PJ praises lots of players, no doubt. How often does he credit the source of those players, the program they came from? The training they received before he took over? Being we are in year zero? It's Not whether we have good players, hopefully we agree we do? It just gets old PJ praising himself for all things. Something like, "I truly believe we have the best d-coordinator in the country but let's be honest we inherited some great players who were very well coached. Now, WE just wanna get them to the elite level." Would that be so hard?
Pioneer Press: Gophers’ defensive success not a coincidence. P.J. Fleck explains why.
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PJ praises lots of players, no doubt. How often does he credit the source of those players, the program they came from? The training they received before he took over? Being we are in year zero? It's Not whether we have good players, hopefully we agree we do? It just gets old PJ praising himself for all things. Something like, "I truly believe we have the best d-coordinator in the country but let's be honest we inherited some great players who were very well coached. Now, WE just wanna get them to the elite level." Would that be so hard?
Johnnyboy18
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He's complimented the previous staff multiple times, it's not his fault you have your head in the sand. He has no obligation to bring up the previous staff when talking about the current team a month into the season. It's been more than 9 months, I think some of you guys should get over the previous staff. Colorado State almost ran for more yards in one game than the team has allowed the entire year thus far. Clear improvement, should he credit the previous staff for that as well?
HoustonTXGopher
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZmG-D4L4jc
Glen Mason on BTN sums up Claeys, Fleck and how PJ tries to keep expectations low to start with Gophers
Glen Mason on BTN sums up Claeys, Fleck and how PJ tries to keep expectations low to start with Gophers
Richardson might get drafted.
Curious to see how McGhee finishes the year, runs at combine. Be nice to keep the drafted defensive backs streak alive.
Celestin playing very, very well...undersized to be drafted as a NFL linebacker?
Winfield an elite player.
Merrick Jackson not undersized. Has the measureables NFL likes.
Stelter will get a camp invite, at least.
Moore with another year of Weight-room gains/Paup technique work could develop into a drafted NFL lineman.
Poock used to be considered an NFL prospect...have the injuries cut into his strength and speed numbers? Looks pretty damn quick to the ball and still physically delivers in limited action so far.
If Shenault continues to improve his game, he will get looks next year. Has the raw speed, has increased his strength.
Cashman one of those guys who makes a NFL roster based on special teams and specialty pass rusher ability and develops into a full time player?
Very interested to see how Coughlin, Martin and Barber develop over next 2 and 3/4 years. All three in the NFL would not surprise.
Kiondre a redshirt frosh has stepped in and held his own. His 40 time is elite. Long and strong.
Santoso will get NFL looks. Carpenter has that leg and accuracy up to 50...to make it in NFL on ft, do you need to be accurate up to 55?
Curious to see how Durr recovers. Also how Devers and DeLattiboudere develop.
Is 14 defensive guys a dearth?
Are two specialists a dearth?
Others on other side of ball who seem to have the measureables, have performed well, have been talked about by coaches as having a chance to play after college: Smith, Brooks, Greene, Lingen, Wozniak, Tyler.
Calhoun or Wright?
Still have upside, time to develop: Andries, Olson, Connelly, Weyler, Still, Croft, Seth, Oseland, Schlueter, Dovich, Howard, Hmielewski, Kieft, Beebe, Witham.
Curious to see how McGhee finishes the year, runs at combine. Be nice to keep the drafted defensive backs streak alive.
Celestin playing very, very well...undersized to be drafted as a NFL linebacker?
Winfield an elite player.
Merrick Jackson not undersized. Has the measureables NFL likes.
Stelter will get a camp invite, at least.
Moore with another year of Weight-room gains/Paup technique work could develop into a drafted NFL lineman.
Poock used to be considered an NFL prospect...have the injuries cut into his strength and speed numbers? Looks pretty damn quick to the ball and still physically delivers in limited action so far.
If Shenault continues to improve his game, he will get looks next year. Has the raw speed, has increased his strength.
