Gophers Official Non Conference Schedule

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Gophers7633

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Nov. 10th vs. USC Upstate
Nov. 13th @ Providence
Nov. 15th vs. Niagara
Nov. 19th vs. Western Carolina
Nov. 21st. vs. Alabama A&M
Nov 24th vs. UMASS(Barclays Classic)
Nov. 25th vs. Alabama(Barclays Classic)
Nov. 29th vs. Miami(ACC/B1G Challenge)
Dec. 9th @ Arkansas
Dec. 11th vs. Drake
Dec. 21st vs. Oral Roberts
Dec. 23rd vs. Florida Atlantic
Dec. 29th vs. Harvard
 

High end games appear strong but the low end games are very yucky.

Missing out on of the middle of the pack teams (RPI in the 150 range) like we had last year with Arkansas St, Georgia Southern, etc. Maybe Harvard can be one and UMASS if they really over achieve.
 

Need to go at least 3-1 against Providence/Alabama/Miami/Arkansas because the buy games are going to leave us with a poor OOC SoS IMO.

2016 RPI by opponent:

USC Upstate - 228
Providence - 55
Niagara - 273
Western Carolina - 268
Alabama A&M - 350
UMASS - 194
Alabama - 78
Miami - 42
Arkansas - 25
Drake - 314
Oral Roberts - 292
Florida Atlantic - 262
Harvard - 140

On the surface, this appears to be significantly worse than what it was last year. Lets hope some of these teams are better than projected.
 

Wisconsin like schedule could end up with Wisconsin like seeding. Yuk.
 

If they do well in the non-conference (lets say 12-1) and do well in the conference (13-5/14-4/15-3) then I don't think the OOC SOS matters much. It gets tricky if you're, lets say, 10-3/11-7
 


I think absolute worst case scenario would be 9-4(which would really be deflating) and best case would be to run through this undefeated. Even an 11-2 record would leave me somewhat unhappy.
 

As a season ticket holder it is very disappointing to see only 9 pre big ten games with only one game of any interest at all against Miami (not DUKE?). Then one of our home big ten games is played in New York. Very disappointing. I feel ripped off.
 

Click on this tweet to get all the thoughts on schedule.

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bobmartinfan said:
As a season ticket holder it is very disappointing to see only 9 pre big ten games with only one game of any interest at all against Miami (not DUKE?). Then one of our home big ten games is played in New York. Very disappointing. I feel ripped off.
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I wonder if it's better exposure for our program to play a nationally-televised conference game at the legendary Madison Square Garden or another home game at Williams? I'd say this staff's connections, influence and results in the NYC metro area (Dupree McBrayer, Isaiah Washington, Jamir Harris) make this an easy answer.

I just can't see how anyone who is a Gopher fan with the big picture in mind could complain about our boys having the opportunity to play on one of the world's most famous basketball stages. In essence you're probably talking about a $30-40 difference per seat on the season tickets with this game missing. Maybe look at this as a one-year investment (cause they won't play a B10 game at MSG very often at all) in the long-term health and national image of our program.

As far as the scheduling stuff, people complain on here when we don't get enough national games, but then they complain when we get a national game on a marquee stage. People complain when our schedule is too easy, but then we get two very challenging TRUE road games against 2016 NCAA teams and people complain that there aren't enough good home games? Again, this seems like a short-sighted, borderline selfish stance to take:

A. We have our best non-con home game (Miami) in 15 years this year.
B. It's not realistic to think we can just have our best non-con games at home every year - Arkansas was a home-and-home, so we knew that was coming in 2017.
C. Pitino is smart with his scheduling and he has known for awhile that we have said two very tough true road games on the schedule PLUS an ACC title contender coming to Williams. If he knows we have three games on the 2017 non-con that are already tougher than anything we had on 2016's schedule, is it really wise to put our squad in a position like MSU was in last year with a bunch of early losses?
D. Tough road games build character for March - as does playing on a big stage like MSG - and, more importantly, should we really strive for a schedule like Syracuse traditionally has where they have sometimes ZERO true road games and then gets left out of the tourney (as they did in the past 2-3 years) for that very reason?

