% in any year.

    The other solution Dems provide is more free stuff (college and health care are now their offers) which only provides greater deficits and a further drag on the economy. See Europe.

    A tax decrease will add up to a reduction in revenue for the CBO and people who don't understand capitalism or history. But a tax decrease can and will provide more overall revenue as it did for Kennedy, Reagan and Bush.
    Are there any analyses, even from conservative think tanks, that conclude the Trump tax plan will be deficit neutral?

  10. #10
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    Too soon for that. I don't think it is fully flushed out either. In our condition "deficit neutral" is mission impossible. We have to get the economy out of the new normal for that to happen.

    What we need to look for is an "economic growth" budget that isn't buried under government handouts.
    Kingdom Warriors

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by justthefacts View Post
    Are there any analyses, even from conservative think tanks, that conclude the Trump tax plan will be deficit neutral?
    First off- I am not a big fan of the Trump proposal, but it is probably as far as we can get in one step. I think it is an incremental step in the right direction, but not nearly enough. DH is correct, there is not enough meat on the bone to out hard analysis of what would happen. What we do have is common sense. What is likely to happen if we allow corporate money to come back from overseas without repatriation tax? A ton of money will come home and the investments here will employ more people. What would happen if the corporate tax rates are cut? Trump is saying 20%. It should be far lower. What would happen? A huge jobs and investment boom.

    As I said above, you have to get more people employed and less people who are taking from government to cure the problem. If you look at simple percentages you simply cannot get to revenue neutral without screwing the whole tax cut idea up. But if you look at building a booming economy- you have a great chance to fix some things in the longer term. In fact, outside of a severe crash where government freebees are taken away in one fell swoop- there is no way to end the entitlement mess without first inspiring people to be part of a growing economy. Everyone is looking for a government solution. The government is who got us in the mess in the first place, promising more than we can deliver long term. This has to be a market driven solution.

    Steve Moore, one of Trump's advisors cites this CBO advice:The biggest deficit we need to urgently fix is our growth deficit. We must pump up our GDP growth from the anemic 1 percent rate of Mr. Obama’s last six months up to a sustained 4 percent for five to 10 years.
    Here are some amazing statistics from the Congressional Budget Office. If you raise the growth rate by one percentage point over one decade it reduces the budget deficit by $3 trillion. If Mr. Trump can juice growth from 2 to 4 percent then poof, federal borrowing disappears by $6 trillion.
    Liberal economists pout that this kind of growth is impossible for America, but that’s what people said in the miserable 1970s, but Mr. Reagan (and JFK before him) proved that with the right policy incentives that get government off the back of business, a new era of prosperity is just around the corner.


    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...ate-cuts-work/

    The problem with the CBO is not that they cannot due mathematics, it just that the CBO doesn't believe in the idea that a market driven lower tax economy could push 4% growth- so they don't project it in their models. Rather, the CBO produces static projections.

  12. #12

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    OK, I'll ask another way: have any of the tax plans that Trump has released in the last 18 months been shown to raise the GDP growth rate by 100 basis points by any analyses, even ones by conservative think tanks?

  13. #13
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    I am sorry that you can not understand how any of this works. Go take some of your kid's toys out and have a family night.
    Kingdom Warriors

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by bga1 View Post
    First off- I am not a big fan of the Trump proposal, but it is probably as far as we can get in one step. I think it is an incremental step in the right direction, but not nearly enough. DH is correct, there is not enough meat on the bone to out hard analysis of what would happen. What we do have is common sense. What is likely to happen if we allow corporate money to come back from overseas without repatriation tax? A ton of money will come home and the investments here will employ more people. What would happen if the corporate tax rates are cut? Trump is saying 20%. It should be far lower. What would happen? A huge jobs and investment boom.

    As I said above, you have to get more people employed and less people who are taking from government to cure the problem. If you look at simple percentages you simply cannot get to revenue neutral without screwing the whole tax cut idea up. But if you look at building a booming economy- you have a great chance to fix some things in the longer term. In fact, outside of a severe crash where government freebees are taken away in one fell swoop- there is no way to end the entitlement mess without first inspiring people to be part of a growing economy. Everyone is looking for a government solution. The government is who got us in the mess in the first place, promising more than we can deliver long term. This has to be a market driven solution.

    Steve Moore, one of Trump's advisors cites this CBO advice:The biggest deficit we need to urgently fix is our growth deficit. We must pump up our GDP growth from the anemic 1 percent rate of Mr. Obama’s last six months up to a sustained 4 percent for five to 10 years.
    Here are some amazing statistics from the Congressional Budget Office. If you raise the growth rate by one percentage point over one decade it reduces the budget deficit by $3 trillion. If Mr. Trump can juice growth from 2 to 4 percent then poof, federal borrowing disappears by $6 trillion.
    Liberal economists pout that this kind of growth is impossible for America, but that’s what people said in the miserable 1970s, but Mr. Reagan (and JFK before him) proved that with the right policy incentives that get government off the back of business, a new era of prosperity is just around the corner.


    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...ate-cuts-work/

    The problem with the CBO is not that they cannot due mathematics, it just that the CBO doesn't believe in the idea that a market driven lower tax economy could push 4% growth- so they don't project it in their models. Rather, the CBO produces static projections.
    There are good conservative economists. Moore is an ignoramus, fraud, and a liar.

    You will help your case by not appealing to him. He is not an authority on anything other than partisanship.

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by justthefacts View Post
    OK, I'll ask another way: have any of the tax plans that Trump has released in the last 18 months been shown to raise the GDP growth rate by 100 basis points by any analyses, even ones by conservative think tanks?
    Keep trying. I’ve no doubt if you keep trying you can word it in just such a fashion as to force the response you’re looking for. You can do it!!
    - Respect is the ultimate currency

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