Cashman one of those guys who makes a NFL roster based on special teams and specialty pass rusher ability and develops into a full time player?
Very interested to see how Coughlin, Martin and Barber develop over next 2 and 3/4 years. All three in the NFL would not surprise.
Kiondre a redshirt frosh has stepped in and held his own. His 40 time is elite. Long and strong.
Santoso will get NFL looks. Carpenter has that leg and accuracy up to 50...to make it in NFL on ft, do you need to be accurate up to 55?
Curious to see how Durr recovers. Also how Devers and DeLattiboudere develop.
Is 14 defensive guys a dearth?
Are two specialists a dearth?
Others on other side of ball who seem to have the measureables, have performed well, have been talked about by coaches as having a chance to play after college: Smith, Brooks, Greene, Lingen, Wozniak, Tyler.
Calhoun or Wright?
Still have upside, time to develop: Andries, Olson, Connelly, Weyler, Still, Croft, Seth, Oseland, Schlueter, Dovich, Howard, Hmielewski, Kieft, Beebe, Witham.
Pompous Elitist
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Summarizing, if a coach does well in Year 1 it's because he ad his staff are elite, and The Culture is taking hold. If a coach does poorly in Year 1 it's because he hasn't brought in his players yet, or The Culture has not been fully instituted
Acknowledging that we don't yet know how the team will do against the Big Ten in Year 1 we all have time to solidify our positions. Elite, good, average, meh, bad - stake your position.
Acknowledging that we don't yet know how the team will do against the Big Ten in Year 1 we all have time to solidify our positions. Elite, good, average, meh, bad - stake your position.
I'm only guessing, but for argument's sake let's say it's been more than 9 months since you left home with Mom and Dad...do you still credit them to others on occasion for instilling values in you and shaping your character? Will you, for years to come?
Johnnyboy18
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He has credited them on occasion? Should he do it in every interview to satisfy people like you who can't get over Claeys?
I defer, I must admit I stopped listening as closely after "catastrophic" interception and "two missed kicks". But other than a left handed acknowledgement that academic numbers weren't bad before he got here, I have not heard much in the way of crediting the former coaches you speak of. Yes, when the question is asked if PJ credits Kill or Claeys or Sawvel...he says Yes and then talks about himself or how much other coaches influenced him more. I've heard that if that's what you are referring to. "Do you think our baby is the most beautiful baby ever?" PJ "Yes, absolutely, hey, have you seen my baby pictures? Hey, you know Heather.... " Does that really count? Granted most of my PJ news is on here...so if you wanna post links since he has done it so many times I'd read a handful if you provided them.
GFBfan
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I'm confused, I thought this was year 0?
Our defense this year has continued the strong play that was established during the Kill and Cleays years. That is a fact.
We have not played any great offenses yet this year, but even so, our D has dominated those opponents, especially in the second half.
We are also doing it with players who got great experience for the most part last year. Really looking forward to seeing how they do against BIG teams and as they get more comfortable with their roles in Coach Smiths system.
BilldGopher
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The B1G season is upon us.
Time to take that in and set the new baseline.
As Wren used to post it's the Big 10 wins that count.
Here's hoping for win #1 this weekend.
Time to take that in and set the new baseline.
As Wren used to post it's the Big 10 wins that count.
Here's hoping for win #1 this weekend.
Spoofin
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Yes yes Mulli - I'm well aware of the fact that it bothers you that I can like PJ as a coach and support him - yet not really like him or his approach. It's OK - there are only 4 or 5 of us outliers out there. Carry on with the zingers.
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Spoofin
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This post makes no sense - even for you. I didn't take a shot at Fleck or praise TC in this thread. I poked at a couple specific posters who spent much of the summer promoting a talent level on our team that would make one wonder if the players could tie their own shoes.