Other than season ticket holders being down a game due to MSG (which was a B10 call and NOT a Pitino/Coyle call), if we can handle the big games on this non-con schedule, we will be rolling into the B10 portion well-respected and in the Top 10. Even if we lose at Providence or Arkansas, it's not a loss that will hurt our RPI or national perception. Sounds like a win-win. If you want the greatest things for this program, seems like a no-brainer.
 



As a new season ticket holder, I don't love the schedule but mainly because the B1G home games does not include Wisconsin.

However, I plan on having my tickets for a long time (assuming I can afford them and all that) so I don't worry too much about this season. Will be nice to have national exposure and some difficult road tests. Hopefully it pays dividends and we dominate our home conference schedule
 

Gophers7633 said:
Need to go at least 3-1 against Providence/Alabama/Miami/Arkansas because the buy games are going to leave us with a poor OOC SoS IMO.

2016 RPI by opponent:

USC Upstate - 228
Providence - 55
Niagara - 273
Western Carolina - 268
Alabama A&M - 350
UMASS - 194
Alabama - 78
Miami - 42
Arkansas - 25
Drake - 314
Oral Roberts - 292
Florida Atlantic - 262
Harvard - 140

On the surface, this appears to be significantly worse than what it was last year. Lets hope some of these teams are better than projected.
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The non-power 5 is brutal. Swapping a couple of those for two of NDSU/SDSU/UND/USD would help.
 

There will be no time for an early season slump. Between 11/25 and 12/9 they will have Alabama, Miami, B1G game, B1G game, Arkansas.
 

howeda7 said:
There will be no time for an early season slump. Between 11/25 and 12/9 they will have Alabama, Miami, B1G game, B1G game, Arkansas.
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That's another great point. Considering we will have two very early - and very important - B10 games in December, we have to think that Pitino adjusted the schedule a bit this year to factor that in.
 



Only playing 1 extra B1G game in December than each of last 3 seasons

Sack up, Big 10 coaches.

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Just to do a comparison to last year's OOC schedule in terms of RPI rank:

Louisiana - 115
UT-Arlington - 45
Mt. St. Mary's - 149
St. John's - 123
Arkansas - 25
Southern Illinois - 145
Florida State - 13
Vanderbilt - 38
Georgia Southern - 128
NJIT - 285
Northern Illinois - 239
LIU-Brooklyn - 226
Arkansas State - 120

Avg. Rank: 127

Avg. Rank this year: 187

Wisconsin's Avg. Rank for their OOC schedule last year was 179. To put that number into context Wisconsin had the 304th ranked OOC SoS last year according to the RPI. This schedule won't do us any favors, that's why it's critical we go at least 3-1 against the P6 schools. Wisconsin was 11-2 OOC and 12-6 in the B1G and got an 8 seed. We may need to go something like 14-4 to get a top 4 seed in the tournament.
 

WriterGoph said:
That's another great point. Considering we will have two very early - and very important - B10 games in December, we have to think that Pitino adjusted the schedule a bit this year to factor that in.
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I'm fine with not adding another Power 6 game, but the cream puffs didn't have to be this creamy.
 


When are the B1G games in December? After the NC, correct?
 


Gophers7633 said:
Just to do a comparison to last year's OOC schedule in terms of RPI rank:

Louisiana - 115
UT-Arlington - 45
Mt. St. Mary's - 149
St. John's - 123
Arkansas - 25
Southern Illinois - 145
Florida State - 13
Vanderbilt - 38
Georgia Southern - 128
NJIT - 285
Northern Illinois - 239
LIU-Brooklyn - 226
Arkansas State - 120

Avg. Rank: 127

Avg. Rank this year: 187

Wisconsin's Avg. Rank for their OOC schedule last year was 179. To put that number into context Wisconsin had the 304th ranked OOC SoS last year according to the RPI. This schedule won't do us any favors, that's why it's critical we go at least 3-1 against the P6 schools. Wisconsin was 11-2 OOC and 12-6 in the B1G and got an 8 seed. We may need to go something like 14-4 to get a top 4 seed in the tournament.
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Why are we still talking about seeding? Didn't last year teach us that seeding (outside of the #1 seeds) doesn't mean much? Wisconsin was an 8 seed, yet still got to the Sweet 16 (like clockwork). We have 4 great challenges on our non-conference schedule (3 of them away from home) and a B10 slate that is always a grinder. I could care less about seeding. I want our team tested in tough environments, steeled by adversity and ready to answer the bell in March - this schedule with the crazy stretch of games from Thanksgiving weekend to December 9 - should be great prep. This should not be the year we are worried about "playing the RPI game" to help us get off the bubble. Bottom line, if we take care of business with the schedule we have and the national expectations of the program coming into this season, we will be seeded just fine in March.
 

SelectionSunday said:
Sack up, Big 10 coaches.

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For being one of the most consistently informative and solid posters on this board, I have to say I find this comment very misleading and quite flippant. As much as you know about scheduling, are you really trying to compare two games between Dec. 1-4 with a game on Dec 30/31? There is so much development and growth that happens with a team during the non-conference, I just can't see how you can can lump two conference games in at the start of December with a single game at the very end of the month (when the non-con is already over)?

Not to mention, those Dec. 1-4 games fall right in between three of our most challenging games on the non-con schedule. So, to see you call out our coach's testicular fortitude as opposed to acknowledging that, yes, this odd 2017 scheduling anomaly (based off the B10 tourney being at MSG a week earlier than normal) DOES need to be factored in when laying out the difficulty of the rest of the schedule is very surprising to see.

If you're looking at it from what's best for the team/program and not "what's best for my season ticket experience", it seems like such a simple and logical explanation to me as to how the schedule came out like it did.
 

WriterGoph said:
For being one of the most consistently informative and solid posters on this board, I have to say I find this comment very misleading and quite flippant. As much as you know about scheduling, are you really trying to compare two games between Dec. 1-4 with a game on Dec 30/31? There is so much development and growth that happens with a team during the non-conference, I just can't see how you can can lump two conference games in at the start of December with a single game at the very end of the month (when the non-con is already over)?

Not to mention, those Dec. 1-4 games fall right in between three of our most challenging games on the non-con schedule. So, to see you call out our coach's testicular fortitude as opposed to acknowledging that, yes, this odd 2017 scheduling anomaly (based off the B10 tourney being at MSG a week earlier than normal) DOES need to be factored in when laying out the difficulty of the rest of the schedule is very surprising to see.

If you're looking at it from what's best for the team/program and not "what's best for my season ticket experience", it seems like such a simple and logical explanation to me as to how the schedule came out like it did.
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I agree. In addition, last year's non-con schedule was a cakewalk (all the RPI BS aside). I understand the RPI and how much the selection committee values it, but at the end of the day, there were only 3 games the Gophers could have lost last year... one of which they did. While this year's schedule isn't exactly a gauntlet, they'll have to play well in all four of the tougher games considering where they're being played.

And yes, to the quoted post above, it absolutely needs to be taken into consideration when looking at how the schedule shapes up. If you're playing that many tough games in a row, it could be a fools errand to schedule many more lose-able games.

Like other posters, I would have loved to see more 100-150 teams scheduled, but I certainly don't blame the powers that be for the decisions they made. If the Gophers win, they will be rewarded for their efforts.
 

I think this is a pretty decent schedule. Providence, Miami, and Alabama all should be top 50 and Arkansas should be right around there too. I would think Harvard will be top 100ish and a couple of Umass, Drake, Oral Roberts, and Niagra will end up being decent. Interesting to see a couple different occasions with 2 games in 3 days in the non con which we haven't seen a whole lot of before.
 