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Another thread that devolved into a pissing match over Claeys not getting enough credit. I suppose Brohm should give Hazel credit for leaving so much behind for him? Harbaugh should have trumpeted Hoke's recruiting acumen? Makes no sense for a coach to talk about how good the other staff was, especially 3 games into the season.
And yes, I understand Jimmy is not in his first year at Michigan.
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And yes, I understand Jimmy is not in his first year at Michigan.
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Spoofin
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Interesting take since the first 18 posts had nothing to do with Claeys until an anti-Claeys poster had to make sure he wouldn't get any credit and take a shot.
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e.bigelow
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So then the defense really isn't that talented since we've been playing scrubs for opponents? You're confusing man.
Spoofin
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Nah, we have talent. That much is obvious. We aren't the best defense in the Country tho. That ranking is based on opponents.
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That was the point, 18 posts and the thread goes off the rails all because someone is hurt that Claeys is not getting any credit. Again, sounds like other coaches are doing the same thing, not giving previous coaching staffs enough credit.
Also, if this season goes off the rails, does Fleck get to blame the prior staff? I mean, if he should be giving them credit for the defensive performance to date, should he blame them if it does not hold up all season? Of course, I already know the answer to this one....
Ski U Mah Gopher
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You have to give Smith some credit for not trying to force a round peg into a square hole.
He saw the strength in the linebacker core and said "Even though I have been a 4-3 coach, let's play to our strength and go 3-4". Many coaches wouldn't do that.
He saw the strength in the linebacker core and said "Even though I have been a 4-3 coach, let's play to our strength and go 3-4". Many coaches wouldn't do that.
John Galt
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Fleck has said as many good things as could be expected about the previous coaches.
Do you think Urban Meyer bent over backwards praising Jim Tressel for a year? Did Paul Chryst talk about how great a program he was left by Gary Andersen? I'm not sure what you could possibly be expecting.
Mulligan
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This. Honest to God I'm not sure what some people expect. What the hell difference does it make anyway? If he loses, it's on him. If he wins, it's also ultimately on him. He's under no obligation to thank Kill or Claeys for whom he inherited. And if he wants to poor mouth his situation, fine also. That's what about every football coach who has ever lived has done. As many things people find to bitch about him at 3-0, can't imagine what it'll be like after a loss.
Johnnyboy18
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This was being setup by a few specific posters for many months. If Fleck succeeds this year or next year it's because he inherited a boatload of talent and if he fails it's because he's not as good of a coach as Claeys. I mentioned this multiple times and of course they denied it. So predictable...
https://www.elevenwarriors.com/ohio-state-football/2016/03/68641/it-was-urban-meyers-idea-to-bring-jim-tressel-to-ohio-states-coaches-clinic-another-step
http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/09/07/urban-meyer-chastises-tom-herman-for-sprinkle-fairy-dust-quote/
Well, I don't care to dig for more but these two instances come to mind from Urban. Maybe you listened to the Maryland press conference? Are you aware PJ says we have 3 returning defensive starters? I'm curious which 10 guys of at least 13 who also have had defensive starts for Gophers in their career is PJ not including? Just all this constant poor me stuff that isn't true bothers me. No where have I said he can't coach. I just wish he'd follow his own farmers alliance. Otherwise why does he emphasize it? It's not my mission statement, it's his. Do what you say you are going to do.
Johnnyboy18
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Winfield, Richardson, and Celestien should be the only players considered "returning starters" on defense.
HoustonTXGopher
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This is all off season chatter, we are now playing football and have a great BIG season to look forward to. Fleck says it himself, he is not for everybody. You can certainly argue that he is a bit full of himself, but then again most coaches are. Fleck differs from so many coaches in that he actually loves to talk and loves the press conferences. He gives 5+ minute answers to questions that other coaches only give one simple word. He is different, he is not for everybody but he is successful. The successful part is all I care about. I don't really know how much talent PJ inherited, I only know he inherited a winning team, a team on the up and as far as I can tell he is building and probably taking this team to heights that the last staff may have struggled to get. 9-3