WriterGoph said:
Why are we still talking about seeding? Didn't last year teach us that seeding (outside of the #1 seeds) doesn't mean much? Wisconsin was an 8 seed, yet still got to the Sweet 16 (like clockwork). We have 4 great challenges on our non-conference schedule (3 of them away from home) and a B10 slate that is always a grinder. I could care less about seeding. I want our team tested in tough environments, steeled by adversity and ready to answer the bell in March - this schedule with the crazy stretch of games from Thanksgiving weekend to December 9 - should be great prep. This should not be the year we are worried about "playing the RPI game" to help us get off the bubble. Bottom line, if we take care of business with the schedule we have and the national expectations of the program coming into this season, we will be seeded just fine in March.
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This type of schedule leaves no margin for error. Our team was tested last year as well(@ FSU, vs. Arkansas, vs. Vandy), and honestly the odds of all four of Miami, Providence, Alabama and Arkansas all getting in the tournament are slim, so the high end games aren't much different than last year. Games against 100-150 type of teams are good games and can get you battle tested. We have none of that this year, so if anything we aren't going to be challenged as much as we were last year.

The problem with this type of schedule is that we could have a better team, a better record and a worse seed. If we are an 8/9 loss team like last year, we'll be destined for a 7/8/9 seed. Which would be considered a huge disappointment.
 

Gophers7633 said:
This type of schedule leaves no margin for error. Our team was tested last year as well(@ FSU, vs. Arkansas, vs. Vandy), and honestly the odds of all four of Miami, Providence, Alabama and Arkansas all getting in the tournament are slim, so the high end games aren't much different than last year. Games against 100-150 type of teams are good games and can get you battle tested. We have none of that this year, so if anything we aren't going to be challenged as much as we were last year.

The problem with this type of schedule is that we could have a better team, a better record and a worse seed. If we are an 8/9 loss team like last year, we'll be destined for a 7/8/9 seed. Which would be considered a huge disappointment.
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Yep, I agree. Thinking that an 8 seed is okay to get in the NCAA tournament, especially for the team we hope to have this year, is stupid. Just because Wisconsin played one of their best games all year to catch Villanova by surprise doesnt mean that it happens all the time. If we're playing a 1 or 2 seed in round 2, I would be very disappointed.
 

Gophers7633 said:
This type of schedule leaves no margin for error. Our team was tested last year as well(@ FSU, vs. Arkansas, vs. Vandy), and honestly the odds of all four of Miami, Providence, Alabama and Arkansas all getting in the tournament are slim, so the high end games aren't much different than last year. Games against 100-150 type of teams are good games and can get you battle tested. We have none of that this year, so if anything we aren't going to be challenged as much as we were last year.

The problem with this type of schedule is that we could have a better team, a better record and a worse seed. If we are an 8/9 loss team like last year, we'll be destined for a 7/8/9 seed. Which would be considered a huge disappointment.
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I respect what you're saying here and you have some good points, although I think you are downplaying the quality of our 4 best non-con games. Yes, @FSU was a great test last year (and they ended up playing into the Top 10 later in the year), but from what I can find, they were not yet ranked when we played them. Arkansas got better later in the year and had a nice burst in the tourney, but they were not in good shape when they came to Williams and we waxed them. Vandy was a middle of the road SEC team that ended up sneaking into the tourney on a couple late February wins. In summation, none of the teams we played in our three toughest games were ranked.

Flash forward to 2017-2018 and (yes, I know it's a preseason ranking) we have three opponents in these preseason rankings: https://www.cbssports.com/college-b...jumps-up-to-no-1-after-landing-marvin-bagley/

#11 Miami - maybe it will be considered a wash with FSU last year at the end of the year, but heading into the season, the expectations are much higher for Miami than they were for the Seminoles.

#19 Alabama - a neutral site game for us at the Barclays Classic, but it's clear that Alabama is much more revered going into this season than Vandy last year.

#26 Providence - a true road game against an NCAA team who returns its top 7 scorers. This is clearly a tougher game than at home against Arkansas last year.

Add onto that another true road game against Arkansas (an NCAA team that should definitely be Top 50) and I think we not only have more top-quality non-con games this coming season, but also (at least based on preseason expectations/rankings) higher-quality opponents. I'm excited to see us with 3-4 marquee non-conference matchups that should feature a ranked Gophers team against ranked opponents. That hasn't happened in decades.
 

gopherguy15 said:
Yep, I agree. Thinking that an 8 seed is okay to get in the NCAA tournament, especially for the team we hope to have this year, is stupid. Just because Wisconsin played one of their best games all year to catch Villanova by surprise doesnt mean that it happens all the time. If we're playing a 1 or 2 seed in round 2, I would be very disappointed.
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You're missing the point. You seem to not be appreciating the quality of our 4 best games and moaning about the lack of mid-level (100-200 RPI) teams on our schedule. Whether it be a 100ish, 200ish or 300ish team on our non-conference schedule, those are all pretty much scheduled wins - if we were to lose to any of those level teams at home this year it would be equally damaging and embarrassing. So we're basically debating whether we should be scheduling "better looking wins"?

How about the fact that we will have played at least 6 Top 100 (but more likely Top 50-75) teams this year by December 9?! 4 of those likely come away from home (B10 schedule pending). That is INSANE. If we play to the level of talent and experience we have assembled, seeding will not be a concern. But I think everyone worrying about whether the "wins" are from 100s, 200s or 300s is setting their sights far too low. Let's beat these good teams and the rest of this scheduling debate is meaningless.
 

WriterGoph said:
You're missing the point. You seem to not be appreciating the quality of our 4 best games and moaning about the lack of mid-level (100-200 RPI) teams on our schedule. Whether it be a 100ish, 200ish or 300ish team on our non-conference schedule, those are all pretty much scheduled wins - if we were to lose to any of those level teams at home this year it would be equally damaging and embarrassing. So we're basically debating whether we should be scheduling "better looking wins"?

How about the fact that we will have played at least 6 Top 100 (but more likely Top 50-75) teams this year by December 9?! 4 of those likely come away from home (B10 schedule pending). That is INSANE. If we play to the level of talent and experience we have assembled, seeding will not be a concern. But I think everyone worrying about whether the "wins" are from 100s, 200s or 300s is setting their sights far too low. Let's beat these good teams and the rest of this scheduling debate is meaningless.
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EXACTLY THIS
 

WriterGoph said:
I respect what you're saying here and you have some good points, although I think you are downplaying the quality of our 4 best non-con games. Yes, @FSU was a great test last year (and they ended up playing into the Top 10 later in the year), but from what I can find, they were not yet ranked when we played them. Arkansas got better later in the year and had a nice burst in the tourney, but they were not in good shape when they came to Williams and we waxed them. Vandy was a middle of the road SEC team that ended up sneaking into the tourney on a couple late February wins. In summation, none of the teams we played in our three toughest games were ranked.

Flash forward to 2017-2018 and (yes, I know it's a preseason ranking) we have three opponents in these preseason rankings: https://www.cbssports.com/college-b...jumps-up-to-no-1-after-landing-marvin-bagley/

#11 Miami - maybe it will be considered a wash with FSU last year at the end of the year, but heading into the season, the expectations are much higher for Miami than they were for the Seminoles.

#19 Alabama - a neutral site game for us at the Barclays Classic, but it's clear that Alabama is much more revered going into this season than Vandy last year.

#26 Providence - a true road game against an NCAA team who returns its top 7 scorers. This is clearly a tougher game than at home against Arkansas last year.

Add onto that another true road game against Arkansas (an NCAA team that should definitely be Top 50) and I think we not only have more top-quality non-con games this coming season, but also (at least based on preseason expectations/rankings) higher-quality opponents. I'm excited to see us with 3-4 marquee non-conference matchups that should feature a ranked Gophers team against ranked opponents. That hasn't happened in decades.
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Yes, the two early December Big Ten games is a huge factor in our schedule. It may rate easier non conference wise overall but this year's schedule is difficult. Win games and we'll be fine.
 

Ranking the difficulty of Gopher games

Throwing out KenPom and RPI rankings from last season, my ranking of the Gophers non-conference games, from most difficult to least difficult. 2016-17 record vs. Division I opponents in parentheses.

1 @ Providence (20-13)
2 vs. Alabama (19-15)
3 @ Arkansas (26-10)
4 Miami (21-12)
5 Harvard (16-10)
6 Niagara (10-23)
7 vs. UMass (15-18)
8 Western Carolina (7-23)
9 SC Upstate (13-15)
10 Drake (6-23)
11 FAU (8-20)
12 Oral Roberts (6-22)
13 Alabama A&M (2-27)
 

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